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Andre...so glad to read that you are gearing up for postwar train running.

Curious if you have more affinity for steam engines, or diesels?  Good luck jumping back in!!!!  And some advice about turds that split up trains...such as separately selling the engine, tender or the A units without the B.

Learned from astute Mrs RedJimmy...ask/tell them you want both at a fair price...if not, YOU MOVE ON! Dont waste your time. After all you have the $$$ (thats leverage),  and they have something to sell, or cart around another umpteen years!

Last edited by redjimmy1955

Hi redjimmy!

Over the years since my 3-rail experiments, the allure of "traditional-sized" trains, especially select PW Marx and Lionel pieces, has been residual within me.

For the immediate future, "running" will only be on a small loop set up on the kitchen table for piddle-playing and testing purposes. In the upcoming months, I'll be acquiring track on an "as can" basis, and eventually, I'll restore the ability to run trains on the existing "around the wall" bench work here in this 2'6" x 9' 6" "computer room".  In order to do that I will need to re-install the hinged drop-down bridge so as to have continuous running. (But I saved all the parts to the hinged drop-down bridge upon disassembly after the last experimental effort.)

As for steam or diesel?

Well, Lionel's PW Hudson steam engines that were based on the Berk boiler (including a Berk "one of these days") as well as the shorter "Baldwin" boiler Hudson's are my favorites among the postwar steam offerings. I'll start with those when it comes time to purchase.

As for Lionel PW diesels, I prefer the downsized "traditional" engines that better fit the 6464-type boxcars. That would mainly be the cast frame and stamp frame FA's. I am not interested in any "scale sized" equipment, either engines or rolling stock. Migrating toward "Hi-rail" was my downfall when I seriously explored 3-rail back almost 20 years ago.

Marx: Wouldn't mind at all having a #333 smoker and possibly a few litho diesels.

As for non-PW engines of interest would be MTH Railking "Stubby" F3's, and an RMT "Bang" Alco S-2 or two. OR, in time, perhaps any "traditional" sized Williams FA or what have you.

Long term: I fully intend to make progress on my HO layout and enjoy it as long as I dare before making a HUGE decision as to what to do with it once the "Hassle Factor" has overtaken the "Fun Factor". In meantime, hopefully within a few months I'll have double main continuous run loops w/switching here in my computer room upon which to scratch the 3-rail itch.

Hardest part will be dealing with some "take aways" that accommodating 3-rail will entail.

Andre

Last edited by laming

6-28627 C&O Berk Junior for 0-27 (or similar JR) can/railsounds/conventional (I don't think its full tmcc..??)  I park it's tender powered for the cycling and bell. I was used to hearing a switcher bell for hours on end, non-stop. The two toghether make for a soothing symphony of ambiance when the rails get quiet fiddling, etc.

... the old Berk is kinda long in wheelbase and needs 31or 36 curves period.

Talk about prices and climbing. The 333 takes off every time I look serious at one.  Same with a Wyandotte streamiliner w/ Indian brave logo and Marx Mercurys. They were giving away sets a while back for what todays beaters may fetch. I would settle for a cheap shell of either about now. Ol Yella, the cheap bump and go trolley eludes me and the new died WAY too soon for another round of those yet.

Wanton spending can effect the bid costs imo, driving prices up artificially until a broad sampling can once again accurately show the averages. A lowball win does the same. Neither truely reflect market value imo; just some luck, some  greed, or apathy.  (I dont hound for last minute lowballs or walk away from yard sales giggling with a $10 boxed 2332 in tow either)

Just because you can throw some weight around, doesn't mean you should beat up the whole playground daily to be 1st thru last in line on the slide . 🤔

Some folks even overbid just to put the thumbscrews on others. Not to shill, but because they like to taste tears.

Well, I think y'all were right: Patience, and keep watching.

I actually wasn't ready to take the plunge and purchase just yet, but I was curious about the pricing and sale prices of the 2055/2065 type Lionel PW "Baby" Hudson's, so I have been frequenting the Bay, as well as the sale site at the link provided above.

As expected, the "Buy It Now" and "Opening Bid" prices on the Bay were way "up there". Prices were much better at the other site, but typically the models needed some help, or were being offered with non-whistle tenders. (Whistling tenders are essentially a "must" for me and Lionel PW steam.)

However, over on the Bay, a couple/three standard auctions appeared. One auction was a package deal. Long story short, I placed a bid that I felt would result in an acceptable price point for me, and surprisingly, mine was the winning bid and the sale price was lower than my maximum bid I had entered!

SO, I ended up purchasing my first PW items in years: A 2055 engine, a 2065 engine, and a 2046W tender for less than any of the decent looking 2065 w/tender listings! Quite surprising. In this one purchase I was able to obtain two engines that were on my long term "find/purchase" list, as well as a 2046W tender. They should be shipped tomorrow.

I'm really looking forward to their arrival. I really enjoy the heft of Lionel PW steam and I enjoy tinkering with them. (i.e. Cleaning them up, fixing any issues, tuning them, etc.) Can't wait!

Andre

Yes Frank, you've got a pair of mighty fine looking engines. I think between the two styles of baby Hudson's (Berk boilers and Baldwin boilers) the Baldwin boilers are my favorite. I hope to have examples of all of the the baby Hudson's "one of these days".

A few years ago I parted with my 665. (Pictured here shortly after I had cleaned it up and serviced it.) I've regretted selling it several times since.

Picture 012

This time, I intend to keep my Postwar purchases. My wife can feel free to sell them after I no longer have a need for them.

Andre

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Last edited by laming

Andre, 20 years ago I followed the same path you are on now. HO most of my life but decided to get the Lionel set I had as a kid. For the first 5 years or so I was totally satisfied with traditional trains.

These are a few of my Hudsons that include Williams and K-Line. One you may not be familiar with is cab number 5340. Its a 2046 mechanism with an engine shell and tender offered by Charles Ro. Its truely a baby 700E closer to a NYC Hudson than the Berk body 2046.

Pete

Last edited by Norton

Zero bids are not unusual.  I get some and that's not a problem.  Anyone who sells a lot and doesn't get some zero bids is probably starting too low.  I make he opening price the absolute minimum that is worth while when including my time for packing and shipping.  Sometimes during the ten days of the auction no one comes along who is willing to buy at that price.  But then I set the same price as a buy-it-now and eventually it sells.  That just means the buyer willing to pay that price wasn't looking during the ten day auction window.

@franktrain posted:

Here's a completed auction yesterday for a postwar Alco Santa Fe 223. Anyone know why such a huge price?   

D420187F-D5FA-4192-AC88-96F91B383F62

I believe I read several days ago in a "postwar" posting thru Collector's Weekly that the #223 was considered to be the rarest of the SF Alcos. Really? Not to trample on someone's idea of a good loco, but those Alcos are like child's toys compared to much better running, better looking, better detailed early postwar Alcos that were ditched by Lionel by the mid-to-late 50s. You need to be a stamp-collector to want to spend seven hundred bucks on a POS like those babies, but some people hate their money, I guess.

I reckon it's whatever you think you kin git out of it?

Fortunately for me, I'm not interested in the big aluminum cars. To my demented mind, they wouldn't look "right" behind my Baldwin Hudson's, or my cast frame FA's. (I'm a bit anal about trying to keep my traditional stuff proportionally congruent.)

When it comes time for passenger cars, I'll be looking for the PW "generic" ("Lionel Lines") shorty cars along with the modern-era release of the Pullman Green "Baby Madison" set. (I've had two of those Pullman Baby Madison sets over the decades and stupidly sold both.)

Andre

d_8016Andre, even though I only run scale trains now, I still have a love for the 50s Lionel and will never loose it. I remember going into Browns Dept. store in Mill Valley Ca. and just sitting in front of a wall of Lionel trains. I wanted an Alco Erie so bad. I alway asked my Pop for it but he would just say you have an engine now why do you want another one. I did save my money an bought a full size Madison car for 10 bucks. Wish I could have bought all of them. I thought it was the most beautiful thing in the world. Still have it. A good friend I'm helping is giving me a mint set of the green 027 cars from the 40's. I'm going to run it around the tree this Christmas with my 2026 I got in 1948. Have a great night. Don

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Last edited by scale rail
@lee drennen posted:

There’s  a lot of that on sleezbay 

The posting of slanderous remarks like that is quite inappropriate.  I've been both a buyer and seller on eBay for about six years having sold over a thousand train items and bought well over a hundred.  In 99.9% of those transactions there has been a satisfied buyer and a satisfied seller.

It's an excellent market place for old trains.  If you aren't smart enough to avoid stuff that's overpriced, that's your problem.  Most items that are priced too high go unsold.  If you don't believe that study the sold prices on items that interest you.

@scale rail posted:

d_8016          Andre...

....I still have a love for the 50s Lionel and will never loose it....

I understand, Don, boy do I understand.

I enjoyed your reminisce. I agree about the Erie Alco's: One of Lionel's classiest scheme renditions ever. (Those Erie's in the pic are in excellent condition!)

I've denied/disciplined myself for several years now to not sink money into PW again (I've had three acquire/sell off cycles since the 1990s)... but my attraction for it just won't go away. SO, I've promised myself that this time, no matter what, I will NOT sell off any PW I acquire.

Now, I don't intend to get silly with it like I did in the 1990s... but I would like to have a very nice selection of PW steam engines, a few cast frame FA's... and some rolling stock that compliments my late-40s/early-50s era and theme choices. I have a small space that I can use for a semi-permanent layout... but that's on down the track before I need to decide on that.

You have a great night, too, Don.

Andre

<snip>

It's an excellent market place for old trains. 

<snip>

It's my only place to buy old trains at this point. If it weren't for The Bay... I'd be a stuck duck.

(I keep forgetting to check OGR's "Sell" forum!)

I agree: 'Ya gotta' pay attention and keep your head cut-in about pricing/shipping/etc. What I have purchased off eBay the past few weeks, ended up being purchased at genuine "good" prices.

(Confession: I've really kicked myself for not acting immediately on a "Buy It Now" listing for a set of 2031's in really nice shape at the lowest price I've seen recently. Oh well!)

SO... in many ways, eBay is what you make of it. It's like the small bird whose habitat is the harsh desert: It flits about and draws nectar from the flowering plants it finds. A larger bird circles overhead, scanning the scorching hot desert looking for carrion to eat. Same environs, two different birds looking for two different forms of sustenance. One looks for the sweet, the other the putrid. They both find what they're looking for.

Many things in life depends on what we're looking for, whether looking for the good, or the bad, we typically find it.

Andre

Evilbay has always had lots of "Wishing" when it comes to asking prices.  Just as at some estate sales, they see the name "Lionel" and automaticly think its worth a small fortune.  When 9 times out of 10 its a super common lower end piece.   I recently picked up a nice 2343 powered/dummy pair for under $250 to my door.  But I can remember when a pair this clean would have commanded 500-900 with boxed examples this nice being over 1K in price.  For those that do not wish to run the new computerized stuff, nice postwar is still a good buy if your willing to put in some time searching and knowing whats out of line price wise and what is a good or even great deal.    AD

Well, my own opinion is that while separateing loco and tender is sort of a cardinal sin to me, the prices you can find for a good 2065 are still sort of a bargain.  I know they don't have modern sound and cruise and remotes, but they are great locos and just bulletproof with a little bit of care and service - they never give problems.  

Last edited by Lee Willis

The Bay:

I think the general consensus is...

* "Buyer beware". (Know the going price and pay attention to the shipping.)

* "Seller take care". (Do your homework on market price vs condition of the piece, and try to be reasonable on the shipping.)

When the above two factors are on the same page, a good transaction for both sides will result.

665/2065's...

I've had a weakness for them all these decades. I've owned three now. I think much of its appeal is that imposing feed water heater hung atop the front of smoke box. (In spite of it being incorrectly mounted, in regards to the prototype. Hey, it's a Lionel toy train! Lionel gets a pass on a lot of things!)

685/2055's...

Conversely, the lack of the feed water heater gives the 685/2055 its own appeal to me. The fact that it doesn't have that imposing feed water heater on the top, well, to me it makes it look more sleek and contrasts wonderfully with the 665/2065. Just like the 2065, I really like my 2055.

Yeah, yeah, I know, such prosing as the above about old trains may be silly sounding, but that's the way my eyes and mind interpret Lionel's PW stuff. I reckon it's sort of like me riding dirt bikes: If I have to explain it, you wouldn't understand it.

Andre

Last edited by laming

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