The end of the dcs hand held controller?

Roving Sign posted:

I never called it a "replacement" for the TIU. It appears the existing products (sans handheld) will continue as the core product - and the DCS Explorer will serve as a conduit to a full fledged DCS setup.

 

What am I missing?

The mind boggles.   If you didn't say it was a replacement, what were you trying to say below?  Those were your words, how else could they be interpreted?  The TIU is a 4-channel device, however you equated it to the DCS Explorer, which is clearly a much less capable device.

If that's not what you mean, maybe more care in selecting your replies?

Roving Sign posted:

eddiem posted:

Three comments:

1) If MTH goes only wifi, then they should come out with a single wifi unit that is a combined WIU and TIU, at a price better than the current combined price of these two wifi-required items!

Coming in November - the DCS Explorer

http://mthtrains.com/50-1035

Just noticed a recent Post, Connecting LCS WiFi to a Home Network, I didn't read word for word but I'll admit, as I mentioned above, I'm not sold, or even interested in WiFi.

I also just watched a video by a member here, Adam Fischer, trying to create a lash-up, and having difficulty using the MTH app.

I'm sorry, I don't use apps, I only use my iPhone for communication and watching videos of my Grandson.

I guess I'll pass on the WiFi. Time to buy a couple of DCS handhelds to hold in reserve, along with my extra VCR's and DVD players!

Clem,

Is it possible to go backwards on the upgrade (downgrade)  ?

Sure, except it's a bad idea.

It won't fix any problems that you're experiencing and may introduce some new problems due to bugs in 4.30 that were fixed in 5.0 and 6.0. Also, you can't use WiFi in 4.30.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, however, mine is that there is no good reason to go back to DCS 4.30. Whatever problems one may be encountering are almost certainly not due to the DCS 6.0 software.

Just noticed a recent Post, Connecting LCS WiFi to a Home Network, I didn't read word for word but I'll admit, as I mentioned above, I'm not sold, or even interested in WiFi.

Post that on the Legacy Forum, where it belongs, after you do read it "word-for-word", so that you understand it.

I also just watched a video by a member here, Adam Fischer, trying to create a lash-up, and having difficulty using the MTH app.

Read Adam's last post on that thread.

Now that he has loaded DCS 6.0 in his TIU, which is a stated requirement for the Premier version of the DCS App, he's running lashups just fine. His only issue is that the lashups are missing their soft keys, a bug in the DCS App of which MTH is aware.

Re: Bluetooth.  It is my understanding that all Lionel locos (Legacy, Lionchief,  Lionchief Plus) will be coming in the future with Bluetooth.  The Lionel universal remote has Bluetooth built in for about $40 street price,  so those who prefer a physical remote, but don't want wi-fi, a Legacy base or TIU can use a physical remote for basic command control of all these products.  Inexpensive and simple, it seems to me. 

To me, the Explorer seems a step in the wrong direction, or no particular direction.  Not as capable as a TIU, but more expensive than Bluetooth.  Can you operate the Explorer with the DCS remote or is a tablet/smartphone the only option for controlling the Explorer? If so,  sort of neither fish nor fowl perhaps?  Leaving those who prefer the option of some sort of physical remote out in the cold?

I get it. Just like the guy who only runs conventional because it's starting to get over his head, right now WiFi control is not for me. I like devices that have specific purposes. Maybe I'm alone, so be it.

Multi tasking, all in one entertainment systems, great! If that's what your into. Can I text, or call my family while I'm running my trains on my iPhone? I'm for any advancement that will help draw new members into our hobby, if it does

It feels like freezing some operators out and forcing them out of there comfort zone.

I know I'm running off track with my next statement, but it's bad enough I'm afraid to run my older PS2 engines for fear that the electronics will fail. It's happened 3 times in a year before I started to see the threads on this problem. I only run recent equipment or at least swap out the batteries.

I only hope that repairs for damaged handhelds, as well as software upgrades, will be available long after the remotes are discontinued.

IRONMAN1.  I only hope that repairs for damaged handhelds, as well as software upgrades, will be available long after the remotes are discontinued.

I hadn't thought of that.  Is it even possible that future TIU upgrades might not continue to support a handheld remote? 

OK, 2nd try, if you are using an Apple device you do not have to look at the screen:

 

david1 posted:

Proto 3 can be run by blue tooth and yet from what I have read not one person has brought that up. 

No need for any extra equipment to run trains just the blue tooth app.

It looks like  the dcs explorer which will be in every train set, so is the Bluetooth based?

if not what does the dcs explorer really do? 

700e:

Have you tested that on Apple devices? The reason I ask is that Apple is pretty serious about accessibility guidelines. If there are accessibility issues with MTH's app then MTH needs to be made aware of them so they can fix them. I have known of apps that Apple has pulled from the app store because people have reported that the developers have refused to fix accessibility issues. When you tried it did you document the exact accessibility problem and relay that info to MTH? Hopefully later this week I'll be able to do some more testing. Can you mention specifically some examples of accessibility issues in the MTH app on Apple devices that I can test?

thanks

 

 

700E posted:

The operating systems of most Android and i-type devices have built-in accessibility apps, with names such as explore-by-touch and talkback, that support use by people with visual impairments.   Unfortunately, the user interface of the DCS app is only partially compatible with these accessibility apps.  (I tried it.)  Even for the cases in which the DCS app supports the accessibility apps, it can take so long to find and execute the desired function that reliable train operation (and crash avoidance) becomes impossible.  Bottom line is that, even with the apps that support vision-free operation of Android and i-type devices, you can't run the DCS app without looking at the device -- something that is definitely not true with the old fashioned remote.

I understand the comments about having a tactile based interface when it is necessary to place close attention constantly and visual interfaces amount to a distraction.  I don't see this as a significant issue because most layouts require you to set the throttles and occasionally you can operate the sounds or other accessories and that is about it.  Unless you have a very complex layout, set it and forget it seems to be the norm.  Hence the popularity of features such as cruise on the command locos.

The rest then comes down to personal preference.  I don't think either MTH or Lionel is trying to force anyone to abandon handhelds.  That being said, if there is a software application that will replace the handheld and that will be able to run on a device that the vast majority of households already have, that seems like a rational solution to the problem of hardware obsolescence and reliability.  Moreover, a tablet or phone has more expandability and can be upgraded over time as technology warrants.  This makes the hobby more interesting generally and appeals more to younger users that relate to things more through a phone or tablet.

I do think there will be some debugging and I went through that with the DCS wifi unit a few days ago, posted here about it.  The good thing is that you have people here on the forum who are experts and most of the issues are readily fixed.  Having adopted the wifi unit, I can tell you my kids love it and I wouldn't go back.  Not that the other modes of operation are bad, it is just that the tablet interface is easier for them to use.

Well, if using  a mobile device makes the toy train experience more attractive to a younger crowd, I'm for that. Will it make them a life long enthusiast is yet to be seen.

Real trains were the cutting edge technology of our time. Many of us here grew up with toy trains, fantasizing about being real engineers, or astronauts for that matter, and some have. Toy trains were the interactive toy of our childhood, and has lasted a life time. 

At times, we frequently like to just watch the trains run in our miniature worlds. The great thing about model railroading is that it can incorporate many creative aspects, electronics, model building, painting, weathering, scenery, etc. To keep the younger generation focused, we should also try to nurture those skills. Best yet, it's 3 dimensional, virtual reality will change that. 

I'm not into electronics, but I love to build models. Sometimes it's an all out detailed show piece, other times just glue together with a nice paint job. With the railroad, I may feel like doing scenery, wiring, building structures, or just running trains. We all have our favorite activities and gravitate to our desires.

I'm confident any bugs that exist with the new technology, will be worked out by the time I'm ready to explore it. If I do, I hope it's my Grandson who guides me along the way.

WiFi, mobile devices and apps, it's all good. It's just another road to follow, if we choose. Hopefully, if we don't follow that path, the one we have chosen doesn't say ROAD CLOSED at the end.

Barry Broskowitz posted:

Clem,

Is it possible to go backwards on the upgrade (downgrade)  ?

Sure, except it's a bad idea.

It won't fix any problems that you're experiencing and may introduce some new problems due to bugs in 4.30 that were fixed in 5.0 and 6.0. Also, you can't use WiFi in 4.30.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, however, mine is that there is no good reason to go back to DCS 4.30. Whatever problems one may be encountering are almost certainly not due to the DCS 6.0 software.

Curious what "bugs" in 4.3 were fixed in subsequent releases, bugs pertaining to general use?   I don't have a "lost the lashup" issue since I quit doing "read", which was unhooking the logical tie between the units.  Can't think of other issues I'm having with 4.3 ... am I missing something important by not upgrading, if I don't want WiFi, etc?

What specifically bug-wise?

Thanks!

KERRIGAN.... I wonder if there is a list of  things each update changed ? Things they fixed and things, that are for a lack of a better term, new bug.

Clem

Kerrigan,

There is absolutely no reason not to upgrade to DCS 6.0, except for any imagined reasons that exist solely in your mind. If you have difficulties actually performing DCS upgrades, I'd recommend that you either work through them or find someone to do upgrades for you. In that regard, I'd be happy to do your DCS upgrades ro you. Just cover the cost of shipping your DCS stuff to and from me.

The single biggest reason to update to DCS 6.0 is that, if you contact MTH with any kind of an issue with anything earlier than DCS 6.0, the first thing that they should, and hopefully would, do is to tell you to upgrade to DCS 6.0.

My personal take is that I'm not going to waste any time troubleshooting any issues that may crop up while using an older DCS release.

Clem,

Click here to see what's been added/fixed in DCS 6.0.

I also still prefer the DCS remote and don't even own a smart phone, I still have a flip phone that's probably 8 or 9 years old by now. I do have an iPad, the DCS Wifi unit and the Deluxe app, but have not yet upgraded my TIU to 6.0 (although it's coming soon). The iPad is a bit large for using to run trains, IMO. An iPad mini might be a better choice for it's smaller size, also IMO, but we have had the iPad for several years (before the mini's were available anyway).

I also have several iPods that have accumulated over the years and one was starting to have problems. Went over to the Apple store to look around for a replacement and ended up with an iTouch (it's all they have now). It's basically an iPhone that doesn't make phone calls. Thought I would also try it with the new Deluxe app to see if I was ready to switch to a smart phone. Well I've been using the iTouch every day since I got it a couple of months ago and am still liking it more each day. I think I am now hooked on it and all of it's features (some of which I am still discovering). Really a much, much more functional device than my older iPods. 

Anyway, I can now clearly see an iPhone coming soon and possibly even another iTouch (the old flip phone will finally get to retire). Maybe the switch to using the MTH app full time will be next? Then as an added bonus I ordered an inexpensive little Bluetooth stereo receiver to fiddle with as the iTouch has Bluetooth. Now I have music in the basement that can be controlled from my iTouch (which is now almost always in my pocket) from anywhere in the basement. No longer have to go back to the music PC to adjust volume, change playlists, songs, etc. and to me that is really handy!!

Now I am wondering why I didn't do all this a lot sooner? Just saying you don't know until you actually try something for yourself. This is not the first time something like this has happened to me, not seeing a need for something until I finally got one and then couldn't do without it. 

rtr12 posted:

Now I am wondering why I didn't do all this a lot sooner? Just saying you don't know until you actually try something for yourself. This is not the first time something like this has happened to me, not seeing a need for something until I finally got one and then couldn't do without it.  

That's what happens to a lot of folks. Technology is often something we don't really need because what we have generally still works and it's costly to try something new that we may not like. My daughters gave me an iPod many years ago and it finally started having problems so I switched to an iTouch. I also had that for quite a few years and never really used it, mostly because soon after I bought it we got smartphones and no longer really had a need for the iTouch.

Then a few years ago we wanted tablets and iPads were too expensive, so we went with Android like our phones. Unfortunately, we picked a brand (Toshiba) that soon got orphaned and that soured us on tablets, so we settled for new laptops. The aging eyes helped with that decision. We did get 2 more smaller tablets because they were free with other purchases, but we should have gone with iPads to begin with and just kept upgrading. Now tablets are losing favor, but I'm getting tired of lugging 2 laptops when we travel, so we're still thinking about iPads. Trouble is I think I want the large Pro with the keyboard to replace my laptop, not sure about Jeanette, so I'm going to play with my brother's smaller version next week to see how it works with its stand on my lap tray to simulate the laptop.

Even though I still haven't started my layout build, and it looks like it will be delayed until next spring now, I need to update my equipment, so a small test loop-2-loop will go back up and I think I'll start fiddling with wifi. As we drive from Savannah to Green Bay this week, we'll be stopping at Mr Muffin's on Wednesday and with some luck I hope to buy a diesel, if they have the one I want.

Either way, I feel your pain about technology and the hesitation. I've long wanted to upgrade our home with "smart" features like Alexa, Chromecast, wifi security cameras, speakers, thermostat, lighting, etc., but it's hard to figure out which system to buy into. If I decide to get the iPad, that will probably make the decision for me and I'll go with Apple's HomeKit and see where that takes us.

The wifi under the tree with a couple of trains was different and a good conversation piece. However, for my main layout with a dozen or so trains running the remote is my choice and will continue to be for the foreseeable future. With time, l'll experiment with the wifi and see how things like record/playback work. I did just purchase a new remote while they are available. So now I have a combination of 4.1,4.2 and 5.0 software. So far I haven't noticed any unusual problems. Pulling the plug on the remote is premature in my opinion. 

So now I have a combination of 4.1,4.2 and 5.0 software.

That's a bad idea and it makes troubleshooting much more difficult.

So far I haven't noticed any unusual problems.

Give it some time...  

Hi Dave,

Yes, I agree with the new tech stuff. I did the same thing with ipods, never saw a need until I finally got one. Then I couldn't do without one. Some things do get me right away, but some do not. I also just discovered my iTouch keeps track of how far I walk every day! Another neat feature. It only has wifi and there is none where I walk on the trails around here, but it somehow keeps pretty close track of the mileage. I was always going by the trail mile markers before and the iTouch is very close to the mile markers in distance measuring.

As for the iPads, we have an early version. My wife wanted it and then hardly used it. I have been using it too. My wife texts the kids and grand kids with it and that is about all. I think you will like the iPad Pro. It looks like it's plenty big enough to be able to read most everything on. I have been thinking about an iPad Mini as well, for train operation. Although so far I have been able to read the iTouch just fine so I may wait on that for a bit. Also my grandson has an iPad Mini and I may just try his first.

As for the phone, I will probably get an iPhone 6, the smaller one. I think you have to get the wireless earhones with an iPhone 7 and that's another $150 or so plus tax I think. I already have a bunch of wired earphones and they work just fine. I have a friend that recently got a Samsung smart phone (not the exploding/burning kind) and he tells me regularly that he wishes he had gotten an iPhone instead.

I also like the home automation stuff and the smart phone would allow all that to happen too. That is one newer tech item that I won't have to wait on, I have been interested in that for some time now, but had no smart phone or desire to get one until now. What will they think of next??

RTR12, I agree with everything except the iPhone part, but that's a personal preference. We have Samsung Note 5's and love them. However, if I do go with the iPad and HomeKit, our next smartphone will probably be an iPhone so everything works seamlessly. If your friend has other Apple products, that might explain his regret over not buying an IPhone. I much prefer Android and really don't like the iPad, iPhone, etc., but everything does work together more easily, so that's the reason I'd switch. The biggest negative will be having to keep my laptop to run SCARM.

Barry my plan is to give all this some time for debugging and then upgrade everything to 6.1!  I've got 5 tiu's and 4 remotes. I'm not one to upgrade these myself. You may be seeing me at a future DCS meeting in York for some upgrades. Of course your book will be a requirement to help with all this as well.

rtr12 posted:

Hi Dave,

Yes, I agree with the new tech stuff. I did the same thing with ipods, never saw a need until I finally got one. Then I couldn't do without one. Some things do get me right away, but some do not. I also just discovered my iTouch keeps track of how far I walk every day! Another neat feature. It only has wifi and there is none where I walk on the trails around here, but it somehow keeps pretty close track of the mileage. I was always going by the trail mile markers before and the iTouch is very close to the mile markers in distance measuring.

As for the iPads, we have an early version. My wife wanted it and then hardly used it. I have been using it too. My wife texts the kids and grand kids with it and that is about all. I think you will like the iPad Pro. It looks like it's plenty big enough to be able to read most everything on. I have been thinking about an iPad Mini as well, for train operation. Although so far I have been able to read the iTouch just fine so I may wait on that for a bit. Also my grandson has an iPad Mini and I may just try his first.

As for the phone, I will probably get an iPhone 6, the smaller one. I think you have to get the wireless earhones with an iPhone 7 and that's another $150 or so plus tax I think. I already have a bunch of wired earphones and they work just fine. I have a friend that recently got a Samsung smart phone (not the exploding/burning kind) and he tells me regularly that he wishes he had gotten an iPhone instead.

I also like the home automation stuff and the smart phone would allow all that to happen too. That is one newer tech item that I won't have to wait on, I have been interested in that for some time now, but had no smart phone or desire to get one until now. What will they think of next??

iPhone 7 doesn't require the AirPod headphones. Apple simply removed the headphone jack and now uses Audio thru the lighting port. Apple even gives you an adapter to use your old headphones.  I would recommend get the 7. 

Dave,

I think maybe he has a Note 5 as well, or something like that. It is not one the newer ones they have out now. I will try to remember to ask him why he wants an iPhone instead. He does have an iPad, but he has an app that allows texting between the different types of devices and I don't know what all else he has adapted to the iPhones.

If you like the Samsung phones, you should maybe look into the apps for compatibility before switching. Not having a smart phone, I really don't know enough to say what is and is not compatible? I am sure you would know what to look for though. Just a thought...

I know that is one bad thing about the Macs, iMacs, etc. that nothing for our trains runs on them, like the Lionel and MTH update programs and things like that. It will be good to keep a PC based laptop for just such things and also SCARM and RRT of course.  

ChessieMD posted:

rtr12 posted:

Hi Dave,

Yes, I agree with the new tech stuff. I did the same thing with ipods, never saw a need until I finally got one. Then I couldn't do without one. Some things do get me right away, but some do not. I also just discovered my iTouch keeps track of how far I walk every day! Another neat feature. It only has wifi and there is none where I walk on the trails around here, but it somehow keeps pretty close track of the mileage. I was always going by the trail mile markers before and the iTouch is very close to the mile markers in distance measuring.

As for the iPads, we have an early version. My wife wanted it and then hardly used it. I have been using it too. My wife texts the kids and grand kids with it and that is about all. I think you will like the iPad Pro. It looks like it's plenty big enough to be able to read most everything on. I have been thinking about an iPad Mini as well, for train operation. Although so far I have been able to read the iTouch just fine so I may wait on that for a bit. Also my grandson has an iPad Mini and I may just try his first.

As for the phone, I will probably get an iPhone 6, the smaller one. I think you have to get the wireless earhones with an iPhone 7 and that's another $150 or so plus tax I think. I already have a bunch of wired earphones and they work just fine. I have a friend that recently got a Samsung smart phone (not the exploding/burning kind) and he tells me regularly that he wishes he had gotten an iPhone instead.

I also like the home automation stuff and the smart phone would allow all that to happen too. That is one newer tech item that I won't have to wait on, I have been interested in that for some time now, but had no smart phone or desire to get one until now. What will they think of next??

iPhone 7 doesn't require the AirPod headphones. Apple simply removed the headphone jack and now uses Audio thru the lighting port. Apple even gives you an adapter to use your old headphones.  I would recommend get the 7. 

Thanks, I was not aware of that. I haven't yet really looked at the phones though. Coming soon!

I'm not attached to any particular phone or operating system. I just think Android allows users to do more than any of the Apple products. Apple is a closed/controlled environment, but its hardware and software work together seamlessly and that's a big plus for a lot of folks. I'm now past the stage where I want/need the flexibility Android offers, but I still have some difficulty with the high price of Apple products. However, if I go SmartHome, I feel the premium prices are worth it for the ease of use, just like Mianne bench work is worth it for those who want the ease and convenience.....and can afford it. I know I can walk into an Apple Store and come out with a fully functional system. I know I can probably piecemeal together an Android system too, but at what cost and how much time and how much of a learning curve. I really need to find someone with some or all of that I want so I can see what I'm getting into.

I will ask my friend what the differences are that he's missing, the one that wants an iPhone instead of his Samsung phone. I really don't have a clue never having really looked closely at any of them. I am still discovering new buttons to push on my iTouch after a couple of months! 

I did see the Apple home control stuff at the Apple store, but wasn't really sure what it really did either? I have been thinking about looking for a wireless security camera system of some sort to catch pictures of the wild life that goes through our back yard at night. Maybe the Apple home stuff has those too? Probably need to make another trip to the Apple store. Was thinking about a trail camera, but the wireless video sounds like it would be a lot neater.

Ok, so the impending DCS Explorer can only control 3 locomotives. The handheld is convenient. My current iPad is heavier and bulkier and I do not want to use my iPhone as I have many incoming phone calls coming in and that's distracting for me. I'm not thrilled but I ve come to expect, technology is always changing.

George, this is what we need for tablets to make them easier to hold when controlling our trains.

RTR12, I don't know if the Apple HomeKit is the solution I'm looking for either, but it's something I'm going to be checking out. I want to be able to check on the house while we're traveling. I also want to be able to turn the AC or heat on before we get home, things like that. I'll send you an email with whatever I find when I start looking into this when we get home., We're in Georgia and leaving for Wisconsin in the morning.

Seacoast posted:

Ok, so the impending DCS Explorer can only control 3 locomotives. The handheld is convenient. My current iPad is heavier and bulkier and I do not want to use my iPhone as I have many incoming phone calls coming in and that's distracting for me. I'm not thrilled but I ve come to expect, technology is always changing.

You really DON'T want to be using your everyday phone for running trains - get a dedicated device!

That's why I've been recommending Android devices -they are cheap and feature-wise your only concern is screen size.

Plus - if you decide you dont like table/phone control - you're not out much coin.

Roving Sign posted:

You really DON'T want to be using your everyday phone for running trains - get a dedicated device!

That's why I've been recommending Android devices -they are cheap and feature-wise your only concern is screen size.

Plus - if you decide you dont like table/phone control - you're not out much coin.

And they don't need to be connected to a service, they just need to have wifi, right?

DoubleDAZ posted:

Roving Sign posted:

You really DON'T want to be using your everyday phone for running trains - get a dedicated device!

That's why I've been recommending Android devices -they are cheap and feature-wise your only concern is screen size.

Plus - if you decide you dont like table/phone control - you're not out much coin.

And they don't need to be connected to a service, they just need to have wifi, right?

Correct. They don't even have to be connected to the internet, just a local network. 

Roving Sign posted:

Seacoast posted:

Ok, so the impending DCS Explorer can only control 3 locomotives. The handheld is convenient. My current iPad is heavier and bulkier and I do not want to use my iPhone as I have many incoming phone calls coming in and that's distracting for me. I'm not thrilled but I ve come to expect, technology is always changing.

You really DON'T want to be using your everyday phone for running trains - get a dedicated device!

That's why I've been recommending Android devices -they are cheap and feature-wise your only concern is screen size.

Plus - if you decide you dont like table/phone control - you're not out much coin.

Ok, maybe I'll search Groupon for a refurbished Samsung tablet. Let me get this correct the DCS Explorer will only run 3 engines. Will I need more Explorers to run more then 3 engines ?

George,

Will I need more Explorers to run more then 3 engines ?

AFAIK, you are limited to one DCS Explorer per layout. However, there won't be any definitive answers regarding this product until MTH actually builds it and releases, sometime later this year.

The DCS Explorer is a replacement for the DCS Remote Commander. It is intended to be an entry-level device for running a starter set engine in DCS mode usng the DCS App. It is expected to allow only limited DCS functionality.

Seacoast posted:

Roving Sign posted:

Seacoast posted:

Ok, so the impending DCS Explorer can only control 3 locomotives. The handheld is convenient. My current iPad is heavier and bulkier and I do not want to use my iPhone as I have many incoming phone calls coming in and that's distracting for me. I'm not thrilled but I ve come to expect, technology is always changing.

You really DON'T want to be using your everyday phone for running trains - get a dedicated device!

That's why I've been recommending Android devices -they are cheap and feature-wise your only concern is screen size.

Plus - if you decide you dont like table/phone control - you're not out much coin.

Ok, maybe I'll search Groupon for a refurbished Samsung tablet. Let me get this correct the DCS Explorer will only run 3 engines. Will I need more Explorers to run more then 3 engines ?

Good question - info is scant on the DCS Explorer - While it seems it uses the same DCS app - not sure its made to interact with multiple units or interact with full DCS systems.

Barry Broskowitz posted:

Clem,

Click here to see what's been added/fixed in DCS 6.0.

Thanks for the link Barry.  Didn't see anything on it which would induce me to upgrade from 4.3.  Haven't encountered problems since upgrading to 4.3 which would cause me to think it's not working correctly for my layout.  Layouts vary so much it's not unusual there would be some operational differences even using the same version of software.  How many times have we heard "ummm ... it doesn't do that on my layout" ... or does when it doesn't on someone else's setup.  Upgrading our three TIUs and three remotes to 4.3 was a big PIA and don't want to go down that road again if I can avoid it.

Not having been able to get any help from MTH in the past I'm not counting on any in the future.  Ordering parts is enough of a headache, depending on one person at MTH "Midge" to handle it all.  Never got a return call from her in the couple of times I called.

There are more than a few  here who have messaged "wish I'd have stayed on 4.3"

For the past months our layout has been stable, and as Kyrian wisely suggests "if it ain't broke, don't upgrade it."

Ok I'll ask what issues is happening or what are you supposedly losing when you upgrade from 4.3???  

It is the end of the line for my DCS Handheld Controller. 

C&O Hudson #492

B&M SW8 #800

U.P. F3 A-B-A #1400

Next stop, move onto an iPad - I was able to run my android phone next to an iPad at a train show at my LHS.  The iPad is faster and the larger screen is better for the touch screen.  Better finger management on the commands.

Gary

Kerrigan posted:

Grandma will sell it all when I die, move to Italy, and marry some 30-year-old Italian stud I imagine, and buy a Porsche, in all likely-hood.

She'll buy a Ferrari! 

As the MTH WiFi can't control the Z-4000 remote box, they are a no go here with hidden transformers.