I read an interesting article in a late 90's back issue of Trains magazine that described electronic controlled braking equipment. ATSF installed the necessary interfaces on top of the existing pneumatic equipment in a double stack trainset, and tested it on the trans-con. The engineers instantly loved it.
My question is: did this technology take hold and increase? When I pulled the pin 33 years ago, the "new deal" was train handling using only the dynamics. The engineers instantly hated that.
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..When I pulled the pin 33 years ago, the "new deal" was train handling using only the dynamics. The engineers instantly hated that...
I have never understood the aversion to using air.
Stretch braking is a necessity in certain situations, but it is becoming a lost art.
Every once in a great while, I will run into a railroader. When they find out that I was in train service, they usually ask me if I know how to run a train. My standard reply, when appropriate, is "sure...put it in run 8 and straight-air the pi** out of it". That always gets acceptance and a good laugh.
Lately all I do is stretch brake. Coal trains around 100 cars mind you. I know it's going to catch up with me. The railroad I work for has always practiced, "dynamic first" as a means of stopping. I love doing it and when I work with an old-head conductor I usually get the response of, "That's the way we used to run trains", with a smile. Just a matter of time..............but it's fun and changes it up a little.
Oh, and by the way. We have ECP trains, (electric brake), and they stop on a dime! I had one a few weeks ago and we were running on an approach. Supervisor was riding with us and he had never been on an ECP train. We were coming around to the yardboard so I decided to see how fast it would stop just for fun. I applied the brake when we went by the approach and we stopped in about 900 feet! We were traveling at 25 MPH. I'd say that's pretty good stopping distance with about 13000 tons of coal. Knocked the brake off and pulled on around to the signal. It was impressive.
Do I crowd signals with these trains? No I don't. I still operate as if I have a regular train that has the standard brakes.
Were you going up hill? I still don't understand exactly what an Electric brake is ? Are the cars different than a car with an ABD brake ?
I'm old school. Dynamic brakes came shortly after I retired although there was the Odd geep /7/9?? with that capability.
I still don't understand exactly what an Electric brake is ? Are the cars different than a car with an ABD brake ?
Yes, the cars are different. To be technically correct when referring to "electric Brakes", it is actually a combination of air powered brake cylinders which are actuated by a train lined or radio electronic signal, i.e. "Electro-Pneumatic Brakes". Thus every single car in the train set has its brake cylinder apply braking AT THE SAME TIME! Just the way passenger commuter trains and Amtrak trains operate.
What is so interesting in all this "new technology" is, quite a number of railroads had EP Brakes in the late 1930s and early 1940s! For example, the Southern Pacific Daylight passenger trains had EP braking with the GS-4 class steam locomotives, delivered in 1941.
I'm old school. Dynamic brakes came shortly after I retired although there was the Odd geep /7/9?? with that capability.
Thanks for the explanation HotWater. I suppose having the brakes apply at exactly the same time is a good thing. Faster braking and perhaps less slack action. How about the release, I don't think there would be much difference. You can only pump them off so fast .
Interesting..what's next... Satellite control of the train?
There is a lot to tell about ECP, but the most significant feature is that the brakes are actuated by an electronic command instead of a reduction on the trainline...that is earthshaking good news for braking on a long downhill run (like Cajon).
I am still wondering what percentage of unit trains (or the US car fleet) have ECP capability.
When I see Distributed Power becoming commonplace, and the success of ECP in train handling, it makes me think that some of our forsaken "Holy Grounds" like the Raton Line, Tennessee Pass and Saluda will become practical and more easy to utilize.
Just wishing out loud.
I still don't understand exactly what an Electric brake is ? Are the cars different than a car with an ABD brake ?
Yes, the cars are different. To be technically correct when referring to "electric Brakes", it is actually a combination of air powered brake cylinders which are actuated by a train lined or radio electronic signal, i.e. "Electro-Pneumatic Brakes". Thus every single car in the train set has its brake cylinder apply braking AT THE SAME TIME! Just the way passenger commuter trains and Amtrak trains operate.
What is so interesting in all this "new technology" is, quite a number of railroads had EP Brakes in the late 1930s and early 1940s! For example, the Southern Pacific Daylight passenger trains had EP braking with the GS-4 class steam locomotives, delivered in 1941.
I'm old school. Dynamic brakes came shortly after I retired although there was the Odd geep /7/9?? with that capability.
Heck, the U-12 Universal Valves have a third "face" on the front of them for mounting an Electric Portion. These are 100 years old.
..When I pulled the pin 33 years ago, the "new deal" was train handling using only the dynamics. The engineers instantly hated that...
I have never understood the aversion to using air.
Stretch braking is a necessity in certain situations, but it is becoming a lost art.
On the Ex PRR lines when I hired back in 1979 about all they did was stretch or Power brake. It was all about giving the conductor a smooth ride in the caboose. If he could set a Pepsi on the table and it stay there the entire trip he had a good hogger running the train. I found that with experience you could brake faster and release the brakes faster under power keeping the train stretched than you could taking the time to bunch the train slow it down then stretch the slack back out before getting back under power. What would take a mile to slow down from 50mph to 40mph using the dynamic brake you could do in half a mile stretch braking. It doesn't seem like much but when running the Conrail Single Track Buffalo Line usually the train that was making the better time held the main while the opposing slower train took the siding. This could save you as much a 3 hours returning from Enola back to Clearfield.
Conrail tested an Electronic Brake Train. The guys that got to run it loved it coming down over Horseshoe curve. My understanding was you could graduate the brake on and off like a passenger train. If you got a little to much brake on you could graduate a couple of pounds of air back off as opposed to having to drag the train down the mountain. It is way to dangerous and against the rule to make a running release on the mountain. The one time I had the train the Electronic brake system was cut out. If there was one or more cars that had a defective Electronic brake management just cut out the entire system as opposed to training the crews to cutout that one car using the computer. I never felt that they wanted it to succeed.
Great reply from Wyoming Hogger. I was hoping to get good responses from train service people, and see if the technology is here to stay.
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