How's your new ToT working out for you?

Mine is fine! I've gotta admit though, I always get butterflies when unwrapping new equipment that has literally traveled thousands of miles to get to my hands for fear of some of the issues you are describing. I believe 3rd Rail's packing is to be commended given the adverse circumstances in shipping.

No issues here. Everything appears to be in very good order.

For those of you who have just received this passenger set, what is remarkable is the overall appearance. The blue color is striking and it just draws your attention. It is unlike any other passenger train we own, in a very good way.

So far so good.  It has made it out of the boxes and onto a shelf near where it will be on display.  The shelf just fits its length!  Wow!

 It came tied up with a bow, literally.

 The only damage may have been done when I pulled a protective sheath around these antenna off, but I was oh so careful.  I will try to fix it tomorrow.

Y'all know what I found interesting?

On the $100,000 model created for GM, the cars were made 2x the length of the locomotive, making them each 10' long! I was struck by the idea that the loco and/or the cars were "super stretched " to give the impression the train was flying by, not to mention larger than life!

Obviously, the engine is not exactly half the length of the cars, but the model still reflects that original intention of creating a long, beautiful, elegant train.

Just finished unpacking with no issues either. To reiterate Brian's comment, the color is amazing. The fine pictures posted fall short of capturing it's magical hue. The overall effect is true confection.

"This post was also placed on another thread before I saw this one"

I have only opened the engine so far but mine has a pretty big wear mark in the paint in the front under one of the cab windows.  With the way they packed it, I know it didn't come from the shipping but likely happened at the factory.  It wouldn't be so bad if it were somewhere else but it's right where your eyes are going to look so it's annoying.

And I agree with the wires in some of the windows.  Share what you find and any possible solutions.

But overall, like others, am very happy so far.  I need to dig into the cars next.

My ToT arrived on Tuesday but I haven't yet had a chance to open the boxes.  Hope to unpack my set tomorrow.

I'll probably take my set out of the box, check it out and return it to boxes, as my current layout has O-63 curves including an S-curve.

It gives me more incentive to rebuild the layout (moving to O-72 and O-80 curves and straightening out the s-curve), as I current can't run 3 out of my 4 passenger sets!

Jim

Actually, I've been sitting here tonight for a while looking at mine, and thinking about my reaction.

I like it a lot and I know it is prototypically to scale.

But I would prefer it with 18" cars.  I've just grown accustomed to that siz, and after all these years that size looks best to me.  

I know it didn't have one, but I wish it had a B unit.  

This is my first Sunset engine with the belt drive/drive shaft system.  I finally got my E7 on the tracks and I was surprised it pulled the ToT consist, as the engine is light and the cars are heavy.  Must be the 12 wheel drive!  Very glad there was a bag of parts included.  The tiniest screw in the bag saved the day!  The truck bolsters are held onto the side frames with 2 of these screws on each side.  I wondered why one of my roller pickups was contacting a gearbox when depressed.  I soon noticed one screw was missing and the other 3 were holding on by a thread.  The assembler must of got called away and missed finishing the truck.

Is there a way to shut off the MARS light via Cab-2?  Probably somewhere in the instructions

Rich 

Hey Rich,

Just a quick observation...it was so refreshing to see your post and the attitude of "this is an easy fix" for a couple of minor problems. Granted we all want perfection out of the box, but the rants about things easily fixed get old.

Paul

I would contact Scott.  They may have another shell to swap with yours.

Rich, this is my first Sunset/3rd Rail product too.  I have only looked at the locomotive, so far.  It is absolutely gorgeous.  I have yet to run it, but mine is in perfect shape appearance wise.  So glad that 3rd Rail stepped up and offered this piece of railroad history for us O gaugers.

I understand you had a part in convincing them for this gorgeous train, and for that, a big THANK YOU KEITH!  I'll bet I have 12 hours on it and still can't bring myself to take it off the mainline!

Rich

Here are a couple of other tidbits of information on the E7, confirmed by Sunset.  It is routine for the smoke unit to shut down once it gets to a certain temp when you have it switched to "TMCC".  It will turn on again once it cools down.  Mine was shutting down every ten minutes or so.  You have to experiment and find the lowest voltage where it will just start to produce smoke for optimum run time.  I haven't found it- yet.

The MARS light can't be shut off to have just the headlight.  You can shut off both, but not one or the other.

These aren't complaints, just sharing info as I get it in case others are curious!

Rich 

"a big THANK YOU KEITH"

You are so correct SSL. If it were not for Keith's persistence, this project more than likely would not have happened. We have become good friends and a value his efforts in our hobby, he is one of the most creative people I know.

Of course, Scott Mann was the hub that made this work. A big thank you to him for making this fabulous train available to those of us who purchased it.

I've now had mine on the rails. Fortunately not a bit of shipping damage in evidence. 

I agree with comments about the flasher used for the Mars light and the little people. I've posted elsewhere about changing out the flasher circuit for an Ngineering Mars light simulator, which will make you want the Mars light feature on whenever the engine is moving! I haven't had time to open up the engine to check whether the stock circuit is the same as my other 3rd Rail E7s but I imagine it is. This is a relatively easy fix. I might tackle the passengers another time IF I can find (or make) figures representing the streamliner era that actually fit.

But neither the stock Mars light effect nor the stock passengers detract from the overall impression created by the set, which is nothing short of superb. I'd single out the paint (which has a great gloss finish like the original as seen in in contemporary photos and film) and the dome lighting. I had a small part in helping Scott with the decision about how the GM sets should be painted and the result exceeds even my high expectations.

Like others I think a tribute is due to Keith and Scott for seeing that this project got done and for my part I'm more than happy give it.

Regarding the smoke, this is probably the only engine I have that I will run without it. I've serviced the smoke units on my 3rd Rail Texas Special E7s and the metal piping (for want of a better word) used to provide smoke output to the multiple exhaust ports is delicate. I'm not convinced that you can get a proper refill of smoke fluid to the smoke unit without taking the body shell off and opening the unit itself. Lionel E7s have a somewhat more robust plastic system but the effect is about the same. I can live without it.

I have run mine with smoke enough that I have definately burned up whatever fliud was in it when it was shipped.  i filled the unit and it took a bit to begin again but it did as well as out of the box.  I like to run with smoke on this puppy.

Still waiting here in Murrysville,PA.  Today's ice storm stopped delivery.  My friend Bart,Daylight here,got his set last week and he lives a couple of miles down the road from me.

Maybe tomorrow.

Norm

Actually you can. just use the small cup that was in the parts package and fill each hole with 5 to 7 drops of fluid.  Pick up the engine with one hand under the pilot and the other on the rear of the engine and rock it left and right for a minute or so.  This will help the fluid down into the chamber (can't spell resivour) and distribute it evenly.  It may also help to blow into each of the 8 openings to break up any bubbles that may have formed.

Turned on the track to 18 volts and each of the smoke unit began to smoke.

Also I'm surprised that no asked the question regarding the two blue plastic parts that came in the bag ( maybe everyone knew what they were).  They are brake hoses that go on the rear on the engine but I don't see how they can be attached.

Jon,

  You should bring them to Elliott's layout!

Question regarding the diesel sound.

I expected the rpm (sound) to "ramp up" once the engine was in motion.

This is not the case.  Is it possible that E-7's don't do this?

The rpm sound was just a constant sound regardless of speed.

Also I find the sound volume to be very low compared to other engines with "rail sounds", even with the "pot" turned fully clock wise and tried the cab one feature on the remote to increase the volume but it did not raise the volume at all.

Can anyone comment?

Thank you

I'm glad everyone is enjoying this set. It certainly is a gorgeous one.

The diesel RPMs on mine work as you'd expect. Try ramping them up manually with the CAB (AUX 1, buttons 3 and 6) and then do a soft reset (AUX 1, button 0) to see if that resets the rpm. It should work as expected straight out of the box but sometimes you have to play around with the controls. I have noticed with another 3rd Rail E-7 that the RPMs sometimes need a reset.

As I understand it new 3rd Rail E-7s use ERR Railsounds boards (I'm talking about the 3-rail models of course), which are pretty reliable.

Yes, the sound is lower/softer than you might expect. The stock 3rd Rail speaker, located toward the front of the engine, is a large rectangular one and does not have an enclosure/baffle over it, unlike the Legacy versions of these engines. I have substituted a Lionel Fat Boy speaker and enclosure for the stock speaker in a couple of 3rd Rail engines. There was great improvement with a steam engine but not so much with the diesel. I think that there may be a system volume limitation in the ERR Railsounds board but you can always check this with Scott himself or Ken at ERR.

Thank you for the info; I will give that a try.

I probably should have added a couple more points:

1.  A full reset might be needed if the RPMs still don't work automatically; this is described on page 5 of the E7 manual and is the basic TMCC reset procedure.

2.  You've already noticed that the manual is a little, er, generic and not specific to the T of T. Thus there may be stray references to features/parts that aren't actually relevant to the T of T. In case of doubt apply to Scott Mann or post on this forum.

I'll second that the diesel sounds on my engine do ramp up/down as the speed increases/decreases, actually quite smoothly.  I have noticed with TMCC, this feature doesn't always work consistently.  I get ample volume with my Cab-2 and whatever the volume pot was set at as delivered.

IMHO, with this engine, shell removal isn't the easiest job.  There are 3 different sized screws involved, and the fuel tank piece can be stubborn to re install.  It takes some work aligning the piece between the trucks and side panels.  One of the fuel tank screw tabs extends further toward the rear truck so the piece is properly oriented.  Care needs to be taken not to scar the truck details in dealing with tight working room between the truck, screw head, and drive shaft.  I scratched a little paint from the truck and touched it up with a little Conrail Blue which is not a perfect match, but way more subtle than shiny silver!

I hope someone can figure out a close matching paint for touch-up work

Regarding the MU hoses, I'm not sure what I will end up doing.  There are two pegs to fasten these to the engine, but no corresponding holes exist on the engine.  I'll take a closer look in the ToT book.

Thanks for responding to this thread.  We can help each other on whatever "quirks" we experience

Rich 

Okay, the MARS light is driving me nuts!  Understand I have been running this train a lot, perhaps a minimum of an hour every evening.  The light is cool, but the fact it is a bright bluish LED, it distracts from any other trains running on the layout.  It's screaming "I'm here-I'm here-I'm here-I'm here", you get the picture.  The only available option is shutting off both the headlight and MARS light, which really isn't an option.  Can anyone suggest the least invasive alternative, either electronics or perhaps a simple switch underneath?  I don't want to just shut it off completely (disconnect).

I can't believe how nicely this train runs.  Smooth as silk, wonder if the belt drive has anything to do with that?  I have Lionel and MTH engines that are pretty smooth, but I can practically set my watch to the ToT!

Another thing that keeps this train on the mainline, are the acoustics of those 21" cars! They produce a sweet sounding "clickity-clack" over my Atlas nickel like no other!

Other than the MARS light (which is probably a personal problem) no problems to report. It just keeps getting better!

Rich

Why not just cover the lens?  Try a piece of Scotch matte finish tape that you trip to fit over just the lens.

Jan

BTW: We are going to us Ngineering Mars Lights on our future diesels. Great little circuits, you should give them a try.

But, there is no TMCC functions for us to use to turn the Mars Light on and off. The only function provided bye ERR is the smoke unit ON and OFF. Maybe we should use a switch for that?

Scott Mann

I had the shell off mine because of a wire that was hanging right in the window on the engine.   So I routed it better to hide it.  All the smokestacks are connected to a central channel.  So no matter which one you put fluid in they all run down to the center of the channel and then a single pipe goes to the smoke unit.  The stacks and channel and pipe are made of brass.  Originally I put in the recommended number of drops, and it smoked for a while but then stopped and I could not get it to smoke again even after cool down.  I opened up the smoke unit and the wick was bone dry.  Even after I had put in like 15 drops.  I saturated the wick while it was open, then put it all back together and now, lots of smoke.  It takes a lot of fluid to saturate those wicks.  Interestingly the smoke unit and piping is all attached to the shell not the frame like most.  Honestly I think one of the issues with todays smoke fluids are they are too thick and a lot of what we put in never reaches the wick, it coats the walls of the stacks and channels before it even gets to the smoke unit.

I opened this thread because I didn't know what "ToT" meant, but I noticed that the

problems listed above with a few units are being met with calm and reason, even though

they seem to be the result of sloppy workmanship and packaging.

Had these been L or M pieces I'll hazard a guess that there would have been torches and

pitchforks in the street.

Huh.

You can bet that this problem will not be present on the upcoming F7 units.  Scott learns from these experiences and it's good that they were related here without drama.  The Asian builders are from a different culture and do business differently than Americans.  Sometimes it's not easy to predict what they might try to get by with.

Limited edition models are always going to be more likely to need a little adjustment in order to meet expectations, but, to Scott's credit, he does a good job of making sure quality is high.

I'm a little behind you guys!  I ordered one of the last remaining UP yellow in service sets from 3rd Rail last Monday.   

Though I have lots of UP passenger sets, including K-Line 21", I can't wait for my ToT to arrive Friday.  When it was announced, I wasn't overly excited about it because I model UP steam only.  However, after seeing all the photos by Austin Bill of his 'Moonglow" observation, I had to have this set.  

It's going to be a rare set in the future.  Glad I bought one. 

Scott, A switch is probably the best choice, that way conventional operators can turn it off as well.

ToT

     Oh, Thought you were talking artillery!

Gunny

Just got my ToT set Monday (been on a trip).  Took it out of the boxes and it looks great; no cosmetic defects noted.  Will run it soon.

If the Mars is too bright, is there a way to dim it using a resistor or something?

Here is a great story regarding Sunset's customer service.  I had a question on a vendor email address that Scott Mann responded with.  I called Sunset and spoke with Christopher, service tech, who has always been attentive and helpful.  Christopher said Scot was in China, but they had recently been texting, and said he would seek my answer and call me back.  Well he did, in short order, 20 minutes.  So I'm on the east coast, I call the west coast, who texts China, then returns my call to the east coast, within 20 minutes .  What an age we live in!

Jan: The matte tape might not be a bad idea, Thanks!

Gunny: Judging by your nickname and artillery reference, sounds like you may have handled explosives.  Just curious, what does ToT mean in your world?

Ron: Don't worry too much about the mars light, my personal problem with the light is almost "tongue-in-cheek" humor because it is such a nice set.  I have a pretty small layout so the train passes before me quite often!  Most people probably wouldn't even notice it.

The ngineering.com site is very interesting, but above my knowledge of electronics.  If a person like Gunrunner John checked out the site, he may understand the components and I'll ship the engine to him to modify- hint, hint!

86TA355SR: Wise move you won't regret! One more day!

Rich