Lionel Reading LionChief 0-6-0T '2332010' showed up today out of the blue. Will open it up tonight.
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They're great little locomotives. I love the heck out of mine. They pack some pulling power too considering their size.
My Lehigh Valley Coal and New Haven showed up today as well. Look sharp, especially with the black smokebox of the Lehigh.
The Lehigh runs clean, the New Haven seems to have the same catch from oversized side rods that the previous run of LC+2.0 ones did. I'll be ordering the side rods from the conventional ones to fix it, that worked well on my previous LC+2.0 one.
I love mine as well. I really like the electro couplers as I switched to an operating layout from loop running.
My performs good with no issues. Paint is crisp and bright. The only negative comment is check your side rod screws, 2 of mine were loose.
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How's the sound when they get moving? The first run sounded fine until you got moving, then the chuff sound went all wonky! I changed mine from 4/chuffs to 2/chuffs just so it would run as fast as I would run it and still keep the sound.
I really like mine. I got the first LC+ 2.0 run for $225. New ones are a little pricey but nice locomotives. The chuffing sounded like a machine gun at a normal medium speed. @BillYo414 and @gunrunnerjohn did a really nice simple modification that made a huge difference. I did it and it was a huge upgrade! I assume the newer ones have the same issue with the smaller wheels so you guys with the newer model may want to check it out. Just do a search or they may just leave a link here. Great simple mod. Makes me want to go get mine back out with a set of ore cars.
Brad
The chuffing was fine at moderate speed, did not run it fast. But the mod link would be nice to have just incase.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:How's the sound when they get moving? The first run sounded fine until you got moving, then the chuff sound went all wonky! I changed mine from 4/chuffs to 2/chuffs just so it would run as fast as I would run it and still keep the sound.
I only had a short 40" test track, so I was only testing slow speed; I'll see about setting up a bigger loop this weekend. (my layout construction has stalled)
As low speed they sound fine, it's when you move at anything but yard switching speed that the sound suddenly goes completely wonky. Obviously, reducing the chuff rate from 4 to 2 doubled the allowable speed before the sounds crash.
At the start of this video you can hear what happens at speed. Note that this one has the 2-chuff mod, so the sound breakup happened at half that speed before the mod.
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I was NOT going to buy another engine, but mine is in route to me as I type.
Ron
I had no plans on purchasing another locomotive this year other than the Lehigh Valley model. I have a short section of whisker track which will be perfect for this engine. It should be arriving today.
Gene
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I have a lot of short whisker tracks that I park small stuff on. 
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@gunrunnerjohn posted:As low speed they sound fine, it's when you move at anything but yard switching speed that the sound suddenly goes completely wonky.
Yeah, I have one from the last run and recall that issue. I'll try to run them back to back and take a video to compare.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I have a lot of short whisker tracks that I park small stuff on.
That’s where I got the idea from while you were helping me with the electrical end of the turntable.
Gene
No sense in wasting the space, right? 
This is still one of my favorite runners. Got one in the first run (the nice looking Brooklyn Terminal livery). As noted, the pricing on these then was fantastic. Almost pulled the trigger on another from the latest batch but passed.
Maybe keep my eyes out for a future deal. 
@PSM posted:Yeah, I have one from the last run and recall that issue. I'll try to run them back to back and take a video to compare.
I can't imagine the new one will have a different chuff rate. It's just a very small switcher that's designed to run at slow speeds. It is proto typical at 4 chuffs per revolution but the wheel diameter is tiny. It just sounds so much better at 2 chuffs per revolution. One thing I like about the MTH DCS system running MTH trains you can set the chuff rate to whatever you want.
Brad
@johnstrains posted:This is still one of my favorite runners. Got one in the first run (the nice looking Brooklyn Terminal livery). As noted, the pricing on these then was fantastic. Almost pulled the trigger on another from the latest batch but passed.
Not sure what first run you're speaking of, but I have one from the very first run, a conventional Santa Fe. I also have a LC+ Rio Grande from the previous LC run. The LC Rio Grande has been problematic -been disappointing. The electrocouplers have been a problem. Even ordered new parts from Lionel. Finally got the rear one working, gave up on the front one. I also replaced the side rods, but it still doesn't run as smoothly as the older conventional Santa Fe. That one is one beautiful running sweetheart!
@B rad posted:I can't imagine the new one will have a different chuff rate. It's just a very small switcher that's designed to run at slow speeds. It is proto typical at 4 chuffs per revolution but the wheel diameter is tiny. It just sounds so much better at 2 chuffs per revolution. One thing I like about the MTH DCS system running MTH trains you can set the chuff rate to whatever you want.
Brad
Its definitely still 4 chuffs per rev, I think the question is did they find a way to clean up the audio so it doesn't become completely muddled at normal operating speeds. Obviously at high speeds there's not really anything they can do, but the previous LC+2.0 run did get messy at fairly normal speeds.
You can run other steamers at breakneck speeds, it's true the chuffs blend in together, but with the 0-6-0T they just go nuts. It's clear that they just got lost in the audio generation at a certain point.
@breezinup posted:Not sure what first run you're speaking of, but I have one from the very first run, a conventional Santa Fe. I also have a LC+ Rio Grande from the previous LC run. The LC Rio Grande has been problematic -been disappointing. The electrocouplers have been a problem. Even ordered new parts from Lionel. Finally got the rear one working, gave up on the front one. I also replaced the side rods, but it still doesn't run as smoothly as the older conventional Santa Fe. That one is one beautiful running sweetheart!
Right, should clarify.
Mine is from the Lion Chief Plus 2.0 group that was released several years ago.
No problems with couplers or otherwise. And these smoke like a champ!
My two LC+ 2.0 0-6-0T engines from the 2000 catalog run fine. My only "fix" was to reduce the chuff rate to 2 instead of 4 so they didn't get wonky sound at even a moderate speed.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:How's the sound when they get moving? The first run sounded fine until you got moving, then the chuff sound went all wonky! I changed mine from 4/chuffs to 2/chuffs just so it would run as fast as I would run it and still keep the sound.
John is this something you can do through the remote control? Or does it involve soldering a jumper to the board, etc.? I encountered a LC+ 2.0 Pacific that sounds lousy at anything above slow speed. I was disappointed because the original LC+ (with two chuffs) had decent sound over a wide usable speed range. Please advise, thanks.
@Ted S posted:John is this something you can do through the remote control? Or does it involve soldering a jumper to the board, etc.? I encountered a LC+ 2.0 Pacific that sounds lousy at anything above slow speed. I was disappointed because the original LC+ (with two chuffs) had decent sound over a wide usable speed range. Please advise, thanks.
It's actually a mechanical mod. Here's a link to my simplified method of changing from 4 chuffs to 2 chuffs.
Lionel 0-6-0 Docksider LC+2.0 Chuff Rate Reduction
The LC+ 2.0 Pacific doesn't have a bottom plate, the axles are captive in the chassis. 
The next time it's in my hands, I'll have to take the boiler shell off, and see if it has "prongs." If not I guess they are deriving the chuff signal from the tach. Supposedly LC+ 2.0 was a step forward, with "Legacy-like" speed steps and features. Really disappointed in how garbled the chuff becomes at anything more than slow speed.
@Ted S posted:The LC+ 2.0 Pacific doesn't have a bottom plate, the axles are captive in the chassis.
Based on the topic, I thought we were talking about the 0-6-0T, that's a totally different deal. The chuffs are generated internally and there's no changing those. The back-EMF LC+ 2.0 board doesn't have that ability, so they have an external chuff switch or encoder.
My Lehigh Valley came in a couple days ago. After a quick check and a little lube, it runs great. It’s my first Lionchief Plus 2.0, and for the price, I’m quite happy with it. Smokes better than a couple of my Legacy units.
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Looks like the box got wet!
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@gunrunnerjohn posted:Looks like the box got wet!
It does look like it but it must have been a reflection from the plastic bag. No bag here.
Gene
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@Genemed posted:Smokes better than a couple of my Legacy units.
They do quite a job of smoking, that's for sure.
@breezinup posted:........ I have one from the very first run, a conventional Santa Fe. I also have a LC+ Rio Grande from the previous LC run. The LC Rio Grande has been problematic -been disappointing. The electrocouplers have been a problem. Even ordered new parts from Lionel. Finally got the rear one working, gave up on the front one. I also replaced the side rods, but it still doesn't run as smoothly as the older conventional Santa Fe. That one is one beautiful running sweetheart!
@gunrunnerjohn posted:My two LC+ 2.0 0-6-0T engines from the 2000 catalog run fine. My only "fix" was to reduce the chuff rate to 2 instead of 4 so they didn't get wonky sound at even a moderate speed.
My LC+ DRGW from 2000 runs OK, too, but it's not as smooth as the original run conventional Santa Fe sewing machine I have. You'd mentioned a couple years ago re: the 2000 batch:
"I bought the side rods for the old conventional model for my two Docksiders, they improved the running. They not the smoothest running locomotives, but they run a lot smoother with less slop in the rods."
My DRGW would also qualify as "not the smoothest running locomotive," I guess, although it's certainly acceptable. I'd be curious if the latest batch has improved any. I'm surprised they didn't correct the side rod issue.
I own two of the 0-6-0Ts'. One is conventional (USS) and one is the LC 2.0 (Pennsylvania). They are both fine little engines. The LC 2.0 runs great through my TMCC-DCS system. Here's the rub! I find the whistle to be hideous on both engines. Short back story: My Father was a charging foreman at US Steel's Edgar Thomson works. When the company went to diesel on the open hearth they simply pushed the old steamers into the furnace. Dad climbed up on the last steamer and removed the whistle. I still have it. Does the buzz instead of a whistle drive anyone else up the wall? Comments please.
John
Mine from the 2020 first run of the LC+ 2.0 have a decent whistle for a locomotive that cost me $200 new.
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@gunrunnerjohn posted:Mine from the 2020 first run of the LC+ 2.0 have a decent whistle for a locomotive that cost me $200 new.
I have the same one as well as the same road name. I paid $225. I do think it's a great engine especially for the price. Not sure I would pay the price for the new one though.
Brad
@B rad posted:I have the same one as well as the same road name. I paid $225. I do think it's a great engine especially for the price. Not sure I would pay the price for the new one though.
When they went to over $300, they're nice, but not the bargain they were in the first run. I bought two of them from the 2020 run, the PRR and the Bethlehem Steel.
Has anyone found a parts list and diagram for these latest versions of the 0-6-0T engines???
Ron
I have to believe they're the same as the 2020 run, they sure look and run the same. However, there are no parts listings for those either.
GRJ
I just played the whistle video. Yours sounds exactly like a small steam whistle. (within reason) So, I put the USS on my test track and tried again; still the same buzz. Then a saw the light bulb (brain metaphor) and took my hearing aids off, thinking the high pitch was feeding back. Yes, I'm older than you. Still no luck. You are right. For the price, I will just have to learn to live with it. But for me it was never the price, it was the fact that I own the D--- whistle. I rarely post on the forum but I'm on most everyday. I have learned a lot from you!! Favorite quote: "Who talks like that?". Then the next place I went was a thread on electricity. You were so far over my head I felt I had landed in a parallel universe and I realized; GRJ talks like that!! Thank you for your time AND knowledge.
John
Just left Trainland with the Reading model in tow. 😁😁
Can't wait to get it on the rails later. 👍👍
Bob
I bought a 2020 version but it had problems with derailing on Atlas O-54 turnouts until I re-gauged the wheels. I run it conventionally but still don't think it runs well, especially at slow speeds. Watching it run provides a good example of "dynamic augment," the vertical pounding effect due to dynamic imbalance (and mechanical sloppiness) of the rotating/reciprocating machinery. As a New Haven fan I considered buying the latest version but decided against it due to my experience and also due to price.
MELGAR
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I have to believe they're the same as the 2020 run, they sure look and run the same. However, there are no parts listings for those either.
Shoot like to get another engineer figure to personalize. Then know for Sure how to get to the cab to exchange the figures.
Ron
If memory serves me right, @PRRronbh, the cabs are tight on these. I don't think the figures even have legs. Getting to them isn't too hard though.
@PRRronbh posted:Shoot like to get another engineer figure to personalize. Then know for Sure how to get to the cab to exchange the figures.
When you take the shell off, the whole center of the cab is a big cavity, you just reach in and can easily access the figures.
@PRRronbh posted:Shoot like to get another engineer figure to personalize. Then know for Sure how to get to the cab to exchange the figures.
Ron
I just had mine open today (tried to 3D scan them with my phone - failed). There are 4 screws that hold the shell on. Two in the rear, on the exterior of the locomotive. Two in the front, behind the coupler on either side of the leading pickup roller. It may take some effort to pop the shell off, and there are 4 hand rails in the front to watch out for when removing/reinstalling the shell - two down to the front, two down to the cylinders.
There are two plugs between the shell and the board - one large for lighting and one small for the handrail antennas. Make sure they are fully seated before you reinstall the shell.
@MELGAR posted:I bought a 2020 version but it had problems with derailing on Atlas O-54 turnouts until I re-gauged the wheels. I run it conventionally but still don't think it runs well, especially at slow speeds. Watching it run provides a good example of "dynamic augment," the vertical pounding effect due to dynamic imbalance (and mechanical sloppiness) of the rotating/reciprocating machinery.
Melgar it sounds like one or more of its driving wheels are "out of quarter." The crankpins on opposite sides of each set of driving wheels have to be at EXACTLY the same angle relative to each other, otherwise you end up with the behavior you describe.
If you removed the wheels from the axles to re-gauge them, they might have gotten out of quarter (easy to do when you remove wheels from axle), or perhaps it came that way from the factory. The good news is, since these locos have a "bottom plate," for a modest cost you can order three new wheelsets from Lionel and replace them yourself. That should definitively address any issues with gauging and quartering. Heck, for the cost of shipping I would order a set of side rods as well and compare them to what's on there. Experiment, swap things around until it smooths out.
I wish it were always this easy. With the majority of locos in 3-rail O, you would be looking at buying a whole new chassis!
@Ted S posted:Melgar it sounds like one or more of its driving wheels are "out of quarter."
If you removed the wheels from the axles to re-gauge them, they might have gotten out of quarter.
The wheels/axles/rods are not out-of-quarter. I did not remove the wheels to adjust the gauge - just applied distributed pressure to the outer faces of the wheels to reduce the gauge.
Two photos show phasing of the rods and driving wheels. In forward motion, the left (fireman’s) side driving wheels lead the right (engineer’s) side driving wheels by exactly 90 degrees. In a real locomotive, the right side would lead by 90 degrees, so the model is incorrect in that sense, but it has no effect on the model’s operation.
The rod assemblies seem to have very wide tolerances. Not the best thing for smooth operation.
MELGAR
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@PRRronbh, a Lionel P/N is cs-6208530055-p. I did a search for dockside on Lionel's website, then looked up the parts for Reading Docksider 6-28613 and found this engineer figure. The figure is most likely the same
John, PSM and ZEKE thanks for the replies. Today I going to see a lady 10-years my senior she in a admitted living/ rehab center. After breaking her foot had to be moved into a rehab which in this case is also an assisted living. A few weeks ago she fell and broke a Femur. I want to get up there every week so she dose not feel forgotten!
One point seeing your info am concerned work on this small engine because I have BIG paws!
Ron
@MELGAR posted:The rod assemblies seem to have very wide tolerances. Not the best thing for smooth operation.
I replaced the rods on both of mine with the old conventional model's rods, problem solved.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I replaced the rods on both of mine with the old conventional model's rods, problem solved.
I did the same on my earlier LC+2.0 version, I agree it worked quite well.
Was this a random problem? Seems that some had a "wobble" issue while running but not all. I didn't notice any smooth operation issues the last time I ran mine that I recall. What P/N side rods do I need incase? Sorry if it was already posted here.
Brad
John and PSM I take it both of you have taken your 0-6-0T apart. Is the engineer figure attached to the frame casting or the Cab/Boiler casting?? If the frame casting is there enough slack in the two wires to reposition the two casting such that I could get to the engineer figure to repaint the cap, head and face wit grey bread and mustache and also part over the jacket in a lighter blue?
Ron
@PRRronbh posted:John and PSM I take it both of you have taken your 0-6-0T apart. Is the engineer figure attached to the frame casting or the Cab/Boiler casting?? If the frame casting is there enough slack in the two wires to reposition the two casting such that I could get to the engineer figure to repaint the cap, head and face wit grey bread and mustache and also part over the jacket in a lighter blue?
When you remove the shell, the figures sit on a shelf with a big hole in the middle. It should be easy to remove the figures for whatever painting adjustments you desire.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:When you remove the shell, the figures sit on a shelf with a big hole in the middle. It should be easy to remove the figures for whatever painting adjustments you desire.
John thanks for all the info>
Ron
So I have a 0-6-0 conventional Santa Fe. Would it be crazy to put a LC2.0 board and speaker in and convert it?
With the Lionel parts sale coming up it may be worth the investment.
Thoughts?
Cause I need more projects too....🤣🤣
Bob
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@RSJB18 posted:So I have a 0-6-0 conventional Santa Fe. Would it be crazy to put a LC2.0 board and speaker in and convert it?
With the Lionel parts sale coming up it may be worth the investment.
Thoughts?
Cause I need more projects too....🤣🤣
Bob
As an admitted techno-peasant, I can’t speak to the complexity of the conversion, but as a command control aficionado, I’d say it’s worth the upgrade (I have two of the LionChief + 2.0 versions - the BEDT and a New Haven). Look at the bright side… an upgrade will keep you off the streets and out of trouble
@RSJB18 posted:So I have a 0-6-0 conventional Santa Fe. Would it be crazy to put a LC2.0 board and speaker in and convert it?
With the Lionel parts sale coming up it may be worth the investment.
Given that the street price of the current versions is around $300 for the LC+ 2.0 versions, I'd just shop for one of those.
@Apples55 posted:As an admitted techno-peasant, I can’t speak to the complexity of the conversion, but as a command control aficionado, I’d say it’s worth the upgrade (I have two of the LionChief + 2.0 versions - the BEDT and a New Haven). Look at the bright side… an upgrade will keep you off the streets and out of trouble
The 0-6-0 has become my favorite engine. I was running both last night and had a brain fart......
The bodies and drive trains are same (the motor in the old one is different) so the non-techno-pesasant in me got to thinking....
@gunrunnerjohn- true. Like I said just a brain fart. Besides I have more than enough projects going as is.....
Bob
@RSJB18 posted:The 0-6-0 has become my favorite engine. I was running both last night and had a brain fart......
The bodies and drive trains are same (the motor in the old one is different) so the non-techno-pesasant in me got to thinking....
@gunrunnerjohn- true. Like I said just a brain fart. Besides I have more than enough projects going as is.....
Bob
I have both as well Bob. I got the older one used for $75 and bought the newer one used on the forum. I didn't like the smoke puffer on the older one, but it works much better after a modification I did.
If you want a few of the silicone o-rings I bought contact me using my profile and I'll mail you a few. I have too many.
John
I converted one of the original Docksiders to TMCC a long time ago, I've since sold it. One sticking point of upgrading the conventional one is giving it electrocouplers is a major PITA! I finally got a rear one fitted, but after that experience, I decided that a front coupler wasn't in the cards. Couplers, fan driven smoke, better sound, there's just too many things to upgrade for it to make sense to upgrade the conventional model, at least IMO.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I converted one of the original Docksiders to TMCC a long time ago, I've since sold it. One sticking point of upgrading the conventional one is giving it electrocouplers is a major PITA! I finally got a rear one fitted, but after that experience, I decided that a front coupler wasn't in the cards. Couplers, fan driven smoke, better sound, there's just too many things to upgrade for it to make sense to upgrade the conventional model, at least IMO.
the EC's would have been an issue.
I'll crawl back under my rock now.......
@RSJB18 posted:So I have a 0-6-0 conventional Santa Fe. Would it be crazy to put a LC2.0 board and speaker in and convert it?
With the Lionel parts sale coming up it may be worth the investment.
Thoughts?
Cause I need more projects too....🤣🤣
.....The 0-6-0 has become my favorite engine.....
Bob
I have that same Santa Fe conventional version (from the first production of the docksider). I've mentioned this before, but it runs like a sewing machine, whereas the Rio Grande LC+ docksider I got doesn't seem to run as smoothly. I changed the rods, too, to see if that would help, but it didn't seem to make a lot of difference. It's ok, but was a little disappointing considering how well the conventional Santa Fe runs.
@breezinup posted:I have that same Santa Fe conventional version (from the first production of the docksider). I've mentioned this before, but it runs like a sewing machine, whereas the Rio Grande LC+ docksider I got doesn't seem to run as smoothly. I changed the rods, too, to see if that would help, but it didn't seem to make a lot of difference. It's ok, but was a little disappointing considering how well the conventional Santa Fe runs.
Try putting the rods from the Santa Fe conventional model on the LC+ one.
@breezinup posted:I have that same Santa Fe conventional version (from the first production of the docksider). I've mentioned this before, but it runs like a sewing machine, whereas the Rio Grande LC+ docksider I got doesn't seem to run as smoothly. I changed the rods, too, to see if that would help, but it didn't seem to make a lot of difference. It's ok, but was a little disappointing considering how well the conventional Santa Fe runs.
Exactly why I mentioned an upgrade. It runs great, even after taking a swann dive to the floor after it got bitten by a shirt sleeve.....can't say I love the conventional whistle tho....🤣🤣
I have one of these little engines as well.....LC+2 Docksider.
I completed the modifications that John noted, namely fixing the chuff rate and changing the side rods.
There was a noticeable improvement however it does not run near as smooth as my Polar Express LC+2.
The first speed step is just okay, not smooth but second speed step is more acceptable.
Just the nature of this small engine. I have also watched many YouTube videos and noted that many did not run smooth at the first and sometimes second speed step.
Acceptable for the price.
@RSJB18 posted:can't say I love the conventional whistle tho....🤣🤣
Maybe it's just because I grew up with the conventional one, but I prefer it to the ones on the LC+2.0. I wish it was one of the 5 options.
@PSM posted:Maybe it's just because I grew up with the conventional one, but I prefer it to the ones on the LC+2.0. I wish it was one of the 5 options.
Here's what a real 0-6-0T sounds like, at least one example.
@breezinup posted:I changed the rods, too, to see if that would help, but it didn't seem to make a lot of difference. It's ok, but was a little disappointing considering how well the conventional Santa Fe runs.
Here's one of mine after I put the new rods on it. I didn't really expect much more given that this has the back-EMF LC+ 2.0 board, overall I'm pretty happy with it for $200. Important point, this does have cruise, do once it's moving it's pretty consistent in speed. The very low speed isn't great, but that's probably more the gear ratio and electronics.
It's also dragging my magnetic debris pickup car, the large magnet actually creates a lot of drag simply attracting it to the track.
"I didn't really expect much more given that this has the back-EMF LC+ 2.0 board, overall I'm pretty happy with it for $200. Important point, this does have cruise, do once it's moving it's pretty consistent in speed. The very low speed isn't great, but that's probably more the gear ratio and electronics."
For $200, but the current ones are $315 (cheapest street price). Your comments about possibly the back EMF board or gearing or electonics affecting the performance was interesting. Sounds kind of like the impression is that the performance is fine, although not outstanding, which is my view.
Here's a video of my conventional Santa Fe conventional "Swiss watch" taken in January. This isn't a demonstration of slow speed running, obviously, but it does do very well at slow speeds. My Rio Grande LC plus version gets use as well, although it's not as smooth a runner.
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Breezinup,
Your post shows why I always buy conventional. :-)
Mannyrock
"$315 (cheapest street price)"
Small difference but preorder from some places like Charles Ro was $299.
@Mannyrock posted:Your post shows why I always buy conventional. :-)
Is it that you always buy conventional, or always run what you buy in conventional?
There were several potential "issues" mentioned in that post. Which specifically are your reasons for sticking exclusively with conventional?
By extension then I assume, because of all manner of new-fangled remote control being found on all recent stuff, you avoid purchasing nearly everything produced within the last 30 years -- at all costs.
Mike
Hi Mike,
Lots of totally conventional stuff still being made, or available NIB at reasonable prices. I have learned that the best running ones have dual can motors, and flywheels. Williams in particular.
Lionchief 2.0 engines were supposed to happily run in conventional, and were so advertised. But lots of folks reported problems on this board in trying to do that.
So, I passed them by.
I know that lots of folks don't mind buying complicated things, and then constantly fiddling with them, adjusting them, modifying them, and tuning them, . . . but to me it is just a big headache, not fun at all.
So, I just stick with what works right out of the box. And if it doesn't, I send it back the next day.
Fortunately I have several other absorbing hobbies, plus my regular work, to keep me busy. :-)
Mannyrock
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Here's one of mine after I put the new rods on it. I didn't really expect much more given that this has the back-EMF LC+ 2.0 board, overall I'm pretty happy with it for $200. Important point, this does have cruise, do once it's moving it's pretty consistent in speed. The very low speed isn't great, but that's probably more the gear ratio and electronics.
It's also dragging my magnetic debris pickup car, the large magnet actually creates a lot of drag simply attracting it to the track.
John,
I thought you modified it to 2-chuffs instead of 4?
John
@Mannyrock posted:I know that lots of folks don't mind buying complicated things, and then constantly fiddling with them, adjusting them, modifying them, and tuning them, . . . but to me it is just a big headache, not fun at all.
I have minimal problem with most new stuff, although there are clinkers. Conventional stuff is not immune from issues as well. Also, I get all the latest wizzbang features with my command engines.
If you're happy with conventional running, there's no reason for us to try to talk you out of it. I ran conventional for years, and I vastly prefer command operation. All my conventional stuff is gone or converted to command.
@Craftech posted:John,
I thought you modified it to 2-chuffs instead of 4?
John
I did, that was a video before the mod. I did both of mine.
@Landsteiner posted:"$315 (cheapest street price)"
Small difference but preorder from some places like Charles Ro was $299.
That ship has sailed, of course. They're $315 at Ro presently. Even at $299, that's 33% more than what GRJ was basing part of his evaluation on.
In any case, I (and many others) don't preorder, but prefer a wait and see approach. There have been too many instances of the as-produced version being significantly different from the cataloged version, particularly involving paint variations. I suppose with primarily black engines, that risk is small, although sometimes other issues lurk.
Point taken about the current pricing. But there is this. Still the least expensive command equipped steam locomotive in three rail O gauge, I believe. And one has the choice of operating using TMCC/Legacy, Bluetooth via the app or the universal remote. So I think the value is there, even if not quite as much of a bargain as pre-pandemic. Or it can operate conventionally, obviously, although not with all the features available in command. Everything else has increased in price too, with rare exceptions. Toy trains have gone up quite a bit, almost without exception.
Here's a short video of slow speed of the current LionChief Plus 2.0 New Haven loco controlled by the Universal Remote.
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@Landsteiner posted:Point taken about the current pricing. But there is this. Still the least expensive command equipped steam locomotive in three rail O gauge, I believe. And one has the choice of operating using TMCC/Legacy, Bluetooth via the app or the universal remote. So I think the value is there, even if not quite as much of a bargain as pre-pandemic. Or it can operate conventionally, obviously, although not with all the features available in command. Everything else has increased in price too, with rare exceptions. Toy trains have gone up quite a bit, almost without exception.
Agree - they're still a very good deal. In fact, now checking with inflation, even getting one of these 3 years ago (and those weren't the +2 versions, either) for $200 wasn't as good a deal as what you can get one of them for today! This definitely changes the equation.
The main point, though, for me, is that the newer ones don't seem to run as well as the old conventional versions. Don't know why, and it's just my perception, and just from observing my particular two examples. Nonetheless, the new ones still run well, and certainly well enough to be a satisfying purchase. Big caveat, though: my Lionchief 0-6-0 model is a LC + version, not +2, so I don't know about those. I'd be curious to observe one of the +2 versions in action to see if there's any difference from the + version.
"for me, is that the newer ones don't seem to run as well as the old conventional versions."
If you haven't already, check out my video above and see if the problem is only in conventional mode. Seems pretty smooth at low speed in LionChief/Bluetooth mode. Haven't run it extensively by any means and perhaps the middle or high end is rougher.
My two run fine with TMCC, I have no complaints, especially for a $200 locomotive! Here's the pair MU'ed pulling some boxcars.
Just for a not entirely comparable comparison , this morning I received the following advert:
30-1871-1 East Broad Top 0-6-0 Imperial USRA Steam Switcher w/Proto-Sound 3.0
Cab No. 3
Pre-Order Price: $519.95 (plus freight)
Click HERE to order from Side Track Hobbies.
So for $200 more you get PS3.0 and a tender. Our toys aren't getting any cheaper, regardless.
@Landsteiner posted:Just for a not entirely comparable comparison
30-1871-1 East Broad Top 0-6-0 Imperial USRA Steam Switcher w/Proto-Sound 3.0
Cab No. 3
Pre-Order Price: $519.95 (plus freight)
Click HERE to order from Side Track Hobbies.So for $200 more you get PS3.0 and a tender. Our toys aren't getting any cheaper, regardless.
Trainworld has the same loco in LIRR for $499.00. Yea- not cheap by any means.
@Landsteiner posted:Here's a short video of slow speed of the current LionChief Plus 2.0 New Haven loco controlled by the Universal Remote.
The conventional Santa Fe, just on a text track, for comparison. It would have gone slower, but the basic $20 transformer I was using on the test track wouldn't throttle down any more before cutting power. Of course, not as slow as your New Haven LC +2 or my Rio Grande LC+, but slow enough for most uses. It certainly is a smooth runner throughout its range, though. (Also makes good smoke rings!)
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@Landsteiner posted:Here's a short video of slow speed of the current LionChief Plus 2.0 New Haven loco controlled by the Universal Remote.
Doesn't play.
John
@Landsteiner posted:Here's a short video of slow speed of the current LionChief Plus 2.0 New Haven loco controlled by the Universal Remote.
That video is broken, doesn't play for me either.
All videos work here for me 
Sorry for any inconvenience. Plays for me. I find that sometimes it takes a while for a video to load and work. A good long while, as in minutes.
Another potential issue is the video was made on an Apple device (iPhone), so it's probably Quicktime (.mov file), and I wonder if that gets fubared when played on some Windows machines? Beyond my knowledge and pay grade.
Short version is that employing the Universal Remote, the new 0-6-0T runs at very, very slow speed steadily and smoothly. Haven't tried it with TMCC or conventional yet.
@Landsteiner posted:Sorry for any inconvenience. Plays for me. I find that sometimes it takes a while for a video to load and work. A good long while, as in minutes.
Another potential issue is the video was made on an Apple device (iPhone), so it's probably Quicktime (.mov file), and I wonder if that gets fubared when played on some Windows machines? Beyond my knowledge and pay grade.
Short version is that employing the Universal Remote, the new 0-6-0T runs at very, very slow speed steadily and smoothly. Haven't tried it with TMCC or conventional yet.
The Santa Fe .mov plays fine, the New Haven .mov does not.
John
@Landsteiner posted:Sorry for any inconvenience. Plays for me. I find that sometimes it takes a while for a video to load and work. A good long while, as in minutes.
Another potential issue is the video was made on an Apple device (iPhone), so it's probably Quicktime (.mov file), and I wonder if that gets fubared when played on some Windows machines? Beyond my knowledge and pay grade.
Short version is that employing the Universal Remote, the new 0-6-0T runs at very, very slow speed steadily and smoothly. Haven't tried it with TMCC or conventional yet.
Hi it is 10:17 and still dose not play for me. Notice it show no time for the video.
And OH I am using an iMac 21"!
Ron
No clue as to why some are having difficulty, but might try viewing on an Apple device (iPhone, iPad, iMac)? Some weird incompatibility? Perhaps I should try to upload to You Tube and provide a link. Will try to do that perhaps this weekend. Apologies again to all who are experiencing frustration and wasting of their time.
@Landsteiner posted:No clue as to why some are having difficulty, but might try viewing on an Apple device (iPhone, iPad, iMac)? Some weird incompatibility? Perhaps I should try to upload to You Tube and provide a link. Will try to do that perhaps this weekend. Apologies again to all who are experiencing frustration and wasting of their time.
Like I said, it is only ONE of the two that has the issue. Both are .mov files
John
@Landsteiner posted:No clue as to why some are having difficulty, but might try viewing on an Apple device (iPhone, iPad, iMac)? Some weird incompatibility? Perhaps I should try to upload to You Tube and provide a link. Will try to do that perhaps this weekend. Apologies again to all who are experiencing frustration and wasting of their time.
That would be great if I actually had an Apple device. I can assure you that Windows works fine with all the other videos posted here.
It's moving so slowly it looks like it's standing still.
(Actually, it works fine on my PC.)
@gunrunnerjohn posted:That would be great if I actually had an Apple device.
@Landsteiner posted:No clue as to why some are having difficulty, but might try viewing on an Apple device (iPhone, iPad, iMac)? Some weird incompatibility? Perhaps I should try to upload to You Tube and provide a link. Will try to do that perhaps this weekend. Apologies again to all who are experiencing frustration and wasting of their time.
Doesn't work for me either on PC w/ firefox, or on my Galaxy 22.
Sometimes Chrome works when other browsers don't.
It's an issue with .mov format.
