Star or home run wiring?

I think wires being the same length is a myth, but blocks are essential. I can say that about blocks from first hand experience.  I would also recommend Barry's book. On my layout I used the OGR wire and MTH terminal strips. The OGR wire is in pairs so you have a red & black in the same jacket. The wires going to each of my blocks are close to the same length, but the lengths going to each block are different. I have not had a problem in close to 4 years (since I got it all running).

Big Mike G,

   No need to have the wires the same length, that was a fallacy and proven incorrect a long time ago.  Just remember to set up your DCS layout in blocks, no more than 13 Track joins to any one block, in fact I limit most of mine to 10 Joins.  Use as many long track pieces in your layout as you possibly can, its the Track joins that degrade your DCS signal, not the actual length of the track.  Your DCS TIU Red Channel wire goes to the mid rail, DCS TIU Black drops to the outside rail.  If you are running Legacy, run one Legacy drop from the outside Black DCS TIU Black Post, to a outside Track Rail.  Then run a Legacy Drop directly from the Legacy Base unit, to the opposite outside rail, from the original DCS/Legacy Drop.  This gives you a strong double sided Legacy signal.   In this manner your DCS should also have nearly a 10 signal all around your layout.  Pay no attention to the signal strength at your switches. 

PCRR/Dave

Thanks guys, RTR I do have Barry's book on my computer, wish I would have got the hard copy. I bought the DCS video cause I learn better from watching and seeing what is really going on!

I know I am going to have many more questions when the time comes! Thanks again!

I have my layout blocked .  I use 1 set of wires to a terminal block and from there they go to the insulated blocks.

Barry's DCS book is excellent, Barry not as much...

Thanks for the insite John! 

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

Big Mike G,

   No need to have the wires the same length, that was a fallacy and proven incorrect a long time ago.  Just remember to set up your DCS layout in blocks, no more than 13 Track joins to any one block, in fact I limit most of mine to 10 Joins.  Use as many long track pieces in your layout as you possibly can, its the Track joins that degrade your DCS signal, not the actual length of the track.  Your DCS TIU Red Channel wire goes to the mid rail, DCS TIU Black drops to the outside rail.  If you are running Legacy, run one Legacy drop from the outside Black DCS TIU Black Post, to a outside Track Rail.  Then run a Legacy Drop directly from the Legacy Base unit, to the opposite outside rail, from the original DCS/Legacy Drop.  This gives you a strong double sided Legacy signal.   In this manner your DCS should also have nearly a 10 signal all around your layout.  Pay no attention to the signal strength at your switches. 

PCRR/Dave

Would it help if one was to solder track sections together?

I also started out with the digital version of Barry's book. Soon after I ordered the printed copy and have been buying/using those ever since. You can take them to the layout or where ever you need them and I just like the books better for reading as well. The digital copy is nice for finding things faster using the search. I now usually purchase both whe a new version comes out. Lots of good info in those books! The DCS video is good, I got it in 2011 or so, but it is a bit outdated now. The book is more current and Barry usually updates it as new features are added.

As John P explained above, I did the same as he says. One pair of wires from one TIU channel to each MTH terminal strip and from there as many pairs as I needed for my blocks being fed from that terminal strip.

Mike G,

   Although the OGR Video Guide to DCS is a might dated, there is still a wealth of great information visually presented and you can re-watch it any time you want.  Rich Melvin did a great job with this educational DCS video.

John P Jr,

  I do hope you and Barry are good friends.

PCRR/Dave

BALIDAS,

What kind of Track are using?

PCRR/Dave

Pine Creek Railroad posted:

BALIDAS,

What kind of Track are using?

PCRR/Dave

Super O. I've been thinking to solder 3 maybe 4 sections together to make some extended straights.

There is a debate whether soldering track sections together will make it count as one section. I was told by one knowledgeable person that soldering eliminates the joint and another knowledgeable person said every time there is connection it counts as one joint. solder or pin its the same. Soldering track joints did not help my pike with signal, but electricity likes it. Would be nice to get the latest information on this?

Mike G

I do hope you and Barry are good friends.

Barry is one of my favorite guys to give a hard time to. He reminds me of friend who I love giving it to a long time ago. Barry is a good guy.

Me not so much. 

clem k posted:

There is a debate whether soldering track sections together will make it count as one section. I was told by one knowledgeable person that soldering eliminates the joint and another knowledgeable person said every time there is connection it counts as one joint. solder or pin its the same. Soldering track joints did not help my pike with signal, but electricity likes it. Would be nice to get the latest information on this?

Clem,

There track section count approach is an easy way to arrive at a length without measuring. The length of rail that the DCS signal must travel is the limiting factor.

So, with track sections ~ 12" one can estimate the length for a block. The mileage on this can vary, meaning some operate DCS with longer blocks than others and have no problems.

Soldering provides a good electrical connection, but doesn't reduce the length of the block. I don't see why there would be a debate, as it is not about track joints.

As PCRR/Dave has pointed out, dispelling myth one of DCS wiring is equal length wires.

Myth 2 is having to use a distribution block. I have worked on layout rebuilds where the owner's used bus wiring with feeds and have no problems with DCS signal.

I have spoken with professional layout builders that use bus wiring and the customer wants DCS.

Ask Marty Fitz, his layout has not changed in twenty years. He operates DCS and Legacy with bus wiring. Check out National Capital Trackers and the North Penn O Gaugers that operate DCS and TMCC/Legacy on a huge modular layout, which is definitely bus wiring with blocks.

So, to Mike G., I say run bus wiring for your around the wall layout. Divide each loop into four blocks for the main and one for the reversing loop island. Then you can run any system that you like.

I can't say that I have dispelled Myth 2, but there is a lot experience that proves otherwise.

A terminal strip will certainly make troubleshooting easier.

Thanks for the information everyone.

Carl, please tell me if I am right or wrong. I have a Z4000, I plan on running the inner loop off one handle to a MTH Terminal strip and then as you said make 4 blocks. Then for the outer loop I plan on using the other handle and doing the same thing. Just wondering if this is a good way to go?

Thanks again for all the help!

The National Capital Trackers, and other modular clubs, cannot use star wiring due to the nature of show setup and operations.  We use bus wiring.  The layout configuration changes with each show so the total length of the bus cannot be controlled.  We do not dictate the type of track and the number of track joints per module (and bridge tracks between modules cannot be soldered).  We went through several iterations of DCS signal improvement schemes - blocks, filters, bulbs, magic incantations, cursing the DCS demons, etc.  What finally worked was demanding the bus wiring be standardized with 12g pairs (hot and ground) for each main line.   No common ground except tying all the grounds together at the TIU. Each main line is fully isolated from other tracks.  Crossing tracks between main lines have the ground rails fully isolated.  Yards and sidings are fully isolated.  No accessories draw main line power.  Legacy signal is fed with a single wire to the common ground. 

Our approach works for big layouts (i.e., the 120 ft. long York layout).

If you have an around-the-room layout, DCS will work fine on bus wiring - but keep each track's power bus (that carries the DCS signal) separate from all the other powered devices.

Thanks John!

Tom, that sure is some great looking work! I must say my last layout was a mess, I am going to try and keep it neat like you and others have shown!