Best deal on a steam engine? LionChief +. MTH Railking or Williams. rising prices

For dependability go with the Williams. We use them at our club and they run most consistently as compared to the competition.

The LionChief + Mikado, Pacific, and Hudsons are fine locos, and while they might be slightly more than Williams or possibly even some MTH, remember that they do also come with their own controller. This should be considered, since you like to hand over the controls to kids at a show, which could be hard to do with Williams, and as you mention, could be costly with MTH, since MTH controllers are both more fragile and expensive.

Bill in FtL

IMO, the MTH sets are the best value. The Remote Commander is limited, similar to Lion Chief controls, but you get an entire set, track, transformer and remote commander for about the same street price of a LC+ engine, tender & remote only. The MTH engine also has full DCS capabilities if you want to upgrade.

I think the LC+ engines are also quite nice and a good value as well, but you would still need track and power, so you don't get as much as you do with the MTH sets. I think MTH sets and LC+ are also similar in reliability. I would not rate either one better than the other in that department.

As for the Williams, they are conventional only and not yet remote control so it really isn't an apples to apples comparison with the other two. I have no conventional and I don't keep up with it so I really know very little about these items. I have heard (from reading here  on the forum) that they are supposed to be pretty reliable though. I think the kids would find more play value in the remote sets. If WBB comes out with the Bluetooth control system for O gauge they are talking about, then I see a lot of added value there and I think the kids will like the control from a phone or other device.

And according to my LHS, all of the above have increased in price over the last year or so, not just LC & LC+. Some maybe more than others, but all of the MSRP's have gone up.

The LionChief + locos have apparently been a big hit.  Hence some explanation for the price increase, no doubt.  They were a bargain, now less so.  Still, a full featured command, semi-scale diesel for less than $250 which has it's own remote is unique in the hobby (just got a NYC RS3 from Charles Ro for $245).  These are effectively command control locos that you don't need to buy Legacy, TMCC or DCS to operate. They come with the remote as mentioned above.

These are somewhat apples to oranges comparisons.  A set is cheaper than a separate sale loco on a per piece basis.  You can get an inexpensive LionChief Thomas set for half or less the price of other sets, as you know.  So Lionel has some inexpensive Lion Chief sets, as well as separate sale locos.  These are simple, toy-like locos in the case of Thomas and companions. 

Williams is conventional only so there is no option for handing the remote to anyone, anytime, anywhere.

MTH sets are designed for use with DCS,  ultimately.  If you want to operate two MTH locos on the same loop you need to invest in DCS, another $300 or so.  

As a comparison, to operate two LionChief + locos independently on your display loop, you'd need to invest $500 for two diesels or $700 for two steamers.  You could buy two MTH sets for that price range,  probably closer to the middle of the range than the lower end. But to have independent control of the two locos,  you'd still need to have an extra DCS remote,  or the entire DCS system (if you don't already have a TIU), so figure on another $150 to get that second remote that comes with the LionChief + loco as standard.  And if you don't have DCS, figure on $300 to get that in place, as well as the second remote. For $700 you can have two LionChief + locos and their remotes.  If you don't have DCS, you're looking at $600-700 or so for two full RailKing sets plus $300 for DCS and $150 for a second remote to get the exact same capabilities (with the track and rolling stock as a bonus).  If you already have DCS, you're looking at $750-850 for the sets and the extra remote.  Pretty much a wash, but you get to keep the track and rolling stock .

So apples to oranges it seems to me.  Different approaches, neither clearly superior.  Just different.

An MTH Starter set goes for $429.95 to $449.95 according from their recent R-T-R Catalog. MTH has a DCS Remote commanderto run engines and your fleet can expand and operate off that remote.  

From Williams by Bauchmann go for a similar price but the smoke unit is not as strong as an MTH and Sounds are not their.

Lionel has great LC+ starter sets but what is the point of Lion chief or Lion Chief plus when you need a remote for that specific engine, the sets are cheaper but you might as well buy an MTH Set for the same price of a LC+ Mikado.

I really think If I buy anything Lion chief it would be a Thomas and Friends set up, because the Kids like them in our youth group. 

I have an honest Idea...and that is make something called Lion chief 2.0. Have it so you can run it as a TMCC Locomotive, Lion Chief Remoted or conventional. If they did a Legacy set up, it would be almost the price of their ES44AC.

I also thought the LC & LC+ items made little sense when they were first released. I have since changed my mind completely. Some folks actually like the separate remotes for the LC & LC+ items. That is one of the big selling points. Price points are another big attraction to the lines.

It's also great for kids, they can each have their own train and remote, no fighting over who gets to control the trains. Thomas is a good attraction for kids as well, but so are all the other LC & LC+ items. Many here have also really taken to the LC & LC+ items. LC+ also gives Lionel a mid-priced line of steamers that they were sorely lacking.

I haven't yet decided if any of this is for me, I am just not sure if it fits in with my plans for my layout right now? But, it has sure been popular with a lot of folks and I now think it was a great idea on Lionel's part.

Thanks good comments. I wound up ordering a LC+ engine will see how good it is. (got it on a sale)

The other LC set engines apparently do not have quite the extra features of the + engines.

I have 7 of the LC engines mostly Thomas and the kids love them bolt them to a board with a metal bracket to prevent the kids from breaking the speed dial.

They tend to rotate it to far and snap them off trying to get more speed!

Williams engines can be had used and often new at train shows for around $100.  I have never understood why they don't bring a better price.  That said I recently got a LC+ so that my 3.5 year old grandson could enjoy the remote.  It is a really nice engine and he and I both like running it.

Gentlemen,

   Although I pick up a RTR set when I see a real good deal on them, I tend to purchase more Tin Plate than I do anything else, the new Legacy Shay from Patricks Trains was a good deal for me also.  My original Williams Engines were all good deals and still run perfectly.  However just because something is a little less money does not make it a good deal if you seldom use the train.  I always purchase trains that I am going to like to run, not because they cost less money.

PCRR/Dave