I have been running this engines cousin, the 2-10-4 on 054 with no issues. The 2-10-4 and the 2900 Class 4-8-4 appear to share the same boiler casting.
I believe that the first and fourth axles on the 2-10-4 are flanged (it's been a while since I looked)-that might give the 2-10-4 a slightly shorter wheel base in the curves.
By the way, the MTH U.P. 4-12-2 will also operate comfortably on 054.
RAK posted:I have been running this engines cousin, the 2-10-4 on 054 with no issues. The 2-10-4 and the 2900 Class 4-8-4 appear to share the same boiler casting.
I believe that the first and fourth axles on the 2-10-4 are flanged (it's been a while since I looked)-that might give the 2-10-4 a slightly shorter wheel base in the curves.
By the way, the MTH U.P. 4-12-2 will also operate comfortably on 054.
Quite frankly I'm surprised that the 2-10-4 will go around an 054 curve. On the MTH model only the 1st and 5th set of drivers are flanged. I would assume that the overhang from the 2-10-4 on 054 has to be worse than the 2900 class. I'm curious if the 2-10-4 has more or less overhang than the 2900 class 4-8-4 on 054. If you get a chance could you measure the overhang, just for fun?
I measured my MTH Premier 4-8-4 Northern and 2-10-4 Texas type. The rigid wheelbase of the 4-8-4 model is about 5-1/4 inches (21-feet full scale). The rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 model about 6-1/2 inches (26 feet full scale). The length behind the rear driver on the 4-8-4 model is about 6 inches (24 feet full scale). The length behind the rear driver on the 2-10-4 model is about 5-3/4 inches (23 feet full scale). Since the rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 is longer and the length behind the rear driver is smaller than the 4-8-4, the rear cab overhang toward the outside of a curve is smaller on the 2-10-4. I did not measure on the layout.
MELGAR
MELGAR,
Thank you sir! I learned something there!
MELGAR posted:I measured my MTH Premier 4-8-4 Northern and 2-10-4 Texas type. The rigid wheelbase of the 4-8-4 model is about 5-1/4 inches (21-feet full scale). The rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 model about 6-1/2 inches (26 feet full scale). The length behind the rear driver on the 4-8-4 model is about 6 inches (24 feet full scale). The length behind the rear driver on the 2-10-4 model is about 5-3/4 inches (23 feet full scale). Since the rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 is longer and the length behind the rear driver is smaller than the 4-8-4, the rear cab overhang toward the outside of a curve is smaller on the 2-10-4. I did not measure on the layout.
MELGAR
That's just nuts. I never thought about it that way but it makes sense. If the 2-10-4 could go around a 054 curve then it would have less overhang.
I measured the overhang numbers you provided on my layout. Because the 2900 is slightly longer than a GS4 it overhangs about 1/16" more. So instead of having a 1/8" gap between rolling stock on the adjacent track like the GS4 does it would only have 1/16" of a gap or slightly less. Waaay to close for comfort. Someone want to measure the overhang of a Premier Santa Fe 2-10-4?
In all honesty I'm probably better off with another 3460 class Hudson.
If you want to run a Santa Fe steamer, I think the Hudson is the best choice on O-54.
Making measurements on the layout, taking pictures and writing the post kept me busy today... Thanks.
MELGAR
MELGAR posted:If you want to run a Santa Fe steamer, I think the Hudson is the best choice on O-54.
Making measurements on the layout, taking pictures and writing the post kept me busy today... Thanks.
MELGAR
Thanks for taking the measurements. At least I know that if I ever purchased a 2900 class it wouldn't work on the 054 sections of my layout.
I already have one Premier Santa Fe 3460 class Hudson, 3463. It runs great on 054 with not much overhang. So I could get one of the other non-streamlined road numbers (3461, 3462, 3464, 3465) or 3460, the Blue Goose. At least that way I'll know the locomotive will clear everything on my layout fine.
Excellent thread guys, great work conveying the overhang.
To add to the insanity apparently 3rd Rail's Chicago Great Western 2-10-4 is rated for 054 track: http://www.3rdrail.com/instock.html#ERIES4
So running a MTH Premier Santa Fe 2-10-4 on 054 like the above poster might not be such a feat after all.
I wonder what the overhang on that thing is...
Lou1985 posted:To add to the insanity apparently 3rd Rail's Chicago Great Western 2-10-4 is rated for 054 track: http://www.3rdrail.com/instock.html#ERIES4
So running a MTH Premier Santa Fe 2-10-4 on 054 like the above poster might not be such a feat after all.
I wonder what the overhang on that thing is...
I will make the same set of measurements on my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas type and report back.
MELGAR
MELGAR posted:Lou1985 posted:To add to the insanity apparently 3rd Rail's Chicago Great Western 2-10-4 is rated for 054 track: http://www.3rdrail.com/instock.html#ERIES4
So running a MTH Premier Santa Fe 2-10-4 on 054 like the above poster might not be such a feat after all.
I wonder what the overhang on that thing is...
I will make the same set of measurements on my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas type and report back.
MELGAR
Thanks. You've been very helpful.
This whole thread got far more technical than I thought. I should take measurements with my Premier SP GS4 Northern for comparison purposes.
Lou1985 posted:MELGAR posted:I will make the same set of measurements on my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas type and report back.
MELGAR
Thanks. You've been very helpful.
This whole thread got far more technical than I thought. I should take measurements with my Premier SP GS4 Northern for comparison purposes.
I can do that one too. Sometime next week.
MELGAR
MELGAR posted:Lou1985 posted:MELGAR posted:I will make the same set of measurements on my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas type and report back.
MELGAR
Thanks. You've been very helpful.
This whole thread got far more technical than I thought. I should take measurements with my Premier SP GS4 Northern for comparison purposes.
I can do that one too. Sometime next week.
MELGAR
I'll take some measurements from my Premier GS4 Northern Saturday as a comparison. I have Lionel tubular 054 curves, which may be slightly different than Atlas curves.
These photographs show my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas-type #5012 steam locomotive on Atlas O-54 curved track. I used a plastic triangle set against the side of the engine and a steel rule to measure the overhangs.
The 2-10-4 Texas-type cab overhang is 1-23/32 inches measured from the (outer edge of the) outside rail compared to 1-13/16 inches for the 4-8-4 Northern. Thus, the cab overhang of the 2-10-4 is 3/32 inches less than on the 4-8-4.
The 2-10-4 overhang at the pilot truck is 1-3/16 inches compared to 1-3/8 inches for the 4-8-4. Thus, the pilot overhang of the 2-10-4 is 3/16 inches less than on the 4-8-4
On the 2-10-4, the third driver is completely off the inner edge of the outer rail on the O-54 curve. This is consistent with the longer rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 compared to the 4-8-4.
It appears that the front and rear trucks have adequate range of motion for both models to operate on Atlas O-54 curved track.
Thus, based on cab and pilot overhang, it appears that the 2-10-4 has better turning performance than the 4-8-4 on Atlas O-54 curved track.
MELGAR
MELGAR posted:These photographs show my MTH Premier ATSF 2-10-4 Texas-type #5012 steam locomotive on Atlas O-54 curved track. I used a plastic triangle set against the side of the engine and a steel rule to measure the overhangs.
The 2-10-4 Texas-type cab overhang is 1-23/32 inches measured from the (outer edge of the) outside rail compared to 1-13/16 inches for the 4-8-4 Northern. Thus, the cab overhang of the 2-10-4 is 3/32 inches less than on the 4-8-4.
The 2-10-4 overhang at the pilot truck is 1-3/16 inches compared to 1-3/8 inches for the 4-8-4. Thus, the pilot overhang of the 2-10-4 is 3/16 inches less than on the 4-8-4
On the 2-10-4, the third driver is completely off the inner edge of the outer rail on the O-54 curve. This is consistent with the longer rigid wheelbase of the 2-10-4 compared to the 4-8-4.
It appears that the front and rear trucks have adequate range of motion for both models to operate on Atlas O-54 curved track.
Thus, based on cab and pilot overhang, it appears that the 2-10-4 has better turning performance than the 4-8-4 on Atlas O-54 curved track.
MELGAR
Thank you for the measurements. I'm quite surprised that the 2-10-4 actually has less overhang than the 4-8-4. Although the 2-10-4 has the wheels hanging off the inside of the curve on 054 it actually works. I'm quite surprised by that, and it gives me more options as far as equipment goes.
I measured my MTH Premier Southern Pacific GS4 Northern this morning on the Lionel 054 curves on my layout. I measured from the top of the rail head like you did. It has virtually identical measurements to the Santa Fe 2900 class Northern you have. Front overhang is 1-7/16", rear overhang is 1-13/16". When going around the 054 curve closest to a 072 curve on my layout there is 1/4" clearance between the rear cab of the GS4 and a 16" aluminum passenger car parked on the adjacent 072 curve. In that case the 2-10-4 would actually have more clearance than the Northern. But either a 2900 class Northern or a 2-10-4 should work anywhere on my layout, which is good to know.
@Lou1985 For future reference... how far apart are the center lines of the two curves? Although everyone's equipment may vary, this is a good thing to know for layout planning purposes. Thanks!
I don't know how much that information would help anyone else but me. The 054 loop inside of my 072 loop isn't even all the way around. For lack of a better term it juts out in two spots to clear the end of a yard, so it's not even all the way around, unlike the outer 072 loop.
Well as an update I ended up buying a MTH Premier Santa Fe 2-10-4 Texas. I got a great deal on a MIB PS2 3V version. I would have passed on it if I hadn't started this thread. It works great on both 072 and 054 tubular track. The inner drivers are off the curve on 054 but those areas are hidden on my layout, so it doesn't bother me.
Lou,
To the extent that I might have helped in your decision to purchase, I hope you enjoy the new model. I think MTH did an outstanding job on these.
MELGAR
MELGAR posted:Lou,
To the extent that I might have helped in your decision to purchase, I hope you enjoy the new model. I think MTH did an outstanding job on these.
MELGAR
You share much of the blame for this purchase 😉.
It's a very nice model and runs/smokes/sounds great. I do plan on painting the smokebox front gray at some point, as that seems to be an oversight on MTH's part.
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