Is there a diagram showing how to use two insulated track sections to control a Lionel number 153 block signal?
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My understanding is that you can operate it with insulated track sections, but without a relay you might end up with situations where it displays both red and green at the same time.
Bill N posted:My understanding is that you can operate it with insulated track sections, but without a relay you might end up with situations where it displays both red and green at the same time.
Yep. I use a relay to activate my 153 signal via insulated track sections. Works great.
Here's a diagram showing how a 153 is used with an AC relay and an insulated rail.
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graz posted:Here's a diagram showing how a 153 is used with an AC relay and an insulated rail.
Graz,
Where do you get you relays? Back years ago, I used Radio Shack relays with rectifiers. Of course, I have not tried to buy relays there in a very long time. I would like to install some new 153's but I need a new source.
Thanks
The relay I use is from here:
http://www.azatrax.com/track-power-relay.html
Admittedly, there are plenty of other suitable ones out there. I just happened to have one of these on hand and used it for my 153 block signal. Works perfectly! Very smooth transition from green-red-green.
Here's the AC "ice cube" relay that I've been using. I pair them up with the plug-in base that is available to simplify wiring connections.
https://www.automationdirect.c...,_plug-in,_3a_-_15a_(78x-z-_qxx-z-h78x_series)/general_purpose,_15a_(781_-z-_782_-z-_783_-z-_784_series)/782-2c-12a
I'd get a relay with a time delay to eliminate any chattering/flickering due to intermittent wheel contact caused by dirty wheels.
graz posted:...
https://www.automationdirect.c...,_plug-in,_3a_-_15a_(78x-z-_qxx-z-h78x_series)/general_purpose,_15a_(781_-z-_782_-z-_783_-z-_784_series)/782-2c-12a
Your link to the automation direct site doesn't work. In any case, I believe you're referring to this relay and socket.
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If you don't mind some DIY wiring (though no soldering required), this recent OGR post shows how to cobble together the AC relay function using 2 eBay modules for less than $4 (free shipping from Asia).
The thread discusses a variety of other methods.
Here is how to do it w/o relays or modules as posted in 2011.
lionelsoni posted:...There is a simple way to operate a signal from a control rail (an insulated outside rail), which I have described a number of times on the forum, using only an extra incandescent lamp:
Connect the green lamp's terminal to the layout common, that is, the outside rails generally. Connect the red lamp's terminal to the supply, whether the center rail or a separate accessory supply. Connect the signal's common (the terminal connected to both lamps) to the control rail. Then connect an extra lamp in parallel with the red lamp, that is, effectively between the supply and the control rail. The extra lamp should have the same voltage rating as the signal lamps but draw twice the current. When the signal lamps are number 52s or 53s, as they often are or could be, a number 57 is ideal as the extra lamp. An alternative is to use two extra lamps in parallel, of the same type as in the signal.
A couple of years ago, I was surprised to come across almost the same idea in an old book I was reading. [Raymond F. Yates, Making and Operating Model Railroads, D. Appleton-Century, New York, 1943] It was attributed to Albert C. Kalmbach, the founder of the very company that sponsors this web site. The difference was that he used an ordinary resistor in place of the extra lamp. However, lamps work much better in this circuit.
The extra incandescent method yields more joy if the 153 does NOT have the resistor in the base. 
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@ADCX Rob posted:Here is how to do it w/o relays or modules as posted in 2011.
Worked great for me. No need for a relay.
Have used the Lionel infrared controls with much success.
Bill, I have used those as well, have a few on my layout, they do work well. The above is just another option that costs around $1.00
@ADCX Rob posted:Here is how to do it w/o relays or modules as posted in 2011.
H'm! How well would that work with those 12v bayonet socket LED bulbs?
Mitch
On my old 70s layout I attached another relay to the stop (red) side to shut down the block to the rear of the train to hold a second train until the the signal showed Clear (green) . About a six foot insulated section beginning at the signal did the job. A second signal wired in parallel with the first was placed at the beginning of the shut downed block where the second train would be stopped. (Only have two colors to work with). We ran two nice long trains on the line (about 50 ft. in length) at the same time, adjusting the number of cars until the two trains were about even in timing, but with enough overlap so that viewers cold see the trains stop and proceed on signal indication. Of course both trains were locked in forward. Visitors were delighted to see trains move and clear on signal. Fun and easy to do. Those old Lionel pamphlets about operating trains had a whole lot of great tips for interesting running.
@M. Mitchell Marmel posted:H'm! How well would that work with those 12v bayonet socket LED bulbs?
Mitch
It could probably be worked into this scheme.
There was an article in a train magazine how to use the 153 with Atlas snap relays. Posting the article would be a copyright violation.
@ADCX Rob posted:Bob Nelson explains how the resistance in the circuit affects the performance, so LEDs can be used, in parallel with the bulbs, but you still need to use the bulbs as well, hiding them under the layout, eg.
I s'pose one could light a trackside structure or something.
Even then, because the one bulb never actually shuts off, an LED will probably remain "on" when you expect it to be off.
It sounds sort of like how Minitoys did "directional" lighting on their trolleycars. Each bulb is wired to one of the brushes. When the motor is going one way, the bulb is getting power directly from the track. When the motor goes the other way, that same bulb is getting power after it's been through the motor; this reduces voltage to the bulb and dims it. Quite clever, really.
Mitch
