This was posted on the Eastern Division's Facebook page today. Note the description at the bottom. "Future Yellow Hall looking to return in April 2019 - watch for further details." Was surprised to see this. If this is truly in the works, this should be a welcome return for the April meet. We will just have to wait and see as April gets closer..
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Call me when they bring back the Green Hall. 
Farmer_Bill posted:Call me when they bring back the Green Hall.
AKA "the Green Barn" when announced on the PA system for some reason. (I guess in fairness it was more like a barn than the rest of the halls, and perhaps for those familiar with other uses of the Fairgrounds property, maybe it did regularly serve as a barn?)
As to the original post, that's a bit interesting. It can't be because the meet needs more space, I don't think. Seems to be a fair number of empty tables at each meet(I don't know for sure at this meet, but I seem to recall even Orange had a few no-shows over the last year or two).
If it could be used to replace a number of smaller halls, it might make sense, but I don't see how the layout of the building would work too well for that. I doubt it could replace more than maybe 2 of the member halls' amount of tables if you were to try to cram the participants in there.
I could take the optimistic view and say influx of extra cash caused by the elimination of the Senior rate for meet attendance will put the event so far in the black that they can afford to rent the extra hall and spread people out. 
-Dave
Now don't get me wrong, because I truly enjoyed the "old days" working and shopping in the Yellow Hall back when I was with Greenberg Publishing. But it is far from being a comfortable place to work in, or even shop in, and I can't imagine going back to those roots again.
If the TCA Eastern is going to change ANYTHING at or about their meet, they absolutely (in my opinion) need to go back to the "old days" of a Friday-Saturday meet schedule. They really need to see the writing on the wall in regard to the changing trends and demographics of the hobby. I must have talked to at least 30 Orange Hall dealers last week who agree with me on this. I never had a chance to visit any of the other halls this time around, but I imagine others in those venues would echo the same sentiment.
And I'm still very much in favor of going to a once-a-year, October-only event for much the same reasons.
But it's their meet, and I certainly respect their right to run it in whatever way they see fit. I suspect it can survive well enough for a few more years, but I, for one, would like to see it have a more promising long-term future.
Alan, I agree. The yellow hall would bring back the memories for sure but it did get tight in there. Also going back to Friday Saturday would be fine. The lack of attendance was little better this time but spring usually ruins that feel. One less day would help
Allan Miller posted:
If the TCA Eastern is going to change ANYTHING at or about their meet, they absolutely (in my opinion) need to go back to the "old days" of a Friday-Saturday meet schedule. They really need to see the writing on the wall in regard to the changing trends and demographics of the hobby. I must have talked to at least 30 Orange Hall dealers last week who agree with me on this. I never had a chance to visit any of the other halls this time around, but I imagine others in those venues would echo the same sentiment.
Because Saturday is such a big draw? (yes sarcasm). Maybe just stay with Thursday / Friday. AT least those days have people attending. All we hear about Saturdays is no one is there and everyone packing up to leave early. I'd dump Saturday and move on with life. It won't be any better if it was Friday Saturday.
Marty very true, I don't recall Saturday being very packed even when I was a kid.
MartyE posted:Allan Miller posted:
If the TCA Eastern is going to change ANYTHING at or about their meet, they absolutely (in my opinion) need to go back to the "old days" of a Friday-Saturday meet schedule. They really need to see the writing on the wall in regard to the changing trends and demographics of the hobby. I must have talked to at least 30 Orange Hall dealers last week who agree with me on this. I never had a chance to visit any of the other halls this time around, but I imagine others in those venues would echo the same sentiment.
Because Saturday is such a big draw? (yes sarcasm). Maybe just stay with Thursday / Friday. AT least those days have people attending. All we hear about Saturdays is no one is there and everyone packing up to leave early. I'd dump Saturday and move on with life. It won't be any better if it was Friday Saturday.
Every day is Saturday when you’re retired. So how does Thursday even matter? For those of us working jobs all week long, the days really do matter and having a full day Saturday without table holders slithering away early would promote attendance by working folks who can only go on the weekend.
The yellow hall will be used for othe gauges. Lionel, MTH, Bachmann, and Atlas all offer HO. If they get on board ED would try to get other manufacturers and dealers in there to attract those interested in other than toy trains. In other words more of the model train community.
And Alan you might just get your wish.
Pete
GregR posted:Every day is Saturday when you’re retired. So how does Thursday even matter? For those of us working jobs all week long, the days really do matter and having a full day Saturday without table holders slithering away early would promote attendance by working folks who can only go on the weekend.
Like it does now? Again sarcasm. If all folks not wanting to take a day off went Saturday now, then we wouldn't even be discussing this. If Saturday was a boom I'd be all for it but as of now, Thursday and Friday are the big draws. Would that change if Thursday was axed? I don't know but from what I remember, Saturday was never very crowded and especially after the noon hour.
To me it doesn't matter. I'll go whenever they have it but you have to maximize the days that show the greatest attendance and that's not Saturday. Hopefully they can figure something out. I guess any ideas pertaining to what days are certainly worth entertaining.
To a certain extent there is a fair amount of sameness to every York meet. Different pickings but categorically similar. Since 1994 I have gone every fall/spring, once a year or skipped a few years. During the times I skipped the only thing I really missed were the people. Friends and vendor contacts.
For senior attendees who have difficulty with increased fees I would simply suggest to follow some big vendors, skip a year.
MartyE posted:Allan Miller posted:
If the TCA Eastern is going to change ANYTHING at or about their meet, they absolutely (in my opinion) need to go back to the "old days" of a Friday-Saturday meet schedule. They really need to see the writing on the wall in regard to the changing trends and demographics of the hobby. I must have talked to at least 30 Orange Hall dealers last week who agree with me on this. I never had a chance to visit any of the other halls this time around, but I imagine others in those venues would echo the same sentiment.
Because Saturday is such a big draw? (yes sarcasm). Maybe just stay with Thursday / Friday. AT least those days have people attending. All we hear about Saturdays is no one is there and everyone packing up to leave early. I'd dump Saturday and move on with life. It won't be any better if it was Friday Saturday.
Does Saturday have low attendance because all the good stuff sold on Thursday with the small remainder Friday?
I don't think doing away with Saturday is a good idea. Then sellers will be packing up at 2 pm on Friday. Thursday is my usual day to attend York. I seem to remember before Thursday was added, trying to walk the crowded aisles on Friday had me skipping the Red Hall altogether. But perhaps, for some of you, that was part of the "fun".
MartyE posted:Because Saturday is such a big draw? (yes sarcasm). Maybe just stay with Thursday / Friday. AT least those days have people attending. All we hear about Saturdays is no one is there and everyone packing up to leave early. I'd dump Saturday and move on with life. It won't be any better if it was Friday Saturday.
Nope, Saturday never was a particularly big draw, but folks (individuals) would simply have to adjust to it or pass on the meet altogether, as increasing numbers are apparently already doing, particularly in April. A Friday-Saturday meet would serve well for most manufacturers, retailers, working folks, students, and the list goes on. Would also cut down on expenses for all concerned. I would recommend a 11 am-7 pm schedule on Friday, and a 9 am-5 pm schedule on Saturday.
Thursday is a tough day for folks who are still employed, as well as for students and others. Retirees can pretty much handle any days or schedule, of course, but retirees should not be, in my view, a primary consideration. And even in their case, expenses play a part.
It's entirely possible that Saturday could become a viable day at this point because times have changed and the hobby has changed with them, if not faster. Saturday at this past meet was, at least in the Orange Hall, pretty much a ghost town. . . no better and no worse than it was back in the 90s before there even was an Orange Hall. But this is a different time, and circumstances are quite different. We oldsters of today--still the core group in this hobby--were a lot more plentiful, healthy, wealthy, and eager to buy than is the case today when many--dealers and members alike--are contending with life's realities involving all of those same considerations, but from a different perspective. That is one of the reasons I continue to recommend a once-a-year meet, held in October.
Don't get me wrong: I truly enjoy York and hope to be able to attend for a fair number of years to come. I am also not in a position to dictate what moves or directions the Eastern Division folks should take. I am just offering recommendations from my own perspective, formed over many years starting back around 1990 when I first attended as a guest after having moved back to the mainland from Hawaii.
Change is in the air, as likely will be evident at the next York meet, but I hope to be able to attend a good many more Eastern Division meets as long as my health holds up and I have some extra bucks available for such adventures.
Just my opinion (that of a rookie who has ONLY attended approx 25 meets). Reduce York to 2 days All Day Friday and Saturday. You still need a weekend day for those still working. This should be a first step. BTW the Springfield show in Jan does not seem to suffer with two days.
What the TCA needs to do is conduct a survey of the dealers and attendees, and then gauge what everyone wants.
I'm not an ED member, so have no say, but I'd consider elimination of Thursday and adding some of the hours to Saturday (with Museum events moving back to Thursday) as a good way to have enough hours to see it all across the 2 days and also support a Saturday attendance/buying/selling improvement. I might not agree with the exact hours Allan suggested, but something along those lines.
It's the early pack up situation that kills Saturday, IMO. The catch-22 self fulfilling prophecy. Sellers say no one is buying on Saturday, so start leaving early. Prospective buyers say with all the sellers packing up early, why do I want to waste the half day (or 3 hours, if you were to assume the packing is quite prevalent by noon) walking through aisles that are being packed up and I can't see what they have to sell? And repeat.....
But I could be wrong. Others have far more experience with this than I do.
-Dave
Under the grandstand?!! I think that is a really bad idea. You could hardly move under there...if they want to segregate HO, etc., use the "barn" or the one they stopped using next to the "orange", (dealer) hall, "pink", or whatever. Since the buses seemed to run less frequently than l remember, none was in sight when l wanted one, l hiked, and if attendance is shrinking, the buildings should be closely grouped, meaning using the buildings that are closely grouped. I don't know if it is chicken or egg..less attendance at York because of no new prototypes and mfrs., or no new either because of fewer people attending York and in hobby?
Allan Miller posted:
Thursday is a tough day for folks who are still employed, as well as for students and others. Retirees can pretty much handle any days or schedule, of course, but retirees should not be, in my view, a primary consideration. And even in their case, expenses play a part.
It's entirely possible that Saturday could become a viable day at this point because times have changed and the hobby has changed with them, if not faster. Saturday at this past meet was, at least in the Orange Hall, pretty much a ghost town. . . no better and no worse than it was back in the 90s before there even was an Orange Hall. But this is a different time, and circumstances are quite different. We oldsters of today--still the core group in this hobby--were a lot more plentiful, healthy, wealthy, and eager to buy than is the case today when many--dealers and members alike--are contending with life's realities involving all of those same considerations, but from a different perspective. That is one of the reasons I continue to recommend a once-a-year meet, held in October.
Well Allan I think if they go to a Friday / Saturday the meet becomes a 1 day affair. I could very well be wrong and because of no Thursday, Saturday picks up. At least that would be my hope. But I'm with you, I'll continue to go and enjoy myself with whatever they decide. A bad day York is better than a good day at work.
In regards to a yearly show in October, Lionel will not have a booth in April 2019. They will be back for the October 2019 meet. Ryan Kunkle will make a presentation at the TCA Museum on the Wednesday before York. I had posted this earlier as its own separate thread but it was deleted I am guessing because it turned into a Lionel bashing thread.
Neal Jeter
You will never get the public numbers if the days stay as-is or Thursday is dropped.
If you want the public to attend, the show has to be Saturday and Sunday during regular hours, like 10-5. If you have to have a TCA only day, keep Friday exactly as-is today.
.....Show me a public train show (or any family event) anywhere that is only open half-days Thursday and Saturday and all day Friday....
Two posts above "I'm not an ED member".. What is ED?
I know they sell pills for it on TV but this ED must be different.
Tom Tee posted:Two posts above "I'm not an ED member".. What is ED?
I know they sell pills for it on TV but this ED must be different.
Eastern Division of the TCA.
Never seen an explanation as to why hours were so weird, unless it was imposition of religion (l haven't found the area under Blue Laws, which my state was too long burdened with) Almost every other trainshow (Wheaton, etc.) is open Sunday for working stiffs. Must be something l don't know.
It's never been on Sunday, to the best of my knowledge, but I've only been going since 1997.
Supposedly the days had something to do with arrangements with the fairgrounds (possibly selling Sunday to other events, etc.), but only those who run the meet have the actual story and how it is right now.
From the vendor's perspective, many use Sunday to travel long distances back home to actually be open for business on Monday, so a lot would not like Sunday, as they would then need to be closed on Monday while traveling.
Obviously the hours/days evolved when Thursday was added.
-Dave
OK, I'm watching this and the other treads on the York meet and here we are reinventing the wheel for the umpteenth time again on how this and that that does or doesn't work and how the ED needs to run the show. If I remember correctly, it was either the big dealers or the manufacturers (or both) that wanted the show expanded to Thursday in the first place. Once that happened, then there was the push to allow the public to attend. So these things happened and certain people still aren't happy. So now, on this and another tread, there are people who have either heard rumors or actually know something but have to keep secrets for whatever reason. If you know something, just say what it is already. This "I know something and you don't" is like being back in grade school.
Like to improve the York meet? How about wider aisles in the member halls? 
I was also not impressed with the way everyone got the "bums rush" out of the Orange hall before the official closing time! I think they need to deal with that. That's the first time I ever remember then wanting EVERYONE out before the closing time, including the dealers!
In my opinion and I have only been going to York for 41 years, Is to keep the MEET on Thursday, but open it earlier, maybe around 10am. As for the meet being once a year, that is stupid. Who wants to wait a full year. OGR wants it that way to save money. If they give up Saturday, the tables holders will close up early on Friday. The retired people and that is most of the people, have more money to spend that the younger people. Please don't go to once a year. I can't wait that long, & I am sure others feel the same, stupid idea. If the meet goes back to Friday & Saturday the bandit shows will get bigger. This thread happens after every York. I like the idea that the fee will go up in April to $15. for everyone . That will help the ED. As for the Yellow hall returning, I have no idea what's up with that. I have more to say, but I will wait.
gunrunnerjohn posted:Like to improve the York meet? How about wider aisles in the member halls?
I was also not impressed with the way everyone got the "bums rush" out of the Orange hall before the official closing time! I think they need to deal with that. That's the first time I ever remember then wanting EVERYONE out before the closing time, including the dealers!
I may be mistaken, but I believe that dynamic (for both member halls and dealer halls - but key being table holders need to be out as well) changed maybe a year or 2 ago.
Rumors at the time suggested it had something to do with being charged overtime for the guards if anyone was still inside even one minute past the closing bell.
That was pretty ridiculous with the lights being shut most of the way off so early. It was especially comical that the announcement of when the halls would close happened around 30 seconds before they shut most of the lights off (around 15 minutes before close, IIRC). They've been dimming many of the lights early to get people out for a while now, but Friday's timing seemed more extreme.
-Dave
Here are a couple of my thoughts:
1. The regular attendees at York are not getting younger. The York show needs to attract a new and younger/family audience. Other train shows are successful at doing this by having operating layouts, other kid-oriented attractions and/or kid operated layouts interspersed with the dealers.
2. The early "clear the building" announcement interrupted a sale that I was making on Thursday and effectively closed business around twenty minutes early on Friday when the late afternoon shopping still seemed dynamic to me. That should never happen again.
3. I would recommend that the show begin and at the same time on at least Thursday and Friday. That way, bus groups get a "full" day on Thursday and there is no confusion about starting times. Any more that 8 hours a day is a hardship on many dealers.
4. A national advertising campaign to let the non-TCA enthusiasts know that they are welcome on Friday and Saturday needs to start NOW for April. Print deadlines for January- March publications are fast approaching. "York" is both a noun and a verb, but it seems to me that the general public is still either unaware of the event or still feels excluded because of decades of previous exclusivity.
5. Packing early is not an issue if vendors/dealers are making sales. The show promoter must work hard to attract an audience to fill a venue for all days that they collect fees from and expect attendance by their vendors. I am of the opinion that the York vendors in total bring an incredible variety of train products for viewing, discussion and purchase.
Eddie, I been going for only 33 tears, I have to agree with you on opening the meet at 10 on thursday, and keep the other days as is.
Todds Architectural Models posted:
4. A national advertising campaign to let the non-TCA enthusiasts know that they are welcome on Friday and Saturday needs to start NOW for April. Print deadlines for January- March publications are fast approaching. "York" is both a noun and a verb, but it seems to me that the general public is still either unaware of the event or still feels excluded because of decades of previous exclusivity.
I have to agree with this. When in the dealer halls, I didn’t see very many people with the wrist bands on they give out to the public on Friday and Saturday. The people with badges significantly outnumbered those with wrist bands. Don’t get me wrong, I think having York as a members only event is great. However, the amount of members attending the meet continues to dwindle every spring and fall. More advertising at least for the general public side of the meet could help get the word out more resulting in more people attending and an increase in people joining the TCA to see the rest of the meet.
The cold, unheated, dank, dark and crowded "basement" of the grandstand? Oh sure...that will help improve this meet/show.
Been there. Done that. No one in their right mind would want to set up a booth in that dump.
Good grief. 
FORMER OGR CEO - RETIRED posted:The YELLOW HALL?
The cold, unheated, dank, dark and crowded "basement" of the grandstand? Oh sure...that will help improve this meet/show.
Been there. Done that. No one in their right mind would want to set up a booth in that dump.
Good grief.
The Fairgrounds is thinking of upgrading the Yellow Hall and asking its regular customers if they would have a use for it. It wasn't Eastern Divisions idea but they are now thinking of ways to use it. Right now the thought is to use it to attract Model Railroaders who currently have little interest in what goes on there now, including HO and N where the majority of model railroaders are.
Folks here have been saying for years that ED has to make the show more like The Big E or the Great American Train show.
Nothing is written in stone at this point so give it a chance.
Pete
eddie g posted:As for the meet being once a year, that is stupid. Who wants to wait a full year. OGR wants it that way to save money. If they give up Saturday, the tables holders will close up early on Friday. The retired people and that is most of the people, have more money to spend that the younger people.
Well, let's see. I have attended a great many once-a-year events hosted by a large number of national train clubs and such (various scales) and I have had no real problem waiting for the next round. Try Trainfest in Milwaukee, for example, or the NMRA National Convention and its related show held in a different city each year. And there are plenty of others.
"OGR wants it that way to save money?" Hmm. . . I doubt we are anywhere near alone in that regard. I can name a good number of manufacturers and suppliers that feels the same way, not to mention independent dealers who are continually faced with economic uncertainty in a changing hobby, economy, and society. Yep, saving money from a business perspective is not really a bad thing.
Good to know that "retired people . . . have more money to spend. . . ." I'm not so sure that is necessariyl true anymore, if it ever was. But aside from that, a good number of retired people who have been in the hobby for a reasonably long time have pretty much already acquired most or all of the trains they have sought or can use or even house. Many have already recognized the finite limits of our time on this planet, and determined that it is to their advantage to enjoy and make use of what they have rather than see relatives give it all away a couple of weeks after the hobbyist is planted. I can't begin to tell you how many folks I talk to who tell me they come to York now almost exclusively for the social experience it provides, and how many tell me they are cutting back to one time a year simply because it is becoming cost prohibitive due to increased real-world expenses such as health care costs and a myriad of other things that are not matched by increases in pensions or Social Security.
The point is, there are a whole lot of things to be considered by ANY hobby organization operating in today's fast-paced and fast-changing society. There are no simple solutions.
Some sudden thoughts and second thoughts.
**Talking about the attendance at train shows in general, the Saturday/Sunday format always seems to draw the large crowds. The vendors who attend those shows don’t seem to have a problem with being there Sunday. Why is the York Meet any different? Maybe because those vendors are more localized? Does it matter if they are making sales?
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Someone asked: “What is the meaning of life?” Some random dude replied: “To give life a meaning.”
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**We must remember that the York Meet is organized and operated by the volunteer members of the TCA Eastern Division. Only they can decide how to run their event. The Eastern Division members interests should be served first. Also remember that the TCA itself was founded by a group of guys who just wanted to share, trade, buy and sell their trains. It wasn’t created to be a vessel for vendors, dealers and manufacturers/importers to make money. They joined up and became part of the landscape. They have enhanced the Meet greatly, but at some point began to think they are the driving force.
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“When you do things right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all”
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**The Eastern Division folks, nor anyone else, will never be able to make everyone happy. Those who dislike how it’s run or the location or the days and times are going to say the Meet is dying. Those who find their coveted treasures will say how great it is. So if it boils down to making money, wouldn’t you think sellers would want to be there when the buyers would be? It’s a vicious cycle. Members wishes vs. the sellers vs. attendees. My suggestion; Friday, Saturday and Sunday 9-5. Friday would be for members only as well as 9am to noon on Saturday. Noon Saturday until close on Sunday for the non member public. I don’t get the argument about dealers worried about getting home before Monday to open their store when they are getting to York on Tuesday or Wednesday for the rest of the week. Aren’t they worried about being open on those days too?
**The Yellow Hall/Grandstand possibly being reopened is puzzling. It is and was a dungeon of a facility. The only reason I tolerated going there was because the newer trains were housed there. But if the building will be refurbished or remodeled or whatever for future use, maybe it could be a viable space. But as far as the York Meet use, for who, for what? May be a good idea to house vendors of the smaller scales to bring in more public and possibly increase membership. But will those interested in the smaller scales venture over to the other Halls to be exposed to O gauge? Or will they stay in the Yellow? Maybe spread out all scales of modern production throughout the Orange, Purple and the Yellow Halls for maximum exposure.
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”No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible.”
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**We can accumulate all kinds of ideas, but ultimately it’s the Eastern Division members that will decide. And whatever they decide will be just fine with me. (Except for making the Meet only once a year)
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Me and my friends were waiting for a bus for about an hour and a half — with an old man standing a bit away from us at the same bus stop.
Finally, we can see the bus coming, and my friend says, “Oh finally, the bus is coming,” and the old man just turns to us and says, “The bus was always coming.”
Being a newbie to the hobby and this being only my third time at the show I see valid points of both of moving days and keeping days. I’m lucky I only live 20 minutes from the show and work only 10 minutes away, so I can take a half day of work and still attend on Thursday. I’m also lucky enough to get 7 weeks vacation at 43 years old. The thought of getting more families to attend when the current show days are I don’t see it happenening especially the way current employers are with vacation ( again I’m lucky). I came from the farm toy hobby and a lot of those local shows were 9 to 2 on Saturdays with the National show being a few days long. I like that there is one day for members only so you don’t have a lot of extra people just milling about clogging the aisle ways. I did here a vendor in the purple hall wanted more room and they couldn’t give him more room in that hall so he had a stand in the purple and orange halls. I did see a small add in the local newspaper I believe on Thursday morning.
Traindiesel posted:**We must remember that the York Meet is organized and operated by the volunteer members of the TCA Eastern Division. Only they can decide how to run their event. The Eastern Division members interests should be served first. Also remember that the TCA itself was founded by a group of guys who just wanted to share, trade, buy and sell their trains. It wasn’t created to be a vessel for vendors, dealers and manufacturers/importers to make money. They joined up and became part of the landscape. They have enhanced the Meet greatly, but at some point began to think they are the driving force.
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**The Eastern Division folks, nor anyone else, will never be able to make everyone happy.
**The Yellow Hall/Grandstand possibly being reopened is puzzling.
**We can accumulate all kinds of ideas, but ultimately it’s the Eastern Division members that will decide. And whatever they decide will be just fine
A fine post! Thank you.
The Yellow hall is just being talked about to use for HO. Nothing for sure yet. The member attendance was over 9,000. That does not include the public.
Are numbers for public gonna be released?...l didn't pay attention to times/days public was admitted
"It wasn’t created to be a vessel for vendors, dealers and manufacturers/importers to make money. They joined up and became part of the landscape. They have enhanced the Meet greatly, but at some point began to think they are the driving force."
Yes, in the early years it was a genuine, no-frills train MEET--a place for collectors to gather in order to buy/sell/trade trains and share information. But that was some time ago, and I would assert that today, in part because of the significant revenue they provide to the division, but also because increasing numbers of participants in the hobby are actually doing something with their trains rather than simply placing them on shelves, the manufacturers, after-market suppliers, dealers, and vendors ARE pretty much the driving force. Take them out of the mix and I think you might have a rather significant problem to deal with. I could be wrong about that, but who can say for sure?
Norton posted:FORMER OGR CEO - RETIRED posted:The YELLOW HALL?
The cold, unheated, dank, dark and crowded "basement" of the grandstand? Oh sure...that will help improve this meet/show.
Been there. Done that. No one in their right mind would want to set up a booth in that dump.
Good grief.
The Fairgrounds is thinking of upgrading the Yellow Hall and asking its regular customers if they would have a use for it. It wasn't Eastern Divisions idea but they are now thinking of ways to use it. Right now the thought is to use it to attract Model Railroaders who currently have little interest in what goes on there now, including HO and N where the majority of model railroaders are.
Folks here have been saying for years that ED has to make the show more like The Big E or the Great American Train show.
Nothing is written in stone at this point so give it a chance.
Pete
Well that dark dungeon used to draw a bigger crowd than orange will ever. I hope show never gets like big E. This show was originally for collector's to buy and sell trains. Big E is too public. It draws the crowd but mostly people that are just looking for something to do and never buy more than a starter set. My dad has been going twice a year since 1974. Never missed even one. I'll be 32 in March and I've never missed one since around 1992. York is the Disney world of trains. Throw in the bandit shows and you can almost make a week out of it. It's still awesome. No matter what anyone does. A train going in a circle will never compete with video games. Times have changed. I hate it but it's not changing anytime soon.
This is just my opinion, But as one of the young guy's (under 21), I personally think that York should go to a once a year meet in October and two days Friday, Saturday. I also think that opening the Yellow hall is the worst idea ever. While I was only 4 or 5 years old at the time that they closed the Yellow hall, from what I remember of it, was that it was a dark, dirty, and dusty place. I also do not blame the dealers and manufactures for wanting to leave early on Saturday. They are not there for our entertainment, they are there to sell trains and make money.
As a table holder in the Silver Hall a couple of observations:
1. Table space is getting easier to obtain in the member halls.
2. As shared to me from Debbie Geiser,"TCA Eastern pays $250,000 to lease the Fairgrounds from Monday through Saturday." So I feel its to their advantage to open the halls for as many days possible.
3. That said, for me, the meet is effectively over at 2pm on Friday. In all seriousness, the crowd disappears about 1:45. This coincides with some group gathering in the inky-dinky Gold hall...
4. Saturdays are for playing shuffleboard in the aisles.
5. I pray the member halls are never opened to the public for that would kill the TCA as membership would no longer be required to attend. I already know a couple of guys that dropped their membership but still go to the Orange and Purple as paying public.
6. Rumor has it the Yellow Hall will be for HO vendors.
Open fire!
.
If they are putting Ho in the Yellow hall, put N- Gauge in the purple hall and then put Flyer stuff in the brown hall so I don't have to see it when I'm looking at O-Gauge in the other halls!
Not sure if it is true but I heard that April 2019 may be the last April show. It was past on to me a rumor has it. Is there any truth to this? I heard this else where, not here.
hardly post but here are my thoughts.
the days of conventional running the collecting and or looking for that elusive item/s is gone kaput finito during the heyday of collecting old trains and the non posts here on the forum support that very observation. as to those saying waiting a whole year for a York show is not good it seems yesteryear the attendance to that one show a year say 20-30 years ago proves that a non issue the webmaster can confirm we could read more posts about York than you could shake a stick at that's reality.
the once mighty bandit meets are no longer what they were at one time and the small posts about them again support that observation.
York is no longer exclusively about trains but has in fact turned into a social gathering part of York getting together with past friends meeting new ones and talking trains is more up front and center now as well as gathering for a good breakfast or late supper or a photo gathering this seems like the new eastern division York show.
even those having special days for hearing news from various vendors or about learning the new innovations and having questions asked by train companies and answered by representatives is dwindling in size compared to years past.
all this I have watched happen right here on this very forum how can I say that?
easy the posts from 20 years ago would be all over this forum with this is the find I have seeked or this is all the items I was able to get and cross off my list the York posts of today are meek in comparison or oh my mth just announced a dramatic command control system the hype just does not exist anymore the newer items are not as sought after as collecting is not the same anymore nor are the trains made today its a new world and we are a pin size entity vying for a space to compete with video games you can play on a smartphone! need proof look at a child with a parent in a store what's in there hand a smartphone and what are they doing playing a game aimed at what age they are at and its not a train related game.
as to eastern division and York show it seems they are trying a lot of ideas but seems has not found the avenue to generate the excitement needed for a strong attendance as well as for the vendors having more sales during the event or a reason not to pack up early! I haven't a clue how to get more folks interested as we are in trains will assume that the lack of passenger trains as most of us older generation grew up with might also have a impact of general public lack of interest as those are long gone and the childhood excitement seeing them and the once plentiful freight trains from class 1' railroads and short line railroads we live in a very different world now.
as to vendors packing up early where is the incentive not to? as to leasing the buildings for a week for the show common sense 101 folks all shows I attend at fairgrounds the vendors have 1-2 hrs to pack up after the doors closed its not rocket science allow time after shows end for them to have time to pack up if that means you pay overtime duh rethink and short both days opening time to compensate for it. not sure but seems someone posted they pay for a weeks time to use the buildings so to me a week is 7 days the show is open ? correct me if wrong 3 days so can someone explain where the other 4 days got off to time wise not to allow vendors those hours after show to pack up or is the security an extra fee they pay over and above the building fees?
I miss the days of the great American train show the first few years it was fantastic all train makers various suppliers of scenery or? were plentiful and just like the York show is now poof they all pretty much left leaving nothing more than a swap meet that folks came looked and left and nary a purchase we stopped going as well as we wanted scenic items or miniature people for our layouts and on and on all gone poof.
personally from a sideline viewer you all had a better show a better manufacturer showing with yep once a year show sorry but go back you will see twice a year and allowing public in did nothing to excite the masses but once a year and the posts flourished about it all and the vendors were plentiful vying for a spot to show the latest you just gotta have this and no bto's needed either!
that's all I have agree disagree matters not to me I can run my trains and dream and enjoy them from times of long ago to the few command control engines I have and honestly really do not need anymore I am content with what I have can you say that?
Dmaxdeere87 posted:Big E is too public. It draws the crowd but mostly people that are just looking for something to do and never buy more than a starter set.
It would be great if they DID buy "starter sets". I've spent a number of entire weekends at "public" shows with our modular group. I would say, "never buy more than a $5. Thomas toy". However, the kids loved the layouts we put up.
eddie g posted:The Yellow hall is just being talked about to use for HO. Nothing for sure yet. The member attendance was over 9,000. That does not include the public.
Yikes! Didn't they claim 15,000 to 16,000 attendance a few years back?
The thread is a waste. Rumors, rumors, rumors...Please take this thread down...ED is NOT going to once a year.
eddie g posted:The thread is a waste. Rumors, rumors, rumors...Please take this thread down...ED is NOT going to once a year.
I'm not going to take the thread down, but at least you said "please."
This is a discussion forum, and as long as the conversations stay civil, it can continue.
B&O946 posted:This is just my opinion, But as one of the young guy's (under 21), I personally think that York should go to a once a year meet in October
Why? Twice a year is a great thing, and why October? I know more who go in the spring than go in October. I grew up in that area, and weather wise April is normally better than October. I feel the way they have it now is actually the best. the only thing I might change is maybe longer hours for Saturday but that would have to be a test thing for a few shows to see if it drew enough to see if it made it worth it. I also say don't make it mandatory during the test period for sellers to stay past noon as it is now, until you see if it works. If it does then you can consider that.
eddie g posted:The thread is a waste. Rumors, rumors, rumors...Please take this thread down...ED is NOT going to once a year.
Actually there is some very good responses to this. Even if some of it will never happen, it lets other know how they feel about things going on at the York Train Show. Members of the eastern TCA could receive some good feed back from post like this.
Doing a hall or say a portion of one hall that was HO could be beneficial as I know some HO people who would come if they thought there was enough HO to make it interesting for it. IT would also be better for them if it was all in one area instead of trying to find 20 or so HO dealers between 3-5 halls. As for S and O being separated I don't see that as there are some who collect both.
rtraincollector posted:B&O946 posted:This is just my opinion, But as one of the young guy's (under 21), I personally think that York should go to a once a year meet in October
Why? Twice a year is a great thing, and why October? I know more who go in the spring than go in October. I grew up in that area, and weather wise April is normally better than October. I feel the way they have it now is actually the best. the only thing I might change is maybe longer hours for Saturday but that would have to be a test thing for a few shows to see if it drew enough to see if it made it worth it. I also say don't make it mandatory during the test period for sellers to stay past noon as it is now, until you see if it works. If it does then you can consider that.
The reason that I say to keep the October meet is that in the spring people are heading into summer and are not doing much with there trains, where as in October people are heading into the winter months and are starting to do stuff with their trains again. I also think that extending the hours on Saturday is a terrible idea. I went through the Orange hall on Saturday morning this last York just after the show opened and one dealer was about 90% packed up. So if the dealers are already doing that on Saturday that early, what good is extending the hours going to do? These are just the thoughts though of some 20 year old who wants to see York continue successfully.
rtraincollector posted:B&O946 posted:This is just my opinion, But as one of the young guy's (under 21), I personally think that York should go to a once a year meet in October
Why? Twice a year is a great thing, and why October? I know more who go in the spring than go in October. I grew up in that area, and weather wise April is normally better than October. I feel the way they have it now is actually the best. the only thing I might change is maybe longer hours for Saturday but that would have to be a test thing for a few shows to see if it drew enough to see if it made it worth it. I also say don't make it mandatory during the test period for sellers to stay past noon as it is now, until you see if it works. If it does then you can consider that.
October usually has good bit bigger crowd
Why October?
Well, because that's the time of year that most people, even those already well into the hobby, begin thinking about trains. It's the time of year when the hobby begins its growth cycle (if there still is a growth cycle). The link between toy trains and Christmas is a very strong one, and there darn sure isn't anything wrong with helping to perpetuate that tradition.
"October usually has good bit bigger crowd".......not last week, at least not in Orange Hall. A good judge of the crowd is how far vehicles are parked out from Orange Hall on Friday mornings around the 9 a.m. opening. On good years, the parking has approached the west gate off Highland Ave., both on the pavement and the grass. Last week, vehicles weren't even halfway to the gate. People keep posting about how big the crowd was....I didn't see it that way. I didn't see a lot of the general public in Orange Hall on either Thursday or Friday although there were two Amish families looking around on Friday morning. Also, there was little to no bargaining on prices. I understand that dealers are there to make money but the buying public also has only some much to spend. To me, April is the better show if it should unfortunately have to come down to being held once a year. October prices are higher because it is the start of the Christmas buying season.
Another point about last week's show is that it followed a pattern that hasn't happened in a few years since the ED changed the show's schedule. For years, on average late Sept./ early October has the Fall Carlisle Car Show, followed by the Hershey Car Show leading into Columbus Day weekend, and the Fall ED show would then be the following (3rd) weekend. A few years back, the ED pushed the fall show back a week. People, particularly those with campers, would spend the better part of the three weeks in Central PA and attend all three shows. I use to attend all three at once time and see familiar faces at each event. This year, the calender cycled around so that the three shows followed each other on the three subsequent weekends. One would have expected at least some members to do this again.
If the ED wants to put the HO and N scale in Yellow, why not try it and see if it works. Yellow was a challenge to navigate and carry packages when it was crowded. Both gauges are a crowd that York doesn't seem to draw very well.
Well, my guess is that if it ever comes down to just one York Meet per year, the October Meet would likely be the winner. I cannot imagine April taking the prize due to the time of year--spring weather and tax time among them. I believe the April 2019 event will be a good one for gauging this. But I don't have a crystal ball, so am cotent to sit back and watch, and to continue to see how others feel, and why.
Nobody in the ED has even mentioned once a year. Who is making this up, and why? The meet is not going to once a year period.
There is only one other four letter word that gets more attention and whining than the word, York.
eddie g posted:Nobody in the ED has even mentioned once a year. Who is making this up, and why? The meet is not going to once a year period.
Just like it was not going to allow cameras and not open to the public? It may not go to once a year in the short term, but never say never.
PA Anthracite posted:"October usually has good bit bigger crowd".......not last week, at least not in Orange Hall. A good judge of the crowd is how far vehicles are parked out from Orange Hall on Friday mornings around the 9 a.m. opening. On good years, the parking has approached the west gate off Highland Ave., both on the pavement and the grass. Last week, vehicles weren't even halfway to the gate. People keep posting about how big the crowd was....I didn't see it that way. I didn't see a lot of the general public in Orange Hall on either Thursday or Friday although there were two Amish families looking around on Friday morning. Also, there was little to no bargaining on prices. I understand that dealers are there to make money but the buying public also has only some much to spend. To me, April is the better show if it should unfortunately have to come down to being held once a year. October prices are higher because it is the start of the Christmas buying season.
Another point about last week's show is that it followed a pattern that hasn't happened in a few years since the ED changed the show's schedule. For years, on average late Sept./ early October has the Fall Carlisle Car Show, followed by the Hershey Car Show leading into Columbus Day weekend, and the Fall ED show would then be the following (3rd) weekend. A few years back, the ED pushed the fall show back a week. People, particularly those with campers, would spend the better part of the three weeks in Central PA and attend all three shows. I use to attend all three at once time and see familiar faces at each event. This year, the calender cycled around so that the three shows followed each other on the three subsequent weekends. One would have expected at least some members to do this again.
If the ED wants to put the HO and N scale in Yellow, why not try it and see if it works. Yellow was a challenge to navigate and carry packages when it was crowded. Both gauges are a crowd that York doesn't seem to draw very well.
Thursday the cars were pretty close to the gate,more people were parking out by the side this year asphalt.
I like looking at cycles to try and predict things. Let's say the postwar years were a booming time for trains. Then the beginning of the modern era, the 70's into the 80's things took a dive. And I'm not dissing General Mills or MPC. But plastic steam engines and plastic wheels on freight cars was a low for starter sets, especially for Lionel. Things started to pick up with the Kughn years and then MTH burst onto the scene and started what I believe to be the platinum age of toy trains. Competition drove Lionel to get their quality back up while MTH pumped out engines and rolling stock never before made. Never before had an operator had so much to choose from from so many different brands...Lionel, MTH, Atlas, K-Line, Williams, 3rd Rail, etc. Not to mention all the off shoots associated with building and operating a layout. I'm guessing most of us bought trains like they would dissappear tomorrow. Way more than we could use or need. Standard gauge died because spaces got smaller and trains adapted accordingly. Postwar died as slot cars, space travel and other things occupied young kids. Modern era gave way to Platinum. Each time things went high and then low and then high. Now phones and video games and computers occupy most kids in an endless onslaught of information and connectivity. We have held up the hobby as long as we could. It may be on the down slope. Hopefully it will come around again and a new train age will be born. Enjoy what you have and have fun. BigRail
eddie g posted:Nobody in the ED has even mentioned once a year. Who is making this up, and why? The meet is not going to once a year period.
I’ve been reading all these posts, and I still don’t understand why anyone would want to cut it to once a year. I know I don’t have the York pedigree many of you do, but dang, I would never want to have LESS train show time!
Scrambler81 posted:I’ve been reading all these posts, and I still don’t understand why anyone would want to cut it to once a year. I know I don’t have the York pedigree many of you do, but dang, I would never want to have LESS train show time!
Depends, I suppose, on whether you are looking at things from a business perspective (manufacturer, distributor, after-market supplier, dealer, seller) or from a consumer perspective (TCA member, general public, etc.).
Scrambler81 posted:eddie g posted:Nobody in the ED has even mentioned once a year. Who is making this up, and why? The meet is not going to once a year period.
I’ve been reading all these posts, and I still don’t understand why anyone would want to cut it to once a year. I know I don’t have the York pedigree many of you do, but dang, I would never want to have LESS train show time!
The Eastern Division's contract with the Fairgrounds is up next year. Prices have been steadily going up. Income has been going down. They may not be able to afford more than one show a year.
BTW you won't hear this from an ED member because no one knows how all this will play out yet.
Pete
I don't care what anyone says, I'm still going to York. Once a year or twice a year, manufacturers or no manufacturers, one hall or eight...it matters not to me. Getting worked up over speculation is pointless. All we know at this time is:
1) Lionel isn't coming in April
2) The contract for the use of the fairgrounds is up for renewal after next year
-Greg
One other thing we know for sure is no more senior discount.
Pete
Rumors are always a fact of life. Some true and some false. If York goes down to one show per year so be it. Let us face the fact that we are all getting older and a lot of us have way more then we can actually use on our layouts at one time. There are no records we have access to on how each manufacturer did for the year. Costs for everyone keep going up, buying market could be going down. So down the road some critical decisions will have to be address coming down to expenses, if manufaturers would still do two shows a year, if opening up to the public increases the attendance substantially and the cost of leasing the fair grounds. For me I will take each day as it comes pertaining to trains and York and just enjoy the moment........................Paul
Heard from a reliable (eastern division leader) that Yellow Hall will reopen as a dealer hall, and 'HO Only'. TCA is changing.
Also, Lionel said they would not display in the Spring of next year. (and that they too are moving back into HO)
Jim
I can tell you JIM from a more reliable person nothing a been finalized about the yellow hall.
Good to know that "retired people . . . have more money to spend. . . ." I'm not so sure that is necessarily true anymore, if it ever was. But aside from that, a good number of retired people who have been in the hobby for a reasonably long time have pretty much already acquired most or all of the trains they have sought or can use or even house. Many have already recognized the finite limits of our time on this planet, and determined that it is to their advantage to enjoy and make use of what they have rather than see relatives give it all away a couple of weeks after the hobbyist is planted.
Allan,
The above statement is very true to me these days. I have bought enough trains in the past 30 years that I do NOT need anymore. I have enough to run and to enjoy. Besides, being a retiree, I need to make the $ last and buying a $1700 engine these days makes no sense as the end of the paragraph is quite true as well.
I can't begin to tell you how many folks I talk to who tell me they come to York now almost exclusively for the social experience it provides, and how many tell me they are cutting back to one time a year simply because it is becoming cost prohibitive due to increased real-world expenses such as health care costs and a myriad of other things that are not matched by increases in pensions or Social Security.
Allan,
York has become a social event for me. I enjoy going twice a year to see my friends from around the country and oh yeah... I might buy a train, etc.... I missed this past York (1st time in 26 years) due to illness (shingles) and not the ones that the yellow hall needs. I missed all my friends. Did I need to see Lionel with their new offerings? No. I f they are not attending in April, it is purely a financial decision. York is a HUGE O gauge show. You never know what you will find there.
P.S. Rich Melvin, I hear ED will let you park the motorhome next to the yellow hall so you can be the first one in at noon on Thursday.
I am bringing this discussion back. ED TCA seems to be putting folks who recently registered in the Yellow Hall. I don't know anything about the current status of that hall as most comments from 3 years ago seem to indicate it is less than desirable. Has anything changed with the ambience of this hall? My son, a recent TCA member is being offered two tables in Yellow. I already have two tables in Red so it looks like we would be quite far apart.
Thanks,
LionelFlyer
@lionelflyer posted:I am bringing this discussion back. ED TCA seems to be putting folks who recently registered in the Yellow Hall. I don't know anything about the current status of that hall as most comments from 3 years ago seem to indicate it is less than desirable. Has anything changed with the ambience of this hall? My son, a recent TCA member is being offered two tables in Yellow. I already have two tables in Red so it looks like we would be quite far apart.
Thanks,
LionelFlyer
The Yellow Hall was "interesting" but I had no problems with it.
I'm thrilled that it is being re-added to the event, and that it will be a full 3 day event (Thursday - Saturday), especially after reading/hearing all of the carping that the event is shrinking and halls are being eliminated.
I must say I agree with a lot of Allan Miller’s comments. I read in different places that the hobby is in the decline and probably so. I haven’t missed the Yellow Hall not beginning there, it wasn’t an easy place to shop. Now as far as changing to the 1 show a year, that’s a good idea. I’ve been there for the 2 shows and over the past 25 years find the October show the better and more attended show. With the costs of everything going up Manufacturers and private dealers are finding it harder to fund the expenses it takes in coming twice a year. The Friday and Saturday are good for everyone involved and would cut back on expenses. If TCA would change the hours up a little and make Saturday a 9-3 Day instead of 1pm close it would help for those who are now rushed to get through the show that day. Maybe it is time for the Eastern Division Leadership to take a good hard look at this best of all Train shows and not so much what has been, but what the future looks like for the hobby and to adjust it to meet those expectations.
@Lionelski posted:The Yellow Hall was "interesting" but I had no problems with it.
I'm thrilled that it is being re-added to the event, and that it will be a full 3 day event (Thursday - Saturday), especially after reading/hearing all of the carping that the event is shrinking and halls are being eliminated.
Fyi... It's not due to an increase in vendors. This is directly from the ED TCA releases on their website and Facebook page. I'm not mentioning the reason here so as not to risk the thread going down the path of discussing a prohibited topic. You can read for yourself directly from the source.
-Greg
@poconotrain posted:......... Now as far as changing to the 1 show a year, that’s a good idea.......
I strongly disagree - please no.
Many people, including myself, look forward to this event every 6 months - the hunt, learning experiences, friend gatherings, etc
@rtraincollector posted:Why? Twice a year is a great thing, and why October? I know more who go in the spring than go in October. I grew up in that area, and weather wise April is normally better than October. I feel the way they have it now is actually the best. the only thing I might change is maybe longer hours for Saturday but that would have to be a test thing for a few shows to see if it drew enough to see if it made it worth it. I also say don't make it mandatory during the test period for sellers to stay past noon as it is now, until you see if it works. If it does then you can consider that.
FYI, the October York Meet numbers have always been higher than the April York Meet numbers for as long as I have been in the TCA. I joined in 2002.
Pat
@poconotrain posted:I must say I agree with a lot of Allan Miller’s comments. I read in different places that the hobby is in the decline and probably so. I haven’t missed the Yellow Hall not beginning there, it wasn’t an easy place to shop. Now as far as changing to the 1 show a year, that’s a good idea. I’ve been there for the 2 shows and over the past 25 years find the October show the better and more attended show. With the costs of everything going up Manufacturers and private dealers are finding it harder to fund the expenses it takes in coming twice a year. The Friday and Saturday are good for everyone involved and would cut back on expenses. If TCA would change the hours up a little and make Saturday a 9-3 Day instead of 1pm close it would help for those who are now rushed to get through the show that day. Maybe it is time for the Eastern Division Leadership to take a good hard look at this best of all Train shows and not so much what has been, but what the future looks like for the hobby and to adjust it to meet those expectations.
While I have not seen any official announcement, the Eastern Division calendar now indicates that there will be both April and October York Meets through 2024 and all will be the traditional three-day Meets - Thursday, Friday and Saturday.
Pat
"I'm not mentioning the reason here so as not to risk the thread going down the path of discussing a prohibited topic. "
I'm not good at tip-toeing, and the reason doesn't seem to be controversial to me. The management is ensuring (not "assuring" as they like to say) that there will be enough room between tables to keep us all safe. If safety is a prohibited topic, maybe this isn't a good hobby site for me.
I only have fond memories of the Yellow Hall......bring it on!!!!!!
Peter
Oh? This sounds interesting. I see why I missed this post. Way back in 2018 it is from. Hopefully I can add fond memories too Peter.
I remember the problems in this hall when it was raining, hopefully it has been fixed.
I have zero fond memories of this hall. Damp, hot, and stanky.
@MartyE posted:I have zero fond memories of this hall. Damp, hot, and stanky.
You forgot dark.
@MartyE posted:I have zero fond memories of this hall. Damp, hot, and stanky.
This is true, but I have fond memories of the things I bought in that dark, musty building!
Announced the Yellow hall is for TCA museum display. No open house York week at museum. It was announced in TCA newsletter just issued.
From the TCA newsletter:
"The Train Collectors Association will have several tables in the Yellow Hall (located under the grandstands with other vendors) to sell excess National Toy Train Museum and National Toy Train Library items. There will be something for everyone, so stop on by. The TCA area will be open Tuesday and Wednesday, October 19th and 20th from Noon to 5:00, Thursday, October 21st from Noon to 6:30, Friday, October 22nd from 9:00 to 6:30 and Saturday, October 23rd from 9:00 to 3:00. Please take the time to stop by and pick up some unique items to support your TCA Museum and Library."
Andy
Not to be a pessimist, but the way things seem to be going on a national basis, I would not count 100% on there even being an October York. I sure do hope I am wrong, but COVID "stuff" does not seem to be heading in the right direction at the present time. We shall see! And PLEASE, do not post ANY political comments here or I will delete this thread faster than you (or I) can count to 10.
@dk122trains posted:Announced the Yellow hall is for TCA museum display. No open house York week at museum. It was announced in TCA newsletter just issued.
@Andy Hummell posted:From the TCA newsletter:
"The Train Collectors Association will have several tables in the Yellow Hall (located under the grandstands with other vendors) to sell excess National Toy Train Museum and National Toy Train Library items. There will be something for everyone, so stop on by. The TCA area will be open Tuesday and Wednesday, October 19th and 20th from Noon to 5:00, Thursday, October 21st from Noon to 6:30, Friday, October 22nd from 9:00 to 6:30 and Saturday, October 23rd from 9:00 to 3:00. Please take the time to stop by and pick up some unique items to support your TCA Museum and Library."
Andy
Thanks Don and Andy - I was curious about the museum's plans this year.
-Greg
@Allan Miller posted:Not to be a pessimist, but the way things seem to be going on a national basis, I would not count 100% on there even being an October York. I sure do hope I am wrong, but COVID "stuff" does not seem to be heading in the right direction at the present time. We shall see! And PLEASE, do not post ANY political comments here or I will delete this thread faster than you (or I) can count to 10.
Im glad someone said it...and I totally agree.
@Allan Miller posted:Not to be a pessimist, but the way things seem to be going on a national basis, I would not count 100% on there even being an October York. I sure do hope I am wrong, but COVID "stuff" does not seem to be heading in the right direction at the present time. We shall see! And PLEASE, do not post ANY political comments here or I will delete this thread faster than you (or I) can count to 10.
Maybe but I'm still planning as if it will go on. We can't live in a bubble forever.
Back to the yellow hall, the only thing I can remember even being close to enjoyable is the smell of MTH smoke fluid. Not sure why but that always was about the only thing I remember enjoying. Maybe it's because it masked all the other odors. LOL!
@Allan Miller posted:Not to be a pessimist, but the way things seem to be going on a national basis, I would not count 100% on there even being an October York. I sure do hope I am wrong, but COVID "stuff" does not seem to be heading in the right direction at the present time. We shall see! And PLEASE, do not post ANY political comments here or I will delete this thread faster than you (or I) can count to 10.
Well, I am not going to worry about it since I can't control what the PA government or the ED decide to do. If they have it I will be there. If not I will save my York money for April 2022 or whenever there is another York. The first time that York was cancelled last year I was very disappointed that it got cancelled but with each cancellation after that I got more and more used to the idea of no York. If they cancel this one it won't even phase me.
I for one am looking forward to walking through the Yellow Hall again. That hall was open when I first started going to York. Maybe the years have colored my memories but I don't remember it being dirty or musty. I remember it being very crowded with a lot of excitement in the air as was all the Yorks I attended in those early years (2001 to 2007). Even if it is all HO I will definitely enjoy walking through the Yellow Hall again.
" I don't remember it being dirty or musty. I remember it being very crowded with a lot of excitement in the air as was all the Yorks"
My memories of this hall are the same as Phil's. I also remember it to be long with aisles (two?) that zig-zagged through it's length. Closed food booths, etc. along the walls and in the center at one point, vendor tables in front of them. Is was not very well lit.
I'm looking forward to hunting there again - the more halls the better (even if it is just to make space for wider aisles in the other halls)
@Allan Miller posted:Not to be a pessimist, but the way things seem to be going on a national basis, I would not count 100% on there even being an October York. I sure do hope I am wrong, but COVID "stuff" does not seem to be heading in the right direction at the present time. We shall see! And PLEASE, do not post ANY political comments here or I will delete this thread faster than you (or I) can count to 10.
Funny, I said the same thing about a week ago. Said I hoped there would be a York but watching the national news, I was wondering. Nothing Political. My post got deleted. That said.........I really hope there will be a York.
Does anyone have an idea of when the last time that the show was held in the yellow hall? I remember being in that hall and remember it being shoulder to shoulder. I remember MTH being inside there with the repair tent set up outside. I believe it closed when the Orange hall opened. I seem to remember late 90's but cant pinpoint the last time it was used.
I believe the last time the ED used the Yellow Hall was in 2004.
I confirmed last night that my son has two tables in the Yellow Hall while I have two tables in Red. Hopefully we can co-ordinate in the future so all of our tables are together. It seems like there is quite a bit of distance between the Red and Yellow halls. Luckily we both have our significant others traveling with us to help with the table coverage.
My only problem with my son is he is a miscreant and in to "N" Gauge. Kids are such a disappointment sometimes (just kidding).
What's not to like about the Yellow Hall? Wall to wall trains and happy, smiling people energized by the atmosphere of all the choices! Lots of great people to visit and chat with....Myron & his daughter Barbara; Fred Dole and his wife; Jim Barrett; Lou Caponi and more......if it was dank and musty, I never noticed......
Peter
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