@SouthCoastRocco posted:I'm alternating between the current question and trying to be positive, not negative.
Just go with the flow . . . 
There was a couple hours of time-delay here. I was starting to feel stranded....
@endless tracks posted:There was a couple hours of time-delay here. I was starting to feel stranded....
Don't fret, ET, we've got you plugged in! No extension needed . . . 
Maybe time for a shunt trip here.....winding is shorted
Ohm......I Tesla that reading all these puns Faraday is starting to Hertz.
It's shocking, but I've exceeded my capacitance and it has induced me to lose all resistance.
@MainLine Steam posted:Ohm......I Tesla that reading all these puns Faraday is starting to Hertz.
It's shocking but I've lost all resistance.
I guess we're all just a bunch of wire nuts.....
Geez. You guys need a hobby. 
Yes, if in-phase
On more serious note...ponder the lone primary lead going pole to pole in a Great Plains setting, finally reaching a transformer where something like 4160V is converted to 230VAC, with a neutral, just from that HV lead feeding one side of the transformer primary, and the other side fed via the ground rod driven next to the pole.
Go back to the old telegraph along the RR with just one wire on the pole.
Most people are shocked when they find out I'm not an electrician.
@CALNNC posted:On more serious note...ponder the lone primary lead going pole to pole in a Great Plains setting, finally reaching a transformer where something like 4160V is converted to 230VAC, with a neutral, just from that HV lead feeding one side of the transformer primary, and the other side fed via the ground rod driven next to the pole.
The original question raised was:
"Yesterday I was asked what on the surface seems like a little harmless question: what is the purpose of a return/ground wire on a layout? Answering "To complete the circuit" was not an acceptable answer but the only one that I had. The person said "Power goes out and does it's job, what needs "returned"?"
So, I'm asking you here: what is a SIMPLE, DOWN TO EARTH non-theoretical answer to that question."
I assume you know the answer to the question you asked people to "ponder", but for those that may not, please read this.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...le-wire_earth_return
In my original post, I mentioned that less conductive materials, can be used at the cost of efficiency. Also this will NOT work for 20VAC on our layout (the wood table top is not conductive enough).
So...I gotta say that posts like yours only serve to "shake the confidence" in good solid answers that have already been given and "muddy the issue".
@MainLine Steam posted:BTW for those that may not know, current is what kills people not voltage, but it sure can "sting".
My 12v boat battery has 800 CCA, but i can carry it around with my thumbs wrapped around each post. Can't feel a thing.
@CALNNC posted:On more serious note...ponder the lone primary lead going pole to pole in a Great Plains setting, finally reaching a transformer where something like 4160V is converted to 230VAC, with a neutral, just from that HV lead feeding one side of the transformer primary, and the other side fed via the ground rod driven next to the pole.
@MainLine Steam posted:I assume you know the answer to the question you asked people to "ponder", but for those that may not, please read this.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...le-wire_earth_return
In my original post, I mentioned that less conductive materials, can be used at the cost of efficiency. Also this will NOT work for 20VAC on our layout (the wood table top is not conductive enough).
CALNNC, not withstanding the slightly off-topic deviation, of which I was severely guilty of with puns, I found your post to be most curious. I read it about 3 times and then, in the wee hours, tried to find something to further explain what I was to "ponder". Perhaps I should also be tarred and feathered for adding, with help from others, about 20 lines to this post.
Jim,
I fully understand your points and am not debating them. There's always something to learn on this forum, even the many times I read things that have little to do with my railroad but generally peak my curiosity. That's why I click on topics like this. Yes, threads sometimes get clouded with answers (or puns) that go well beyond the pale, or are over-answered, but I earnestly hope that through the many answers here that the original poster got his question answered.
Having said that, I am very grateful for the link you included. It was very **en-lightening**and further explained to me some of the mysteries of how things work. I highly encourage all to read that article!!! I no longer have to ponder and go back to my project of the day. I never saw a number sticker that said "I'd rather be sheet rocking", but alas, onward I go....LOL
@Jim Teeple posted:Go back to the old telegraph along the RR with just one wire on the pole.
Please see the link below.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...between%20two,ground)%20to%20complete%20the%20circuit.
@MainLine Steam posted:Please see the link below.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...between%20two,ground)%20to%20complete%20the%20circuit.
Another interesting read, Thanks for posting!!!
Bob
@CALNNC posted:On more serious note...ponder the lone primary lead going pole to pole in a Great Plains setting, finally reaching a transformer where something like 4160V is converted to 230VAC, with a neutral, just from that HV lead feeding one side of the transformer primary, and the other side fed via the ground rod driven next to the pole.
And this is where transmission lines come in. Look up “single wire earth return” for more info.
@rplst8 posted:And this is where transmission lines come in. Look up “single wire earth return” for more info.
rplst8, if you scroll up a few frames, @mainline steam had provided two links (in separate frames). One explains the one-wire for power and the other explains the one-wire telegraph. Great articles....
Ah, I missed those other replies. That said, the fundamental principle at work here is a transmission line, which no one had mentioned.
