will a new vision line locomotive be revealed at york this year ?
if so i hope its a diesel like a SD70ACE-T4 or a Big blow turbine from MTH tooling but all diecast, or an Amtrak ALC 42
whatever it is i probably won't be able to afford or run it
what if there was a vision line quality diecast engine line for us traditional guys
i still want an all diecast tier 4 though
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I never been to York myself. Does Lionel often make mention of a new locomotive like this??
@BillYo414 posted:I never been to York myself. Does Lionel often make mention of a new locomotive like this??
Well, the probability would be nil being that the latest catalog has already dropped. When they announced the Niagara, the catalog was going to be released that day(that is the first day of October's York), so it made sense to reveal it then. Usually asking any questions to Ryan about any future projects is going to get you nowhere. If he were to say anything, it would be so extremely vague that it could be anything. I know he had said to me that the next catalog(I think this was 2018) would have a lot of stuff for everyone. He may have said something a bit further, but again it was so board that it could have meant anything at all.
Having said that though, they have probably already worked out the next four years of what could be the next Vision Line engines. Typically these things don't happen overnight, so rest assured that whatever is going to be in next years catalog, has been in the works for no less than five years. This is because when they had worked on the brass hybrid American 4-4-0's, Ryan and Dave had said that they had been working on it for the past four or five years. We can only hope that there is a good variety of Vision Line engines in the works that will satisfy those who are hungry for something different.
Keep in mind that just because Lionel has acquired MTH Toolings, it doesn't mean that they will be working on these right out of the starting gate for the next catalog. However, there probably will be somethings that they will want to produce because they have not had them in Lionel's history. Most folks want to see a Triplex or something along those lines. This really does depend on what Lionel bought or if there was some other agreement made, hard to say exactly what.
Regardless, we will see things that Lionel has not produced but MTH has. Hopefully it will be something for everyone. I know I am hoping for Dreyfuss Hudson's to come down the pike at some point, but I will have to wait and see like everyone else.
Interesting @Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4. I had a different idea in my head of how it all worked. That was informative.
A Vision Line Triplex would be pretty awesome. The thought hadn't crossed my mind.
I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens at York!
@BillYo414 posted:Interesting @Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4. I had a different idea in my head of how it all worked. That was informative.
A Vision Line Triplex would be pretty awesome. The thought hadn't crossed my mind.
I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens at York!
Here's the thing. If you know what engines they have produced, and produced consistently, you can sort of get a pretty good idea of what engines will be produced in the coming years. I think I had said before the catalog had come out one of the diesels that had not been produced in some time, I think SD35 or something like that. Well, I got lucky on that one.
So, that being said, that means that whatever engines they have toolings for are easy projects that don't need a lot of work to them other than maybe minor alterations if they can. When it comes to Vision Line Engines, they could possibly use old toolings, or not very old toolings to pop out a Vision Line Engine. They could also go forth and get new tooling to produce that, which of course costs a heck of a lot of money. Either way they have easier work with what they have, and hard work with what they don't have.
When they have done something new like Brass hybrids, it has been just like making a Vision Line Engine in that they have had to do quite a bit to get things right from the start. Yeah, they have to get license for whatever they are building, but also figuring out how things come together. When they were talking about the American 4-4-0's in that catalog, Dave was talking about how hard it was to get what they could in there. Ryan had also talked about going down to the wire on what the actual colors were on the 119 and Jupiter as they had a few different paint schemes on the real reproductions out in Utah. That was not the correct color according to Ryan research team, historians, etc., etc. They finally got the real color right before the cutoff to the catalog, which made Ryan pretty happy as he wanted the color right(yeah, color).
Now, about what they bought from MTH, this is the difficult part of the equation. Right now we only know what has been released, but again, you can sort of get maybe an idea or two of what would be money makers. We all know the 3 engines that were the big lawsuit engines, Dreyfuss Hudson, PRR T1, and the N&W Class A. Most of us are hoping they got those, if not that would be maybe a disappointment. However, also consider something else to this. In 2019 when the NJ HiRailers were hosting OGR's 50th Anniversary, Lionel and MTH were there. During that celebration, everyone had come up to speak(meaning Ryan and Andy) and it was said how they are on the road together representing their perspective companies. This would also mean Mike as well. So, perhaps, and this is a big perhaps it was already know that Mike would be retiring a year or two beforehand. That could mean that Lionel would have already had a good idea of what they wanted to see if they could buy from Mike.
Also consider though that it possible that Lionel has already been working on some of these other projects, maybe a Dreyfuss, maybe a PRR T1, and maybe the N&W Class A. It is a heck of a lot to digest, that much is certain. Why do I say this? For the same reason that most of the community is always telling the manufacturers what they want. Since I first went to York, I have said to Ryan on almost every occasion, that I would like to see a J3 Hudson, a Dreyfuss, a PRR T1, the Class A, and even the 4-4-0's. I had said the 4-4-0's mainly because I am a big steam engine fan, and had seen the Heisler that they produced, and thought it would be interesting to have a 4-4-0 that had smoke and be to scale. Well, little did I know that they already were working on it.
There are many other engines in the long list of engines that I don't think have ever been produced, and may not ever be produced because they would require new tooling or be made of brass. The other factor is of course would they sell. If it is not Santa Fe, Union Pacific, Northern Pacific, Pennsylvania, New York Central, and a few others they don't seem likely to be produced. Now of course I can't list all that is popular because heck, I don't know what the list is. Reason why is because it could be regional sales. You would imagine East Coast Lines sell better on the East, West Coast out there, Middle of the Country, you get the idea.
With all that being said, lets hope for somethings, not just one, but quite a few that will be making their way into the newest catalog when it comes out, and what we don't see in that, in the next. Here's hoping. 
A new Vision Line locomotive at York would be very cool. A Vision Line Triplex would be outstanding!
Hasn't been a vision line diesel in quite a while
@hclarke posted:A new Vision Line locomotive at York would be very cool. A Vision Line Triplex would be outstanding!
I doubt they would announce one at York since they are not popping out a catalog. The only thing you could be sure of is if you ask Ryan a question, he'll most likely say good things are coming, stay tuned or something like that.
@tom21pa posted:Hasn't been a vision line diesel in quite a while
I think that it is overdue for a diesel or an electric. I would believe steam would not be the next Vision Line engine, but what do I know. 😆
I was under the impression that Lionel wasn't going to be at York this fall, so why would they introduce a new product there?
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I was under the impression that Lionel wasn't going to be at York this fall, so why would they introduce a new product there?
https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...3#157265375429367473
Sorry this took a bit John. On that topic Ryan said Lionel would indeed be at York. I actually had to hunt this topic down, and screenshot the reply by Ryan.
The brand new and exciting I am curious as to what that could be. I would imagine it is most likely something perhaps a sample of some of the in catalog items that use MTH tooling. I would highly doubt that it would be anything to come out in the next catalog.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/...3#157265375429367473
Sorry this took a bit John. On that topic Ryan said Lionel would indeed be at York. I actually had to hunt this topic down, and screenshot the reply by Ryan.
The brand new and exciting I am curious as to what that could be. I would imagine it is most likely something perhaps a sample of some of the in catalog items that use MTH tooling. I would highly doubt that it would be anything to come out in the next catalog.
Think Amtrak, think blue...
@das boot posted:Think Amtrak, think blue...
Not an Amtrak guy, so you could tell me what it was and I still wouldn't know, unfortunately.
The last vision line that Lionel came out with was a challenger and was a disaster quite a few things were not right and many new engines had to sent back for upgrade problems that should have been fixed at the factory!
@Alan Mancus posted:The last vision line that Lionel came out with was a challenger and was a disaster quite a few things were not right and many new engines had to sent back for upgrade problems that should have been fixed at the factory!
Actually last was the GS series of locomotives, which some of those had some issues. The current one is the 2-10-10-2's, see how they fair when they arrive. The Challenger's did have issues yes.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Actually last was the GS series of locomotives, which some of those had some issues. The current one is the 2-10-10-2's, see how they fair when they arrive. The Challenger's did have issues yes.
The Challenger issue was "it only hurts once". Mine has been very good after the sound deal was squared away. My Niagara went back also for an elecrical issue. Once back, a wonderful engine. I hope the 2-10-10-2 comes out well. I hope for the best and expect the worse. My GS-2 came out of the box perfect and has not missed a bit. To the original topic, my gut is no VL announcement. I will miss the MTH catalog and boxcar at York.
The Triplex would be awesome. Plus, Lionel could add some coal hoppers or other freight cars to go with it. I also want a Vision GEVO Hybrid again (this time in multiple liveries) as well as the Ethanol tank cars and other modern freight cars in multiple liveries. I'd love the SD70ACe-T4 and/or ET44AC/ET44C4 in several liveries.
I still want a Vision Line PRR T1 Duplex. Even though I'm working on upgrading the scale TMCC version, I'd jump on the VL model in a heartbeat!
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I still want a Vision Line PRR T1 Duplex. Even though I'm working on upgrading the scale TMCC version, I'd jump on the VL model in a heartbeat!
I would as well John. Despite me not knowing what I was looking at back in the mid to late 90's on a poster card(of course the engine was all dirty from its work), seeing a model of it I sort of got a better appreciation for what it was. I really do hope that they got the lawsuit 3(that is the Dreyfuss, PRR T1 Duplex GRJ just said, and of course the N&W Class A). The only question would be what would they run first. With so many options to run in their catalogs, it really would be nice to see something that is not a giant catalog of stuff, and not a ton of reruns that have been in the catalog less than 5 years ago(though I will jump on a Y6B). If they are going to do anything, it is going to be sprinkles here and there of whatever MTH Tooling and their own.
@Bryant Dunivan 111417 posted:The Challenger issue was "it only hurts once". Mine has been very good after the sound deal was squared away. My Niagara went back also for an elecrical issue. Once back, a wonderful engine. I hope the 2-10-10-2 comes out well. I hope for the best and expect the worse. My GS-2 came out of the box perfect and has not missed a bit. To the original topic, my gut is no VL announcement. I will miss the MTH catalog and boxcar at York.
That's great Bryant. I got my sounds fixed on my Challenger, my Niagara hasn't gotten out of the box yet unfortunately, hoping to change that sometime this year with a new layout big enough for those big engines. I do hope the 2-10-10-2 is as great as we can expect it to be. I didn't order any of the GS series engines, but saw there were only a few people that had issues with one of the types(don't remember which one(s). Lets hope all the colors are correct, including some dang graphite on the smoke box(where applicable). Also, I doubt there is going to be any cat out of the bag on a VL announcement. If anything Ryan will vaguely tease, "Big things coming in the new catalog" and that will be all we hear until it hits(unless there is a leak a week before the catalog is out).
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:it really would be nice to see something that is not a giant catalog of stuff, and not a ton of reruns that have been in the catalog less than 5 years ago(though I will jump on a Y6B).
I have the Legacy Y6b from a few years ago with the whistle steam and great sound, I don't need one of those. 
Remember when Vision Line was suppose to be locomotives that have never been made yet?
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I have the Legacy Y6b from a few years ago with the whistle steam and great sound, I don't need one of those.
I have the TMCC version, good old 2200. I just missed coming back into the hobby at the right time. They had the weathered one in the first catalog I came back to. Sorry, no weathering for me.
@Traindiesel posted:Remember when Vision Line was suppose to be locomotives that have never been made yet?
Yup. I have suggested some oddball steam engines to Ryan like the Prairie, but given the fact I have no earthly clue what railroads would have had them, doubt they'd sell anyway even if they went into fantasy paint schemes. American 4-4-0's we got as a hybrid, how about something like the Flying Scotsman, or some of those delightful looking English and European engines? Maybe they could be in the works. It would be great to have a model of the fastest steam engine, that is that broke the speed record way back in the day.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:I have the TMCC version, good old 2200. I just missed coming back into the hobby at the right time. They had the weathered one in the first catalog I came back to. Sorry, no weathering for me.
Yup. I have suggested some oddball steam engines to Ryan like the Prairie, but given the fact I have no earthly clue what railroads would have had them, doubt they'd sell anyway even if they went into fantasy paint schemes. American 4-4-0's we got as a hybrid, how about something like the Flying Scotsman, or some of those delightful looking English and European engines? Maybe they could be in the works. It would be great to have a model of the fastest steam engine, that is that broke the speed record way back in the day.
Agreed, a vision line model of the A4 pacific would be fantastic.
Whatever it is most of us can't afford it. If they even offer a Vision Line locomotive this time.
sierra railway 3 would make a really good new engine and they could have tons of paint schemes
@Traindiesel posted:Remember when Vision Line was suppose to be locomotives that have never been made yet?
Yes, I do. Unfortunately, that ship sailed a long time ago.
@feet posted:Whatever it is most of us can't afford it. If they even offer a Vision Line locomotive this time.
Well that’s a positive way at looking at it,….let’s all stick our heads in the sand 🙄
Pat
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I still want a Vision Line PRR T1 Duplex. Even though I'm working on upgrading the scale TMCC version, I'd jump on the VL model in a heartbeat!
A PRR T1 would be fantastic! I’ve seen a few photos on this forum of the scale lionel tooling and it seems to be very detailed. It would be a real treat if lionel made a vision line version. PRR seems to be a very good road for Lionel to turn a profit.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Not an Amtrak guy, so you could tell me what it was and I still wouldn't know, unfortunately.
Reading this thread, I was also thinking that Ryan will have some Amtrak news. This is following up on his teases during Train World's live show a few months back.
The blue is no doubt the "Midnight Blue" 50th Anniversary diesel. I think Lionel will also being announcing some additional Amtrak passenger cars and maybe even some new Amtrak sets.
Whatever it is, we will know soon.
@johnstrains posted:Reading this thread, I was also thinking that Ryan will have some Amtrak news. This is following up on his teases during Train World's live show a few months back.
The blue is no doubt the "Midnight Blue" 50th Anniversary diesel. I think Lionel will also being announcing some additional Amtrak passenger cars and maybe even some new Amtrak sets.
Whatever it is, we will know soon.
I've been missing all the Train World Live shows except a few. I think I caught some of the Dave segments, but have missed out on a lot of times when Ryan was talking with Ken Jr. Miss catching so much working for a different company. At least I can hope some great things are coming our way.
@johnstrains posted:Reading this thread, I was also thinking that Ryan will have some Amtrak news. This is following up on his teases during Train World's live show a few months back.
The blue is no doubt the "Midnight Blue" 50th Anniversary diesel. I think Lionel will also being announcing some additional Amtrak passenger cars and maybe even some new Amtrak sets.
Whatever it is, we will know soon.
Yes, they said they would make either a special announcement this fall or it would be in the 2022 V1 catalog.
(These of course being the old Railking toolings)
Okay I eat my words. Lionel booth has the newest VL engine that they will post later on this week or next week. It is the N&W Class A. I took a bunch of pictures with my camera and not my phone, so I'll post those later on tonight.
Ryan said this is all new tooling, so no MTH tooling was bought for the Class A. Also, in the picture when I post them, the engine looks shiny, that's because it is a 3D printed shell of it. I'll say that again when I post.
@Alan Mancus posted:The last vision line that Lionel came out with was a challenger and was a disaster quite a few things were not right and many new engines had to sent back for upgrade problems that should have been fixed at the factory!
"DISASTER" IS WAY TOO STRONG OF A WORD, IMHO.
I'M AS BIG OF A CRITIC AS BIG ORANGE HAS HAD OVER THE LAST TEN YEARS OR SO....AND YES....I WAS ANNOYED WHEN I HAD TO SEND MY VL 3985 BACK TO NC.
BUT IT CAME BACK WITH THE CORRECT SOUND AND OFFSET DRIVERS AND HASN'T MISSED A BEAT SINCE.
I'M A LITTLE BUMMED THAT THE GREY ON THE FIREBOX AND SMOKEBOX DON'T MATCH MY FIRST LEGACY 844 AND FIRST LEGACY 4014....BUT THAT'S PRETTY MINOR, IN MY BOOK.
MY VL CHALLENGER IS EASILY MY MOST REQUESTED LOCOMOTIVE TO RUN WHEN COMPANY IS OVER.
I WILL NO LONGER PARTICIPAE IN BTO AT ALL.....BUT I'M HAPPY WITH VL 3985.....NOW.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:Okay I eat my words. Lionel booth has the newest VL engine that they will post later on this week or next week. It is the N&W Class A. I took a bunch of pictures with my camera and not my phone, so I'll post those later on tonight.
Ryan said this is all new tooling, so no MTH tooling was bought for the Class A. Also, in the picture when I post them, the engine looks shiny, that's because it is a 3D printed shell of it. I'll say that again when I post.
oh dear its something i really like the class A and its the norfolk and western which is something i want. i don't know what to do if they have a Pennsy or B&O version planned . I can only hope that a miracle happens but i do want to see those pics though
@paigetrain posted:oh dear its something i really like the class A and its the norfolk and western which is something i want. i don't know what to do if they have a Pennsy or B&O version planned . I can only hope that a miracle happens but i do want to see those pics though
All versions will be N&W. There is a prewar, postwar, fantasy version. I don't remember the numbers but Ryan did say 1218 would have the shiny coat like the one Big Boy did.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:All versions will be N&W. There is a prewar, postwar, fantasy version. I don't remember the numbers but Ryan did say 1218 would have the shiny coat like the one Big Boy did.
Any chance you can give Ryan some Dullcote while you're in York?
After the Mallets, the A Class are probably the best looking Articulated on 0-72 Curves....IMHO.
@Dave NYC Hudson PRR K4 posted:All versions will be N&W. There is a prewar, postwar, fantasy version. I don't remember the numbers but Ryan did say 1218 would have the shiny coat like the one Big Boy did.
what is the differance between a prewar and postwar class A?
It still doesn't matter because as soon as i see them i'm gonna want one probably the fantasy one.
however i can't afford or run one unless a miracle happens
Thanks for the pictures Ed!
Really curious as to this special feature being announced in January. Nothing currently listed has never been done before to make it a Vision engine. New tooling is a pleasant surprise however.
really curious about the new feature. it can't be the depleating coal load can it ? waving engineer ? what else can you shove in a steam engine?
I’ll take bets now this engine will list well north of 2000 bucks
@superwarp1 posted:I’ll take bets now this engine will list well north of 2000 bucks
maybe even 3000
Well, sorry I am late, just got back from dinner. I didn't realize I never took a good picture of the board with all the details. Thanks @ed h for getting that shot up close. I don't know why I didn't get that. @Berkshire President, I doubt I would be able to convince Ryan to Dullcote it.
Ryan did say that there is going to be two different tender style, what I guess you would consider normal, the other being an extended tender(I think that is how he worded it, or close to what he said). Regardless though, I think @superwarp1 Gary is right, this is probably going to cost at least $2,500 or dang near close. Of course this really depends on what all the features they jam into it. I guess we'll see what that is when we see it. I'll see about getting better pictures tomorrow on this so I can even read it. All I did was look at the different engines and that was it. I would have thought I would do more work than that. Bad me.
Prewar version of the A had a boiler tube pilot and tender with smaller coal bunker and water capacity. If you remember the Y3 Lionel did last year the tender would be similar.
The postwar Class A had a solid, cast steel pilot and larger, riveted tender. Same tender used as the Y6b. Those are the most notable differences. Also the prototype 1238 had roller bearing side and main drive rods.
I heard a rumor about this last year and I’m so glad to see it was true!! 😁 When will Lionel be releasing the concept art for all the different schemes?
I wonder if the special feature is an auxiliary water tender. The A’s and Y6’s were almost always seen with one in tow after WW2.
i'm also curious about the fantasy one that says passenger scheme . i guess it will be painted in the colors similar to 611
@N&WGuy posted:I heard a rumor about this last year and I’m so glad to see it was true!! 😁 When will Lionel be releasing the concept art for all the different schemes?
we probably won't see those until January when the catalog comes out
One thing I hope they offer is weathering by Harry Heike
@N&WGuy posted:I heard a rumor about this last year and I’m so glad to see it was true!! 😁 When will Lionel be releasing the concept art for all the different schemes?
Ryan did say that they would do a press release on it being the new VL engine, but I imagine that they art will come out when the catalog does.
@superwarp1 posted:One thing I hope they offer is weathering by Harry Heike
Ryan did tell me that the NYC weathered Mohawk they weren't doing I guess because they didn't get enough orders for those. I would imagine that this would be in the same boat if they did a weathered version. I didn't ask Ryan specifically about that but that is because I am not a weathered guy. I would wager that it is possible Mr. Muffin would do one, but that is the thing were Lionel says it voids the warranty on it(was it?).
At 2500 bananas, I'd rather buy a TMCC A and upgrade the smoke and possibly the speaker(s).
10K should buy more than four model train engines, in my book.
The other problem that I, personally, have with this price point is that it exceeds what Third Rail is charging for something comparable....for usually better detail and far better QC.
@Berkshire President posted:At 2500 bananas, I'd rather buy a TMCC A and upgrade the smoke and possibly the speaker(s).
10K should buy more than four model train engines, in my book.
The other problem that I, personally, have with this price point is that it exceeds what Third Rail is charging for something comparable....for usually better detail and far better QC.
Or send it to me for a basic LEGACY conversion that includes whistle steam.
@Berkshire President posted:At 2500 bananas, I'd rather buy a TMCC A and upgrade the smoke and possibly the speaker(s).
10K should buy more than four model train engines, in my book.
The other problem that I, personally, have with this price point is that it exceeds what Third Rail is charging for something comparable....for usually better detail and far better QC.
I knew it would probably be around that price just i like a diecast shell more than brass . i am worried about the problems these things may have for some folks
just wish i could get my hands on the prewar, WW2 or fantasy version oh well
@Bruk posted:Or send it to me for a basic LEGACY conversion that includes whistle steam.
Wish I had two more hands so I could give this four thumbs up!!
Does anyone know how/when/where we can pre-order one?
Most likely the ordering will be in the new catalog come whenever, January/February I guess. Ryan thought maybe they had done a little press release on FB but he hadn't had time to take a look(and since the cell coverage is really spotty, hard to look here at York for anyone inside the halls anyway). Well, no preview yet. I would imagine that it is possible they will run the press release most likely Monday/Tuesday next week since everyone is still at York. Perhaps they want to capture everyone when they have returned home or to work.
I did get much better pictures today of the engine and the board so it can easily be read by all. I also saw that they had a video running up top(above the model at the top of the booth) which I didn't see yesterday. I don't know if that was on at the time I ran through there or if they put it on later. Some of the features will be safety pop off valves, whistle steam, kinematic coupler, road specific crew talk, smoke stack smoke, and something else which has not been revealed(will be when they release the catalog, something they have never done). We can speculate all we want, but it is not going to get us anywhere. I jokingly said to someone that it transforms into a robot. That would of course be the worst feature for a steam locomotive, but at least the price would be inline if it was a real robot, lol.
Enough of that silly joking, lets get down to some pictures.
I tried to get a good view of all sides of the engine, couldn't do anything about the glare on the backside. I would have had to ask Ryan or someone remove the case which they might do, but I don't know. Maybe I will ask that tomorrow and see if they can just for some shots.
One further thing to note. Ryan was asked by someone about the possible cost, though he had a number it is not a final one because of some of the electronics pricing(not figured out just yet). He did not even give the possible cost I would guess to just CHA, which is understandable. He doesn't want to say $5.00, and then they come out with a figure of $30.00, as an example.
Hey Dave: in the background of some of those pictures is a SP Daylight loco, on a display shelf.
Is that just the VL GS-4 on display....or is it something else?
Thanks for the great reporting, BTW!!
@Berkshire President posted:Hey Dave: in the background of some of those pictures is a SP Daylight loco, on a display shelf.
Is that just the VL GS-4 on display....or is it something else?
Thanks for the great reporting, BTW!!
It doesn't say. I'll have to ask Ryan about that tomorrow. I would imagine that it should be considering that the VL 2-10-10-2 is right above it.
Also, here is the video that Lionel just put out about 2 hours ago on their YouTube channel. At least it is something further to look at.
I wonder if Lionel will offer the Class A in a VL Set? Plus is the additional feature a depleting coal load?
This is a long shot, but a neat feature for an articulated would be actual wheel slip on one set of drivers. It would require an additional motor and perhaps some way to take some weight off the front set of drivers but it would be pretty cool.
You're really pitching the slipping set of drivers, but I can say with about 99.9% certainty that ain't happening! The mechanics and electronics necessary to make that happen realistically would really bump up the price.
@SouthernFan56 posted:I wonder if Lionel will offer the Class A in a VL Set? Plus is the additional feature a depleting coal load?
I’m really hoping for a set! I had sent Lionel an email a few years ago about doing these A’s and I had suggested a War Time Set with an A, N&W boxcar, some 40 foot N&W flats with Sherman tanks, and a caboose. Don’t know if they ever saw that email, but I’m hoping they did!
@Bruk posted:Or send it to me for a basic LEGACY conversion that includes whistle steam.
Truth be told, I’d bet the old TMCC A class with your magical touch would be a far superior product …..if I have a hunger for a Legacy locomotive, off to you or Sid it goes,….those early 2000’s Korean made Lionels and MTH Premier engines are some of the most robust pieces of equipment to come from overseas,…combine that with yours & Sid’s attention to detail and care, how could anybody go wrong??…old world craftsmanship speaks volumes over mass production,…..BTW, I thought of you guys as I cruised the halls, and saw quite a few TMCC A class locomotives for cheap!….
Pat
@SouthernFan56 posted:I wonder if Lionel will offer the Class A in a VL Set? Plus is the additional feature a depleting coal load?
Ryan said the "mystery" feature would be something new and not something they've ever done previously. That being the case, the depleting coal load is out, it's been done.
It'll be interesting to see how they pull it off. With all the versions of the A they claim to be making they'll need a matrix to see what matches where. As built the early engines did not have covers over the sand lines coming out of the domes. To make the versions reasonably accurate we'd be talking about 3 different tenders (really should be 4), 2 different types of tender trucks, 2 different sets of crosshead guides, different side rods, pilots, and some other things I've been trying to wrap my mind around. It can be done, but sometimes they seem to overlook things that would have been simple to do, that they've even already made before, and just have to apply this or that part to this project here and there.
I'll believe it when I see all the different versions done accurately.
Gunrunner,
Yep, I'm just talking about a few of the reasonable things they might take into account.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Ryan said the "mystery" feature would be something new and not something they've ever done previously. That being the case, the depleting coal load is out, it's been done.
I am really curious whats in a steam engine that they haven't done already? i do hope there is a set of some kind as well maybe a world war 2 set or coal hauler set like i have wanted with diecast hoppers even though i can't afford it i can still dream
Well, I made it home just a bit ago. I got lucky this morning when I went over to the booth. Ryan was doing a promo for it and they had the cover off of it. When I get settled and set up I'll post all those photos here. I got all sides with nothing to case any glare. It may be a bit hard to see, but we're talking about a 3D printed shell anyway.
Also, I would imagine that they will throw in(at extra cost since there is no set offering listed at this time anyhow)some sort of rolling stock to pull behind it, whatever would be the most typical for maybe all the versions(except the passenger one). Having said that, they may just run some N&W cars instead of doing other rolling stock. I would hope that if the do passenger cars, they do freight as well.
Having said that mouthful, I'd advise anyone that really wants one of these that is in the pinch already to save up money for it and also seek an option like what Steve Nelson has of the lay-buy. You don't put any money up front(unless he already has it), you can put down a certain percentage, choose how long the layaway is for and it will automatically deduct the amount whenever it is due. That's just my personal opinion for those folks in the pinch.
The only other options are to wait, see what comes out, buy or don't buy, or get nothing when you can't pay. Pat's suggestion about getting a TMCC one and getting upgraded is the only other option, and will cost a lot less unless you get tussled over on buying the TMCC version. Hopefully that doesn't happen, but we've seen nutty prices.
@Will Ebbert posted:This is a long shot, but a neat feature for an articulated would be actual wheel slip on one set of drivers. It would require an additional motor and perhaps some way to take some weight off the front set of drivers but it would be pretty cool.
I never thought of that as a feature! It would be interesting to see.
Maybe they're going to give the engine real time conditions that display on the remote/app like steam pressure, water and fuel level, etc. If this is the case, I sure hope they have some overly dramatic sound effects for when your water level gets too low
I don't mind thinking about the new possible feature. It's a good opportunity to brain storm cool ideas that could be possible in the near future. Maybe they'll have a cab cam! Maybe they'll have holographic projections of the figures getting out and doing maintenance!
I'm surprised some members here haven't come around to say "maybe it'll have packaging that protects it during shipping" or something to that extent haha
Here are the full shots, though I could only get some much on the fireman's side.
Also, really doubt that there would be any sort of wheel slipping going on at all. The gearing would have to be independent of each other for the drive wheels to begin with, and like John said, no way. That alone would just grind the gear up to send it back for a warranty repair or end up like the Moguls. I really doubt Lionel would want something that is supposed to be big like this, be a dud right out of the box. Ryan was doing the pitch for these which I am sure we'll see on their FB or on their YouTube(probably already since it was this morning) when I started shooting.
Remember, it is a 3D shell and not the real thing.
I’m in for a Pilot version. 😎
I made a video giving my thoughts and using my MTH Premier Class A and Lionel tenders to show hopefully what they’ll look like! Looking forward to seeing the 2022 Vol. 1 catalog 😁
I didn't think about this until just a few seconds ago. They'll probably have auxiliary tenders for these unless they weren't used, in a few variations. Obviously one would be the standard prototypical one, other would be the passenger style.
I forgot to mention what Sean of "Sean's Trains" had said to me yesterday as a possible feature which I doubted was a waving engineer or crewman. I didn't think this would be a viable option as it would be hard to pop what would be needed to get it to work in that tight area. Plus Dave would probably roll his eyes.
Whatever idea they have come up with as a feature, that is probably going to or already has gone through some pre-testing this a bunch but naturally need more testing of whatever it is. Maybe when you open the smoke box door gold pours out?
@BillYo414 posted:Maybe they're going to give the engine real time conditions that display on the remote/app like steam pressure, water and fuel level, etc. If this is the case, I sure hope they have some overly dramatic sound effects for when your water level gets too low
You mean something like this…
but now some more critical sounds when the water gets low would be good😉
Well do not have to worry about this Visionline another RR that's way over done and there are tons out there you can get cheaper and upgrade. I sure wish we could get something new like when they did Santa Fe 2-10-10-2.
How is N&W way overdone? It’s been close to 20 years since Lionel has made an N&W Class A and it’s a rare day when an accurate N&W steam engine that’s not a J or a Y6b is manufactured.
Joe,
I totally agree! The N&W always gets the shaft when it comes to Lionel’s productions. It seems like there’s always something wrong with each release. Let’s hope they get this one right. 🙏🏻🤞🏻🙏🏻
I’d really like a painted 1218 but their track record makes me want to get the Pilot version or at least wait till I see one out of the box.
Mystery Special Feature:
My money is on “Cab Vision”😎 The engine will have a camera that connects to Wifi as if you were sitting in the engineer’s seat. 😎
@Joe Congemi posted:How is N&W way overdone? It’s been close to 20 years since Lionel has made an N&W Class A and it’s a rare day when an accurate N&W steam engine that’s not a J or a Y6b is manufactured.
Its funny you say accurate, I have never seen Lionel do anything accurate and it's funny how people only bring up Lionel when I say it's been way overdone like they are the only train manufacturer that does 3 rail models.
Or close to it. Was not insinuating Lionel is the only manufacturer. MTH had done the best to date in 3 rail. But that was 5 years ago. Williams did one in brass over 20 years ago. What I’m asking is what’s your definition of overdone?
Also Shawn, since you mentioned a Santa Fe 2-10-10-2, there was one catalogued last year and I believe it was one of the first VisionLine engines way back in 2009 or 2010.
@zhubl posted:You mean something like this…
I'm not going to admit that I never read through the instructions but yes! Haha something like that!! I don't use FasTrack though. I would have made that feature run off a tachometer or something. Maybe tie it to the sensor for the chuffs. Unless the sensortrack is just relaying the info back to CAB2. I'm not particularly knowledgeable on how the CAB2 communicates. I just know I need a ground. Sensortrack or not though, I still think this is a minor feature that adds loads of depth to operating a model railroad. Particularly if the train stops for a minute when water/fuel is depleted.
Boiler explosions aren't a joke or anything but I would have high expectations for the entertainment value of the boiler explosion. The sound effects for the guy having a bad day in the cattle car were top notch for me in terms of making me chuckle.
@Burl posted:Does anyone know how/when/where we can pre-order one?
Lionel is still working on the new feature for the A’s and they still don’t have a price for these yet, so It sounds like we’ll have to wait until the new catalog comes out around January 22 for preorders. The images for all the other versions won’t be available until the new catalog’s release either, so a bit of a wait unfortunately… 😩
my biggest question is will the fantasy version which is number 1201 be a prewar or postwar version or a mix of both like a prewar engine with the postwar y6b style tender which would be very interesting. i am most excited for this fantasy version even if i can't afford or run one. my hope is lionel will also release the lionmaster version with the same fantasy scheme so us tight budget traditional guys can have a class A too.
@Berkshire President posted:Hey Dave: in the background of some of those pictures is a SP Daylight loco, on a display shelf.
Is that just the VL GS-4 on display....or is it something else?
Thanks for the great reporting, BTW!!
Oh, I did get an answer from Ryan, yes the GS-4 is the VL version. I had actually thought I did answer this instead of my speculation that it was. I guess I was fired yesterday and didn't remember that bit. Ryan had said when I asked him that "yeah, it is not new, but we figured we should have some VL representation."
@paigetrain posted:my biggest question is will the fantasy version which is number 1201 be a prewar or postwar version or a mix of both like a prewar engine with the postwar y6b style tender which would be very interesting. i am most excited for this fantasy version even if i can't afford or run one. my hope is lionel will also release the lionmaster version with the same fantasy scheme so us tight budget traditional guys can have a class A too.
IDK about mixing a prewar and postwar version, but someone who is more educated on what the differences between the two could explain all that. I do know that Ryan had said the fantasy passenger version would have a stripe like the J's did, but he didn't say exactly how that I recall. One of the guys I know who is a big N&W fan/expert, said that the stripe would probably be more on the tender than the rest of the locomotive.
As far as Lionmaster, they did release a 1218 version in 2016 but that was like the prototype. Only other way to get one on a tight budget is to get some layway from a good dealer if you can even afford the whole price in however many months(or short few months) you can put money to it. Only advice I can offer is that. Good luck.
Prewar and postwar A’s had a few big differences…
The prewar N&W A’s had a boiler tube front pilot and a smaller tender. I’d hope this is the version Lionel is doing for the fantasy Passenger Scheme 1201 version since it’s what the A’s looked like when they ran passenger trains.
The biggest difference with the postwar N&W A’s was a solid front pilot and a rebuilt larger coal/water capacity tender. This is the version that saw nearly only freight service apart from a few excursions by the #1239 and #1240 on different occasions. The #1218 is a version of a postwar A.
Another difference if you look closely is the cross head guides on both sets of drivers!
@BillYo414 posted:I'm not going to admit that I never read through the instructions but yes! Haha something like that!! I don't use FasTrack though. I would have made that feature run off a tachometer or something. Maybe tie it to the sensor for the chuffs. Unless the sensortrack is just relaying the info back to CAB2. I'm not particularly knowledgeable on how the CAB2 communicates. I just know I need a ground. Sensortrack or not though, I still think this is a minor feature that adds loads of depth to operating a model railroad. Particularly if the train stops for a minute when water/fuel is depleted.
Boiler explosions aren't a joke or anything but I would have high expectations for the entertainment value of the boiler explosion. The sound effects for the guy having a bad day in the cattle car were top notch for me in terms of making me chuckle.
I don’t always read them either 😉
I actually haven’t been able to play with sensor tacks much. I just recently got these installed on the clubs new layout with GarGraves/Ross track
Either way I’m very interested to see what new feature they came up with. Happy to see another return of safety valve steam, I think that’s definitely a cool addition. The swinging bell when appropriate is also very cool too see. I’ve never seen the new GS cylinder steam but I’m sure that was another home run
@zhubl posted:I don’t always read them either 😉
I actually haven’t been able to play with sensor tacks much. I just recently got these installed on the clubs new layout with GarGraves/Ross track
Is that like a sensor converter for people not using Lionel Fastrak??? I would be very interested in that if it meant I could use this fuel/water level feature.
See HERE
Keep in mind this only works with the Legacy stuff since about 2012ish (there may be some leeway) with the IR sensor either in the Fuel tank or on the tender.
@zhubl posted:Keep in mind this only works with the Legacy stuff since about 2012ish (there may be some leeway) with the IR sensor either in the Fuel tank or on the tender.
I couldn't tell you what year my b6 is. I bought it used. But either way, I'll keep that in mind when I buy used. Thanks!
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