From an email from Scott Mann an hour ago:
"JUST ANNOUNCED: 3rd Rail is producing the SD40-2 Diesels in stunning detail in your favorite road names. We welcome your reservations . Expect these beasts to arrive in the the fall of 2017. Please visit our web site and choose your favorite livery."
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Hey this is fantastic!
great news modern modelers!
How cool is that.
Excellent news! Thanks for sharing Bill!
Thankfully, there are no new SP or DL&W models. My wallet can breathe a sigh of relief. And the Erie Lackawanna ACE 3000 provided the comedic relief I needed today.
Bob, Don't forget you can write in a roadname, assuming if Scott get's enough requests they would be done. 
Scott has added N&W to the list. All are planned to be low hood so if you want Southern, N&W or NS high hood you need to mention it to Scott so he can see if there is enough demand for high hoods. If not you will have to wait for MMWs SD-40s at a much higher price.
I'll be reserving a Chessie System SD40-2. Now to convince Scott to do a GP30 Kinda funny to hear you call an SD40-2 "modern" Erik :-)
I pout myself down for a couple of Scott's SD40-2's in Chicago Northwestern, now to buy enough to get them made
I'll spring for 2 CSX SD40-2's unless enough requests to do a run of Wheeling & Lake Erie SD40-2's can be met.
My gut feel is Scott will end up doing multiple runs of this VERY popular locomotive!
Scott will have to talk to the builder regarding the additional cost for the high hood as for how many units will be required to get it done. My guess is around 50 including Southern, NW and NS. The tooling cost for the SD7/9s was not quite double the E and F units so tooling costs for hood units is becoming a significant piece of the cost structure.
Great y'all are emailing Scott with units you'll reserve that are not listed. Keep it up. The possibilities were overwhelming so the initial pick was a total WAG.
The Conrail units are in a similar situation as the high hoods as they sat on older trade-in trucks for which tools need to be made.
I've also told Scott I may sponsor/guarantee the Milwaukee Bicentennial unit if there is any interest. Email me or Scott if interested. We shall see.
Mike DeBerg posted:My gut feel is Scott will end up doing multiple runs of this VERY popular locomotive!
And more F7s ????
Soooooo wish Scott would do this in S gauge with TMCC! I would be in for half the road names he has listed.
Ben
Hi RDUNN,
The Conrail SD40-2s were ordered with Flexicoil trucks (while other roads used the HTC truck).
These Flexicoil trucks on the CR SD40-2s were not trade-ins.
I have read that the Flexicoil trucks used on early Conrail SD50s were trade-ins from CR SD9s and SD35.
By that rational (and if valid), couldn't the SD7/9 Flexicoil truck sideframes be used?
Probably the most significant O scale locomotive announcement in a decade.
Not my era but certainly one of, if not the most significant locomotive of the past 50 years.
Tell me again how O scale is dying?
Rule292 posted:Probably the most significant O scale locomotive announcement in a decade.
Not my era but certainly one of, if not the most significant locomotive of the past 50 years.
Tell me again how O scale is dying?
Not "the most significant O Scale locomotive announcement in a decade" if those who want a particular SD40-2 and it can't be made because of tooling cost. Especially when it is popular roads. We will wait and see how this all pans out. I will not be ordering any.
Stephen
nw2124 posted:Rule292 posted:Probably the most significant O scale locomotive announcement in a decade.
Not my era but certainly one of, if not the most significant locomotive of the past 50 years.
Tell me again how O scale is dying?
Not "the most significant O Scale locomotive announcement in a decade" if those who want a particular SD40-2 and it can't be made because of tooling cost. Especially when it is popular roads. We will wait and see how this all pans out. I will not be ordering any.
Stephen
I dabble in a couple of different scales. HO being one of them. This announcement got me thinking about the recent announcement by ScaleTrains for their "Rivet Counter" SD40-2. Apparently it will feature not only road specific details, but road number specific details. If I were a betting man I would bet that the HO model will be more detailed and accurate. I could be wrong, we'll see. List prices are $199.99 vs. $729.99 both having DCC and sound factory installed. I'm working on both an O scale switching pike and an HO module right now. I'm not sure which way I'm going to go on these now that I've thought about it a bit. I'll probably wait to see the SD7 first before making a decision.
Jonathan, Certainly understand your situation, but this is a great problem to have.
Unless you make your tooling modular, similar to Scaletrains.com and Athearn Genesis are doing to allow for more of that road and roadnumber specific details it will be hard to match that level of accuracy. So here in lies an opportunity, do the SD40-2 in phases, it's got such a long life span, many multiple owner locomotives, modifications, etc. If you're looking at the higher end line, this is almost a must, if you're wanting to minimize the variations then it may not matter except for just breaking them up into multiple runs from a production standpoint. The SD40-2 can easily be a cornerstone product in one's product line if done correctly.
nw2124 posted:Rule292 posted:Probably the most significant O scale locomotive announcement in a decade.
Not my era but certainly one of, if not the most significant locomotive of the past 50 years.
Tell me again how O scale is dying?
Not "the most significant O Scale locomotive announcement in a decade" if those who want a particular SD40-2 and it can't be made because of tooling cost. Especially when it is popular roads. We will wait and see how this all pans out. I will not be ordering any.
Stephen
Stephen,
Since you were interested in Midwestern Model Works locomotives, after Sunset’s announcement related to the SD40-2, do you think Erik will still be offering the same model as his next project?
From following Sunset’s announcement in the email newsletter & from following the comments on the 2-rail & 3RS forum, I get the impression that Sunset will be offering road specific details for the popular road names. So that leaves Erik to offer SD40-2 in the less popular road names that have unique details that Sunset couldn’t economically make.
As a disclaimer I am not interested in the SD40-2 but I would be interested in the next project, Erik has on his website, the AC4400CW.
These are just my opinion,
Thanks,
Naveen Rajan
Comparing HO to O is not really fair. The market for HO has to be an order of magnitude higher. Once you recover your non-recurring costs (research, fixtures, molds, setup, testing, fixing errors, etc), each succeeding model probably costs a hundred dollars to produce. If you spread your development costs over fifty models, each will cost way more than if you spread the same costs over a thousand models.
An O Scale model built to today's exacting standards will by definition be better detailed than an HO model, and will probably cost ten times as much because of the limited market.
Opinion.
EMD posted:Hi RDUNN,
The Conrail SD40-2s were ordered with Flexicoil trucks (while other roads used the HTC truck).
These Flexicoil trucks on the CR SD40-2s were not trade-ins.
I have read that the Flexicoil trucks used on early Conrail SD50s were trade-ins from CR SD9s and SD35.
By that rational (and if valid), couldn't the SD7/9 Flexicoil truck sideframes be used?
Thanks! I did not know that.
The SD7/9 trucks cannot be used because the brake rigging is completely different and the sideframes are pretty much cast as a single piece. The E units were the last to use sideframes with all the brake rigging as an add on detail. Turns out the cost of tooling is less than the cost of labor to assemble them: who knew.
Bill McBride posted:Mike DeBerg posted:My gut feel is Scott will end up doing multiple runs of this VERY popular locomotive!
And more F7s ????
Not likely. Nowhere near the interest required expressed for any repeats or new roads. The additional units for the Empire Builder and demonstrators has only added up to about 20% of the minimum required.
Mike DeBerg posted:Jonathan, Certainly understand your situation, but this is a great problem to have.
Unless you make your tooling modular, similar to Scaletrains.com and Athearn Genesis are doing to allow for more of that road and roadnumber specific details it will be hard to match that level of accuracy. So here in lies an opportunity, do the SD40-2 in phases, it's got such a long life span, many multiple owner locomotives, modifications, etc. If you're looking at the higher end line, this is almost a must, if you're wanting to minimize the variations then it may not matter except for just breaking them up into multiple runs from a production standpoint. The SD40-2 can easily be a cornerstone product in one's product line if done correctly.
When a production run is 5000 units and the second of 5000 is a sure thing it is feasible. When a production run is 500 and a second 500 is very questionable not so much.
I suggested offering an SD38-2 because the only differences with an SD40-2 are the dynamic brake and radiator areas that could be done with modular tooling. That got put in the "lets see how this goes first" pile.
Scott is starting to offer some HO things and he gets more reservations in about a month for an HO item than he will get in total for any one of these diesels or passenger cars/trains.
Looks like 3rd rail is listing a 2017 delivery. A good thing, since these fill a big hole for the modern 2 rail O scale modeler.
For operators, running a 2 to 4 unit consist could get pricey, but given the excellent running qualities of 3rd rail diesels this might be a "bargain" though $700 is getting up there in price.
nw2124 posted:Not "the most significant O Scale locomotive announcement in a decade" if those who want a particular SD40-2 and it can't be made because of tooling cost. Especially when it is popular roads. We will wait and see how this all pans out. I will not be ordering any.
Stephen
At least you're closer to having the most accurate non-brass SD40-2 in O scale, you can always do what all of us have done for the past 50 years - Paint and scratchbuild.
All versions of SD40-2 from Weaver, MTH & Lionel were all clones of each other. The trucks were located too far inward and the cabs were non dash 2 cabs.
The SD40-2 is one of EMDs most tried and true locomotives with 3,982 units built, compared to 4,112 GP9s (which have already been accurately done).
I wouldn't be surprised if Lionel announces a Built to Order SD40-2
SPSF posted:nw2124 posted:Not "the most significant O Scale locomotive announcement in a decade" if those who want a particular SD40-2 and it can't be made because of tooling cost. Especially when it is popular roads. We will wait and see how this all pans out. I will not be ordering any.
Stephen
At least you're closer to having the most accurate non-brass SD40-2 in O scale, you can always do what all of us have done for the past 50 years - Paint and scratchbuild.
All versions of SD40-2 from Weaver, MTH & Lionel were all clones of each other. The trucks were located too far inward and the cabs were non dash 2 cabs.
The SD40-2 is one of EMDs most tried and true locomotives with 3,982 units built, compared to 4,112 GP9s (which have already been accurately done).
I wouldn't be surprised if Lionel announces a Built to Order SD40-2
Eventually MMW will make a very accurate brass SD40-2 and if all indications are correct Erik will be hitting it out of the park.
In the meantime the current 3rd rail release remains as the most significant second generation EMD being offered given the sheer popularity of the model and the fact that they are still running (and running well) today.
Yep, this is the most significant model release in the past 10 years for 2r O scale for that reason... and I don't even model "that era".
bob2 posted:Comparing HO to O is not really fair. The market for HO has to be an order of magnitude higher. Once you recover your non-recurring costs (research, fixtures, molds, setup, testing, fixing errors, etc), each succeeding model probably costs a hundred dollars to produce. If you spread your development costs over fifty models, each will cost way more than if you spread the same costs over a thousand models.
An O Scale model built to today's exacting standards will by definition be better detailed than an HO model, and will probably cost ten times as much because of the limited market.
Opinion.
That is true. I think a comparison is absolutely valid though. This is a hobby. Each of us makes a personal value assessment before we purchase based on quality, detail, sound, running qualities, etc... Adding scale in to that equation as one of the variables is not out of the question. For someone like me who is starting a new layout build I don't mind switching scales, selling off my O and going to HO if it's worth it. For someone with an existing layout and decades worth of collection it would likely be a different story.
So I have to ask myself if I want to spend orders of magnitude more for equal or less detail and accuracy. Sorry to derail this. I'm sure this will be a great model for Scott. I'm happy for my 2 and 3 rail friends that really want them.
Jonathan,
I see by your picture that you wear glasses and you appear to be in your late 30's or early 40's. If your eyes behave like mine, your eyesight will deteriorate over the next 40 years. I am glad I stayed with O Scale. It is much easier to see and work on than even S Scale, in which I dabbled temporarily. This was my practical approach to deciding which scale to choose. Besides, I like the heft of O Scale.
Best of luck with your decision.
Ed
Yes - if the impressive size of O Scale is not what grabs you, then HO is the place to be, for variety, detail, and especially cost. The smaller models hold zero interest for me.
Ed Kelly posted:Jonathan,
I see by your picture that you wear glasses and you appear to be in your late 30's or early 40's. If your eyes behave like mine, your eyesight will deteriorate over the next 40 years. I am glad I stayed with O Scale. It is much easier to see and work on than even S Scale, in which I dabbled temporarily. This was my practical approach to deciding which scale to choose. Besides, I like the heft of O Scale.
Best of luck with your decision.
Ed
You nailed it Ed. I'm 42 and wear glasses for distance. Recently the near field vision is starting to go too. That is what caused me to rule out of N scale. I don't want to come off as anti-O. I love the size of O scale. Truth be told I think S is the perfect size, but that's another story... I believe you speak wisdom and I will certainly be considering that.
Thanks
Scott Mann....How about the Susie-Q? Atlas O did one number and they sold out and those fortunate enough to have purchased them are in no rush to relinquish them...give the rest of us a chance to get one this time. 3010 was an SD40T-2 (Ex-UP 8590 - SP 5397 née DRGW SD40T-2 5397) but reclassified as an SD40-2 by the NYS&W. The 3022 was an SD40 (Ex-BDLX 1605 - NS 1605 - née N&W SD40 1605 (not a dash-2) (was a high-hood)) but reclassified as an SD40-2 by the NYS&W after the hood was chopped.
NEPA posted:Scott Mann....How about the Susie-Q? Atlas O did one number and they sold out and those fortunate enough to have purchased them are in no rush to relinquish them...give the rest of us a chance to get one this time. 3010 was an SD40T-2 (Ex-UP 8590 - SP 5397 née DRGW SD40T-2 5397) but reclassified as an SD40-2 by the NYS&W. The 3022 was an SD40 (Ex-BDLX 1605 - NS 1605 - née N&W SD40 1605 (not a dash-2) (was a high-hood)) but reclassified as an SD40-2 by the NYS&W after the hood was chopped.
Since neither locomotive is really an SD40-2, despite what the railroad calls them, I doubt 3rd Rail will be offering these anytime soon. Now, if 3rd Rail decides to invest in the tooling for an actual SD40T-2 or an SD45T-2, my budget is in serious trouble.
RDUNN,
Just want to mention that both Norfolk Southern and CSX SD40-2s can be modeled with the Flexicoil trucks (as former Conrail units).
How are the sounds of these 3RD RAIL engines compared to the legacy sounds of Lionel?
Grand Trunk Western's GTW 5936 was in Kalamazoo, Michigan in August 2016.
It was from the Missouri Pacific/Union Pacific.
This is the one that I would have to purchase.
Andrew
This is great news. I hope time is taken to get the different components precise so they can be used on future models i.e. cab and trucks etc. It can only lead to other roadnames and other SD and GP models. I would also like to encourage a truck design that would allow a modeler to easily relocate the pivot of the truck from between the 2/3 wheelset to the middle of the center wheelset. This would allow modelers with larger curves to have the truck pivot like the prototype. I hope to make this modification to my Sunset E7 units. The other thing is the pay close attention to the height of the SD40-2 units height above the rails. If they are up in "air" I am not going to be happy.
With the mastery of the Blomberg trucks for the F units, cabs from the SD40-2s it would be a natural for GP50s, GP40s, and GP38s along with their Dash - 2 variants to also get done. I for one would LOVE a trio of Southern Hi-Hood GP50s pulling some hot piggyback trains!
Green Bay & Western posted:How are the sounds of these 3RD RAIL engines compared to the legacy sounds of Lionel?
This can be a point of debate... depending upon whether you prefer absolute fidelity to the prototype or a bit of "artistic license" in favor of great sound. From what I understand, we're at the mercy of ERR on the sound front. And Lionel tends to license "n-1" or "n-2" generation sounds to ERR -- instead keeping the ultimate locomotive sounds for its own Legacy brand products. Here's a link to current ERR sound boards via locomotive series... and you can be the judge.
http://www.electricrr.com/purchaseRailSnd.htm
Some are real winners , and some leave a LOT to be desired 
. The SD-series and GP-series sound boards seem to have great presence. So folks planning on getting an SD40-2 from 3rd Rail should be quite happy.
OTOH, I find the sounds of the E8/E9, F3, and FM-series locomotives to be somewhat lackluster (based on the sound-files featured on the ERR website). I have two 3rd Rail Canadian Pacific E8's on order from last year, and the word is production has slipped to 2017. I'm OK with the slippage, but please, please, PLEASE 3rd Rail... PLEASE choose a diesel sound package with modern-day presence. It's time for these companies to retire the "sick cow" diesel horn sounds once and for all -- whether it's prototypical or not. Other folks may have different opinions on the matter, so YMMV.
David
It would be nice to see them done in CNW livery, but then my wallet would take another hit. I can't recall which CNW purchased and which came as acquisitions from other roads, but some had dynamic brakes, while others did not. Maybe Andrew (FalconService) can clear this up.
Thank you for the info David. It is hard to beat the legacy sounds, but these aren't bad. I too did order a Amtrak E9 from them.
Rocky Mountaineer posted:Green Bay & Western posted:How are the sounds of these 3RD RAIL engines compared to the legacy sounds of Lionel?
This can be a point of debate... depending upon whether you prefer absolute fidelity to the prototype or a bit of "artistic license" in favor of great sound. From what I understand, we're at the mercy of ERR on the sound front. And Lionel tends to license "n-1" or "n-2" generation sounds to ERR -- instead keeping the ultimate locomotive sounds for its own Legacy brand products. Here's a link to current ERR sound boards via locomotive series... and you can be the judge.
http://www.electricrr.com/purchaseRailSnd.htm
Some are real winners
OTOH, I find the sounds of the E8/E9, F3, and FM-series locomotives to be somewhat lackluster (based on the sound-files featured on the ERR website). I have two 3rd Rail Canadian Pacific E8's on order from last year, and the word is production has slipped to 2017. I'm OK with the slippage, but please, please, PLEASE 3rd Rail... PLEASE choose a diesel sound package with modern-day presence. It's time for these companies to retire the "sick cow" diesel horn sounds once and for all -- whether it's prototypical or not. Other folks may have different opinions on the matter, so YMMV.
David
2 Rail models will get QSI Titan DCC sound. Hopefully they will come from the factory with the Q3 ET sound files as they make a huge difference. Here is an HO model with the 645 E3 prime mover as an example:
645 posted:AGHRMatt posted:It would be nice to see them done in CNW livery, but then my wallet would take another hit. I can't recall which CNW purchased and which came as acquisitions from other roads, but some had dynamic brakes, while others did not. Maybe Andrew (FalconService) can clear this up.
All CNW SD40-2's were purchased new from EMD and all had dynamic brakes. You are probably thinking of the secondhand SD45's CNW bought in 1983-1984. The original CNW SD45's lacked dynamic brakes but all the second handers had dynamics.
You can also look for a copy of the 320 page book "Diesels of the Chicago & North Western" by Paul Withers. Morning Sun Books has 4 volumes that cover CNW Diesels in color as well.
Thanks for the info.
With 4 Atlas SD40's (2 Wheeling & Lake Erie and 2 CSX) scheduled for a 2nd quarter 2017 release and now these SD40-2's from Sunset Models (Fall 2017) next year is going to be a great year for vintage EMD 6-axle power for me. I wouldn't be surprised if Sunset get their models delivered before Atlas. I hope I'm wrong.
The upcoming California Zephyr sets from Atlas will tell me a lot about how far they have progressed getting products delivered on time. They still have to make good on F3's and F7's. The latter was supposed to be delivered late 4th quarter 2015. The F3's will need to be delivered when the CZ sets arrive.
As far as sounds go, the best sounding EMD645 comes from ESU LokSound. This absolutely obliterates LEGACY RailSounds and MTH ProtoSound 3 for SD40's/-2's.
You can cast WRITE-IN votes if you order.
Here are some schemes not included:
CNW Original Yellow
CNW Safety Yellow
SOO LINE 1972-1973
SOO 1974 parallelogram.
Later SOO schemes.
GTW - red and blue
CP Rail Multimark
Andrew
ecd15 posted:Since neither locomotive is really an SD40-2, despite what the railroad calls them, I doubt 3rd Rail will be offering these anytime soon. Now, if 3rd Rail decides to invest in the tooling for an actual SD40T-2 or an SD45T-2, my budget is in serious trouble.
No doubt on those SD40T-2's 
AGHRMatt posted:It would be nice to see them done in CNW livery, but then my wallet would take another hit. I can't recall which CNW purchased and which came as acquisitions from other roads, but some had dynamic brakes, while others did not. Maybe Andrew (FalconService) can clear this up.
Top photo is an SD40-2. Bottom photo is straight SD40. no Dash-2
Which version of the Chicago & North Western paint scheme would you choose for the SD40-2?
1970's original yellow
1980's safety yellow or ZITO yellow
1990's Traditional yellow
Andrew
90s traditional yellow with the Operation Lifesaver scheme they did. I always liked the two the did in Falcon Service logo. I never really liked the Zito yellow, it looks like alien blood.
SPSF posted:AGHRMatt posted:It would be nice to see them done in CNW livery, but then my wallet would take another hit. I can't recall which CNW purchased and which came as acquisitions from other roads, but some had dynamic brakes, while others did not. Maybe Andrew (FalconService) can clear this up.
Top photo is an SD40-2. Bottom photo is straight SD40. no Dash-2
Thanks. Didn't even realize what I was looking at.
I never really liked the Zito yellow, it looks like alien blood.
Really? What species?
"...but certainly one of, if not the most significant locomotive of the past 50 years. "
The EMD "40" series locomotives:
Indeed the best all-around diesel locomotive EVER produced! If the Roundhouse Foreman gave me my pick of engines to operate my train, a consist of SD40-2's or GP40's would be my pick, hands down!
Its that species of Alien that bleeds electric yellow blood DUH!!!
Matt Makens posted:Its that species of Alien that bleeds electric yellow blood DUH!!!
Well, if you don't know then just say you don't know.... I only ask since I'm familiar with all sorts of reds, blues, and greens, but yellow is new to me.
I do believe its this one.
Don't get too many of those over in Omtose Phellack.....at least not for long.
catnap posted:With 4 Atlas SD40's (2 Wheeling & Lake Erie and 2 CSX) scheduled for a 2nd quarter 2017 release and now these SD40-2's from Sunset Models (Fall 2017) next year is going to be a great year for vintage EMD 6-axle power for me. I wouldn't be surprised if Sunset get their models delivered before Atlas. I hope I'm wrong.
My money is on Scott. I have zero faith in Atlas delivering an engine within 2 years of the original target.
Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Stafford
What about them? The cab and low short hood are completely different.
There is no way those -3 cabs are getting done. I prefer the standard cabs of the -2's anyway.
Delivery is scheduled for Fall 2017. I have 2 Wheeling & Lake Erie SD40-2's reserved. If 20 reservations aren't met for this road name then I will get 2 CSX. I wonder how long we have until all of the reservations are counted and production commences...
Hot Water posted:Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Stafford
What about them? The cab and low short hood are completely different.
As you are aware, it would require an entirely new cab and short hood to be prototypical. That is what I like about these engine, very different!
Regards, Swafford
Swafford posted:Hot Water posted:Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Stafford
What about them? The cab and low short hood are completely different.
As you are aware, it would require an entirely new cab and short hood to be prototypical. That is what I like about these engine, very different!
Regards, Swafford
Well maybe for a nominal fee, Scott Mann would be happy to make you 20 of that specific model.
i hope Scott will do the SD-45 as well later
Cor
Hot Water posted:Swafford posted:Hot Water posted:Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Stafford
What about them? The cab and low short hood are completely different.
As you are aware, it would require an entirely new cab and short hood to be prototypical. That is what I like about these engine, very different!
Regards, Swafford
Well maybe for a nominal fee, Scott Mann would be happy to make you 20 of that specific model.
you never know!
moonlicht posted:i hope Scott will do the SD-45 as well later
Cor
Do you mean SD45 or the SD45-2? The SD40 and SD45 have the same SD type three axle trucks, whereas the SD40-2 and SD45-2/SD45T-2 have the later design HT-C three axle trucks.
SD-45 as they are used by the D&RGW
don't know how different they are
if i take a look at the project from Midwestern then i see also different types off trucks.
i realy have no clu how or what
Cor
Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Swafford
The "SpongeBob".
Modular tooling for the cab and nose would facilitate this model easily, as well as high hoods, snoots, original and clean cab hood lengths, and possibly even Canadian safety cab versions. Plus allow for nose light positioning where appropriate. The nose lengths (and height) are as much a road specific detail on these models as bell and horn locations, or light packages.
I realize each nose requires an additional tool, and that of course costs money. In a short run environment, the nose and cab parts could be shared across many additional future models. Or possibly the sd40-2 may be the one model whose appeal is broad enough to warrant a different mindset about production numbers and tooling investment. Especially if the nose and cab parts could be used again in the future.
Or possibly some enterprising soul will start a new cottage industry a la Cannon and Co. in HO, supplying aftermarket parts to make these models more detailed and specific.
Jim
Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Swafford
Here ya go.
https://www.shapeways.com/prod...le?optionId=57827007
May sound expensive but it would cost Scott $5000+ for the tool so he would have to sell at least 45 just to recoup the cost of the tool.
rdunniii posted:Swafford posted:What about the CSX SD40-3 Rebuilds?
Regards, Swafford
Here ya go.
https://www.shapeways.com/prod...le?optionId=57827007
May sound expensive but it would cost Scott $5000+ for the tool so he would have to sell at least 45 just to recoup the cost of the tool.
I'm sure that Swafford will foot the bill for this effort - just send him the invoice.
Folks, I am in China working on the SD7/9 inspection. This factory treats these projects like brass projects. Each road has a detail specific list of requirements and application of brass details. Each paint scheme and lettering scheme is hand applied. It's an expensive but necessary process to give you the road specific model details you seek.
I will be meeting with my production manager and tooling manager in the coming days. I am well aware of the need for some modifications of the hood to give all roads a chance for production, with accuracy. That said, I will try my best to incorporate these designs in the SD40-2 project from the beginning so that we can have a project we can make now and in the future as demand dictates. It's a numbers game. There's a lot of up front costs and financial compromises to keep everyone happy. Factory, Customers, and ultimately you. We have a lot of fixed expenses that need to be met, and we try to balance everyone's needs to make this work.
Over the years, we have released many different models that other importers have been producing. We don't see an affect on one another, at least I am not aware of it. Brass models costing 3 X more still sell in their niche.
So we don't feel we are treading on other's project announcements. We just do what we are asked to do by our customers. So don't conjecture that we are out to get anyone. We just do what we do best.
In the 2 Rail sound arena, we have been working behind the scenes with QSI personnel and Josh of QSI solutions to produce a truly outstanding sound set for 2 Rail. The E8/E9 sounds will feature stereo sound and possibly 2 separate prime mover sounds as the E8s had these. To do this Q3 level of sound we needed a fast loader to ensure we could make last minute changes if needed during production. This has now happened. So 2 Rail E8/E9 customers will get this level of sound, as will future runs.
We have implemented in all journal bearings, ball bearing inserts in the truck side frames. 3 Axle trucks are sprung, 2 axle trucks are fixed in our diesels. This is now standard equipment for SD79 and future diesel productions. The results are outstanding. Very smooth, friction free starts. Quiet and smooth operation. I am really pleased with what I have seen so far.
So thanks again for your support and enthusiasm. Keep the suggestions coming, and we will do our best to support you in your hobby now and in the future.
Scott Mann - China
scott
any change you are doing SD45 in this run
or is there a second run for this model
i believe the SD45 is different comare to a SD40
Cor
moonlicht posted:scott
any change you are doing SD45 in this run
The EMD SD45 model is COMPLETELY different than the EMD SD40-2!
or is there a second run for this model
Second run of SD40-2 models?
i believe the SD45 is different comare to a SD40
Ya think! Besides, Scott is NOT offering the SD40. Only the SD40-2 has been announced, at this time. Please remember that the SD40-2 model has different 3-axle trucks (except for Contrail of course) than the older SD40/SD45s.
Cor
sdmann posted:Folks, I am in China working on the SD7/9 inspection. This factory treats these projects like brass projects. Each road has a detail specific list of requirements and application of brass details. Each paint scheme and lettering scheme is hand applied. It's an expensive but necessary process to give you the road specific model details you seek.
I will be meeting with my production manager and tooling manager in the coming days. I am well aware of the need for some modifications of the hood to give all roads a chance for production, with accuracy. That said, I will try my best to incorporate these designs in the SD40-2 project from the beginning so that we can have a project we can make now and in the future as demand dictates. It's a numbers game. There's a lot of up front costs and financial compromises to keep everyone happy. Factory, Customers, and ultimately you. We have a lot of fixed expenses that need to be met, and we try to balance everyone's needs to make this work.
Over the years, we have released many different models that other importers have been producing. We don't see an affect on one another, at least I am not aware of it. Brass models costing 3 X more still sell in their niche.
So we don't feel we are treading on other's project announcements. We just do what we are asked to do by our customers. So don't conjecture that we are out to get anyone. We just do what we do best.
In the 2 Rail sound arena, we have been working behind the scenes with QSI personnel and Josh of QSI solutions to produce a truly outstanding sound set for 2 Rail. The E8/E9 sounds will feature stereo sound and possibly 2 separate prime mover sounds as the E8s had these. To do this Q3 level of sound we needed a fast loader to ensure we could make last minute changes if needed during production. This has now happened. So 2 Rail E8/E9 customers will get this level of sound, as will future runs.
We have implemented in all journal bearings, ball bearing inserts in the truck side frames. 3 Axle trucks are sprung, 2 axle trucks are fixed in our diesels. This is now standard equipment for SD79 and future diesel productions. The results are outstanding. Very smooth, friction free starts. Quiet and smooth operation. I am really pleased with what I have seen so far.
So thanks again for your support and enthusiasm. Keep the suggestions coming, and we will do our best to support you in your hobby now and in the future.
Scott Mann - China
This is great news Scott! You are addressing the few issues I had. Kudos for making continual improvements.
What a brilliant business model, ask the customers what they want and if there's money there you build it. Then ask the customer how they want it and try to meet them there.
I have 4 2-rail Atlas SD40's ordered (2 W&LE and 2 CSX) so they should have the same QSI sound decoders as these SD40-2's from Sunset.
I'm looking forward to these future releases.
Cannap - I think you will find a big difference between the older model QSI decoder used in AtlasO diesels and the later design QSI Titan loaded with a Q3 sound set. You will also experience better starting / low speed performance than the Atlas model due to Sunset's single motor drive setup. For owners of earlier 2 rail Sunset 3rd Rail diesels you may want to consider investing in a QSI Programmer ( possibly with friends in your area) so you can replace the Q2 sound set with a Q3 one (available on the QSI Solutions web site). I did that for my E7's and was please with the improved sound and operation.
Jonathan-
How many Chessie units are you ordering? You said one up above but you could probably use 3 to 4...
Keystoned Ed posted:Cannap - I think you will find a big difference between the older model QSI decoder used in AtlasO diesels and the later design QSI Titan loaded with a Q3 sound set. You will also experience better starting / low speed performance than the Atlas model due to Sunset's single motor drive setup. For owners of earlier 2 rail Sunset 3rd Rail diesels you may want to consider investing in a QSI Programmer ( possibly with friends in your area) so you can replace the Q2 sound set with a Q3 one (available on the QSI Solutions web site). I did that for my E7's and was please with the improved sound and operation.
Ed - I've had very little success with QSI decoders, oth Titan and older. No problems with the sound but HUGE problems running them in consists. For some reason if you have a 2, 3 or 4 unit lashup not all of the locomotives will respond to commands in a reliable manner. If you have a four unit ABBA consist only 2 or 3 locos will respond to function commands. Once that happens (and is is virtually every time) you have to turn the power off and on to get them back in sync.
Bill McBride posted:Jonathan-
How many Chessie units are you ordering? You said one up above but you could probably use 3 to 4...
I think he wants a few Wheeling & Lake Erie units, as the rest of you should. At least 18 of you since I have the first 2 reserved...
Keystoned Ed posted:Cannap - I think you will find a big difference between the older model QSI decoder used in AtlasO diesels and the later design QSI Titan loaded with a Q3 sound set. You will also experience better starting / low speed performance than the Atlas model due to Sunset's single motor drive setup. For owners of earlier 2 rail Sunset 3rd Rail diesels you may want to consider investing in a QSI Programmer ( possibly with friends in your area) so you can replace the Q2 sound set with a Q3 one (available on the QSI Solutions web site). I did that for my E7's and was please with the improved sound and operation.
These 4 SD40's are preordered and are due 2nd quarter of 2017 so they'll probably come with the latest QSI soundsets. I'm planning on getting a programmer anyway.
I won't attempt to mix a China drive with a canon motor so the Atlas and Sunset models will not run together.
Folks, I confirmed, we are tooling the High Hood for Southern, NS and N&W (I think).
Scott Mann
Great news Scott! Thank you.
Neal Jeter
Scott: If you do the N&W SD40-2 High Hood do you know which paint scheme you will do. If it's not the one we want can we order one undecorated?
VGN64 posted:Scott: If you do the N&W SD40-2 High Hood do you know which paint scheme you will do. If it's not the one we want can we order one undecorated?
Which will be done depends on reservations. If 20 reservations for each of the possibilities are received then each of the possibilities will be done.
The same will be true for high versus low hood NW. If insufficient reservations are received for low hood but the high hood receives enough (or vice versa) then only the high hood will be made.
Interestingly undecorated requires the same 20 reservation minimum or a combination of some scheme plus undecorated equals 20. Eg., someone only wants to reserve 10 black and white high hood NW because it received insufficient reservations you can fill that reservation with 10 undecorated to equal the 20. As I understand it so long as there are 20 reservations per single paint and decals that works. That does NOT work to reserve 10 NW and 10 some other scheme or combination of schemes because the paint and decals still have to be applied to the other 10.
Come on guys reserve more CNW units
Matt Makens posted:Come on guys reserve more CNW units
Any idea how many have been requested in CNW?
I can't seem to find it ..... what is the minimum track radius for these SD40-2's?
Thanks
Being that it's a brand new model, anyone can throw a number out there, but until they are built and run, there is NO accurate number that can be verified.
Especially with fixed pilots.
Laidoffsick posted:Being that it's a brand new model, anyone can throw a number out there, but until they are built and run, there is NO accurate number that can be verified.
Especially with fixed pilots.
Thanks. Do you know what the minimum track radius is for the SD7/9's that were just shipped?
Well my SD7s are 3 rail and they run just fine on 072 which is a 36" radius.
Manual says O72 or O54 if you take the front coupler off
Atlas SD40's require a minimum 40.5" radius so I imagine that the Sunset SD40-2's will require the same, maybe 45." I have 49.5"
I think they are taking orders through March so perhaps by the end of this month or the beginning of next month we could get an update on how the reservations are going to see if some roadnames may not make the cut.
catnap posted:Atlas SD40's require a minimum 40.5" radius so I imagine that the Sunset SD40-2's will require the same, maybe 45." I have 49.5" ....
Thanks. And as far as Atlas turnouts, would #5 or #7.5 turnouts be the minimum. I'm completely new to 2-rail.
just curious , will the SD now being cancelled or is it a go?
i only see the the announcement in the newsletters for a year now that the SD probaly will be dumpt and a posible GP-40 is considered
Cor
Three rail SD trucks on the recent Sunset 7/9 models.
The SD40-2 is not cancelled. No projects really ever are. It just needs enough reservations to go forward. Right now I don't know the exact number but it's just not there. Scott and those of us who assist him thought this would be a great model for the market, especially 2 rail, for a good quality and accurate diesel that would be at home on a post 1972 layout to this day. The GP40-2 question is just that. A question. I'd love to see the SD40-2 go forward and it would be a nice gateway to more modern offerings. The interest just doesn't seem to be there at the moment.
As with everything, time will tell.
I did my bit; Reserved two in UP.
And what is the new guess estimate on price?
The reservation price is still up on the Sunset website at 729.95, realistically Scott needs 400+ reservations to produce at this price so a mix of 2 rail and 3 rail reservations is necessary to make this number. It would appear 2nd and 3rd generation diesels are simply not getting that support from 2 railers [opinion] and 3 railers have been inundated with these products from MTH and Lionel, it does not look promising for modern 2 rail diesel era modelers/collectors. JMO
Lionel did just put their version of the SD40-2 loco for 3-Rail in the latest catalog.
Nobody has made the GP40-2 or the Canadian GP40-2W.
Many of the GP40-2W are being used in the USA now by WATCO.
Andrew
falconservice posted:Lionel did just put their version of the SD40-2 loco for 3-Rail in the latest catalog.
Nobody has made the GP40-2 or the Canadian GP40-2W.
Many of the GP40-2W are being used in the USA now by WATCO.
Andrew
but what will this help me, i am running 2-rail
Cor
I placed an order for 2 W&LE SD40-2's (2-rail). If this project ever gained some traction I would probably add a 3rd.
Both Lionel's and MTH's SD40-2's are a joke.
Somebody put the CN repaint of the GTW SD40-2s that they got from the Union Pacific/Missouri Pacific.
I need the Grand Trunk Western scheme on the SD40-2s.
I am surprised that a few more people have not ordered the Grand Trunk Western variation.
It would be great to finally have the best SD40-2 diesel-electric locomotive model in 2-Rail and 3-Rail.
They have to show us how much better it is going to be over the Lionel and MTH/ex-Weaver versions.
Andrew
Scott has asked for interest in a GP 40-2 but I suspect that has not been strong enough for him to actually post GP 40-2 models for reservation. JMO
If they can produce a high short hood version of the SD40-2, Scott Mann has to make sure there is a true Canadian National Wide Safety Cabin version of the SD40-2 produced that they call the SD40-2W.
The GTW SD40-2 units should be the ones in the white, blue & red scheme, not the CN scheme.
Andrew
Just placed an order for a NS High Hood variation. Hope these get in the works soon before my mom finds out.
Max, you should run them in pairs or triples
I hope this thread stays current because it may inspire others who didn't know about it or were on the fence to reserve models. I don't own any 3rd Rail models but I'm well aware of their reputation for detail and craftsmanship.
I don't know if there would be enough reservations (20) to push through for W&LE, even though it's an awesome paint job/herald. In that case, I would shift my reservation to CSX or B&O (Chessie). Regardless of road name, I would like to have 2 or 3 of these and hope this project eventually meets enough reservations.
What Jonathan says can be considered an update
Question for Scott, will the NS version be equipped with orange strobe lights on top, signifying the locomotive is equipped for remote control operation? Also will the road number be from a former N&W or a SOU unit?
When I saw this thread in the 'Recent Posts', I became hopeful...
Have 2 Conrail Quality units on order & would consider a third (or maybe an NS unit)
Like CATNAP said, keep this thread going with the hopes of more orders
I just ordered 200 sets of gears and bearings for P:48 conversions. While emailing back and forth I asked Scott about the SD Project and he told me reservations are slow but the project isn't cancelled.
Jay
Maxrailroad posted:Question for Scott, will the NS version be equipped with orange strobe lights on top, signifying the locomotive is equipped for remote control operation? Also will the road number be from a former N&W or a SOU unit?
We haven't made any of these determinations yet. Design won't officially begin until there are enough preorders to allow the project to move forward. Depending on detail variations between Southern and NW we might do numbers for both. Not sure about the strobe since it would limit the use, but it all depends on what people put in the comments when they pre-order a unit. Request your desires. We take all that into partial consideration when it comes to detail specifics. The factory has limitations on how many variations they will do, but Scott does a great job of pushing them to do more all the time.
I have a Conrail 2 rail pre-ordered and a ATSF 3 rail pre-ordered. Conrail is out of my 2 rail modeling era, but I grew up with Conrail so why not?
good to see there is still a go for this project
would it be posible to ad something as a counter how far a project is doing ?
now i (and i think more people) are guesing how far is it or is it a no go.
i was almost giving up hope for these SD 's
Cor
Maxrailroad posted:Question for Scott, will the NS version be equipped with orange strobe lights on top, signifying the locomotive is equipped for remote control operation? Also will the road number be from a former N&W or a SOU unit?
I asked for the ex N&W HH 1630 as per the illustration when I placed the reservation back in Dec 2016 - I can live without the strobe - lets just get it made
moonlicht posted:good to see there is still a go for this project
would it be posible to ad something as a counter how far a project is doing ?
now i (and i think more people) are guesing how far is it or is it a no go.
i was almost giving up hope for these SD 's
Cor
Probably 3-5 years. If it was a go today it would be 15-18 months before delivery.
Maxrailroad posted:Question for Scott, will the NS version be equipped with orange strobe lights on top, signifying the locomotive is equipped for remote control operation?
I certainly hope that they wouldn't put one of those ugly things on top! Besides, it would limit the era.
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