Which Class A are you looking at in the new catalog?

@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:

I had asked on the whatcha getting topic of the catalog what are commonwealth trucks and the no after-cooler(I think it was). Sorry, on my phone and can't pop my picture from yesterday. Also said to, guess the tender extensions are referring to the coal bunker at the top? Looks like the artwork is all the same so you don't know what the difference is unless you already know. Can someone please educate me on these questions?

Commonwealth trucks are a type of tender truck and there can be variations. All of the A engine numbers in the catalogue should have Commonwealth tender trucks. The illustration of the 1238 has the WRONG Commonwealth trucks under it. The trucks for the 1238 should be the same trucks that were used on the J 611-613. Lionel already havs the molds for the correct trucks so I'm not sure why they would not use them. In the catalogue illustrations the Y3 tenders seem to show Buckeye trucks which is incorrect for the numbers shown. There were early A engine tenders that did have Buckeye trucks.

The Wilson after cooler is the radiator looking thing up front on top of the pilot. These were added later in the life of SOME engines.

The the tender extensions are the coal boards that extend on top of the coal bunker. In the early 50's engines started getting extra water tenders added to eliminate stops. After the water tenders were added the coal boards were later added to lengthen the engine trips without stopping for fuel. Some photos claiming to be the years 1953 and 1954 show tenders with the coal boards on them but if at all I'd say they were not prevalent in those years. I'd say that in 1955 the coal boards really started becoming prevalent.

@Alabama Joe posted:

Questions for you detail guys......   do you see any differences between the Class A 1222 and 1238?  other than the road number?

   

N&W Guy has it right about the 1222 vs 1238.

But additionally the illustration of the 1238 shows a wrong tender and wrong tender trucks. The more accurate tender would be one from the Y6b minus the Buckeye trucks. Lionel has the mold for this tender shell so I'm not sure why they wouldn't use it. Maybe they will if someone asks.

The 1238 should also have the same Commonwealth trucks that were used under the J 611-613 tenders. Those trucks were different than the earlier numbered J tenders. Lionel also has these molds so maybe they will use them, but how would anyone know but to ask.

@Madockawando posted:

This locomotive is too large for my layouts curves but I think it speaks well for the hobby to see the enthusiasm for these class As. I wonder will there be anyone who will order all nine?

Believe it or not, there are a few individuals that order one of everything in the catalog.  They own warehouses to keep it all in.  So the answer to your question is yes - there may be a few who will order all nine variants of the Class A's.

@Allegheny posted:

Believe it or not, there are a few individuals that order one of everything in the catalog.  They own warehouses to keep it all in.  So the answer to your question is yes - there may be a few who will order all nine variants of the Class A's.

Ohh... I would love to see his layout. That would be cool to see all nine Class As running at the same time.

@N&WGuy posted:

The 1222 should be just like the 1211 Post 1945 version, but the difference in the Catalog says that the 1222 will have Roller Bearing Rods like the 1238. In reality only the 1238-1242 had them, so the fact that Lionel is putting them on the 1222 is actually completely inaccurate… 😕

Thank you,   I appreciate the info.  

@christopher N&W posted:

Commonwealth trucks are a type of tender truck and there can be variations. All of the A engine numbers in the catalogue should have Commonwealth tender trucks. The illustration of the 1238 has the WRONG Commonwealth trucks under it. The trucks for the 1238 should be the same trucks that were used on the J 611-613. Lionel already havs the molds for the correct trucks so I'm not sure why they would not use them. In the catalogue illustrations the Y3 tenders seem to show Buckeye trucks which is incorrect for the numbers shown. There were early A engine tenders that did have Buckeye trucks.

The Wilson after cooler is the radiator looking thing up front on top of the pilot. These were added later in the life of SOME engines.

The the tender extensions are the coal boards that extend on top of the coal bunker. In the early 50's engines started getting extra water tenders added to eliminate stops. After the water tenders were added the coal boards were later added to lengthen the engine trips without stopping for fuel. Some photos claiming to be the years 1953 and 1954 show tenders with the coal boards on them but if at all I'd say they were not prevalent in those years. I'd say that in 1955 the coal boards really started becoming prevalent.

Awesome Chris, glad I got an answer on this. I popping what we are talking about with a comparison so others know as well.

After-coolerCoal bunker extensions up top.

Commonwealth trucks on the Pilot version, and the 1238 wrong Commonwealth trucks.

I am wondering if they may confuse some of the options when they are building these. Its a good thing that they are looking at samples now(HOPEFULLY).

One thing I thought I was concerned about greatly looks like another catalog blooper. The doghouse on some of the Class A tender's is blacked out. Here is the Pilot, 1201, and 1211. The error is also on the 1238 and the 1222. I had thought that there was no doghouse because I couldn't see the window. Upon zooming in, you can see that the goofed and filled it in black.

Okay, so it sounds like MrMuffin’s might actually be doing a Special Run of the Vision Line A Class!! He’s gonna try for a Pennsylvania Railroad version with a solid front pilot, small tender (similar to the 1200 and 1210 versions), and Roller Bearing Rods. The engine would be painted Brunswick Green as well!

It’ll kinda be a “What If” locomotive had the Pennsy chosen the A Class over the C&O 2-10-4 in their WW2 design tests!

I’m guessing it’ll probably look something like this… Some of my photoshop work lol.

@N&WGuy posted:

Okay, so it sounds like MrMuffin’s might actually be doing a Special Run of the Vision Line A Class!! He’s gonna try for a Pennsylvania Railroad version with a solid front pilot, small tender (similar to the 1200 and 1210 versions), and Roller Bearing Rods. The engine would be painted Brunswick Green as well!

It’ll kinda be a “What If” locomotive had the Pennsy chosen the A Class over the C&O 2-10-4 in their WW2 design tests!

That means that there will be ten different Vision Class As for this catalog cycle.

Can a scale PRR 4-4-4-4 T1 redo be far behind? Wasn't that also part of the MTH/Lionel lawsuit?

I think that I am going to go with the 1211 with the Class A tender, no after-cooler, commonwealth trucks. I had thought about the 1200 and the 1210, but I like the solid pilot and the Class A tender. It took quite a bit of time to work this all through as I was looking over all the versions, this one best suits me. Plus I like how the smoke box door is the grey and the boiler goes all black.

It’s official! The custom run for MrMuffin’s Trains, the Pennsylvania Railroad Class A, is now available for preorder on their website!

https://mrmuffinstrains.com/pr...=f277fe306&_ss=r

By the way for those who didn’t see the Facebook live stream that TrainWorld did with Lionel tonight, Ryan and Dave from Lionel did mention that all the errors that appear in the catalog art for the Class A’s are going to be corrected for the actual models which is good to hear!! It does sound like they’ll be keeping the Roller Bearings on the LCCA #1222 though, but other than that everything else will be addressed! 🙂

@N&WGuy posted:

Ryan and Dave from Lionel did mention that all the errors that appear in the catalog art for the Class A’s are going to be corrected for the actual models which is good to hear!! 🙂

I saw the video. It sounds somewhat promising, however a blanket general statement doesn't settle some things for me.

They specifically said they will make right the turret in front of the cab and kudos for that.

They generally said they would get the side rods and crossheads right on all of the models but wouldn't it be better for them to state or write specifically which engine will get what rods on a $2,000 model after it was shown incorrectly in the catalogue.

They also said they'd get the tenders worked out but that leaves me a little uneasy. The tender of the 1238 in the catalogue is incorrect without any variation of the right tender shown at all. I don't have confidence without having them come out and state specifically that on the 1238 they will be using the same tender used on their Y6b or better and with the same Commonwealth trucks that were on the J611-613.

I've been burned on nailing down these types of details before. The engines cost a lot of money. It seems reasonable to ask and be informed ahead of time what you will be getting.

@N&WGuy posted:

By the way for those who didn’t see the Facebook live stream that TrainWorld did with Lionel tonight, Ryan and Dave from Lionel did mention that all the errors that appear in the catalog art for the Class A’s are going to be corrected for the actual models which is good to hear!! It does sound like they’ll be keeping the Roller Bearings on the LCCA #1222 though, but other than that everything else will be addressed! 🙂

Yeah, I was watching that later on in the evening and took note to that big conversation about the Class A's and all the errors in the catalog. I may have to write Ryan just to ask what errors are noted on the one I want and what it is really getting. Maybe he'll answer, maybe he will take some time in doing so, but the main point is that we told him stuff that was wrong, and they're going to fix it before it's produced. BigJim pointed out right away to Ryan some of the details before the catalog hit, and that helped a lot. Hats off to Jim and everyone else.

Is anyone looking to get the fantasy passenger scheme?

Terrance

I think I am leaning toward the 1211 based on what Chris said. 1238 looked cool because I sort of wanted the roller bearing rods. It might be worth picking up the Ed King book. I always regret not getting the Legacy Y6b. I also need to think about a caboose. Thanks Chris for the input!

Legacy Y6b went up for sale on one of the auction sites recently, didn't sell for as much as I thought it might. Unfortunately I missed the auction, but some bidder out there must be very happy!

I was hoping for a LionMaster! :-(