People have way too much free time........

There are far worse things on youtube. At least this doesn't need to be investigated.

LMAO, look at the likes and the pages views.  That will tell you all you need to know.   Have you noticed , YOUTUBE now hides how many dislikes a video gets?

As someone who made one of these videos, yea these videos do get lots of views, that is why everyone makes one. Plus, it helps some of us pick up some spare change to preorder things.

Sorry guys, but YouTube for trains is pretty awesome.

@RJ I posted:

As someone who made one of these videos, yea these videos do get lots of views, that is why everyone makes one. Plus, it helps some of us pick up some spare change to preorder things.

RJ I watched yours.  It wasn't bad.  You explain your opinion a bit and it's not just page flipping.  You kept it moving along and well paced.  There are some that are literally just page turnings.  I found one that was over 3 hours long yesterday. 

I know some of these are specifically made for subscribers and I think that's a plus.  It's good to see young blood in the hobby.

Agreed.  You actually had content in your content.

Jon

I’ll admit I made one of these for the first time. I’m not sure how these got started, but it’s like a party now and everyone does them. I enjoy hearing thoughts from others in the YouTube community. But if it’s not for you, hit “not interested” and move on. The YouTube community is a huge aspect for the young blood in this hobby.

@EricTrainMan posted:

I’ll admit I made one of these for the first time. I’m not sure how these got started, but it’s like a party now and everyone does them. I enjoy hearing thoughts from others in the YouTube community. But if it’s not for you, hit “not interested” and move on. The YouTube community is a huge aspect for the young blood in this hobby.

Eric again yours was fine to watch.  I think Jon is referring to the ones that literally flip the page and that's it.  And again yours was well paced.  You guys are providing a service for your subscribers.

@MartyE posted:

RJ I watched yours.  It wasn't bad.  You explain your opinion a bit and it's not just page flipping.  You kept it moving along and well paced.  There are some that are literally just page turnings.  I found one that was over 3 hours long yesterday. 

I know some of these are specifically made for subscribers and I think that's a plus.  It's good to see young blood in the hobby.

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Agreed.  You actually had content in your content.

Jon

Thank you guys, means a lot!

I haven't watched RJ's yet.  I don't do these type of videos as others have it covered.  No one wants to hear me talk anyway.

@superwarp1 posted:

No one wants to hear me talk anyway.

You say something Gary?

Spam, Really? The videos are the exact same content as the postings on the "Lionel 2022 Volume 1 is up! Whatcha Getting?" page of this forum only in a different medium.

Youtube and folks the o-gauge creators are revolutionizing this hobby. Why try and stifle that? I don't get the hate. If you don't want to watch folks paging through the catalogs, don't click on it. They will go away with time, I promise. If you watched it and though it was crap, dislike it and/or offer constructive criticism in the comments. Maybe message the creator. What does complaining on here accomplish other than boosting your own ego?

If I am misinterpreting the overarching message here, let me know and I will apologize. But if I am not, @KOOLjock1 and others comes off a bit like bullies with this post.

In response to the initial query; I live streamed the catalog on my small channel as soon as it dropped as a way for folks to discuss what we were all seeing together. We had a discussion in the chat and it was a lot of fun. Other than that, my video was exactly what your describing. "Oh that's cool" move on.

The stream stayed up after I finished recording is getting views and presently sits a 100% likes.

Sheesh "Until you know who you are, you will always be vulnerable to what other people say".

In the meantime Tony. How about a "go fund me" for less fortunate / forumites /children that have limited funds to afford a train. Instead of a retired engineer more than financially able to buy his own?

I'll watch the ones from popular youtube channels who are knowledgeable with trains.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Sorry guys, but YouTube for trains is pretty awesome.

The community on Youtube is AWESOME! Very inspiring and it's the next best thing when you don't have any friends locally that are into it.

Some of the catalog videos are great because they provide a different perspective on products. I don't know the production history of products very well but a lot of the people in the videos and comments do. That can be helpful. Some are a narration of the catalog and I don't care for that.

I live alone. The dog doesn't have much to say. So sometimes these videos are just great background noise haha

@RickO

”When you resort to attacking the messenger and not the message, you have lost the debate.”

@Jdjones24

that is exactly the point. Watch the videos you enjoy. Don’t watch the videos you don’t enjoy.

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Like many of you, I peruse YouTube on a daily basis.  And like many of you, I've noticed a huge uptick in a strange kind of home-made video production: "Paging Through the New Lionel Catalog... the motion picture".  If you've never seen one of these, its just a guy shooting a video of him paging through the new catalog, while telling us what he sees there... the very same thing WE can see there by simply going to LIONEL.com.  Except WE can take the time to actually READ the descriptions on the items that we're interested, while skipping past the junk we don't care about.

On these videos of which I speak, the host basically says:  "here's a train and another train and another train... that's kinda cool..."

What's the point?  Do people actually watch these?

If they had insider information on tooling or tech or offered any insights at all that can't be gleaned from reading the catalog that's already posted for free at Lionel.com that would be one thing...

Jon

I think the uptick in YouTube videos demonstrates a shift in the hobby itself. Often we hear people say that the hobby is dying. Stores are closing and clubs closing their doors. While this may be true, many of us have found more connections with fellow modelers in the last 12 months through YouTube than in the previous 5 years through shaking hands at swap meets.

When I started my YouTube channel in 2017 mentioned in my first video that the purpose was to inspire and help others see get into the hobby. If it weren't for Eric's Trains I would not have been as motivated to have the layout and collection that I currently do. If it weren't for my channel I wouldn't have the network of friends to chat with, take and give advice from, and simply enjoy the hobby with.

Catalog season is always crazy. As Tony points out above, the forum here is a hot bed of catalog topics every time a new one drops. Unfortunately, those same topics typically fall into a back and forth session of people complaining about prices.

YouTube catalog reviews aren't for everyone. Just like "What are you Buying?" threads on the forum aren't for everyone.

The younger generation tends to create and enjoys the YouTube catalog reviews the most.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But I would think the consensus of this forum would be to promote and encourage the young generation of the hobby. Not deter them.

Many of those "Catalog Reviewers" and "YouTubers" come on the forum hoping to find a community of like minded hobbyists only to be belittled and discouraged by the veterans.

Keep in mind, the younger generation enjoys sharing the hobby in different ways. Do we want to welcome and foster them? Or start another thread about why the hobby is dying?

- Jason

@Cmontagna posted:

I think the uptick in YouTube videos demonstrates a shift in the hobby itself. Often we hear people say that the hobby is dying. Stores are closing and clubs closing their doors. While this may be true, many of us have found more connections with fellow modelers in the last 12 months through YouTube than in the previous 5 years through shaking hands at swap meets.

When I started my YouTube channel in 2017 mentioned in my first video that the purpose was to inspire and help others see get into the hobby. If it weren't for Eric's Trains I would not have been as motivated to have the layout and collection that I currently do. If it weren't for my channel I wouldn't have the network of friends to chat with, take and give advice from, and simply enjoy the hobby with.

Catalog season is always crazy. As Tony points out above, the forum here is a hot bed of catalog topics every time a new one drops. Unfortunately, those same topics typically fall into a back and forth session of people complaining about prices.

Man, I thought you were premiering your video yesterday but it was just a teaser lol

@TheRambles posted:

@RickO

”When you resort to attacking the messenger and not the message, you have lost the debate.”

No debate here. Just a quoted theory from a well known psychologist that can apply to dealing with others criticism.

No attack either. Just IMO better use of internet donations which is typically used for more dire circumstances than rewards.

Again, see the quote. Have a nice day Tony! Let's go run some trains!

The industry is evolving at a quick pace and social media right now is a huge part of where model railroading is headed. Folks want to not only have fun, but also express themselves in different ways. There is certainly going to be various tiers of content quality out there, but that doesn't diminish the message of the author. Seek first to understand before being understood.

I have been focused on my O Scale Podcast more than anything and I'm having an absolute blast with it.

Let's support everyone out there and make this the best darn hobby in the world.

I hate to say it, but your efforts tend to get a lot more views on Youtube. I used to like posting on the 3RS forum but have you guys looked at it lately? Talk about spam!

I really do enjoy seeing some of the younger generation posting their videos.

A lot of what is on YouTube is crap.  You can usually tell within the first 10-15 seconds - then click on something else.  It's the flip side of giving everyone a megaphone.

My personal pet peeves are the folks who umm and errr for a long time before making their point, or the folks who show a train running loops for 10 minutes - after the second time around, we've seen it all.  But again, I just click on something else.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

I hate to say it, but your efforts tend to get a lot more views on Youtube. I used to like posting on the 3RS forum but have you guys looked at it lately? Talk about spam!

I really do enjoy seeing some of the younger generation posting their videos.

I'm with you Norm.  I really enjoy interacting with some of the younger guys who are doing some great things on Youtube.  I'm encouraged by what I see there in looking at what the future of the hobby looks like.

Mallard, haha, sounds like one of my vids!

@MichRR714 posted:

I'm with you Norm.  I really enjoy interacting with some of the younger guys who are doing some great things on Youtube.  I'm encouraged by what I see there in looking at what the future of the hobby looks like.

Those guys make me want to buy new stuff. They seem to be having too much fun. How dare they!

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Mallard, haha, sounds like one of my vids!

I rewatch your old videos because the depth of your detail gives them replay value haha I gotta take notes so I know what I want to accomplish.

It was tough for me to meet other people into the hobby before the pandemic but now it's real tough. Youtube fills the gap until I get enough of a layout to post for open houses and join the local club, so I can meet people that way. Low-quality content aside, the model railroading Youtube community is very important. I've learned a ton from there.

Plus look how many people (Youtube visitors that aren't train people yet) were exposed to the existence of York thanks to a few Youtubers that turned it into a joint production. It's a good thing. No doubt about it.

Thanks Bill! Even 'crap' Youtubes are very informative. I found myself hunting for old TMCC engine videos to hear the sounds. One very rare sound set was the K4 5385 one. When I found the video I went ahead and ordered the boards from Lionel. It was just some guy running it on the floor from what I remember.

@TheRambles posted:

Spam, Really? The videos are the exact same content as the postings on the "Lionel 2022 Volume 1 is up! Whatcha Getting?" page of this forum only in a different medium.

Youtube and folks the o-gauge creators are revolutionizing this hobby. Why try and stifle that? I don't get the hate. If you don't want to watch folks paging through the catalogs, don't click on it. They will go away with time, I promise. If you watched it and though it was crap, dislike it and/or offer constructive criticism in the comments. Maybe message the creator. What does complaining on here accomplish other than boosting your own ego?

If I am misinterpreting the overarching message here, let me know and I will apologize. But if I am not, @KOOLjock1 and others comes off a bit like bullies with this post.

In response to the initial query; I live streamed the catalog on my small channel as soon as it dropped as a way for folks to discuss what we were all seeing together. We had a discussion in the chat and it was a lot of fun. Other than that, my video was exactly what your describing. "Oh that's cool" move on.

The stream stayed up after I finished recording is getting views and presently sits a 100% likes.

You know after considering this thread I will say I am wrong.  While not something I would watch a ton of, catalog reviews that is, it is good for the hobby to have so many folks interested enough to put a video out.  Just keep it under 3 hours.  LOL!

Young guys should be encouraged.  Thanks for changing my mind everyone.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Thanks Bill! Even 'crap' Youtubes are very informative. I found myself hunting for old TMCC engine videos to hear the sounds. One very rare sound set was the K4 5385 one. When I found the video I went ahead and ordered the boards from Lionel. It was just some guy running it on the floor from what I remember.

I agree. I rely a lot on Youtube to see how things look so I can decide what I want to replicate.

@Mallard4468 posted:

A lot of what is on YouTube is crap....My personal pet peeves are the folks who umm and errr for a long time before making their point, or the folks who show a train running loops for 10 minutes - after the second time around, we've seen it all.  But again, I just click on something else.

AMEN!

I spent my professional life producing good videos for various corporate clients like The Hoover Company, US Air, OGR, and many other corporate clients. The junk I see that passes for "good" video on YouTube today truly saddens me. Jump cuts, shaky camera work, improper use of microphones, audio loaded with room tone and echo instead of being clear, no attempt to script the video so it makes sense, poor or no editing, audio levels all over the map, and my biggest peeve, vertical video.

I am almost ashamed to say I'm a "video professional" these days, for fear of being lumped in with the people who produce the crap that passes for good video on YouTube today.

I understand there is some value in the hobby-related videos that are being produced, and I have found that most of them are OK. But some of the click-bait nonsense that is put up there is truly awful...and that includes the guy showing a train running around a loop for ten minutes. 

Ain't it funny how people are worried about new people joining the hobby, but meanwhile the older folks are raining on there parade. I'm an 19 year old who has made a pretty good name for himself. I repair trains for people, do upgrades, and have a successful YouTube channel I would say. I'm nothing special, but that's the point isn't it. Be yourself and make a video. I do agree some content is better than others. Social media in general has allowed lots of people to make videos and content that may not be interesting to a more sophisticated person. However, at the end of the day YouTube videos aren't meant to be world class productions. Rich I give you all the credit in the world. I watched tons of your videos as a kid especially the tmcc video. I will never be able to make high end productions with twelve cameras facing towards the same object. In all honesty nobody will do that on YouTube because that is not what it is about. Its not a documentary. Its young and older people sharing their views and life in the hobby. I'm sorry if some videos annoy you guys, but as a fellow train YouTuber with a good following, I just ask that you don't rain on our parade because of a few people who just don't have the right style of editing or video making. Hope this was insightful.

Hi Everyone,

It looks like another great day in the neighborhood. I was almost afraid to open this thread and start reading but...

Just about everything I thought I would read I have seen and read. First of all, for all of the YouTubers that have read and even commented in this thread, I want to thank you for helping to create another dimension to this hobby.

I agree that the hobby is being promoted in various ways on the platform. Some of it fits our fancy and some of it does not. There are some presenters who I await their next video and others not so much and that's ok. It is self expression and a way for an individual to show how they enjoy the hobby. Please correct me if I am wrong, but this hobby is meant for us to enjoy in our own way, correct?

It never fails that even in the best hobby in the world we have "negativity" as it relates to how an individual promotes and enjoys the hobby. If it's not someone stating that something isn't prototypical it's someone trashing a video post they have seen. Sad! From what I see, this negativity is not coming from the younger generation. This simply is not right guys and gals! For those who pass judgement and criticism, do you believe you are encouraging or helping the hobby?

YouTube was created for people to express themselves through whatever medium they choose. Some people may not have the skills to have the best production techniques. Some of the most popular YouTubers started off with less than desirable videos but over time and with positive encouragement they got better. When I first started watching YouTube and in particular, model railroad videos, I was not concerned with the quality of the video. I just wanted to see what the author was promoting, demonstrating, and so excited about that they put themselves out there to the world. Sometimes, I wanted to see a particular locomotive, other times it may have been for scenery, etc. Whatever it was I saw the video for the author's intent. There were certainly times when the author didn't have the best skills as it pertained to editing but sometimes a compliment and then a suggestion can be powerful. 

You may not like the content, you may not care for the editing or lack thereof, but think about how you express that. Are your words and attitudes encouraging or not?

Some things I have read on this thread are simply "ugly" and I certainly hope that newbies and the younger guys are strong enough to ignore it. Face it, we need them for the hobby to continue. That does not happen by only chiming in to say something negative especially if you can't offer something positive and uplifting.

Lastly, when I see someone open a box, in most cases I see someone excited about a product that they have gotten. How many boxes has Mr. Siegel opened? I can promise you that because he opened that box someone watching his video went out an purchased what he showed, demonstrated, and simply had shown excitement for. YouTubers are sales people in a certain right and I'm sure manufacturers are happy when their products are promoted by them. Again hobby promotion is the name of the game. Not to mention the presenters are simply having fun within the context of model railroading. Isn't that ultimately what it is about?

Dave

Well, if it shows anything, it shows that there are young people involved in the hobby and that they are using new ways of communicating. Too bad the Train Karens want to dump all over them.

@Norm Charbonneau posted:

Well, if it shows anything, it shows that there are young people involved in the hobby and that they are using new ways of communicating. Too bad the Train Karens want to dump all over them.

Norm, I resent being called a "Karen."

You are one of the finest modelers in the world. Your work is some of the best there is. How would you feel if sub-standard, shake-the-box kits on a piece of green felt were suddenly being hailed as “great” modeling work? How would you feel if the very thing you were so proud of, your exquisite modeling work, just didn't matter to anyone any more?

That's how I feel about the the declining standards of what now constitutes “good” video.

Rich,

As stated above, what you have done in the world of editing is top notch. I can probably speak for most in saying there is no comparison in your talents with production and that of most YouTubers. Your very job was to produce good videos and of course that comes with good editing. YouTube however is not necessarily that. We don't go to YouTube for a "finished product" as we would if we were purchasing one of your videos or a "Black Diamond Railway". When we say a YouTube video is good we are mostly speaking of the author's intent, what information we received from watching the video, and most importantly how fun it was to watch. The very idea of YouTube is for one to be themselves and we are hardly perfect. Frankly the "imperfection" for some is what keeps them coming back. It gives others the feeling that they can do it too. Not to mention IT'S FREE!

I believe you see the videos through the eyes of someone who has mastered the art of production but most of the content producers have not seen a day of edit training and production. They simply want to have their chance to be seen, heard, and get their chance at being in the limelight, even if it's only for 20 other people who watched their videos.

Dave

As a guy who will be 70 in 5 months, I am just excited to see the younger generation get interested in this hobby.  Kudos to them the way they are communicating!!   The you tube videos are not all pros, good thing they aren't.  To see the enthusiasm of this young generation makes me very happy.  Come on guys,  times are changing, keep up with them or be lost and forgotten.  I wish ALL the young generation great luck in the hobby.  Keep all those videos coming. 

Yep, YouTube is one of the main reasons why many folks in this business do not produce videos any longer.  Why pay for a professionally done video when you can go to YouTube and get a video for FREE regardless of the content and quality.

I'll let this thread go a little longer but we need to promote what we have here including the great threads that members post as well as the producst that our sponsors offer.  Yep, it is nice to get everything FREE on sites like YouTube but they do not promote our hobby rather they bombard videos with commercial interruptions which is why you get FREE content.  HEY....you get FREE content here too!

Well this has been a fascinating discussion!  How it went off the rails with younger vs. older I'm not really sure.  The whole purpose to having a YouTube Channel is two-fold:  to generate clicks and shares.  To do this, one must create useful, unique content that the target audience wants to consume and return for.

It is still my belief that a video of scrolling through another company's content while merely stating what is obviously on the screen or in the catalog and freely available is neither useful  or unique.  Create enough of these, and pretty soon your target demo will go elsewhere for content.

There are really two forms of blogs and videos: long form and short form.  Short form videos are going to be about 6 minutes max, and focus on one or two topics.  Long form videos should be no more than 20 minutes max, and cover no more than one or two big ideas in-depth.

Your six minute catalog video for instance could cover "the three big changes for Lionel in the 2022 Big Book Catalog".  They could be the Base 3/Cab App, the further incorporation of MTH tooling to the line, and the expansion of Amtrak rolling stock.  Those are just examples.  Never do more than three topics at a shot, because your audience will tune out or forget the first two after three.

In a 20 minute video, you have the time to really tackle a single topic in-depth, like why the Base 3 is necessary, how it would work with what you may already have, and what equipment you might need if you choose to start Command Control from scratch.  A 20 minute video also allows you the time to editorialize a little if you should so choose, but again you want to limit your topic selection to no more than three.  And those three should be tied together by a single "big idea".

Want to do an unboxing?  Go for it.  But edit severely or speed up the video.  Again, is it unique content?  Eric's fabulous BFIMHO segment is what I'm talking about:  UNIQUE CONTENT!

Less really is more.  Unique content wins the day.

Jon

We have a third middle rail running down our tracks on our layouts......anything reguarding professional filming is null and void.......

What's this about feeding YouTube spam?  Another scrapple devotee thread?  Pig parts is pig parts.

What, me worry?

@OGR CEO-PUBLISHER posted:

Yep, YouTube is one of the main reasons why many folks in this business do not produce videos any longer.  Why pay for a professionally done video when you can go to YouTube and get a video for FREE regardless of the content and quality.

Alan; this comment is spot on! I used to purchase train videos from a production company here in the Atlanta area that in the past specialized in historic railroad videos. When that well ran dry, they started producing videos of current rail operations. I bought a few of these early on but, discovered exponentially better prototype rail videos on YouTube that provide train symbol, locomotive numbers and other info all for free and fast paced, generally being only about 20-30 minutes long. The production company videos contain none of this info and tend to drag on for an hour and a half to two hours. The production company videos have essentially become unwatchable for me as I much prefer the YouTube “channels”. I haven’t watched any of the catalog review type videos mentioned above but, I do enjoy watching videos done by Norm and by Eric Siegel.

I have grown to appreciate YouTube to the point that I very rarely watch network TV any longer with the exception of sports and certain programming on PBS.

Curt

I'm with you there, Curt.

Jon

@KOOLjock1 posted:

Well this has been a fascinating discussion!  How it went off the rails with younger vs. older I'm not really sure.  The whole purpose to having a YouTube Channel is two-fold:  to generate clicks and shares.  To do this, one must create useful, unique content that the target audience wants to consume and return for.

It is still my belief that a video of scrolling through another company's content while merely stating what is obviously on the screen or in the catalog and freely available is neither useful  or unique.  Create enough of these, and pretty soon your target demo will go elsewhere for content.

There are really two forms of blogs and videos: long form and short form.  Short form videos are going to be about 6 minutes max, and focus on one or two topics.  Long form videos should be no more than 20 minutes max, and cover no more than one or two big ideas in-depth.

Your six minute catalog video for instance could cover "the three big changes for Lionel in the 2022 Big Book Catalog".  They could be the Base 3/Cab App, the further incorporation of MTH tooling to the line, and the expansion of Amtrak rolling stock.  Those are just examples.  Never do more than three topics at a shot, because your audience will tune out or forget the first two after three.

In a 20 minute video, you have the time to really tackle a single topic in-depth, like why the Base 3 is necessary, how it would work with what you may already have, and what equipment you might need if you choose to start Command Control from scratch.  A 20 minute video also allows you the time to editorialize a little if you should so choose, but again you want to limit your topic selection to no more than three.  And those three should be tied together by a single "big idea".

Want to do an unboxing?  Go for it.  But edit severely or speed up the video.  Again, is it unique content?  Eric's fabulous BFIMHO segment is what I'm talking about:  UNIQUE CONTENT!

Less really is more.  Unique content wins the day.

Jon

What wonderful insights @KOOLjock1. What’s your YouTube channel called? Mind sharing a link. Some of us might learn something.

@RJ I posted:

Plus, it helps some of us pick up some spare change to preorder things.

What does the payout actually look like for someone with your view and subscriber numbers? Does it actually "help your bottom line" in terms of train related purchases?

@Blake posted:

We have a third middle rail running down our tracks on our layouts......anything reguarding professional filming is null and void.......

I've seen some very professional 3 Rail O videos as well as some absolutely dismal prototype railroad videos.

Rusty

@Blake posted:

We have a third middle rail running down our tracks on our layouts......anything reguarding professional filming is null and void.......

What the heck does having a middle rail have to do with producing good video? Good grief. Total nonsense like this is one reason why I haven’t shot and produced any new videos for years. Why should I, when “…anything reguarding (sp) professional filming is null and void...” in the mind of today’s audience.

Enjoy your 90-minute video of somebody opening a box.  

Everybody take a few deep breaths. Part of the atmosphere at OGR is keeping things calm and reasonable. Personal/emotionally charged attacks get threads locked or deleted.

The age bit thing is misguided. I don't think age is relevant. Some people are trying to point out that (usually) the same guys barking about video games taking away from this hobby are the same people barking about how dumb it is to feature model railroads on social media or something to that effect. That's the frustration and it definitely happens. But arguing with those people is not the way. You gotta side step them and keep going.

YouTube has its strong points and benefits. It's not mandatory programming though so it's all good.

@Alfred E Neuman posted:

What's this about feeding YouTube spam?  Another scrapple devotee thread?  Pig parts is pig parts.

What, me worry?

I love me some spam but scrapple wasn't my thing. I tried to like it but ooph...I couldn't do it haha do they make a jalapeno scrapple like they make a jalapeno spam? I would try it!

My two cents.  I believe that one of the purposes of youtube is sharing.  In that context, you don't need professionalism.  Does that take away from some of the professional level videos wtih the same subject?  Sure.  Does that mean every video is watchable?  Certainly not.  Sometimes people watch things just to see something, not to be impressed with the production values.  When I go to someone's house to see a new loco, I am not expecting a prepared presentation.  Sometimes, I'm just satisfied seeing something I otherwise wouldn't have.

Brendan

@Rich Melvin posted:

AMEN!

I spent my professional life producing good videos for various corporate clients like The Hoover Company, US Air, OGR, and many other corporate clients. The junk I see that passes for "good" video on YouTube today truly saddens me. Jump cuts, shaky camera work, improper use of microphones, audio loaded with room tone and echo instead of being clear, no attempt to script the video so it makes sense, poor or no editing, audio levels all over the map, and my biggest peeve, vertical video.

I am almost ashamed to say I'm a "video professional" these days, for fear of being lumped in with the people who produce the crap that passes for good video on YouTube today.

I understand there is some value in the hobby-related videos that are being produced, and I have found that most of them are OK. But some of the click-bait nonsense that is put up there is truly awful...and that includes the guy showing a train running around a loop for ten minutes. 

Michael Bay is that you, it must be hard thinking you are the greatest but nobody else does.   Maybe you could start a YouTube channel and teach use non "video professional" types how to not make junk.

We are just normal people that like to make videos of our trains. Most of us use our iPhone and don't have loads of equipment to be better than poor or no editing.   

I’m not the greatest, not by a long shot. I’m just an average guy who learned a profession, tried to do it well, and made my living doing it for a lot of years.

Thanks so much for your “wonderful” comment.  

Haha this is great. I need some popcorn. It’s great to see some kids in the forum. And if any of you kids work on MTH locos and live in the PHX area please hit me up!

I have a utube channel. I didn’t start it to be a professional. I started it because.

1: I don't have a real layout yet and have to set up & break down every time I want to run trains.

2: I can go back & watch my own videos & see my own weathering art and eliminate a lot of that set/ break down time.

I film with my grainy iPhone, never thought I would have a following, let alone have ppl send me their trains to weather & detail. It’s not why I started a utube channel. Moral of the story.... this is supposed to be fun. Dont spoil someone else’s fun by nitpicking at it.  utube is not just for professional video engineers. It’s a creative outlet for anyone with something to share, no matter what age you are or what topic you are passionate about. Or what your video skills are.

Enjoy, and leave the young guys alone. They are the future of the hobby!
Im DjsOgaugeTrains on youtube.

Good Evening Everyone,

I think a lot of good points have been made on this thread. Everyone has their own opinions and though we may not agree with them we should still have class when responding. Offending one another will do two things, create tension between forumites and get this thread deleted. I don't think we should let our emotions get the best of us because one thing we ALL have in common is we love trains. This forum allows us to express that love. It's even more evident that we love this hobby based on some of the "passionate" commentary.  The powers that be have allowed the author to post the thread and express his thoughts. They also have allowed us to respond to that initial comment. Sometimes we complain when a thread is deleted but when it gets ugly I can see the necessity in doing so. Keep in mind that newbies are coming to the forum regularly and we don't want their introduction to be one of negative interaction and childish behavior. Let's show everyone reading this that we can have a chat about something as subjective as this obviously is, but remain respectful to each other. Anything else is really doing too much.

Dave

@Rich Melvin posted:

I’m not the greatest, not by a long shot. I’m just an average guy who learned a profession, tried to do it well, and made my living doing it for a lot of years.

Thanks so much for your “wonderful” comment.  

I think you're missing the main takeaway of his post - maybe offer up some constructive criticism or tips to some of the young guys.  Or post a Youtube video about how to make a good Youtube video.  

And to put my money where my mouth is, I'll suggest to some of the young guys doing the videos, if you struggle with the "ums" and "uhs," just keep in mind silence is fine.  If a word isn't coming to mind, there's no need to fill the gap with an "um."  You can be quiet - your audience will think you're being dramatic or something.  Same goes for public speaking.

@Mark Holmgren 110217 posted:

I think you're missing the main takeaway of his post - maybe offer up some constructive criticism or tips to some of the young guys.  Or post a Youtube video about how to make a good Youtube video.  

And to put my money where my mouth is, I'll suggest to some of the young guys doing the videos, if you struggle with the "ums" and "uhs," just keep in mind silence is fine.  If a word isn't coming to mind, there's no need to fill the gap with an "um."  You can be quiet - your audience will think you're being dramatic or something.  Same goes for public speaking.

I’m horrible with uumms & uh’s. Sometimes when I’m talking for my channel I just wanna go Duuuuuuhuhuhuhuhu.....🤪 good tip! Thanks

Well, I'm hooked.  I just watched your track plan video.  Very interesting and educational - and very well done!  I'm going to try some tweaks to my setup.

@Sid's Trains posted:

Ain't it funny how people are worried about new people joining the hobby, but meanwhile the older folks are raining on there parade. I'm an 19 year old who has made a pretty good name for himself. I repair trains for people, do upgrades, and have a successful YouTube channel I would say. I'm nothing special, but that's the point isn't it. Be yourself and make a video. I do agree some content is better than others. Social media in general has allowed lots of people to make videos and content that may not be interesting to a more sophisticated person. However, at the end of the day YouTube videos aren't meant to be world class productions. Rich I give you all the credit in the world. I watched tons of your videos as a kid especially the tmcc video. I will never be able to make high end productions with twelve cameras facing towards the same object. In all honesty nobody will do that on YouTube because that is not what it is about. Its not a documentary. Its young and older people sharing their views and life in the hobby. I'm sorry if some videos annoy you guys, but as a fellow train YouTuber with a good following, I just ask that you don't rain on our parade because of a few people who just don't have the right style of editing or video making. Hope this was insightful.

I agree! Not sure why all the negativity just because someone puts the effort in to share something with everyone else.  Videos don't just happen; some can take a lot of time to make.  When I started mine a long time ago I did it to share all my work (and mistakes) on my layout build because I could not find it anywhere else.  I'm not a professional actor, so yes, I "Um and Ehh" a lot in mine because it's just shooting from the hip, no script.  The catalog reviews were fun to watch!  Maybe that one you saw wasn't, but just skip it and move on to one that is.  I think all the guys making videos are doing a great job and I look forward to them every time they release one. (RJ's Trains, Sid's Trains, RBP Trains, Nix Crossing, JD Stucks, Chris's Trains and Things, Dagryffin Hobby, Hennings Trains, and on and on).

I mean if you think some of their videos are long, come watch mine LOL, I love to go on and on with detail and people can't handle it, HA-HA.

But I am doing it my way.  Some people do appreciate all the detail.

I get so many ideas from the content all these guys share.  I hope they continue making videos forever!

@Prr7688 posted:

What does the payout actually look like for someone with your view and subscriber numbers? Does it actually "help your bottom line" in terms of train related purchases?

It is different for every YouTuber and depends more on views and watch time than the actual subscriber count. I don't want to give specifics but I made enough in 2021 before taxes to purchase the VL Class and then some. Not bad for someone who films videos using his phone, a free video editing software, and no formal editing education.

Yea, it stinks that the viewers have to watch an advertisement or two but, YouTube and Google now add advertisements to videos regardless of whether or not the creator wants them or not. At least it is still free and not a $20 DVD with more ads to promote other products.

I am a young guy (21 years old), I just graduated from college, have a corporate entry-level job, I have bills, I pay rent. The extra money coming in from YouTube I am extremely grateful for and has definitely allowed me to pick up a few extra trains throughout the year. 

What’s everyone’s secret to a 1000 subscribers? Don’t you need at least a 1000 to do live feeds?

oh Jon don’t try to get out of it now, you really stepped into it.  Lol

@OGR CEO-PUBLISHER posted:

I'll let this thread go a little longer but we need to promote what we have here including the great threads that members post as well as the producst that our sponsors offer.  Yep, it is nice to get everything FREE on sites like YouTube but they do not promote our hobby rather they bombard videos with commercial interruptions which is why you get FREE content.  HEY....you get FREE content here too!

This site certainly bombards us with commercial interruptions too, even those of us who pay!
...

First forum topic 7 page-downs on my 1920x1080 screen!

@superwarp1 posted:

What’s everyone’s secret to a 1000 subscribers? Don’t you need at least a 1000 to do live feeds?

oh Jon don’t try to get out of it now, you really stepped into it.  Lol

You can use some third-party software to do live streams before hitting 1000 subscribers and there are videos on YouTube that can explain how to do that way better than I can.

I say getting to 1000 subscribers takes a mixture of things. The first is regularly uploading, at least once a week, videos longer than 8 minutes. The YouTube algorithm loves that and shares your video with more people. The second is a large-ish collection and a nice-ish layout because nobody wants to see the same three trains every video. Lastly is good video production quality, maybe not on the level as some others have expressed on this thread but your videos have to be watchable and engaging for the average person.

I think that when I post a link to a YouTube video onOGR it gets hurried into a sub forum. And even with a simple title like “Lots of trains running” the thread gets maybe 100 clicks. That’s just thread clicks who knows if even half of that 100 actually look at the video.

but on YouTube I have videos ranging from 200 to 15,000 views. I think I know where my audience is

Here’s a link to my channel!😀

https://youtube.com/c/OGaugeGreg

@rplst8 posted:

This site certainly bombards us with commercial interruptions too, even those of us who pay!
...

First forum topic 7 page-downs on my 1920x1080 screen!

GHEEZZZZ....I think you are a little confused here or perhaps just don't understand my post.  Regardless, we can't make everyone happy obviously as is evidenced in this post.  To interpret the list of topics that come before this thread as "commercial interruptions" is just plain .... well, I will just leave it alone.