What Are We After Here?...

palallin posted:

 

Toy is a function of utility.  An item made to be a diversion, a pastime, a hobby is a toy:  it isn't necessary.   No one depends upon it.  If it disappeared, no one is going to starve or freeze.

Nope, no sale,

Working, providing food and shelter is how we live. Persuing our passions, hobbies and dreams is WHY we live. These are all inextricably connected. Therefore our passions and hobbies are as valuable in my mind. Otherwise, we'd all be blobs sitting on a couch in our cube shelter staring at a wall and not much more than slaves or animals. 

On another note, people do seem to put a monetary value on trains. While I own some very expensive trains, many of the most valuable trains I have cost very little, but are most valuable because people I know built them. If other items are toys to any degree, these are not to me.

Also, deternining what a toy is involves making a value judgement and that value is different for everyone. It also often comes with a negative connotation. If someone values greatly their RailKing K4, who am I to tell them there stuff is toys. Nope, not gonna do it, that would be presumptuous.

Back to the original question. Yes, modelers are pains in the butt to the importers.

Strummer posted:

I also wonder if the manufacturers look at the "prototype" modelers as a pain in the a**; after all, the modeler can point to a photo of the prototype and show a discrepancy in the model; I don't know how many photos are out there of the actual 1:1 "Neiman Marcus" steam engine and train! 

Speaking from the manufacturing side, it's all about the modeler.  Most want to genuinely help and make the project as good as it can be.  There are a vocal few who just want to complain.  Not any different than people in any other hobby or profession.

Rusty Traque posted:

Aliquippa & Southern posted:

This question will be asked till the end of time. I remember in the 70's Walthers had a steam engine lettered in Penn Central. All over America emergency rooms were overflowing with accurate guys having heart attacks. LOL

To me at the end of the day the only person that matters is the one looking back at you when you shave.

".....and I'll have fun, fun, fun till the Big Guy takes my ticker away." LOL

Actually, it was decals for Penn Central steam. 

They also offered sets for Burlington Northern, Great Northern Big Sky Blue and Seaboard Coast Line:

Also, the HO world was not immune:

Rusty

Rusty,

Doah! You're right it was decals. Now correct me if I'm wrong didn't one of their catalogs have an illustration of a steam engine with the PC Logo on the tender?

Doug

I don't know about the catalog, but I recall one of the hobby rags published an editorial about the Walther's set and it had a drawing of a PC-lettered steam engine. Perhaps that's what you're remembering?

Andre

brianel_k-lineguy posted:

Well, most of the history of Lionel is TOY trains, even though terms like "realism" and "scale proportions" were used in Lionel catalogs. Even today, Ryan Kunkle of Lionel, said at the YORK show that even though the traditional trains don't get the attention that the scale products do, it is the traditional starter set line that keeps the company in business.

The scale product line is a new thing and I'm sure the folks at Lionel as well as the other companies thought, "Hey let's try this. This hasn't been done before." And the new scale product realism has helped pull some away from HO or other scales, which was probably part of the idea.

On the other hand, just how big is the scale market? It's certainly NOT taking over as some would suggest. We see announced product runs of scale proportioned products that don't even make one hundred. Lionel has said a run of 3,000 scale items is an exceptionally large production run. Whereas the same number for a traditional line starter set is a small run.

If anyone watched the TrainWorld live stream with Mike Wolf, he said his single best selling item of the year was one of the Christmas cars. And he said all of his Christmas themed cars were very strong sellers. Now you'd think with what we read here on this forum, that the most popular, best selling train would be one of realism, that was high-end scale with 100% proportional accuracy with accurate details and an exact paint scheme to boot. NOT a flat car with Santa and the reindeer on it.

But as Jerry Calabrese once said, Lionel can ill-afford to abandon any one segment of their customer base. And I do believe that to be true, not only for Lionel, but MTH too.

So the problem is not the train companies (although they do have their own difficulties). The problem is us: Every one has an opinion, but in today's self-entitled, electronically connected world, someone's opinion isn't valid unless it matches yours, which then makes it "correct."

We all should be thankful for the multitude of choices that are already available in this hobby, instead of complaining about what hasn't been made yet. Make your product suggestion and be done with it. One hundred product suggestions coming from the same one person doesn't carry the weight of 100 different people suggesting one single product.

I'll close with this story. I was at a train show looking over the Ross 3-rail track and met Steve Ross. He asked if he could help me, and I told him I was strictly a 027 guy, but was curious about his product line. And he told me "thank you." Surprised, I asked him for what?

And he told me that even though I wasn't buying scale products, I was helping to keep Lionel going strong and stay in business. And with Lionel doing well, that benefits his company. I liked his attitude and wish more people in the hobby had that way of thinking. If I was a scale guy, I'd seriously consider the Ross track line just because I liked his attitude.

 

 

 

Very well said! Thank you for saying it. I agree completely.

laming posted:

I don't know about the catalog, but I recall one of the hobby rags published an editorial about the Walther's set and it had a drawing of a PC-lettered steam engine. Perhaps that's what you're remembering?

Andre

This be it:

The article was Bruce Walther's response to a reader who claimed the ad for the decals violated MR's advertising policies.

(Note: Gil Reid sure could make PC steam look good...)

Rusty

Ive been experimenting rolling stuff around since I was a few months old. I like trains bes so far

"spell-wreck" 

Rusty Traque posted:

laming posted:

I don't know about the catalog, but I recall one of the hobby rags published an editorial about the Walther's set and it had a drawing of a PC-lettered steam engine. Perhaps that's what you're remembering?

Andre

This be it:

The article was Bruce Walther's response to a reader who claimed the ad for the decals violated MR's advertising policies.

(Note: Gil Reid sure could make PC steam look good...)

That's it!  And Andre was right it was a magazine.

Aliquippa & Southern posted:

Rusty Traque posted:

laming posted:

I don't know about the catalog, but I recall one of the hobby rags published an editorial about the Walther's set and it had a drawing of a PC-lettered steam engine. Perhaps that's what you're remembering?

Andre

This be it:

The article was Bruce Walther's response to a reader who claimed the ad for the decals violated MR's advertising policies.

(Note: Gil Reid sure could make PC steam look good...)

That's it!  And Andre was right it was a magazine.

Right away someone has to go politically correct.....😁😁😁

At one time I had all PW, As times changed I got into MPC, scale 3 rail, but because of a move and getting older I'm now running semi-scale from Railking, Lionchief and even some railking scale. 

I just like running trains and having fun, as the Barrister ( Mark ) said if not fun, why bother. 

The whole point of having trains is fun, sharing with friends and I will till the end of my life. 

Dave

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