Why Lion Chief 2.0?

Hi Scott:

No chaos in my train room. Lionel has these logos on all their packaging, for chaos prevention.

Gary

I think they ought to ditch "LionChief".  Either make all the starter sets LC+ or call it something else.  That would go a long way to avoiding confusion for beginners.  Also, I'll add the now, mandatory-to-the-thread, Lionel bash: whatever they call it, just make sure it works! 

It's very confusing.  I spend a lot of time at open houses trying to explain options to folks.  Dumb decision by Lionel management.  The brand recognition of "Lionel" is really exploited here.  Take away the "Lionel" name and the general public probably would look elsewhere.

-Greg

It's Lionels Neverending pursuit of no standardization.

Its not enough that every Loco takes a different smoke unit.  Some locos have back drivable gears, some do not etc.

There must be a plethora of control systems.

It's no wonder there are quality issues. Every new item is a "one off".

 I remember when semi scale locos had Tmcc just like the scale stuff. It works for MTH.

Why not?

For example, a good, honest hobby store employee will and should know all of the variations a potential customer may encounter when considering a toy train purchase. For me, it is all part of the sale, share your knowledge with a novice, make it fun for both parties. Modern innovations and name changes are the way this 21st century society operates. 

Whether at a hobby shop or train show, it is up to us to spread the word, you may now "beam me up Scotty." 

I'm your average hobbyist and I get confused by all the options. My Dad has his prewar and laughs at all this.

Grampstrains posted:

This is funny.  For months, a lot of folks have complained the LC+ and Legacy can't operate off the same control.  Now they can and still,  some are unhappy.

What is actually funny is that you just proved my point. LC+ and Legacy cannot operate with the same remote.  Lion Chief 2.0 can operate with a TMCC or Legacy remote. Lion Chief plus will not operate with a TMCC or Legacy remote. See it is confusing.

Scott Smith

To me this is what it should of been from the start. I agree Lionchief should go bye bye. Lionchief+ is okay, at least it can be run conventionally, And this is what should be in starter sets. Put Lionchief 2.0 in midway sets, and then some lower end Legacy in your premium sets. ( lower end I mean with out all the fine detail ) So just your beginner sets, would have a different control system. Or even do away with Lionchief+ and go to the Lionchief 2.0 for your beginner to mid range sets, and Legacy Lower end for your premium sets.   

Sidebar: If you go out to purchase a truck or car, you will have a lot of choices. The Ford 150 is just one example. The sales consultant will have to help you out, just like they do at local hobby shops or the big online shops.

Gary

Scott another thought is maybe Lionel is going to phase out Lionchief/+ and go to the Lionchief 2.0. ( which to me is what they should of gone to from the start), they should never of just dropped the control system they had ( except in your more expensive engines ) I like the idea of being able to have TMCC/LegacyL/Legacy all able to run the command engines, of coarse Legacy system can do more than the other two, but you still can run a legacy engine with a TMCC cab1 remote. Yes you won't get all the features, as you would with a legacy remote, but you can run them.  

 

trainroomgary posted:

Sidebar: If you go out to purchase a truck or car, you will have a lot of choices. The Ford 150 is just one example. The sales consultant will have to help you out, just like they do at local hobby shops or the big online shops.

Gary

So I really like the Western Union 4-4-0 set I would like to buy that with the Legacy system. The Disney set with the Mickey ears I would like Legacy there as well. Lionel is not offering models with options like Ford. XYZ set comes with this command system and that’s the way it is. I don’t have an issue with that. I just saying the marketing is confusing.

Did I read the lc2.o info correctly, it comes with no lc remote? I thought lc+ was fine having transformer control or the lc or universal remote to control them. I thought most tmcc/ legacy users just wanted to be able to use their remotes also to control them. I now only use the mth remote to controll all my mth and legacy engines. I do not want to have dozens of remotes to confuse my operators that come over.  I agree with scott lionel realy has confused thier product line. try buying a used lc+ engine in few years. trying to know whats under the hood so to speak  is going to be real confusing when some sellers dont know what they have. mth is by far way ahead of lionel in this area since going to the ps2 platform. with everything being dcs from the starter set to the preimer engines. you know what your getting and its is relatively bullet proof. lionel has no standardization from engine to engine let alone from one line to the next. what is ryan thinking.  drop the starter regular lc crap with no cruies control and make all engines lc+2.0 and make them able to be run with the remote that comes with the engine or the lc+ universal remote or the phone app via bluetooth and also both tmcc remote or legacy remote and be done with it. then in the starter line and semiscale line operators can run everything and not be stuck no matter how they choose to run them. also with the added tmcc/legacy option they wont have to worry about anything when upgrading thier command system. then lastly if they get really serious and want the high end stuff with all the bells and whistles give them scale engines with full legacy. 

ps. after trying to explain my position on this I am almost confused. 😁

Even more confusing in that the original LionChief and LionChief Plus were not Bluetooth.

Eventually we'll all be able to run everything new with BlueTooth through our phones... no rem,otes of any kind needed.

One ring to rule them.

Everything we've been asking for.

Jon

It's called evolution.  The system started out as a way to provide command control inexpensively and control costs in starter sets, and proved so popular that LC+ was created.  The ability to control these locos with Bluetooth and with TMCC/Legacy is a feature, not a bug .  It provides lots of options at low cost.   This system is more reliable than Legacy and TMCC in certain ways, a lot less expensive and uses parts that are not going obsolete because they are 10-20 years old. It allows the sale of starter sets for half the cost of the competition.  It's not that complicated.  None of us like change, but it happens anyway.  This is progress, as will become apparent over the coming years.

LC 2.0 = ((LC+)+some lights + Bluetooth – Remote) X $2

My take: LC+ provided for a relatively low cost entry into the world of remote control and therefore a possible incentive to eventually upgrade to their higher end system. The added features have now doubled the cost.

Landsteiner posted:

This system is more reliable than Legacy and TMCC in certain ways, a lot less expensive and uses parts that are not going obsolete because they are 10-20 years old.

First, I'm NO expert, but those seem like some big assumptions to me.

It’s disappointing that Lionel took the whistle steam effect from the Lionmaster Big Boy. I was greatful to get the 2010 model and still runs great. This to me seems like it might not succeed but I could be wrong.

Jeff T posted:

Landsteiner posted:

This system is more reliable than Legacy and TMCC in certain ways, a lot less expensive and uses parts that are not going obsolete because they are 10-20 years old.

First, I'm NO expert, but those seem like some big assumptions to me.

You dont have to clean the track all the time.    Its only there to pass electricity with LC control or blue tooth! 

My question is.   Do the LC 2.0 engines run on DC?   If not they arent LC at all.   Should be called legacy light.

Jim