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Jeffrey-

 

Lionel, MTH, K-Line, and Ready Made Toys all made or make ore cars. The only diecast cars I know of were made by Lionel and K-Line. Interestingly K-Line's plastic ore car tooling is still in use by Ready Made Toys.

 

Any ore cars from the manufacturers above would be good choices. The only issue I've heard of is that some brands ride very high on the trucks, leaving a large gap between the carbody and the truck.

 

-John

You'd be wise to check out RMT ore cars.  They are probably the best in price/performance for O-Gauge ore cars IMHO.  A couple of years ago, RMT had a super New Year's sale where these ore cars could be had for $10/car (in sets of two).  That was arguably the best deal that's come along in O-Gauge for quite some time -- especially considering that price point was as close to 1966-era pricing that we're gonna see... possibly ever.  I still have a few unopened boxes!!! 

 

David

I have ore cars from all the manufacturers, close to a hundred now.  The late production K-line cars with die cast trucks and the current RMT cars have the best detail and are scale size.  They both sit a little high.  The early K-line cars use the same body mold but sit way too high on plastic trucks.  These were based on the 1970s Atlas ore cars, which are the only 3 rail compatible ore cars that sit at the correct height. The Lionel cars are narrower and a bit smaller, but detail is OK.  The MTH cars rate last, poor detail and sit too high.  To find anything better than the the RMT/K-Line/Atlas cars you'll have to look at 2 rail brass cars, which cost a bunch more.

One thing I've never seen in 3-rail 0 is a high-sided ore car. Ore cars are small because ore, specifically iron ore, is very dense. When the iron mines started shipping ore in the form of taconite, a low-grade ore processed into pellets, ore cars had to get bigger because taconite is less dense than unprocessed high-grade ore. So, many iron ore cars were fitted with upward extensions on the sides, sort of like the extensions that turn regular hoppers into chip cars. Newer cars were built with bigger bays to handle taconite. I haven't seen any 3-rail 0 scale cars that represent older style cars with extensions. 

 

Here's an ore car that's been modified for lighter-weight ore. This one is pretty crude-looking. The DM&IR and the Milwaukee Road, among others, modified whole fleets of ore cars on an assembly-line basis and those cars look much better. 

 

Ore Car Extended 1

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Last edited by Southwest Hiawatha

I concur with John23 and others, that the Atlas/K line/RMT ore cars are the better of the three manufacturers. The Atlas cars started in the 70's as kits. The dimensions have remained consistent, as ore loads I've made fit the same. The MTH ore car is the same width inside, but is slightly longer. The load for the RMT car sits lower. The Lionel car is narrower then the other two.

Don

Originally Posted by Jeffrey Fikes:

Thanks for ALL the replies. Looks like k-line and RMT are the way to go-- as long as they have metal trucks. Apparently MTH is not favored by many-- and since I've never seen any of these in person this info is very helpful.



Jeffrey

One post isn't much of a consensus though. and the MTH cars are of a different prototype than the Atlas/K-Line/RMT models.

Here's a video of a 51-car train made up of everyone's cars but RMT (and that's only because I shot this before buying two sets of theirs). Other than the cars being different roadnames, do any really stick out as being "bad"?



---PCJ

(Dec.2022 edit: replaced broken video link)

Last edited by RailRide

Jeffrey,

 

I believe the RMT, and KLine car bodies are the old Atlas molds from the 70s.  The Klines sit way too high on the trucks.  The RMT are a little better but still sit too high.  The Atlas cars are still out there and ,when converted to Kadee couplers, look the best.  The only drawback is the plastic trucks.  

 

 

How is the layout coming?

 

Dave

 

100 cars in John23's collection, over 50 in Railride's, and then David's train-- a lot more folks have these in quantity than I ever imagined. As far as the diecast question-- probably a moot point-- and problems from an operational standpoint due to the weight-- just "seems" like metal is "nicer" than plastic...

 

As far as the layout-- I am still finishing out my basement train room-- and summer has slowed down my progress. That is one sharp layout you have there David!

 

All these replies, along with videos and photos is very helpful. Those Atlas cars sure look good-- but as Dmasso and Railride have pointed out-- they all look pretty good. The plastic chains molded onto the sprockets could use a little paint or some weathering or something.

 

MTH fixed that problem with a shaft instead of chains and sprockets.

Last edited by Jeffrey Fikes
Originally Posted by Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines:

As a comparison between MTH and Lionel, I took these photos.  Lionel die cast hoppers are very heavy...they are also bulkier looking than their plastic offering.  I love the look of the diecast one.

 

From left to right...MTH...Lionel diecast...Lionel plastic...

 

 

 

 

image

The Lionel metal and plastic cars look like the same mold. And since you can make injection molds work with either plastic or metal....I can't see Lionel make all new tooling for the metal cars. 

I have about 40 of the K-Line, or versions of, plastic cars. I do wish ALL of them sat more correctly on their trucks. 

Last edited by AMCDave
Originally Posted by AMCDave:
Originally Posted by Michigan & Ohio Valley Lines:

As a comparison between MTH and Lionel, I took these photos.  Lionel die cast hoppers are very heavy...they are also bulkier looking than their plastic offering.  I love the look of the diecast one.

 

From left to right...MTH...Lionel diecast...Lionel plastic...

 

 

 

 

image

The Lionel metal and plastic cars look like the same mold. And since you can make injection molds work with either plastic or metal....I can't see Lionel make all new tooling for the metal cars. 

I have about 40 of the K-Line, or versions of, plastic cars. I do wish ALL of them sat more correctly on their trucks. 

Here are some pics of the same cars that better illustrates the diecast car being wider...

 

 

image

image

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Originally Posted by David Minarik:

Jeffrey,

 

I believe the RMT, and KLine car bodies are the old Atlas molds from the 70s.  The Klines sit way too high on the trucks.  The RMT are a little better but still sit too high.  The Atlas cars are still out there and ,when converted to Kadee couplers, look the best.  The only drawback is the plastic trucks.  

 

 

 

 

I did my own take-a-closer-look-see with my own K-Line and Atlas ore cars a couple of years ago and came to the conclusion that the K-Line version is actually a clone of the Atlas ore car tooling. Not surprising being they were tooled in China:

 

k-line and atlas ore car detail

 

Note the K-Line above has four mold gates in the center, while the Atlas below has six. The K-Line cars sit high since the toolmakers in China also cloned the Atlas end-frames, which have a downward-projecting collar for the Atlas plastic trucks with a level bolster, rather than a flat bottom for the arched bolsters found on most 3-rail trucks. They could have removed the raised collar where the screw goes, but what do they know--they were likely told to "clone this car" and they did exactly that.

 

---PCJ

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I have a ton of the RMT cars, when they were $10, I bought some.  After I got them, I realized what a great deal they were and scale sized as well.  Then I bought a WHOLE lot more.   Like David, I still have a few unopened cases of them, I couldn't see how I could go wrong.

 

I have some K-Line and Lionel ones, and even a couple of the MTH ones.  All are very close in size and quality, but you'll likely never see $10 NIB ore cars again, especially of decent quality like the RMT cars.

Rgds the MTH cars,  the reason that I don't like them is detail & their height.  I have a lot of MTH freight cars so I'm not against the brand, but when I look at them closely there are several points that stand out: no poling pockets, the door release mechanism is greatly simplified, the end sill is also simplified, riveting doesn't look right, & no interior detail.

 

I agree with Dave M, the original Atlas cars look the best.  I've been converting my K-Line cars to the original 70's era Atlas trucks when I can find them.  I did a couple with Weaver trucks, but the way the 3 rail coupler sits on top of the Weaver truck causes an increase in height - although not as much as the K-Line trucks.  If I can find enough 1970's Atlas trucks I'll do the RMT cars too.

Last edited by John23

Missabe ore cars made by MTH & Lionel.  The 1st two MTH are redone with correct paint, added stirrups.  MTH sold 2 sets of Blue cars.  The blue car is Lionel and correct,  It was a test car.  As far as I'am concerned  MTH cars match best model of cars on the DM&R.  I also have cars made from companies mentioned in this forum. 1905 car was used as a ballast cars up into 1970's.  The bottom picture is a ore drag on my layout.  The chair is for my grand children. 25AA8A11-0D2D-47B9-977E-E484A457B9FE_1_201_a 2F538584-6496-4407-B36C-A291DB2B75AB10B051BF-B9C7-40EC-B304-21F2EA825B09B28FA965-C00D-4FD3-A8A2-464BD23FA9E3FC82F876-4C01-4CFE-A4C3-E7EF2DA048CF

@Missabe posted:

Missabe ore cars made by MTH & Lionel.  The 1st two MTH are redone with correct paint, added stirrups.  MTH sold 2 sets of Blue cars.  The blue car is Lionel and correct,  It was a test car.  As far as I'am concerned  MTH cars match best model of cars on the DM&R.  I also have cars made from companies mentioned in this forum. 1905 car was used as a ballast cars up into 1970's.  The bottom picture is a ore drag on my layout.  The chair is for my grand children. 25AA8A11-0D2D-47B9-977E-E484A457B9FE_1_201_a 2F538584-6496-4407-B36C-A291DB2B75AB10B051BF-B9C7-40EC-B304-21F2EA825B09B28FA965-C00D-4FD3-A8A2-464BD23FA9E3FC82F876-4C01-4CFE-A4C3-E7EF2DA048CF

Note all we see is Image Not Found.

@Big Ken posted:

I can tell you working in an Open Hearth Furnace in Youngstown Ohio,  the iron ore is a dark brown, almost black in color.  I worked the narrow gauge an never payed attention to the cars that it was brought in on.  The loaded into the charging boxes to be loaded into the furnaces.

Depends where it's from, what variety and how it's processed.  Raw ore from my neck of the woods is either red-orange in color or shiny metallic black.  Taconite is dark grey when it first comes out of the mill, turning reddish when it is stockpiled and oxidizes.  Most ore nowadays is pelletized into taconite.

Last edited by John23

Having worked on Ore Docks in Duluth MN iron ore came in various colors.  From shades what I call dark red to a fine bronze.  The ore in the cars is actual iron ore on glued styrofoam.   Just as taconite from the different plants came light gray to almost purple.  The white in the cars is actually two shades representing calcite and dolomite limestone used for a flux pellet.

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Speaking of ore trains, we (PIHR) ran a 137 car ore train (+ caboose) at our work session last week (shortened it to 110 for the weekend running).  This train is a mix of manufacturers with a large number being Atlas.  A number of the cars at the very front are diecast.  You can see the ride height difference when you get to the close-up run-bys when the silver UP cars show up on screen - they are all Atlas.  When running, they are not that noticeable to people who aren't looking for that sort of thing.  I agree that the Atlas/K-Line/RMT cars are the best, and the Atlas cars can often be had at train shows for very low prices.

Andy

The MTH is a more accurate representation of the style of ore jenny used by the Great Northern, so that is my preference. In a comparison of detailing between the MTH and the K-Line jennies, contrary to what others have claimed, the level of detail is similar, the primary differences being the interior rivets, which you don't see with the load in place, and the lack of stirrups. The K-Line lacks the air brake detailing.

Great Northern Iron Ore Car 89446 at Kelly Lake, Minnesota… | Flickr

GN 91612 Mineral Red Ore Car at Allouez, WI in August 1979… | Flickr

MTH Premier car on the left, K-Line car on the right:IMG_6095

IMG_6096

MTH:
IMG_6100


K-Line:

IMG_6102

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Last edited by Matt_GNo27
@RSJB18 posted:

FWIW- the Menards ore cars are not bad for the $$$$.

The PRR are Menards, the LIRR is MTH. I plan on replacing the loads in all of them with real material.

2022-05-18 18.29.212022-05-18 18.29.30

Bob

@RSJB18, it appears from your second photo that the Menards ore jennies are narrower than the MTH, is that the case? If so, I wonder if they used the Lionel mold or made a mold from a Lionel car?

—Matt

Last edited by Matt_GNo27
@Matt_GNo27 posted:

@RSJB18, it appears from your second photo that the Menards ore jennies are narrower than the MTH, is that the case? If so, I wonder if they used the Lionel mold or made a mold from a Lionel car?

—Matt

Matt- they are slightly smaller overall (height and width). But are well detailed except for the very plastic looking loads. I have some new RMT cars on order that should be in by early next year. I will be interesting to compare them to the others.

I don't have any Lionel cars to compare the Menards too.

2022-12-08 09.19.102022-12-08 09.19.182022-12-08 09.19.362022-12-08 09.20.05

Bob

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The new RMT ore cars are new tooling, but Walter told me the loads from the former Atlas/K Line/ RMT will fit the new cars. The Menards cars look to be the same size as the Lionel cars. Probably cloned as are the quad hoppers which are almost identical to the Lionel and Williams cars. The MTH cars are slightly longer then the K Line cars, but the inside width is the same. Loads from K Line will fit, but will sit lower due to the slightly shorter length.

The first ore jennies I bought were Lionel. When MTH offered the 227 Yellowstone (2-8-8-4 articulated), I jumped on it and also purchased a set of MTH jennies. They are wider, have more heft and are more prototypical to the DM&IR cars than the Lionel jennies. I sold off my Lionel collection and bought more MTH models. K-Line and Atlas ore cars rode too high on the trucks for my liking.    Now after reviewing this thread, I may have to start looking for RMT jennies at trains shows. Gunrunner John, any thought of reducing your inventory?

Actually, I see very little difference between, Menards, RMT and Lionel jennies.   I plan to stick with MTH.   They represent a good base for future detailing and are a closer match to the Missabe cars.

So, I vote MTH

Missabe:



MTH:

IMG_1658

I've spent the past few weeks making new crude ore loads for my 24 car fleet!

IMG_1661

Time for a little action:

Cheers Dave

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Last edited by OGR CEO-PUBLISHER

I enjoyed looking at all the different ore cars in this thread. One thing I noticed was the capacities ran from 40 tons to 100 ton. You would expect different size cars since the iron ore density is probably about the same for the different ores. The last builder’s photo was particular interesting. The outboard wheel sets extend halfway out from under the car. Also the angle cock was in the center of the car above the coupler. At first I thought that might be main reservoir air to assist in dumping the car, but there was no angle cock where it normally would be, so the high cock must be the brake pipe.

I enjoyed looking at all the different ore cars in this thread. One thing I noticed was the capacities ran from 40 tons to 100 ton. You would expect different size cars since the iron ore density is probably about the same for the different ores. The last builder’s photo was particular interesting. The outboard wheel sets extend halfway out from under the car. Also the angle cock was in the center of the car above the coupler. At first I thought that might be main reservoir air to assist in dumping the car, but there was no angle cock where it normally would be, so the high cock must be the brake pipe.

Good observation!   Here is a link that explains ore car wheel spacing, high location of the angle cock and the braking system used by the DM&IR:  https://www.trainorders.com/di.../read.php?11,4692483

Cheers, Dave

Last edited by darlander

Well maybe these ore cars have swivel couplers and can be dumped with an automatic rotary car dumping system without uncoupling.

Charlie

No, the real ones have dump doors on the bottom.  They aren't remote controlled. Most have a mechanical opener.  I know on the ones here in the Marquette Range are opened by what's basically a powered wrench mounted on a cart, which is operated by a dock man. It's moved along the string of ore cars and stopped at each car. It's attached to the shaft on the car which opens the doors and dumps the ore into the pocket.  Each ore pocket holds 4 carloads and from there it is dumped into the ship's holds.

@rail posted:

Nice. Does the shot represent Taconite?

Yes.  I don't know if the Bessemer used Jennys to haul taconite to NB or ore to the sintering plant.  Maybe both depending on when they switched to hoppers.  Anyway, I like how the loads look!  It also adds some much needed weight to the cars as they have plastic trucks.

Last edited by David Minarik
@Richie C. posted:

With this thread back up, here's a couple of pics of the Menard's ore cars - I lightly weathered the plastic loads, but not sure I like the way they came out. I may pull out the plastic and put some styrofoam in and then top with a real load.



BN ORE CAR 1BN ORE CAR 2

Sounds like a good plan!  If Ore the size used in the Menards cars were Real, the first time it was dumped into the cars It might not just dent the sides and bottom, but actually break them wide open.

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