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@NYC Fan posted:

That was great, Larry! Almost felt like I was there with you. What year do you think that was? And, do you have any idea what locomotives were pulling those great trains?  I always figured the NYC had an advantage with the Hudsons and Niagaras but not so sure about the diesels.

Probably E units. The year mid 50s. I went a few times, my dad more often. They were beautiful. There were quite a few vantage points in. South Chicago. But State Line was where they were at speed. My dad witnessed the event back in the steam era too.

That should be the Broadway Limited Streamlined K4 Torpedo if I am not mistaken.

Correct.  It is the 3768 which was displayed at the 1939/40 Worlds Fair.  Streamlined by Raymond Loewy.

S Scale model shown:

PRR 4-6-2 3768 SF

While at the Fair the 3768 was painted a bronze color.  After returning to service, it was repainted DLGE.  The 3768 eventuality lost its streamlining and went to scrap in 1953.

Rusty

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Somebody mentioned that the two stations from which the PRR and NYC departed Chicago were on the other side of town from each other, kind of implying a great distance since Chicago has always been kind of a spread out town.  A better description would be to say that those stations (Chicago Union Station and LaSalle Street Station) were only about 5 city blocks apart.  That distance gradually narrowed until they reached Englewood Station which was also in Chicago, just somewhat further south.  From there, they both started their curve around the southern tip of Lake Michigan, and, if I remember correctly, NYC had the inside lane of that curve, giving them a little "advantage" in that race.

Chuck

Last edited by PRR1950

Correct.  It is the 3768 which was displayed at the 1939/40 Worlds Fair.  Streamlined by Raymond Loewy.

S Scale model shown:

PRR 4-6-2 3768 SF

While at the Fair the 3768 was painted a bronze color.  After returning to service, it was repainted DLGE.  The 3768 eventuality lost its streamlining and went to scrap in 1953.

Rusty

Well that explains the bronze colored ones I've seen modeled. Always wonder what that was about. Thanks Rusty.

@clem k posted:

If you want to see the Race..there is a video.   Herron Rail Video...reflections of the New York Central.  Video shot from the Broadway Ltd. ,  looking at a Niagara coming up fast !!

I'll have to check that out Clem.

@NYC Fan posted:

The structure in the background is the New York Central lift bridge over the Calumet River. It would be to the east of the Pennsy mainline.

The structure still exists today.

Calumet Lift Bridge

This photo is looking west. The Pennsy bridge, still used by Amtrak, can be seen on the other side of the NYC bridge, which is no longer used and left in the up position.

Would you suspect that the PRR and NYC drawbridge operators may have raced, too?  Not as spectacular as the trains racing, but Home Road pride extends throughout the railroad.

@Number 90 posted:

Would you suspect that the PRR and NYC drawbridge operators may have raced, too?  Not as spectacular as the trains racing, but Home Road pride extends throughout the railroad.

I would assume the default position of the bridges when both were in use was down. The Pennsy bridge is still in use by Amtrak. As the NYC bridge no longer serves a purpose, no tracks lead to it anymore, it is always in the up position.  Still makes a cool picture.

@Apples55 posted:

Thanks for all the fascinating historical info (Dave, Rusty, Chuck, and Tom). I was aware of Loewy’s involvement with the streamlining of the T1 and S1 (and, of course, the GG1), but this is new info to me - one of the things I love about this forum!!!

Paul, believe I am just a big novice with mostly everything on here. I am the guy that only knows the batting average of a few players so to speak. Or the best way to say it, I know steam locomotives have smoke stacks, lol. Skip, Rusty, Chuck, Tom and anyone else for that matter know way more than me. The only thing I do know is that Victor McLaglen starred in a movie called Broadway Limited(1941). I saw part of this on Youtube I think in 2019. I forget what I was looking up but saw that and had a laugh or two. They show some of the scenes of the streamlined K4 Torpedo traveling about with Victor playing the role of the engineer of the train. I only saw the short bit of this and can't remember too much of what was going on other than him having some issues with someone on the train. It is a romantic comedy and what I saw was somewhat funny to me. I think if I watched the entire film I could appreciate it since I usually like old films.

Since the topic is "The Race of the Century," here's another aspect that came to my aging mind:

  1. Were there any connecting tracks between the PRR and NYC at Englewood, and east of the drawbridges?  These could have been justified as being interchange tracks for cars destined to and shipped from industries served exclusively by only one of the two railroads.  However, in an emergency, such tracks could have been used to detour over the other railroad if, say, there was a big freight train pileup blocking all tracks of PRR or NYC (or if one of the drawbridges was out of service for some reason).*
  2. If -- if -- there were track connections, does anyone know of the 20th Century Limited or the Broadway Limited actually having detoured over the detested competitor's rails on the famously competitive stretch of track between Englewood and East Chicago?  We're not talking about Penn Central or Amtrak here -- only the two flagship trains of NYC and PRR.

If that ever happened, there would certainly have been glee in one of the railroads' headquarters, while there was seething anger in the headquarters of the road which had to detour.

I know one thing:  I would not want to be a member of a crew whose derailment caused such a detour to occur, nor would I want to be an officer or a supervisor on the Division which included that territory.

*  Normally, if the NYC or the PRR became blocked, and there was time to arrange another way to detour, say, via B&O, Monon, Erie, or NKP, that might have been the preferred solution, but, if the westbound Broadway or Century had already passed the last location where that could be done, there may have been only one heartily despised solution.  I'm only casually familiar with this territory, so that's why I am asking for experts to chime in.

Last edited by Number 90

That's a great question Tom. I myself would think that both railroads would have their schedules at hand and being prepared they would make sure that there was no interruptions. That being said however, we all know that no matter how well planned something is there is always a snafu. I could imagine the hectic dispatchers barking orders out, the signal men, anyone or everyone trying to right things to get their company ahead of schedule in such cases.

Can't speak for the NYC, but the PRR had a little used alternative route out the north end of Chicago Union Station during the early part of the 20th century.  Not sure how long it lasted, but they went north from the station, turned west after a short run, then turned due south for a good distance before turning southeast toward Indiana.  (Can't remember if this was the Panhandle Division entrance to CUS or another division?)  Most likely what would have been used in emergency, despite the passengers waiting at Englewood to head east.

Chuck

FD590B81-7958-468E-BD22-1F5BA1458C84FD590B81-7958-468E-BD22-1F5BA1458C84@NYC Fan posted:

Found another print of the same daily race with streamlined equipment.s-l1600

And on the layout.....



And this Robert West print.....

Steel Steam and Thunder

What an awesome thread NYC fan.

Love the artwork shared here too. Robert West does some nice work. And Howard Fogg we all love his stuff! I’d share some of my artwork but nothing I have done matches this thread.

This made my morning! 😊👍

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Last edited by Erik C Lindgren

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