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Short answer.  If it does not say 'Scale' it is not scale.  If you are looking at the freight cars sold in the 90's forward they are more or less like the Lionel 6464 or K-Line 6400.  Could be wrong but I don't recall Williams making 'Scale' freight cars.  Edited, oops except for the brass set.

I am always puzzled why people think when the maker inserts the word 'classic' it somehow implies 'Scale'.  To me it means they are producing the same size cars we had back in the post war period.

Last edited by Bill DeBrooke

Williams plastic boxcars are NOT 6464 size, They are bigger than 6464, more like the size of RailKing boxcars.

Williams plastic box cars and stock cars started life as products of AMT, American Model Toys company around 1951 or so. AMT advertised them as scale, for some reason. One possibility is that they are models of AAR boxcars, which in real life are smaller than PS-1 boxcars.

Last edited by RoyBoy

Here are pictures of Williams box car from 80's NASA set.  Started life in the AMT/Kusan era. 10-1/4 by 3-1/4.  K-Line Timkin 10-1/2 by 3-1/4. Retooled from the NASA car mold.  Lionel post war Rutland 10-1/2 by 3-1/4.

Williams brass PRR box 11-1/2 by 3-1/2. MTH Premier Katy box 11-1/2 by 3-7/8.  All care measured coupler to coupler.

I don't have a Williams 'classic' series box car.  If anyone can measure and provide.IMG_0473.1

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@Ross posted:

I just measured one of my Frank’s Roundhouse boxcars. It was 10 1/8” in length. I think the molds from Frank’s went to Williams.

@Ross posted:

I just measured one of my Frank’s Roundhouse boxcars. It was 10 1/8” in length. I think the molds from Frank’s went to Williams.

Not sure Frank Rash ever had (as in owned) the molds from Kris.  I believe there was an agreement whereby he used them until that deal ended when they were sold to Williams.

@Strummer posted:

Again, as I mentioned elsewhere, my Lionel Pennsy E6 (#6-28005) was/ is listed as "traditional", yet is full-on "scale", 1:48. In fact, as I look at the website, it is listed as "traditional scale". So I guess you can never be too sure...(?)

Only way to be sure is to measure it against prototype dimensions - labels on boxes or elsewhere are not trustworthy

@mwb posted:

Only way to be sure is to measure it against prototype dimensions - labels on boxes or elsewhere are not trustworthy

Absolutely. When I think of "traditional" (in the Lionel sense), I think of the smaller, "027" post-war size. So yes, it's up to the buyer to do their "due diligence" when something like this is listed..."like this". 🙂

Mark in Oregon

Williams boxcars are scale length, but they aren’t accurate scale models. They are too narrow and a little too short to match any prototype based on the details.

Essentially, the molds were made for the 3-rail market for hobbyists who demanded more realistic-looking models than the 6464 cars.

But unless you’re running a strictly traditional railroad or strictly a scale railroad, it shouldn’t really matter. The cars fit in well for most layouts.

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