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Hi All!

I had a couple requests to post some pics and info about my KC Lines West Bottoms layout that I'm slooowly building in S scale. I'm more than happy to oblige. Please ovelook the poor quality of the pics (my model photography skills are not good), and also, the repost nature of them. I'm trying to get all the bits of info I have scattered in various threads at these forums gathered in one thread to talk/discuss/share. I hope others can find things to enjoy within, but mainly, I think it helps motivate to share and receive encouragement from other modelers. That so... here we go!

How It Came To Be:

Ever since discovering mountain railroading in November of '74 aboard a Frisco freight from Van Buren, AR to Winslow, AR and return, I was a mountain railroad modeler. All my layouts after The Trip were set in the Ozarks, with two of them being based on the Frisco's Fort Smith Subdivision.

A move in 1998 predicated dismantling my final Frisco FS Sub layout of 11 years. My final HO layout was a tri-level with about 200' of mainline w/hidden staging loops. Modeled from Ft. Smith to Fayette Jct, with the north loop representing points north, and the south loops representing the Arthur Sub. The entire layout was housed within a 24' travel trailer modified for layout use.

Once settled into our new home, my only immediately available space was in my combination hobby/computer room, a paltry 9' or so by 12'. Not much.

I tried a couple of things in this room. First was Sn3. I quickly saw there was no way to model mountains and expanse in such a small area. Not Colorado, not the Ozarks with HO diesels, nothging. Nope, mountains, expanse, and 9' x 12' just doesn't cut it. I had to leave that behind and search for a new theme.

I then had the idea to go to O 3 rail, and simply have fun... deciding to create somewhat of a "Kansas City" look. The thinking was that being O 3 rail (since they're "toys"), it didn't HAVE to be realistic. Plus, density was expected in a "city scape" layout. To boot, there was to be a bit of industrial switching to go along with the double track roundy-loop mains. This idea began to shape up and worked "okay", until I grew tired of the compromised look of the traditional 3 rail trains.

So, I tried to convert it to O 3 rail "Hi Rail", that is, scale sized equipment... with semi-realistic scenery. Purchased some items and tried it: No way. Once I started going with trains that were more properly proportioned... I wasn't happy with the tall rail height, the "less than Kato" performance of the engines, and the killer: That third rail running down the center of the track. Serious stagnation resulted. Too many years of "serious" scale modeling, me thinks.

At some unknown point in time a few years ago, I had the brain storm to seriously look at S scale. This I did, purchasing a state-of-the-art engine (an S Helper Service Frisco SW9), a couple of run-of-the mill boxcars, and some flex track.

Wow! It was more than I hoped for! The size was perfect, the SHS SW ran BETTER than my HO Kato (and comparable HO stuff), and I could simulate 110 lb rail and 90 lb rail using code 100 and code 83 track and switches.

By converting to S scale, I could have a NICE little switching layout that hearkened to my childhood memories and impressions of the West Bottoms area of Kansas City. By elaborating on the KC Lines theme, my layout could play host to ANY railroad in KC during the early-mid 60's that I wanted to tackle.

My concept was to model a small industrial yard in the West Bottoms that was part of a larger KC area railroad. This primary railroad would switch customers on their tracks in the modeled portion of the West Bottoms area, while other KC railroads could come onstage and set-out/pick-up into, and out of, the small yard of the host railroad via transfer runs/etc. Using this scenario, the primary railroad could be the Frisco or Missouri Pacific or Kansas City Terminal or... whatever I wanted! The other roads would be used for the transfers. Any of, or all, equipment could be utilized at any given operating session! Perfect for a guy like me that has a hard time modeling only ONE railroad.

At this point, I'm leaning toward my primary railroad being my own Kansas City & Gulf proto-lanced theme that I concocted during the final year or so of my HO tri-level layout mentioned above. Doing this would allow me to avail myself of the available S scale models without heavy kitbashing or other time consuming projects. I theorized this would allow me to get into business quicker than kitbashing to specific prototype models. Good plan, but thus far I'm enjoying creating/obtaining models of the prototype KC roads!

Okay, enough rhetoric, let's get to a few pictures.

First up, is a close view of my 12th St Yard.



I created the backdrops with photos that I took in the actual West Bottoms area then photoshopped them, and this is the result. Given the 24" benchwork depth, and intensity of track, I figure I will need to lean heavily upon the backdrop to convey the urban industrial look, as well as "expanse". So far, so good.

Next up is an overall view of the incomplete 12th St. Yard scene.



I want to point out that I gained about 33%-35% more layout by switching to S SCALE from O 3 RAIL. I like the train-to-scenery ratio MUCH better, and the feeling of "expanse" that I also gained via a switch to S scale. (Plus, I still get BIG TRAINS to boot!)

Next picture is of an in-process kit detailing project I have on the workbench. This is American Models Baldwin S-12 model. It runs nice, but I felt the details were a bit "coarse" out of the box, so I set in to fabricate scale sized hand rails etc. Into this will eventually go a Soundtraxx Tsunami DCC decoder w/Baldwin sound. (You have GOT to hear the Baldwin sounds at the Soundtraxx website!!) This S-12 will either become a KC&G unit, or a Mop S-12 in Jenks Blue.



Below is a comparison of the in-process detail project alongside an out of the box AM Baldwin S-12 to illustrate some of the modifications I'm making:



Next will be a few pics of my Frisco #306 SW. This is an SHS product that has simply been painted/decaled/weathered to reflect the prototype engine. All the details and other stuff is pure SHS. This one also has DCC w/Tsunami sound. (All my engines will be sound equipped.)







I mentioned my proto-lanced KC&G theme as possibly being used as my "primary road". I have yet to get any S scale equipment into KC&G paint, but for the sake of illustration, here is an HO KC&G switcher I modeled over a decade ago that helps to visualize what I'm contemplating:



Lastly, below you will find a trackplan for you to puruse. As with all trackplans, it is a work in progress, and the final product will not be as drawn. (Note: I don't know how to add an attachment of the full sized track plan to avoid the default resizing this forum software imposses.)



Well... that's about it for now! Long ways to go on the layout and equipment... and there have been many periods of inactivity... but overall I think I've found a great way to enjoy a variety of my favorite roads in an acceptably plausible setting... all within a small room! I will be revisiting this thread and updating/etc over time as progress is made, especially if some of you should find it interesting and questions are asked. Sharing and comments helps to motivate!

Have fun!

Andre
Original Post

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Ginsaw:

If you've made the leap from that other thread, here's some of my comments to your post:

Yup, Mike Condren's site is a gold mine. Mike and I first became acquainted in '70, I think. We've been life-long friends ever since. He was an enthusiast operator with me on my Frisco-based HO tri-level layout I had back in the late 80's almost through the 90's. It's been a year or so since I've seen him, but we will stay in touch as the months go by.

That Frisco yard in Memphis: Yes, I've seen that before and YES, I too, was wow'd by it! I love the look of that era, and model it in my V scale medium (when I'm in the V scale mood.)

Thanks for the kind words, I will try to take some acceptable pics of my Frisco DS-4-4-1000 project and post here "soon".

Andre
Rusty:

Gotta' remember that once I discovered what real trains did (countless decades ago Smile ), and that much of a railroad's "reason for being" could be replicated on a layout: Operation became one of the primary reasons I dabble with model trains. (I like the challenges of switching.) So, it comes as no surprise that any layout I design has SOME form of operation designed-in. As mentioned, the beauty (to me) of urban industrial switching is that DENSITY is almost required. Thus, it is FAR easier to cram a bunch in a small space than it is to reflect the openess of, say in your case, the Kansas prairie. Nature of the urban beast, I reckon'.

John:

Thank you kindly! In the past, I had a lot of fun with the KC&G theme, and though it will not play the major role it played there at the last on my HO tri-level layout, I look forward to the flexibilty of its roster and seeing it come to life in S scale.

HOWEVER... a KC&G project is NOT on my workbench at this time. Smile

Nope, I'm still slicing and dicing an AM S-12 into a DS-4-4-1000 to become Frisco's #241. I'm about finished with the body modifications. Alas, though, I just discovered I'm out of 400 grit sandpaper... so I won't be able to finish my sanding procedure (320 grit to remove unwanted cast-on detail, followed by 400 grit, followed by 600 grit) on my body modifications until I pick some up tomorrow while out and about. No biggie.

Here's a couple of progress pics I took a couple of hours ago. First up is a close up.



And here's a pic with an S-12 project for comparison in regards to the body modifications needed to turn an S-12 into a DS-4-4-1000.



Very soon it will be time to start drilling holes, adding detail parts, and fabricating handrails.

Andre
Andre, I'm using your invite for the transfer ticket from over at the 3R board...

I've never met Mike, but his website is my favorite for anything railroad or old Memphis related. The history there alone is priceless. And, one of these days, I'm thinking of donating a couple rare historical documents, one Cotton Belt, the other Rock Island.

My interest in railroading goes way back too and is built around the roadnames of the Mid-South. I've discussed it here before. I also once lived in Pine Bluff and you can probably guess what I was close to there.

For layouts, I had one as a child, a little 027. The second and more recent occupies of spare bedroom and is 10 x 11. I call that medium size. One like that has its limits, as you found out. Basically it's three loops with 088 on the outside and some stub yards (including a Ross four-way) and a one-way reversing loop (I really wanted a double reverse but no room for it on a medium layout that I could see). So, it's mainly a matter of straight ahead running and just showing off what trains I have.

The rest of the layout is a few MTH and old Lionel buildings and a few scratchbuilds, including a radio tower. In lighting, the star of the show is a Miller IC illuminated sign. And I have more than once suggested they do a Frisco sign. There's one on Mike's website. Maybe you know it too. It would be rather nice, and although I remember seeing it, I can't recall the colors or how it changed colors.

Anyway, in model railroading, I went and collected a lot of Lionel big steam including the articulateds. But, what has happened, is that I found I have tired of those and have gravitated to liking only the local roadnames. So I'm selling off the big "national" interest items. And believe it or not, I won't really miss them (Challenger, Veranda Turbine, Class A, Allegheny, Mohawk, Berk etc etc). They're beautiful, but they don't really fit in with what I've learned I care for more.

So, at the moment I'm running three freights, led by Rock Island GP35s, Cotton Belt GP60s and an IC GP9. I'm also looking at an Atlas Frisco switcher which has recently been hard at work. These are more or less what I used to see downtown crossing the IC Junction on Broadway.

For me, it's all about the local roadnames and their history...
Hi Ginsaw!

Glad you made the hyper-jump to this S scale world!

Mike is so smart it's scary. (He's a retired Chemist Professor.) Knows things Frisco inside and out. He's a hoot.

As for donating the historical documents... scans would suffice? That way you retain your originals?

Looks like we're on the same page in regards to what we enjoy replicating: Regional roads of our favorite memories.

Also on the same page with being saddled with a similar layout space. Of course, I chickened-out and went with slightly smaller trains to operationally increase the size of my "space".

Miniature trains are lots of things to different folks. Some of us like to switch, others like to watch'em run... all kinds. No "correct" way of enjoying them.

Miller makes some cool signs. One that would really go well with my KC West Bottoms theme would be the Western Auto "arrow" sign. There was one in reasonably close proximity to the West Bottoms area.

Reallocating your funds tied up in models your refining preferences have left behind into models that are more satisfying will pay off in enjoyment, if not in capital gain!

Ahh... a freight led by Rock Island 35's. Nice. They were in KC, too. Interesting road. (BTW, the IC eventually made it into KC via the GM&O/IC merger, but that is after my era of interest.) Local history, local roadnames. Yup. Same here.

Amazing how these silly little models can evoke such good memories, isn't it?

Andre
Andre, take a look at the Frisco sign here - http://condrenrails.com/MRP/Me...Frisco-Yale-Yard.htm. It's several pics down and used to stand over Yale Yard in South Memphis. You could see it from the Airways Blvd. viaduct over the yard (the yard's still there). Have you seen any like that and do you know how the colors should light up or if it says something besides just Frisco? I think the sign maybe had the ability to also say "Southeast - Southwest" or "Ship It On The Frisco". I was going to try again to interest Miller in it. I would definitely buy one. If it turned out anywhere near as well as the IC sign, it'd be a winner.

I like the Western Auto sign too. We also had one in Memphis.

Do you by any chance attend the annual Cotton Belt Railroadiana event in Pine Bluff? I have been going, with combining a trip to Hot Springs for the season ending high stakes races. It's the first weekend in April each year. We do the railroad show on Sat, then over to the Arlington Hotel that night for the parties and the races on Sun.

Btw, your KC&G I'll bet was taken from the KCS predecessor Kansas City, Pittsburg & Gulf. An excellent choice. Back when I was considering names for my layout, I thought seriously about Gulf & Southern. No reason at all except it was railroad sounding. But, I'm content to let it be a resemblance to all the roads in general I have experienced up close over the years - Southern, GM&O, IC, MoPac, SSW, SL-SW, RI, NC&SL and L&N.

With the Southern I can honestly say they even named a passenger station after an ancestor. And cab rides on the Tennessean in the '50s were pretty neat for a little kid.
Since we're talking Frisco the link below shows numerous Frisco photos all through Eastern and Southern Missouri.

The ones at Lindenwood Yard, especially looking down at the diesel house bring back a lot of memories. These are taken from Fyler bridge which was an old rickety bridge torn down sometime in the late 60's I believe (family moved from St. Louis to the KC area in 1961). You can see the bridge in some of the ground level photos. Man would it shake when the buses rolled over it.

In the late 50's I would spend many hours watching train movements below it and peering down into the engine house especially at dusk when the lights were on. At 10-11 years old I wasn't allowed out much past dusk or had to be in my own immediate neighborhood. What great sights, sounds and smells.

http://www.westernrailimages.c...nc4S#465981208_Xq68F

I almost changed modeling roads from the UP to Frisco after discovering this website but alas the UP in the 40's and 50's is my 1st love.

Enjoy.

Butch
Hi Ginsaw:

It appears the sign has clear neon "Ship IT on the Frisco" to illuminate at night, alternating between the large illuminated "FRISCO". I do not recall seeing anything like that in KC... but perhaps there was one there I didn't know about?

Alas, I don't get out much in regards to swap meets/etc. I tend to crash on the weekends and either stay home and tinker with projects, or the wife and I head off on a scooter adventure (weather dependant), either on our dirt bikes or our road bike. Then there's typically church on Sunday's followed by bi-weekly trips to NW AR to take the wife to spend time with her aging parents. Kind of pinched for "excursion" time at this point in our lives.

Actually, my fictional "history" has the KC&G trying to race the KCP&G to the Gulf. My KC&G lost. Thus, they had to settle for a more laborious traversing of the Ozark and Ouachita mountains in Arkansas. To this day, the KC&G folk refer to the KCS as "that OTHER KC line". Smile

Butch:

Oh my lands! What a FABULOUS find that site is! I just spent one hour of my life viewing pics there of some of my roads of interest... and had to leave before I got them all viewed! (Getting to be bedtime. 5:30 AM comes around awful early. Frown ) Not only are there killer Frisco pics... but those Mop pics: WOW!!! Got me all fired up to eventually get some Mop power up and going!
Thanks a bunch for that link!

As for almost giving in to the Frisco: "Go ahead Luke (gasp)... let go... feel the power of the Dark Side... (gasp) Black and Yellow is your destiny...."

Big Grin

Andre
To all, there may in fact have been a railroad somewhere that had better looking diesel paint schemes than SL-SF. But I'll be darned if I can think of what it is.

Anyway, we had/have the Yale Yard in Memphis and just across the big river at Marion we have the Frisco Harvard Yard. That's a rather studious group of railroaders if I don't say so.

Butch, I'm still enjoying the photos myself.

Oh, do you think that sign would sell, if produced?
Yep, lots of good memories for me.

My parents would have killed me if they knew where I was and what I was doing. I lost track of time a lot running back and forth on the wooden sidewalk of the old bridge trying to be in just the right spot to get a direct blast of exhaust and wave to the engineer. Maybe that's what's wrong with me now. Smile

Late to dinner more than a few times and they just didn't understand that some things in life were worth an a-- chewing! Big Grin

Butch
I think the Fyler bridge in St. Louis was torn down when I-44 was being built in the mid-60's (1966?).

I live just a short distance away from the ex-Frisco Lindenwood yard (over by Ted Drewes), so I am familiar with the area.

Wish I'd seen more of the Frisco, but I moved to Springfield, MO in 1981, just in time to see it disappear into a sea of BN green. I moved to St. Louis in 1995 and except for a short stint in Dearborn, MI (2004-2007), I've been here ever since.

Jeff C
Jeff, I think you're right. I moved from that area in 1961 and came back for a visit in the late 60's and Fyler was gone. Sort of a bitter-sweet right of passage.

It used to be a deadly bridge. It was downhill going west with a dogleg left that drivers would misread and shoot through the guard rails...many times with fatal results. It exited onto Picadilly Avenue but wasn't even close on alignment.

I lived in my grandparents home on Commonwealth Ave in Maplewood for about 4-5 years in the late 50's and had a great view of Fyler bridge and Lindenwood Yards south end from their back yard and an upper back bedroom. I went back to St. Louis on business a few years ago and amazingly the old neighborhood had changed very little in the 50 years since I left.

Besides the Lindenwood Yard I was only a few blocks east of the MP mainline that passed through Maplewood. It was a very busy stop when Maplewood was a bedroom suburb in the 20's, 30's 40' and 50's, but by the time I was around train stops were rare. I spent a lot of time train watching at the old Greenwood station on Greewood Blvd. Don't ask me how I'm remembering all these names because I don't know. Confused


Ted Drewes, now that is a St. Louis tradition.

Butch
While you guys have been pickin' yer noses and scratchin' yer butts... I've been gettin' some modelin' done!!

This weekend I've made some progress on my Frisco DS-4-4-1000 project. I'm almost finished with the brass work on it. YIPPEE!!

Below you'll see some pics of my progress. Again, they are the typical poor quality that I'm getting sort of famous for, now. Big Grin

What I've accopmlished in the past few evenings and today:

* End handrails in place.
* Cab rails in place.
* Cab shades made/installed.
* Hood side rail installed.
* Front wipers installed.
* Modified the roof corners (contoured to blend with the cab side, then
sanded and smoothed) to better reflect the Baldwin cab.

Won't be long and it'll be time for the DCC and speaker!





Have fun!

Andre
Great job Andre! I've been working on layout drawings and making lists of O scale to sell, but alas no modeling. In looking at your layout drawing I see answers to some of my questions.

Thinking in terms of 3/16" instead of 1/4" is not coming as easy as I imagined and I find I'm wasting valuable real estate I no longer need. Might as well use the size advantage of S properly and get this right. Smile

What is the width (depth) of your 12th street yard? What are you using for minimum radius on the corners of your layout? What are you using for track spacing in your 12th street yard? Do you find it works well or should it be increased or decreased if you did it again?

Thanks for fielding these questions.

I'll be running mostly 40ft cars with 2 axle cab diesels but have owned a RRM Turbine for a long time that I want to run, as well as some E8's and larger steam like 4-8-4 and 4-8-8-4. I'm concerned about operating minimum radius as well as visual radius. Just because a 3 axled diesel or FEF-3 will run through the radius doesn't mean it looks right. I will be using easements on all curves to help out but 48" to 52" radius could be the largest radius I can squeeze in unless I completely change my plans.

Butch

P.S. Anyone else with comments, suggestions or 1st hand experiences would be much appreciated........ Rusty?
Hi Rusty!

Yup, we all do it... just one of those things that we don't admit to very often, though. Big Grin Then there's the "air horn" side of our lower anatomy that always makes for a personally gratified smile or a laugh. Odd that our wives typically don't appreciate such flatulatory talent. Their loss.

Thanks for the compliment... I'm looking forward to seeing it finished, as well!

John:

Thanks!


Butch:

It does take a while to regear your thinking in terms of 1/64th.

All of my visible benchwork is 24". The closet shelf is 17" deep.

As for my layout, it is pretty much "purpose designed". That is, I KNOW I'll never want to see big steam power thereon. I also know that I won't have a desire to run large 6-axle diesels: My modeling interests just aren't there.

Thus, I designed the layout to do what I want it to do:

* A dense urban industrial setting using switchers for primary power.

* 40' or shorter equipment to predominate. Absolutely NOTHING longer than 50'.

* A main with larger radii to accept 4 axle mainline power. (Think: GP's and F's.)

The above understood:

* The switching lead/secondary main has 24" radius.

* The mainline is 30" radius.

* I spaced the yard tracks at 3" to allow fingers between the cars for rerailing/etc. Might have been able to cut that down to 2 3/4", but it is what it is now.

You're welcome!

All:

And here's the other side of the engine. Once the above pics were taken/posted, I sat down at the workbench and caught up the engineer's side to the same state as the conductor's side (photos above):



Have fun!

Andre
Thanks Andre, I appreciate the answers and thoughts. I knew you were building a switching layout and from what I see you designed it well.

I'm still hoping to create a yard and mainline operation but may have to reel in my plans a bit if I can't make it all fit realistically. I think in another life I must have operated trains in either N or HO. Wink

Your radii is a little smaller than I can use but works great for your purposes. But even with 3" centers you're able to put a lot of tracks down in the 12th street yard area. That's a real positive for me.

Thanks again!

Butch
Hi Again Butch!

What size room do you have to work with?

As for HO...

Wow... just last night I took out some of my remaining HO to photo and use to illustrate for a guy on another forum: It's TINY. I can't believe I putzed and piddled with such tiny trains. SOOO glad I discovered S scale.

As for yard track spacing:

Consider getting some flex track sticks, and mock-up your proposed track spacing and see how it works for you. I settled on 3" using a very scientific method: Typical HO yard track spacing is 2", typical O scale yard track spacing is 4"... seein' as S scale is almost in the middle... then 3" it was! Yup... very scientific. Smile In retrospect, I wish I would have used the flex stick idea above. Might have gotten away with 2.75" or so, and maybe even gained a track?

Andre
I Think your formula on track spacing worked very well. We modelers tend to crowd our track spacing and then regret it when we have to rerail a car or use the old 5 finger crane. Your spacing looks good to my eye and that is why I asked. I'm amazed how many tracks you are able to put in a 24" wide area.

I've got a room 11' wide and 30' long of which about 25-26' in length is usable above the garage. One long wall has an additional 8' wide by 5' deep dormer that has a desk and full width windows behind it on the outer wall. The walls go up straight for about 50" and then slope inward as most attic bonus rooms do.

I feel fortunate to have this much room but it shrinks quickly when you're trying to do mainline operation in S. But, I wouldn't switch from S now even if I had 10 times the apace or less than I do. It's just the right size to model as you know.

I can't decide whether to save the dormer space for an upstairs workbench area or incorporate it into the layout. I have another great area downstairs in a spare bedroom (empty nesters) set up now for buiding models and working on trains, so I don't really need the space upstairs, except its in the layout room and on the 2nd floor. At my age stairs are becoming a nuisance and someday maybe a problem.

Butch
You guys are both pushing me and inspiring me as I read your progress and plans.
Yesterday I re-installed the sharp (in 2 rail O) curve that goes from Caribou to Ol' Ben Mine No. 1 and I can tell you it looks perfect in S scale. I ran some equipment and it tracks fine and looks good in the scenery!
I'm more convinced than ever that I made the right move and am very satisfied.
Butch, couldn't agree with you more...it's S scale or bust for me.
Over the next months I would like to find some UP/SP F's to run and eventually the 2-8-0 to run.
S Scale America (Des Plaines) cannot get that SD45 rollin' soon enough, although methinks we're quite a ways away with that one. It will be sweet!
Butch:

I'll bet you will be able to come up with something in that space that you'll be happy with. Just keep doodling on your layout drawing until it gels.

John:

S scale is addictive... and we're all a bunch of enablers!! (As you can see, Greg is an enabler, too!)

All:

Getting my KC&G S-12 up to the same stage as my Frisco DS-4-4-1000 project. Below is a quick pic of them.

Andre

I have a confession...at one time I had 28 Atlas Gold locos in 2 rail O scale.
At $425 each, you do the math. I still have some that have never been out of the box. I'm ashamed to say it. But, I did learn a lesson. $50,000 later and three years after a divorce, you might say I learned the hard way. She blamed
"the trains". So, as a result, hopefully, I'm smarter in the accumulation of S stuff.
quote:

Originally posted by John Albee:
One thing that is positive about being hard to find, keeps me from spending on locos when they just collect dust on my shelves.


Yeah, that's not working for me either. One blessing I thought in coming back to "S" scale was the time it would take to locate the locos and rolling stock I would need. I figured it would take many, many months or years to acquite what I needed.

That doesn't appear to be the case this time around as I've found almost everything I need in locos and rolling stock in only a few short months. I actually have more than I need in some locos and once I sort through it, some will be excess and go back on the market. So, now I not only have a lot of O scale to sell but S scale as well.

But, I'm a buy/sell junky and love the hunt. I find it hard to say no to a really good deal once I find it. And, there's been what I consider to be some really good deals out there lately. At least compared to my experiences 10 years ago.

Fortunately, I have no other hobbies or vices so my wife is all for my hobby.......most of the time. Sadly, workig 50-60 hours a week, there's little time or energy to do much else but search and acquire.

But, at least the "S" boxes take up considerably less space in the closet than the O scale stuff. Big Grin

Butch
quote:
Butch, thanks but brass is a little rich for my blood. Over time, I'm sure I'll come up with S Helper Fs.



Hopefully another run of SHS F-units will be made in the future. I think SHS has to be producing product if S scale is to grow, and another run of F-units makes sense to realize the investment on the tooling.

Jeff C
quote:
According to Don Thompson of SHS, ain't nobody to make them. And molds are being "held hostage". (my words) It might be some time before we see another run.




I knew he was having trouble getting another company to run product, but I wasn't aware that he was having trouble getting possession of the molds.

What a shame! The F-units (both F3 and F7) are some of the finest models ever made in ANY scale. I wonder what other tooling is involved?

Jeff C
quote:
Originally posted by leikec:
quote:
According to Don Thompson of SHS, ain't nobody to make them. And molds are being "held hostage". (my words) It might be some time before we see another run.




I knew he was having trouble getting another company to run product, but I wasn't aware that he was having trouble getting possession of the molds.

What a shame! The F-units (both F3 and F7) are some of the finest models ever made in ANY scale. I wonder what other tooling is involved?

Jeff C


It seems the "hostage situation" affects AM and SSA also.

Rusty
Lately brass is not much more expensive than SHS locos, but you do have the added expense or painting, decaling, glazing, etc. But, if you enjoy this activity and building a one of a kind (yours only) loco it can be very rewarding. You just may not be able to do it all at one time.

But, the SHS F units are fabulous locos. I have mine on the mantel for motivation and enjoyment and they are quite remarkable models. Almost makes me question spending the time to turn a raw brass model into a painted, working loco.

My understanding of the SHS dilemma is that it's well on the way to being solved. SHS has found several builders and is making inroads into get their (note I said their) tooling back. Kader is a pack of thieves and cheaters and having to deal with them while using another countries legal system has to be an education.

But, on the Yahoo S Forum last month and in a recent SHS interview posted in Dick Karnes S Curves Column, Don Thompson indicated the worst was behind them and they'll definitely be producing more S products. I dont' think we'll see anything until next year but that is much better than never.

I understand S Scale America (Ron Sebastin) has a handle on their Kader problem as well. The only one of the big 3 producers in S I've heard nothing about is American Models, but I suspect they're getting it pulled together too.

Butch
[quote]Lately brass is not much more expensive than SHS locos, but you do have the added expense or painting, decaling, glazing, etc. But, if you enjoy this activity and building a one of a kind (yours only) loco it can be very rewarding. You just may not be able to do it all at one time.

But, the SHS F units are fabulous locos. I have mine on the mantel for motivation and enjoyment and they are quite remarkable models. Almost makes me question spending the time to turn a raw brass model into a painted, working loco.

My understanding of the SHS dilemma is that it's well on the way to being solved. SHS has found several builders and is making inroads into get their (note I said their) tooling back. Kader is a pack of thieves and cheaters and having to deal with them while using another countries legal system has to be an education.


But, on the Yahoo S Forum last month and in a recent SHS interview posted in Dick Karnes S Curves Column, Don Thompson indicated the worst was behind them and they'll definitely be producing more S products. I dont' think we'll see anything until next year but that is much better than never.

I understand S Scale America (Ron Sebastin) has a handle on their Kader problem as well. The only one of the big 3 producers in S I've heard nothing about is American Models, but I suspect they're getting it pulled together too.



That's good news. S scale needs all three of those manufacturers producing product to grow and thrive.

The F-units are particularly important in my view. It's no secret that F-units are hugely popular with modelers, and in both HO and N scale the EMD covered wagons generate good sales and allow multiple production runs that justify the cost of tooling and development.

And in S scale the vast majority of rolling stock is targeted toward the steam-diesel transition era, and F units are the signature diesel locomotives of the time, rostered on most of the RRs of the era, with huge prototype production numbers and a multitude of classic paint schemes.

Jeff C
Rusty posted a comparison pic a while back of three S scale F unit models.

IMHO, in the "head on" shot, the AM FP7's nose/windows were the closest (in respect to looking "right") of the three models depicted. Granted, the detail level was nowhere near the other models... BUT... it's amazing what some brass wire and detail parts can do! I fully intend to have an AM FP7 on my shelves for eventual conversion into a Frisco FP7.

Andre
quote:
Rusty posted a comparison pic a while back of three S scale F unit models.

IMHO, in the "head on" shot, the AM FP7's nose/windows were the closest (in respect to looking "right") of the three models depicted. Granted, the detail level was nowhere near the other models... BUT... it's amazing what some brass wire and detail parts can do! I fully intend to have an AM FP7 on my shelves for eventual conversion into a Frisco FP7.




I didn't see that photo, but I have seen the AM FP7 on several occasions and it is a nice model that can be detailed to make an outstanding locomotive.

In fact, I would consider the AM FP7 to be a landmark locomotive for S scale, comparable to the Atlas RS-3 in HO and N scale.

Jeff C
Hoo-boy, I had to hop in the Way-Back Machine to 2001 for those. It was actually the AM FP7, E8 and SHS F3 in the Yahoo S Scale photo section languishing for quite a while. (Shot with a camera that used a real, live floppy disc!)

Here they are:





I would also agree that the AM FP7 was a landmark locomotve. AM in general dragged S kicking and screaming out of the cloud of obscurity and helped to shake off the American Flyer only identification of the scale for the model railroading populace.

Till then, S Scalers in general were very proud of the fact that S was considered "the scratchbuilder's scale."

I never agreed with that "selling point." There were scratchbuilders in other scales doing quite well.

Rusty
quote:
In fact, I would consider the AM FP7 to be a landmark locomotive for S scale, comparable to the Atlas RS-3 in HO and N scale.



I agree! It was the genesis of the current "state of the art" S scale plastic locomotive.

As for that photo: I saved a copy of it, as well as the side view. Hopefully Rusty won't mind if I repost them here:

EDIT: 10/03/13  Seeing as the photos illustrating the F/E unit nose differences were lost, I have re-inserted them in this post for illustrative purposes.

 

 


As you can see, the nose and windows are very nicely proportioned on the AM unit. Better than the SHS unit, IMHO. All the little inexpensive AM unit needs would be some wire grabs, windshield wipers, and a few other minor details and you will have an EXCELLENT F unit.

EDIT #2:

Rusty, I see quite a bit of CB&Q in your pics. I take it that's one of your favorite roads? Owing to it's KC location and some of my memories thereof, it has become a significant road to me, too.

Andre

Last edited by laming
quote:
Originally posted by laming:
Rusty, I see quite a bit of CB&Q in your pics. I take it that's one of your favorite roads? Owing to it's KC location and some of my memories thereof, it has become a significant road to me, too.

Andre


Hey, Andre.

Yep, the Q is one of my favorites. When I was 10, my family moved to the Chicago western suburbs (Deep in the Land of the Burlingtons, Berwyn, to be exact) and we lived a block and a half away from the Burlington.

We were also a half block away from the IC's Davenport line but train frequency was nowhere near what the Burlington's was.

Plus, I could catch occasional glimses of 4960 and 5632 on the Q.

But, I would say my first love will always be the Santa Fe. Partially because of my Lionel roots, but also for a trip we took with my dad to an American Legion convention in Calfornia when I was about 5. The train was an extra, just for the legionairs.

Rusty
Never saw that photo before but it is very interesting. You're right guys, the windshield height and shape of the AM loco does look more "right" than the SHS.

I like the thickness of the headlight openings better on the AM's and the contour of the nose just below the windshields as well. Since the SHS is white and the AM is maroon and orange it's hard to see some of the subtle differences between the two but the AM nose definitely looks more like the prototype.

E and F noses have been a problem for builders and importers for decades and remain so even today. The 1st "F" noses to get really good kudos by modelers was the HO Lubliner(sp) nose which Athearn bought and incorporated into their Genesis F line.

The 1st good "F" noses in "O" scale were offered by P&D which Atlas bought and now offers on all their Atlas "O" F units. The Lionel "scale" F-3 locos offered in the early 2000's had a really good nose as well.

But, none of them have anything on the AM nose or even the SHS nose for that matter.

Growing up in the 50's made me a covered wagon junkie and I've always had a soft spot for "F" units.

Thanks for pointing this out Andre and pulling the photos from the archives Rusty.

Butch
quote:
Originally posted by up148:

E and F noses have been a problem for builders and importers for decades and remain so even today. The 1st "F" noses to get really good kudos by modelers was the HO Lubliner(sp) nose which Athearn bought and incorporated into their Genesis F line.

Butch



Simply for the record, the company was called Highliners. The B unit body kit was available forever, while the HOers waited, waited and waited for the A. Almost a vision of the way things are now... Frown

The one thing I can't recall was if the A unit shell kit came out before or after Athearn's acquisition. I think it was actually after.

I remember one conversation I was having with a well respected modeler. He was going on and on about not liking F units. I finally asked him the musical question "Why not?"

The sound of crickets followed... Smile

Rusty
Butch:

I too, have a "thing" for F units, especially the windows/nose. I think most F unit junkies do. Razz

When I saw the AM F compared to the others, I saw a lot of potential and am looking forward to getting my first AM F.

As for the SHS F: I have an undec F3 AB set, and I will eventually need to decide if I will either live with it, or modify it. Seeing as even back in the early-mid 70's I used to modify the old HO Athearn F's windows... I'll bet I figure out something to make it a bit more "pleasing" to my eyes. I have a couple things in mind, I'll just wait to see once I'm ready to tackle the set.

Rusty:

Thought so on the Q! Seeing as you're a "Q-ball"... perhaps you can help me with a date on a couple of CB&Q events:

* The date on when the Chinese Red hood unit scheme began to appear.

* The appearance date on when the block lettered "BURLINGTON" boxcars begin to appear. I have seen both Chinese Red and lots of Boxcar Red versions of that scheme. Would like to eventually represent it on my early-mid sixties KC Lines layout.

Of course an educated guess on the above would be more than adequate.

I have some good memories of the CB&Q's switch engines in/around the North KC industrial area. In particular, their switching of the Fleming Foods warehouse. My dad owned a supermarket that was affiliated with Fleming Foods, and every now and then I would go with him to the warehouse to pick up items we were running out of (before the next truck load delivery at our store). I would often get to see the CB&Q switching the area, including Fleming Foods.

Yup, the Q is a neat road to me, too!

BTW, this has been a really fun thread. Thanks to all that are participating!

Andre
quote:
Originally posted by Rusty Traque:
quote:
Originally posted by up148:

E and F noses have been a problem for builders and importers for decades and remain so even today. The 1st "F" noses to get really good kudos by modelers was the HO Lubliner(sp) nose which Athearn bought and incorporated into their Genesis F line.

Butch



Simply for the record, the company was called Highliners. The B unit body kit was available forever, while the HOers waited, waited and waited for the A. Almost a vision of the way things are now... Frown

The one thing I can't recall was if the A unit shell kit came out before or after Athearn's acquisition. I think it was actually after.

I remember one conversation I was having with a well respected modeler. He was going on and on about not liking F units. I finally asked him the musical question "Why not?"

The sound of crickets followed... Smile

Rusty


IIRC the Highliner kits came out just before Athearn bought the dies. They continued to sell kits for a while after the transfer. I think about the time Athearn did offer their Highliner units as a RTR the kits were nolonger offered.

Greg
Rusty you're right......they were the Highliner kits. I think Paul Lubliner or something similar to that last name was the fellow who created the Highliners. Heck I get lots of stuff twisted around these days and it drives my wife nuts. Paul was the 1st guy to really get the F unit dimensions and contours correct or close to correct.

I wasn't in HO at the time so I only watched from the outside hoping someday, someone would do the same for O scale. Low and behold Pat @ P&D hobbies did it a few years later.

You know Andre, different paint scheme can make a difference on the appearance of the nose contours on F units. I've noticed that before looking through my EMD F Unit book.

After my last post I looked closely at my SHS F3 UP noses painted in Armour Yellow with anti-glare green on top and they look awful good....even knowing the windshield opening is too tall it look better to me in Armour Yellow. SHS did a remarkable job on these locos and captured the F unit appearance well.

Butch
Butch:

Right you are about paint schemes in regards to changing the look of a unit. IF I went Frisco, the black would play down the openings, me thinks. IF I went KC&G, the blue may not. However, as you point out, they are darn good looking units, regardless.

John:

Yes, the ride height is nice on the E unit, and the pilot apron sits nicely. I typically lower units that sit too high. On the old HO Stewart F's, there were tits molded into the truck "bowl" area that I would shave off. It would lower them a few scale inches, enough so they didn't ride so high. As for the AM unit, I figure there would be ways to lower it if I find the ride height objectionable. In the past I have also milled the bolsters of frames that sat too high. I ain't above doing it again! Shucks, it's only time... and we got a lot of that, don't we? Don't WE????

Andre
quote:
Originally posted by laming:
Rusty:

Thought so on the Q! Seeing as you're a "Q-ball"... perhaps you can help me with a date on a couple of CB&Q events:

* The date on when the Chinese Red hood unit scheme began to appear.

* The appearance date on when the block lettered "BURLINGTON" boxcars begin to appear. I have seen both Chinese Red and lots of Boxcar Red versions of that scheme. Would like to eventually represent it on my early-mid sixties KC Lines layout.

Andre


Andre, I can get your Q info tonight after work. My DSL was constipated last night and it was hard to do anything online.

What I can tell you off the top of my head is the first diesel painted Chinese Red was a an SD9 that was rebuilt after wreck. Pretty sure it was before 1960. The Q historic society just put out a tome on the SD's, covering the SD7's to SD24's.

(It's pretty odd. I belong to the CB&Q Historical Society, but not the Santa Fe. Confused)

Rusty
If you want to see "Chinese Red" you can come to central IL and see it on the Bloomer Line, a small shortline made up of grain shippers. They office/work
out of Gibson City and most of their equipment is painted in the CB&Q like color.
Highliners went the route of the GSB SD40-2 in the early to mid eighties. I remember we in HO were all excited to have a SD40-2 and then it took them two or three years to be produced and the product itself was wanting in many areas.
Believe it or not, in HO, it was Lifelike who came out with Northeastern cabooses and a BL2 that was "superdetailed" from the factory and forced Atlas, et al, into the production of something beyond Athearn "blue box". And Atlas shook the HO world in '84 with the smooth running Atlas/Kato Rs-3, which would be a good runner today.
As to S, I remember holding a F something from SHS in St. Louis at the National Train Show in '01 and marveling over it...I knew I should have gone S right then and there.
Last edited by John Albee
Agreed: The KCT scheme rocks. Smile

FWIW: After I finish working nights this week, I have decided to paint my SHS NW2 w/Tsuami into KCT #60. It will look like the scheme above on #75. I figure it is much more attainable to attempt getting that done in time for the Frisco Convention (Sept 17th) instead of the Frisco DS4-4-1000 Baldwin. The KCT and the Frisco were so intertwined in KC that it's almost like making a Frisco unit.

Downside: All those gorgeous stripes are a PAIN IN THE PATOOTEY to apply. Did you notice how many angles are going on with the stripes??? The cab ends are one angle, the battery box sides are another... and the white pilot stripes yet another angle!!! Lot's of tedious decal application ahead. BUT... it'll be worth it when finished.

As for the Baldwins: Still more stuff to decide upon, and order for same. Gonna' be a while on the Baldwins.

Andre
quote:
Originally posted by laming:
Downside: All those gorgeous stripes are a PAIN IN THE PATOOTEY to apply. Did you notice how many angles are going on with the stripes??? The cab ends are one angle, the battery box sides are another... and the white pilot stripes yet another angle!!! Lot's of tedious decal application ahead. BUT... it'll be worth it when finished.

Andre


Sounds like it's time for the chorus to sing "Enjoyment with an everlasting challenge..." Big Grin

Rusty
Yeah, all the stripes will be a PITA, but there's nothing like safety stripes on a black switcher to give you that "Railroad" feeling. And especially since you have both yellow and white stripes!

From what I've seen of your work you'll have no problem with this task.

Looking forward to seeing the results.


Butch

Hi Matt!

 

Thanks for your interest in my little S scale projects. 

 

Alas, there's no new progress to report on my Baldwin's.  In fact, my modeling has taken a backset due to a few factors:

 

1. Available time/inclination.

 

2. Other interests (means I have to choose between the interests in regards to point 1 above!)

 

3. I railroad for a living and (for me) that does detract from the hobby of model trains.

 

4. I lost $500 on a good-faith purchase of S scale decals from Oddballs Decals that were never delivered.  This has taken the wind out of my sails, too.

 

The biggest blow in regards to #4 is that I had ordered pretty much all the decals I would ever need for my KC Lines theme.  Since Oddballs Decals is now out of business... I'm really back to square one as to how to proceed.  Oddballs was the only source for the liveries ordered.  Hate to spend money all over again with another supplier when I'm already out $500!  To complicate this issue further, for the most part all the decals would have to be custom decals. (Oddballs was THE source for such things at the KCT, Frisco, Katy, Missouri Pacific, etc, etc. In otherwords: ALL the KC area railroads!)

 

So, that sort of catches you up to date.

 

Andre

 

 

Hi Frank!

 

Thanks for your interest in my little KC Lines layout.

 

Alas, though, there's not any progress to report at all since the above post dated March 4, 2013.

 

I keep hoping "one of these days" the ol' bug will return... but so far it hasn't.  Like I said above... it was truly a blow that Oddballs has gone belly up and my money went with it.

 

Now that Oddballs decals are no longer an option, if/when the time comes to pick up the pieces and see where I'm with my KC Lines theme ... I will need to seriously consider downsizing my roster/equipment ideas I had.  Gone are the Mop units and rolling stock I wanted to do, ditto the Katy, etc, etc, etc.  It's a shame I hitched my hobby horse to the Oddballs wagon!!!

 

BTW: I recall some of the newbies to S scale have left us... something to do with the lack of product/Kadar Kaper situation?  Who's still "in" S and who's bailed?

 

Andre

Hello Andre,

 

Sorry to read about the Oddballs Decals transaction not delivering. I hope you find another resource that can produce. I wish you the best on your search! 

 

I have not bailed! I plan to start a S Scale layout this fall. I have bought a few cars but mainly looking at what track and switches to purchase. The main theme will be 21st Century. Hope to have a small Intermodal yard with a grain elevator near by and some warehousing and logistic center. The die cast tractor/trailer selection in 1:64 scale is great. The prices are expensive but I'll shop around for some good deals.  I like all the modern engines like the SD70ACe, ES44AC, AC4400AC, AC6000CW and the SD70MAC's.     

 

Best Regards,

Frank   

Wow!  This thread is like my sister...it has whiskers!
Andre, for the sake of all that is holy, hang with S scale!  I've never been more convinced that it is perfect in size and heck, now I'm into scratchbuilding and loving it!
Frank, love having you in SScale!
And Matt, you are the most unselfish and most helpful gentleman on this or any other forum!  How are your 44 tonner project(s) coming along?



quote:
Wow!  This thread is like my sister...it has whiskers!




 

Hmmm... I may have dated her way back when.

 

The time or two that I've taken a look at changing to something else... I just can't get away from the perfect size. 

 

When I reactivate in the model railroading hobby, I'm confident it will be with S scale. 

 

I really suspect that when that time comes, I will need to re-evaluate the overall scope of what I was going to do in regards to running lots of different KC roads on my layout. I may have to scale back to a couple or so roads, and have custom decals made for same. 

 

OR, I could just use up the Oddballs decals I currently have, and proceed forward from that point with my Kansas City & Gulf proto-lanced theme using Microscale and other readily available generic decals and letter them as I did with Champ/etc in HO scale.  Downside to my KC&G theme is that I was enjoying replicating some of my favorite prototype paint schemes in S scale.

 

We shall see!

 

Andre

 

 

 

Originally Posted by John Albee:
And Matt, you are the most unselfish and most helpful gentleman on this or any other forum!  How are your 44 tonner project(s) coming along?

Thanks John.  I've made some progress on the Smoky Mountain Model Works Phase IV 44 tonner...satisfied with a modified HO drive and currently assembling the shell.  My American Models Baldwin S12 repower project is on hold until I receive the updated geared wheelsets from NWSL.  My thread/saga is on the SScaleSIG Forum.  Also working on a sugar cane car per the U.S. Sugar Corporation in Clewiston, Florida kitbashed from an American Models boxcar.  Might make for an interesting micro layout.

 

Matt

Hey Andre,

 

Sorry to hear about the Odd Ball Decal saga.  That is just not right. If and when you care to proceed with your "S" layout plans (I hope you do) I've got a supplier whose given me great service with custom decals.  Dave at LBR Enterprises. If you can supply artwork (decals in another scale work) Dave can make all you want at a reasonable cost and the quality is great. I had him make up a bunch of decals for the Union Pacific to go on some undecorated SHS steel rebuilt boxcars and I now have different road numbers for each car. Only took a couple of weeks. 

 

www.lbrenterprisesllc.com

 

Give him a try.

 

Butch 

 

 

Ditto on the Matt comment John. He is a very talented and patient modeler. Look forward to seeing the 44 tonner. 

Hi Butch:

 

Yes, the Oddballs situation was a real bummer.

 

Thanks for the link/info on LBR Enterprises (decals).  Downside to special orders is the numbers required to get the order.  What do I do with all the excess decals?

 

Like i mentioned above, I guess when the time comes to renew efforts... I will need to do some heavy re-thinking on the scope of the roster/equipment and downsize to what can reasonably be accomplished with my existing locomotive models and a few custom decals. 

 

Originally I was going to be able to free-flow with available models and decals to accommodate several of the KC area lines that I liked.  Not so now.  I have enough switchers to make a couple/three roads... but very little 4-axle road power for the transfers/local freights.  However, for the most part, the transfers/local freights were going to be eye candy mostly, and not completely necessary for operation.  The same transfers could be accomplished using switcher power.

 

Ah well... all for now!

 

Andre

Time for a major update on where things are.  This post is lengthy... so if you're a reader, then read on... if a browser... you've found the wrong post!   Okay... let's git to it...

First off: Oddball Decals is dead.

 

(Oddball's was the only S scale decals source I've used.  No one else had the roads/etc I intend to model.)

As mentioned previously in this thread, this really knocked the stuffin's out of me.  However, the demise of Oddballs is something I'll simply have to accept and make adjustments concerning.  Can't cry n' whine forever over spilled milk, right?

So, it is time to regroup and rethink my concept a bit.  Originally, I envisioned my KC Lines layout as:

1. A small, but interesting, layout that offered plenty of urban industrial feel.

2. A small layout that has the ability to offer some pretty decent switching opportunities.

3. Offer the opportunity for a transfer train to come onto the layout (from a hidden portion), set out/pick up at the 12th Street Yard, and then move along, to reenter the hidden stage area again on the other side of the room.

4. The entire layout would be served by a couple of switchers from a larger rail system "stationed" at 12th Street Yard. To accommodate this idea, 12th Street Yard has provisions for a very small service area such as the above would require.

5. The layout was also envisioned to be a stage on which any/all of my favorite Kansas City area railroads from my childhood/youth could be seen in action, such as on a transfer train, as well as being used as the "stationed" switch engines.  In other words, for a couple of weeks (or months?) 12th Street Yard and the surrounding industrial area would be Frisco territory, and other KC roads would come in on the transfer train(s).  Maybe after the Frisco it could be the Mop, next it could be the Katy, or CB&Q... get the idea?

The above was the concept in a nutshell.  Once originally conceived, the theme was more fully developed, motive power ideas were developed, a layout designed, some track laid, engines/rolling stock bought, some Oddball Decals bought... hey this looked like it was going to work! 

Then I spun the Wheel Of Fortune and sent off a HUGE (to me) order for all the decals I would need... BUT... when the big wheel stopped it landed on "Bankrupt":  Oddballs ceased to exist.

SOooo... that brings me up to the point I'm at now.

So what's next?

Well, I'm regrouping and tweaking my goals.  S scale is such a wonderful size, and in view that there is still a LOT of excellent stuff available, both new as well as on the secondary market, the scale is just too good not to enjoy it in some form or another.

How to regroup, then?  How to tweak the idea and still accomplish SOME of the original goals?

Well, first off, I think points 1 through 4 are still very "do-able".  However, due to the loss of Oddballs and my sizable order with them, I feel point number 5 has taken a pretty hefty hit. THIS is where I'll need to do the tweaking.  Alas, point 5 WAS a significant "druther" for my layout concept... but... it's gotten a lot more complicated with the loss of Oddballs, hence the regrouping.

Originally I envisioned 4-axle 1st Generation power to be used on the transfer trains, and had already purchased a few pieces toward that end.  I could mentally "see": Frisco GP7's, Frisco RS2's (would have been a kitbash), maybe some Frisco F's and FA's.  Also could see Mop switchers, perhaps Mop RS3's, GP7's, S-12's, SW's, etc. Ditto the Katy, the CB&Q and maybe even some KCS, etc.  OH... and the Kansas City Terminal. DEFINITELY wanted KCT power to be well represented. Also intended to have lots of rolling stock lettered for all the Class 1's that were in KC during the early-mid 60's. See what I mean? 

No, the above isn't too practical now that decals are not readily available for the above.

So, what I may need to do is to downsize the projected overall scope of the roster and have decals for select KC roads custom made. My "really, really, want" keepers, so to speak, would be the Frisco, the KCT, the Mop, and perhaps the Katy.  I could do these roads using switchers (for the stationed switch jobs) and single GP/RS units (or a switcher) for transfer trains.

The rolling stock will just have to be what RTR I can find that can be plausibly used... OR what can be found in the way of decals and dry transfers that would be appropriate for the KC area.  Fortunately,  I have a stash of CDS dry transfers and Enhorning decals, many of which are relatively "good to go" for the KC area.

The layout itself really has no major obstacles to overcome other than laziness on my part!  I would like more "user friendly" switches, but that's about all I would actually change.  My "photoflat" idea was paying off in spades... very happy with the way that was turning out.  I already have a DCC system, but could eventually (hopefully) use another handheld for if/when the time comes that there's enough operation possible to support two operators.

So, there you have it.  My S scale effort isn't completely dead after all... just needed a moratorium on it for a spell to give me some time to mull things over.  Now that I have, I still see potential... just gonna' have to readjust and take a bit different approach.  Namely, I can't have it all... I will need to specialize in the elements that are really important to me, and be satisfied with that approach.

 

Later gators!

 

 

Hi Rusty!

 

Yes, I have thought of that and intended to do it.  In fact, I have the Microscale decals on hand needed to create the KC&G switcher scheme. 

 

I have an undec AM Baldwin S-12 that I am detailing and will receive DCC and Tsunami sound.  In fact, I have the needed DCC decoders, sound modules, and speakers in hand to do both AM Baldwin projects. (The other AM Baldwin has been modified to reflect a DS4-4-1000 and will become Frisco #241.)  I also have a couple of undecorated SHS NW2's DCC/Tsunami equipped.

 

I have seriously thought about taking the S-12 and one of the NW2's and doing them up for the KC&G. 

 

NOTE: For illustration purposes for those of you not familiar with my KC&G theme below you'll find a pic of a Kato HO NW2 painted for the KC&G.  (I modeled my proto-lanced KC&G during the last of my HO years.)

 

 

 

So yes, I have considered it, and I have still not totally discounted the idea.

 

The trouble is that thus far, in S scale, I find more enjoyment in replicating the prototypes of the KC area than I do the KC&G.  However, frankly, the KC&G would be a much better fit to accommodate the ENGINES available in S scale.

 

However, all is not rosey in KC&G land either.  The needed decals for the prototype Kansas OKLAHOMA & Gulf boxcars (that I modified for use as KC&G) was an Oddballs product (that was a part of the never-to-be-delivered Oddballs order).  SOOOO... this would mean no KC&G boxcars unless I commission custom decals to be made. 

 

Here's a couple of HO examples of KC&G boxcars that used the modified Kansas Oklahoma & Gulf decals.

 

 

 

So, yes, I have thought about a KC&G reprise... and may do it... but at this point... not leaning in that direction... sort of... maybe.

 

The tangled webs we weave, huh?

 

Now, having said that, I may try to find/purchase a NIB SHS CB&Q NW2 DCC/Tsunami.  It would be my second CB&Q engine, which is enough for the CB&Q to be a "player" on the layout.  (I'm thinking in terms of pairs of switchers in a road name to equip the layout with.)

 

ALSO... thinking about starting the long and patient search for a brass S-2 for the KCT.  Unless the version that was imported years ago runs FAR better than the HO brass I've been exposed to, it will likely need a re-powering job, flywheels, and gear work.

 

However, I'm just GLAD that I'm having this discussion!  In makes me feel like there's HOPE for my KC Lines layout!

Andre, i'm very happy to see your thoughts and take a great approach to thinking things thru.  I'm elated that you're staying in S scale, we need your talent and enthusiasm!
I've posted a number of pics on the S scale Facebook page, I love S scale more everytime I work in it.
As for my rr, after nearly 4 years, my benchwork is 99.9 percent done, buildings being built and generally have exactly the power I need.  I can now begin some superdetailing, but for the most part my scenery is up and will reach that "good enough" mark.
I so appreciate the community of encouragement that we have here!  Thanks to Rusty (more pics please) Butch, Ed and so many others that encourage me!
Frank, how are you S plans coming along?

Top o' the mornin' to 'ya John, me boy!

 

Good to see you pop in here. 

 

Frank: I echo John's sentiment... post us an update on how you're coming along with S scale!

 

As for this thread:

 

Well... I do a lot of thinking... and talking too. (Or have you noticed?)  Agreed, I'm full of enthusiasm for whatever I have the fever for at the time.  Others may also feel I'm full of something else, too... but that's another story left for another time.

 

Me thinks at this point it would behoove me to do SOMETHING that is quickly attained to help spur me on.  Spending money is the easiest way to accomplish that (I'm deciding on which direction to spend as we speak.)  However, I'm talking about some form of tangible PROGRESS to savor. 

 

The Baldwins are still quite a ways off (lots of small piddly that needs to be addressed as well as the electronics side)... not wise to look in that direction for quick gratification.

 

Could weather some rolling stock.  That would be quick and would offer progress.

 

OR... I could take the engine pictured below and get it weathered and "layout ready".  This would be a good Saturday project.

 

 

However, whatever I'm going to do will have to wait until the wife and I return from Colorado.  (Gettin' ready to head out that way again this year for another week of riding dual sport dirt motorcycles amid the Colorado splendor!)

 

At this point, weathering the CB&Q SW is at the top of the list.

 

Church time beckons... later dudes!

 

 

Andre wrote:

First off: Oddball Decals is dead.  (Oddball's was the only S scale decals source I've used.  No one else had the roads/etc. I intend to model.)

 

Ed L. replies:

One alternative to Oddball Decals is taking HO or O decals, scanning them into a computer, adjusting the size to S and printing them out.  There are several custom decal makers that will do this at reasonable cost.  Assuming what you want is available in HO, obtaining S decals should not be terribly difficult.  Ed L.

Hi Edward!  Good to see you poppin' in here, too.

 

While I'm at it: Thanks for helping with the S scale website.  Really a professional looking site.  Also, enjoyed the video clip of your NYC layout found at said website. Some excellent modeling therein.

 

Now... lessee' what'cha had to say...

quote:
One alternative to Oddball Decals is taking HO or O decals, scanning them into a computer, adjusting the size to S and printing them out.

 

Alas, I don't have the capability of printing decals, to say nothing of the multicolored "layered" decals.

 

quote:
There are several custom decal makers that will do this at reasonable cost.  Assuming what you want is available in HO, obtaining S decals should not be terribly difficult.

 

Now Edward, that is a very good idea.  Your Momma didn't raise no dummy, did she? 

 

I didn't realize that if I can find the needed/desired HO decals, it could possibly be reproduced into S scale.  Wow... THIS could open up all SORTS of possibilities in regards to some of the more popular mid-west roads?  (Think Mop, KCS, Rock Island, etc.)

 

Thanks for that input!

 

Andre

So much for working an ANY kind of model at this point!  I've let this hobby room get totally, and completely piled with stacked hobby clutter.  On the workbench there's slot car projects, model airplane glow engine projects, some 3 rail model train stuff, R/C airplanes, control line model airplane stuff... crap, crap, and more crap.

 

The hobby workbench is so bad I can't even find my scale ruler!!!

 

Soooooooo....

 

My hobby "direction" is set for the foreseeable future: I gotta' go into a "selling" mode and start getting rid of some of this stuff!!!  Then I've got to condense the "keeper" stuff and regain control of my hobby room.

 

(Sigh.) 

 

"Momma's don't let yer babies grow up to be PACK RATS..." (Sung with apologies to Waylon Jennings!)

 

 

Originally Posted by laming:



(Oddball's was the only S scale decals source I've used.  No one else had the roads/etc I intend to model.)

Hi Andre

 

If you need an alternative for decals I've had great service and support from Stan Cedarleaf, Stan does large scale decals but I'm quite sure he would be more than happy to do S scale as well.


Colin

 

Worked for the Union Pacific in the late 60s and early 70s as a clerk.  For a few months I held the job on the team track which was located in the West Bottoms,  After the UP pulled out of Union Station I believe it was the renamed City of Kansas City ended it's run in the West Bottoms.  A couple of double wides were the station.

Stan:

 

Thanks for another tip on decals!

 

tcox009:

 

Thanks for that anecdote!  Do you have any pictures you took while serving in the West Bottoms area?

 

All:

 

First: I found my scale ruler!  Hooray for me!  (Hey, it's a start, right???)

 

Second:  Just got back from a fantastic Colorado vacation.  Have given some more thought about this KC Lines layout thing.  The more I do, the more I realize that I am missing the "modeling" part of railroading. (Remember, I do it for a living.  Also, when I do dabble in "playing" trains, it has typically been in "V scale" now for quite some time.)

 

Third: I have already started the ball rolling trying to find/acquire some key items still needed.  I also have some "Saturday" projects in mind for some quicker gratification than the would be found in the Baldwin projects/etc. 


We'll see!

 

In the meantime, here's a pic I just shot (after clearing off that portion of the layout benchwork!).  I guess a "caption" could go something like this...

 

"CB&Q SW9 #9271 eases along the old spur track to Crooks Warehouse to dig out a car that's been released as the crew of SLSF #306 looks on while drilling cars in 12th St. Yard."

 

 

 

Update!

 

First, as you can see from the lack of photos, I'm having server issues with the server that hosts my photos.  Hope to be back up "soon".

 

I have decided that one of my undecorated SHS NW2's is to become my second CB&Q engine.  I wanted variety, so I'm going with an CB&Q NW2 instead of an CB&Q SW9 (like the one I have).  I am going for a different lettering/paint variation on this one, too.  Already have started the ball rolling on a set of custom decals for it.

 

Here's the scheme I'm going to replicate:

 

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...ture.aspx?id=1235014

 

Here's another angle, though I don't know if I'll model this particular unit. I dunno', perhaps if I can figure out what the box is in front of the upper cab windows and what it does maybe it would be cool to make it?  Definitely not like my other CB&Q switcher!  Here's a link to a pic of it:

 

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=589592

 

FWIW:

 

Have been piddlin' and making some tidbit progress on getting back to a point so that I know where I'm at on my previous projects as well as overall inventory of my parts stock.

 

FWIW2:


Ordered and received two SHS rebuilt boxcars in schemes that will work for my KC Lines theme.  Cool.

 

FWIW3:


I'm discovering that IF I can find the decals in HO or O scale... I can likely have them replicated in S scale.  THAT is a very cool thing.

 

All fer now!

 

Andre

 

 

Update to the above update:

 

Forgot to mention that I also have started the process on getting a set of Missouri Pacific early "Jenks Blue" era loco decals produced.  This is leading to a decision to make the other detailed Baldwin S-12 into a Mop unit, as well as the other box-stock undec unit on my shelf.  When finished this will give me a pair of Mop Baldwin's that can putter about the layout, too!

 

It's all good.

10/03/13: Update time!

 

First off, I've edited the post in this thread concerning the pictures that compared the various F/E unit noses.  That particular post is on the second page.

 

Secondly: What have I been doing in S scale lately?

 

Well, it's been a hectic two weeks on account of my wife's father's last days and eventual passing.  However, among the busy schedule of late, I taken some of my time that becomes available and have been dusting off my stuff, continuing to take inventory, and getting some things headed my way so I can further projects.  Such as...

 

* Ordered a good chunk of S scale detail parts order from Bill's Train Shop ( http://www.btsrr.com/ ) for my various engine projects. 

 

* Purchased some Wiseman S scale detail parts off eBay.

 

* Purchased the needed items from Northwest Short Line to re-power one of my Baldwin's to see if it would be worth the effort (and thus re-power them all).  They run pretty darn good as is, but being a "performance freak", I am wondering if I can make them even a smidge better.

 

* Purchased "CB&Q In Color Vol. 3" that has some excellent KC area shots therein.

 

* Decided to commit to S scale and became a member of the National Association of S Gaugers organization.

 

In all, things are reviving and ever so slowly I'm figuring out where I'm at in my modeling and taking steps to have the needed items to make some tangible progress.

 

Forward... HO!  (I mean "S"!)

 

Originally Posted by laming:

* Purchased the needed items from Northwest Short Line to re-power one of my Baldwin's to see if it would be worth the effort (and thus re-power them all).  They run pretty darn good as is, but being a "performance freak", I am wondering if I can make them even a smidge better.

 

Andre,

Please share the details and photos on your AM Baldwin repowering project.

Thanks.

Hi 'ya Old Goat!

 

My NWSL parts haven't arrived yet, so I don't have anything to share at this point. 

 

HOWEVER...

 

I'll go 'ya one better, Slick... below is a link to the article that inspired me to try it (which includes a comparison video link).  You'll need to scroll a bit over half-way down the page to get to the AM repowering article, but once you do there's pics w/parts lists and that video I mentioned!  Enjoy!

 

http://www.nasg.org/Scale/index.htm

 

Andre

This is gonna' be a big week with a lot of S scale goodies arriving at the Ming household.

 

Been givin' some thought as to what I'm going to do with my remaining Undec units.  I "THINK" I've come up with a plan:

 

* It's already decided that one undec SHS NW2 is to become a CB&Q "Blackbird" with the large "Burlington" on the sides (instead of the slogans) and will join CB&Q #9271, giving me a pair of CB&Q switchers that will have visual differences. (I like that.)

 

* The DS4-4-1000 AM S-12 kitbash will become Frisco #241 which will give me a pair of Frisco units for use. (It joining Frisco SW9 #306.)

 

* The in-process AM S-12 that is almost finished with detail work will become a KC&G unit.  The remaining undec SHS NW2 will likewise become a KC&G unit.  This gives me a pair of KC&G units to use. 

 

Now, the above idea is still in the "definite maybe" stage... BUT... there WAS a temptation:  Use the two S-12's and take them into Missouri Pacific "Jenks Blue" paint, giving me a pair of Mop S-12's for use. 

 

This would leave me an undec SHS NW2, which could be paired up with a to-be-acquired AM S-12 to be painted into KC&G livery.

 

OR...

 

Go ahead and go with plan as mentioned above, which leaves a spare S-12 instead of a spare NW2. But what to do for another roadname pair?  Well, here's what I'm tossin' around as options:

 

1. Purchase an AM RS3 and put both the spare S-12 and the RS3 into Mop paint... perhaps Jenks Blue on the S-12 and the older blue/gray on the RS3. 

 

2. Purchase another S-12 to go with the spare S-12 and both of those go into Mop paint for a pair of Mop S-12's (I have pics of two Mop S-12's in Jenks Blue in use in KC during my era.)

 

Hmmmmm.... decisions, decisions.

 

What would you do?

 

Hi John!

 

I've thought about loaner and/or leased power (GN, for example)... but figured my efforts need to be toward something that was actually in KC.  Besides, I have 13 (that's THIRTEEN) Class 1 railroads to pick n' choose from for modeling!

 

In addition to the above list, I foresee the following roads having a presence on my KC Lines layout "one of these days":

 

* KCT (If/when a brass Alco S-2 shows up on the secondary market.)

 

* Katy (The red scheme, but NOT with the "shield" like on the Lionel MKT NW2... but the yellow herald.)

 

* KCS

 

* MILW

 

* CGW (They had SEXY switcher paint schemes in the '50s that lasted into the '60s!)

 

* ATSF (Can be in two schemes: Zebra and Bookends.)

 

* UP

 

* ??? (There's still the Wabash, CRIP, n' GM&O to pick n' choose from!)

 

So, as you can see, simply selecting from what IS correct for KC offers a lifetime of modeling possibilities.

 

erdnA

Andre,

 

I have been thinking about getting back into S scale by converting my N scale layout depicting the Frisco in St Louis.  Although I remember that area better in 1980, but haven't decided on an era yet. With the cars and locomotives currently in my collection, the late 50s, 60s or 70s could all be covered.

 

Ultimately there are many decal projects that could benefit both of us. Have you checked with Herald King? Would they be willing to do some of the Frisco sets in S? To start I am looking at the PS2 two and three bay hoppers which I could use a couple of each. Also how is the MP diesel project going?

Hi Cheltenham!

 

I can certainly understand your desire to migrate from N scale to the much more eye-friendly S scale.  S scale is, after all, the perfect size.

 

As for decals of mutual benefit:  Yup, that would work out good if you hop over to S scale.  There are decal suppliers willing to print to S scale provided the artwork can be supplied.  Doing so would be less painless if "like-minded" S modelers can pool their efforts to absorb any "minimum" numbers required for printing.

 

The Baldwin DS4-4-1000 that could become an MP is still patiently waiting on the workbench for my "round tuit" to arrive.  However, some good news: A week or so ago a package arrived via the USPS. Inside was my back ordered flywheel I mentioned above!  So, when the mood arrives, I now have the needed items to repower one of the AM Baldwin frames to see if it would be worth considering as something for the entire AM Baldwin fleet I have.  Like I said, my stock AM Baldwins run pretty darn good "as is"... but I'm a performance freak... so I need to do this to satisfy my curiosity one way or the other.

 

Hi John!  Now you have the "latest" from this lazy S scale modeler!

 

 

Last edited by laming

Thanks Greg!

 

Mike asked:

 

quote:
How's the work on your AM Baldwin coming now that you have the other flywheel?

 

Still waitin' on that round 'tuit!   Lately I've been on a V scale kick.  Currently recreating the Central Pacific over Donner Pass, circa early 1870s!

 

quote:
Or are you too busy roasting your chestnuts in front of the fireplace these days?

 

We tried something a bit different this year. It was very tasty!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xj-jGAJgZY

 

 

 

 

 

Last edited by laming

Andre,

 

I've pulled my nose out of my Frisco Morning Sun books long enough to look at my S scale stuff.  It seems I have six GP9s that long to be converted to 7s, an SW9, an RS3 and a PHII F3AB that need decals.  I am tired of holding my breath for others so an afternoon of playing around with a new drawing program yielded these results. These are preliminary and represent lettering for first generation locos and PS2 covered hoppers. Are you in?

Attachments

Been looking (off n' on) for one of these for several years.  FINALLY one showed up on eBay... and I over powered my bidding opponents with "shoot to kill" tactics. 

 

So, I'm now the proud owner of THIS:

 

 

 

 

So, what am I going to do with this?

 

Well... I hope to eventually turn it into this:

 

 

More comments to follow.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Last edited by laming

Okay, some comments about the OMI S-2 I've purchased will be down below, but first, some questions...

 

* WHY does this software shrink our pictures so much?  (At least it displays shrunken on my browser that comes with Win7 Pro.)  The pictures were linked to my own private web space and are 1024 x 768... yet they show up as these tiny little pics???  Is there a way around this???

 

Now, for the comments about the Overland Models S-2:

 

* First off, it is EXQUISITE to simply look at.  Almost don't want to paint it!

 

* There's also a bag of goodies that came with it so it can be personalized somewhat. I will eventually see what all is in the packets.

 

* It runs pretty darn good.  I will eventually take off the carbody and take a look-see at the mechanism. Could be that I can add flywheels for even better performance... but it's pretty good "as is".

 

* I've never painted brass... so I may have a brass painter put on the basic black in semi-gloss and then take it from there.  We'll see.

 

Anyway... that's it: I finally have a basis for a reasonably accurate Kansas City Terminal engine!  Yippeeee!

 

 

Originally Posted by laming:

 

 

* WHY does this software shrink our pictures so much?  (At least it displays shrunken on my browser that comes with Win7 Pro.)  The pictures were linked to my own private web space and are 1024 x 768... yet they show up as these tiny little pics???  Is there a way around this???

 

 

 

 

Andre, the forum seems to like images aroud 500-600 pixels wide, probably to maintain the page formatting.  Seeing that your linking photo's from your personal website, I guess your stuck with whatever the software reduces them to.

 

If you upload the images to the forum, they still get reduced in size to fit the format, but the image can then be clicked on to be displayed in it's full glory.

 

Also, if your images appears only "schrunched" horizontally, switch to Firefox (or Chrome so I'm told) for a browser.  These's something about certain versions of Windows IE that Hoopla's not fond of.

 

BTW, I don't recall if the S2's got flywheels, I haven't had mine apart in decades, but it has a can motor and is your basic good ol' two truck center motor drive.  The motor in mine freaked out years ago and I remember buying an A-Line can motor that was a direct replacement for an Athearn drive.  It fit perfectly.

 

Rusty

Last edited by Rusty Traque

Rusty:

 

Yup, know it's the forum software... just sort of sucks is all.  Don't know if it has flywheels either... but I'll find out eventually.

 

Mike:

 

When finished it ought to be a looker, I'd say!

 

John:


Thanks!  It's definitely a neat addition.

 

Tony?  Tony Who?  Wright?

 

Lessee'... in the dateless past I knew a Tony Wright.


TONY!!!  Good to "see" you!  Still putz'n along with your 3 rail layout?  Still doin' the music scene? Got any grand kids yet? 

 

As for me, I'm sort-of-kind-of still messin' with my S scale layout idea... but mainly I'm "gathering goodies" for when I have more time to invest into it. All winter it's been 65+ hour weeks (70.25 hours couple weeks ago) and 6 day work weeks... don't have a lot of oompah to get into craftsman type modeling, even if I wanted to.  However, only 3 more Saturday passenger runs and I'll have most of my Saturday's back. 

 

Hope the family is doing well.

 

Well... all for now! 

Last edited by laming

Good morning Gents!

 

Well, I have some good news, and some bad news.

 

First, the good news: Within the past couple weeks or so, I have been able to find and acquire several pieces for my "KC Lines: West Bottoms" theme that are all ready to go (i.e. DCC and sound already installed and most in factory paint).  I have also been able to find/acquire needed track items. FURTHER, I am redesigning my track plan and it is beginning to appear that I have more than doubled the layout, yet still within the confines of the same small space I have to work with. (I only have 9'6" x 12'9" + 9'6" x 2' within the closet for staging.)

 

The bad news: It's in HO scale.

 

I know, I know.  I'm a defector of the faith.  No need to for any of you to step in and berate me for this choice: I was duly upbraided on the Yahoo S scale list when I announced this. In fact, those that I thought were virtual friends were a bit on the rude side, which surprised, and also disappointed, me. 

 

I say all the above to let you know that this thread will very likely go silent now, as it just wouldn't be right to post updates to an HO layout attempt here in this excellent S scale forum made up of some great S scale guys.

 

S is indeed the perfect size. Just wish I had a 29 year collection from which to work with and more space!  Too little time, now.  Got to make time, thus HO.

 

I will definitely be dropping by and oogling all your models and layouts... so you will not be TOTALLY rid of me!

Last edited by laming
Originally Posted by laming:

Good morning Gents!

 

Well, I have some good news, and some bad news.

 

First, the good news: Within the past couple weeks or so, I have been able to find and acquire several pieces for my "KC Lines: West Bottoms" theme that are all ready to go (i.e. DCC and sound already installed and most in factory paint).  I have also been able to find/acquire needed track items. FURTHER, I am redesigning my track plan and it is beginning to appear that I have more than doubled the layout, yet still within the confines of the same small space I have to work with. (I only have 9'6" x 12'9" + 9'6" x 2' within the closet for staging.)

 

The bad news: It's in HO scale.

 

Aieeeee!

 

Good luck Andre.  We'll keep a light on for ya!

 

Rusty

We'll Andre, you're a skilled modeler and excellent friend, whatever the scale.  I drool at what I see on HO but blindness forbids that size for me.  What I wouldn't give for a Paducah rebuild in S.  On the other hand, it could be built. 
People like you, Rusty, Ed and others have encouraged me in S scale and for that I am grateful.
Please do keep us posted, we want to see your goodies!

Rusty:

 

Yup, keep that light on.  Great group of guys here and I will be tossing in some input as I can.

 

Alan:

 

Thanks for the kind words on my Photoflat backdrop structures!  I intend to start all over again with the backdrop base.  There's some areas where my joints/blending cracked/etc. Also, I'm going to take the plunge and cover that window opening that huge Photoflat is covering.  That way I don't have to have a truly gigantic (in HO) 15 story building overpowering the yard scene to the point of distraction.

 

Speaking of the Photoflats:

 

I have every intention of creating a product line of them and offering them to the modeling public. I already own Photoflats.net domain for my future website for same. My goal is to be up and selling product within a year or two... definitely off the ground before retirement. Unless I get into technical difficulties, each item will be offered in O, S, HO, and N scale.  I still have a few details to work out in regards to marketing/delivery... but it all looks "do-able"... it's just a matter of fitting it in among my current full schedule.

 

John:

 

Thanks to you also for such kind words. It is appreciated. I had hoped some on the Yahoo S scale list felt the same about that "friend" part, I guess I overestimated them.  Oh well.

 

For me, the choice was simple logistics:

 

* I was having to start from scratch amassing enough S stuff to populate a layout. Many S scalers have 30 year collections to work from. I'm 62 years old, I can't wait years for a select items to come available, and scratch building locomotives/rolling stock is out of the question for me. No way I can sink that much time into ONE project.

 

* I didn't fully comprehend the amount of workbench time S scale requires.  The 90/10 rule was out of whack for me.  That is, in S scale, I learned I need to spend 90% of my available hobby time at the workbench altering, assembling, whatever, models and only 10% for other hobby-related things.  At this point in my age, I need 90% RTR that only needs some weathering thrown on it, and only 10% of the time required at the workbench. Yes, I want SOME customized engines (about 10% of the engine roster), but not almost ALL of them (as in 90%).

 

As for being able to see the teeny-wienie trains: At this point I still have good vision. When the day comes that I can't see my wienie trains regardless of the strength of the reading glasses... then I guess it will come out, and a loop of 3 rail will go up in its place... and as long as I can operate the transformer handle I can have a train running!

 

As for keeping you (and others) posted:

 

I guess I ought not to post updates w/pics here.  Perhaps I can fashion a blog of some sort and post progress pictures there?  Alas, that wouldn't be as fun as interacting on a forum such as this one, though.  (Hmmm. Guess I don't have to mention the scale, huh? )

 

All fer now!

Last edited by laming

John A:

 

Just happened to think... I can post some textual info! 


Here's what's purchased or already on hand two weeks into the decision:

 

* RTR Frisco VO1000. Will be sending it off for DCC/Tsunami sound installation soon.

 

* RTR Frisco SW7 w/DCC and QSI sound. (Paid $99 new in box.)

 

* RTR GCW DS4-4-1000 w/DCC and Tsunami sound.

 

* Two MDC 36' steel under frame "Swift" meat reefers to go to the cold storage/distribution warehouse.

 

* Code 83 switches from Peco and Atlas for evaluation.

 

Probably going to purchase enough Atlas code 83 flex track to almost do the layout within the next few days. However, I'm debating taking a look at Peco's code 83 flex track first.

 

In addition to the above I will be able to reuse the following still on hand from the previous HO years:

 

* RTR CB&Q SW7 w/DCC and QSI sound.

 

* Undec NW2 w/DCC and QSI Sound. (Will paint it "someday"... just not now.)

 

* 8 KC&G engines.

 

* 20-something pieces of rolling stock leftover from my previous HO days.

 

* Several Stewart/Kato F units and several Life Like P2K engines. However, these are all undecorated... so will be way down the list of priorities.

 

The short term plan is to continue purchasing the things I'll need as I develop my track plan, continue the process of selling off stuff, (S and other), strip the current bench work of S scale track, and redo the backdrop Masonite/corners.  Once the layout is ready to receive track again, I hope to have enough stuff on hand to start in earnest.

 

My long term goal is to be up and functional in two years.  Not "finished", but functional, and therefore can enjoy some personal operation as well as having a friend over to operate with me. It's been WAY too long since I've had a FUNCTIONING layout. Instead I kept spending valuable time trying to squeeze trains too big (Sn3, O, and S) into this small space I have to work with, and not being satisfied with the result being seen on the layout. 

 

I'll bet all of the above is more than you wanted to know!

Andre,

Good luck with the change.  I too don't have 30 yrs of accumulation but AM and SHS made the core units I need or want, minus the GP40.  I found if I down sized my layout scheme that what was available worked and could fill my needs.  Since you might wonder what I chose, WP is my answer.  One GP9 or GP35 will work for my road switcher/roustabout train.  The SW9 fills my yard switching needs.  Anyway I will miss your presence here in S land.  Like Rusty said the light will be on and the door unlocked.  Do get a blog or web page up on your railroad so we can keep up with your progress.  ****, why do I feel like I'm writing a condolence letter here.  Anyway the HO you have shown was top notch and so will your future layout be top notch.

 

Greg

 

Thanks to you also for such kind words. It is appreciated. I had hoped some on the Yahoo S scale list felt the same about that "friend" part, I guess I overestimated them.  Oh well.

 

 

Andre I don't think they meant to be as harsh as it came off.  They take themselves a little too serious on the yahoo forum sometimes. But, I think you have a lot of train buddies on that forum.

 

Bottom line, as long as you are playing with trains (whatever size), we all gain from your enjoyment and experiences and that's what it's all about. I've been back in O scale for over a year now and really enjoying it for many of the same reasons you mentioned. 

 

I didn't expect much out of Lionel or MTH and they are delivering what I expected. 

 

I frequent the S and O forums as I learn from all of them and don't feel I have to model in S to share the camaraderie I find here. Great bunch of guys. 

 

Butch

Andre:

 

For what it is worth, I'd skip the Atlas track and go with the Peco code 83.  Bought all my Peco track thru Tony's Train Exchange about a year ago, when there was no Atlas to be had.  Looks better than Atlas, is just as easy to work with.  Price was about the same.   

 

Peco makes a darn good switch too.  I didn't buy any of those though, I'm sticking with the Walthers / Shinohara.  I've had very good luck with them over the years.


Regards,

Jerry

 

Update:

 

On hand or in delivery:

 

RTR Frisco VO1000 #214

RTR Frisco VO1000 #224

RTR Frisco SW7 #301 DCC/QSI Pargon2 sound.

RTR Frisco SW7 #303 DCC/QSI Pargon2 sound.

 

RTR CGW S-12 #40 in original paint scheme DCC/Lok-Sound

 

RTR CB&Q SW7 DCC/QSI Quantum sound

RTR Undec SW7 DCC/QSI Quantum sound

 

RTR ATSF Zebra S-4 DCC/Soundtraxx sound

 

Two 25 piece Peco code 83 Flex Track bundles.

 

2 pair Peco #5 Electrofrog switches (to get some dimensions from for track plan revisions.)

 

Plus, some assorted rolling stock and structures.

 

Yup... all it takes to have a model layout is a continual outflow of CASH!

 

ALSO...

 

All S scale track is now pulled up from the layout and is now waiting for the time that I can get started redoing the back drop Masonite/corners, new sky and clouds.

 

The KC Lines will live again...

Last edited by laming
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