Doing a full ERR Upgrade

Before you even order, download the instructions and read them through.  THEN order.  Then re-read said instructions.  Then start the install... with the instructions in front of you.

Jon

KOOLjock1 posted:

Before you even order, download the instructions and read them through.  THEN order.  Then re-read said instructions.  Then start the install... with the instructions in front of you.

 

Jon

Which ERR set would I need exactly? There's a few and I want to do the Cruise Control one, would I go about using lite or the full kit? I know the M kit is for those already with TMCC and this hudson Doesn't have TMCC.

First off have you checked prices on what the the Conventional and TMCC versions are selling for? In most cases the difference is less than $150. An upgrade even using Cruise Lite with Railsounds and electro coupler will cost at least that much. A full blown Cruise Commander with Railsounds and coupler is well over $200. TMCC versions come up all the time.

Pete

Information to consider.

• (1.) Automated speed control ??
• (2.) Are your lamps compatible??  Often lamps are upgraded to 18 volts to operate at higher TMCC operation voltage.
• (3.) Do you want electro-couplers??  There are different lengths and mountings.
• (4.) Components most likely are installed in the tender. Size of the tender is a consideration.
• (5.)  The tender/loco tether, usually is changed to a 6, 8 or even 10 pin tether to accommodate new and existing features.  You would need to know components mounted in the loco and how many wires required to connect to the control board in the tender.
• (6.) Install instructions are available on the ERR website.  A huge plus, as has been mentioned. Understanding the install allows, for an accurate material list of all components required.
• (7.) How are you installing a TMCC antenna ??   There are a couple of different ways this is done, usually with an isolated tender shell, which may require special plastic screws or mounting bushings. 

That's a start list, best wishes with your project.

Mike CT.

Mike CT posted:

Information to consider.

• (1.) Automated speed control ??
• (2.) Are your lamps compatible??  Often lamps are upgraded to 18 volts to operate at higher TMCC operation voltage.
• (3.) Do you want electro-couplers??  There are different lengths and mountings.
• (4.) Components most likely are installed in the tender. Size of the tender is a consideration.
• (5.)  The tender/loco tether, usually is changed to a 6, 8 or even 10 pin tether to accommodate new and existing features.  You would need to know components mounted in the loco and how many wires required to connect to the control board in the tender.
• (6.) Install instructions are available on the ERR website.  A huge plus, as has been mentioned. Understanding the install allows, for an accurate material list of all components required.
• (7.) How are you installing a TMCC antenna ??   There are a couple of different ways this is done, usually with an isolated tender shell, which may require special plastic screws or mounting bushings. 

That's a start list, best wishes with your project.

Mike CT.

 

A strong argument to start with the TMCC version. The railings are already isolated for the antenna. The Motor driver and R2LC are already in the engine. Only a Cruise M needed for cruise. No need to change the tether. Railsounds already in the tender along with an electro coupler.

Pete

Well, converting a TMCC unit to cruise with the CC-M is hardly a full conversion, it's one wire to solder and a couple of plugs!

For a full upgrade, I usually recommend the ERR Cruise Commander and the ERR RailSounds Commander.  As for the chuffing without glue and reed switches, take a look at my Chuff-Generator, that will address the chuffing issue.  Of course, with fan driven smoke, I would obviously recommend the Super-Chuffer.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Well, converting a TMCC unit to cruise with the CC-M is hardly a full conversion, it's one wire to solder and a couple of plugs!

For a full upgrade, I usually recommend the ERR Cruise Commander and the ERR RailSounds Commander.  As for the chuffing without glue and reed switches, take a look at my Chuff-Generator, that will address the chuffing issue.  Of course, with fan driven smoke, I would obviously recommend the Super-Chuffer.

Ah yes the chuff generator, how is that installed? Is it hard? How does it hook up to the rest of the ERR boards? Thanks for the responses

If you don't use the Super-Chuffer, you have to provide a source of 5VDC for the Chuff-Generator.  The actual C-G just has power and a chuff output that replaces any mechanical switch.

Here's the Chuff-Generator Installation Manual, and below is an example of the Chuff-Generator installation with the Super-Chuffer.  Note in this example the C-G also has the optional ground lights installed.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

If you don't use the Super-Chuffer, you have to provide a source of 5VDC for the Chuff-Generator.  The actual C-G just has power and a chuff output that replaces any mechanical switch.

Here's the Chuff-Generator Installation Manual, and below is an example of the Chuff-Generator installation with the Super-Chuffer.  Note in this example the C-G also has the optional ground lights installed.

 

Oh yikes, what if I dont plan on using a super chuffer, I just can’t afford one right now. Where would I get that 5 volts from?

THETRAINMAN:

OK, to get back to the basics: I have done a couple of dozen+ of these ERR upgrades (and a couple of Train America kits back in the prehistoric past), and they are as easy or less easy as you make them. Most of what I have done are steam, but I have done diesels and an MTH NYC P2 electric (die-cast - ouch! on the antenna).

1 - start with a diesel (or electric) with a plastic body. Steam comes later. Read the instructions, of course, but the diagrams ("let's see - this wire goes here, that wire goes there..." and "why" doesn't matter yet) are what have been more helpful to me, after I read the instructions.

2 - the plastic bodied electric/diesel will be duck soup on the antenna mount (tape/silicone antenna inside body, plug in wire to board); there will be no steam chuff switch to mount. There will be no tender tether to handle. The electric couplers will mount just like the old ones and plug into the board; ditto with the headlights.

3 - headlights: not sure about LED usage - I don't mess with them; I bought a bundle of 14V bulbs from MicroMark years ago and use them for headlights. So far none have burned out.

4 - the steam stuff and all the whiz-bang lighting (I don't use it) can come later. Just choose a simple loco (a Williams diesel, for example) and put an ERR Cruise Commander and RS in it. Use the speaker than came in the loco, if it's easier - I usually do.

5 - the next project will be less daunting; start small. Confidence comes with doing. Pretty soon you'll be putting ERR in everything.

I made myself some of these if I just need a low power 5VDC supply.

A diesel is a piece of cake.  Just follow the directions.  But your title says you want to do a full ERR upgrade.  And then you said a steamer and got all the product info to do just that, a full ERR upgrade and more.  More full perhaps than you expected at first.   And some have tried to talk you out of an upgrade.  I will say this, I've done a handful of diesel upgrades and it is a fun project.  And simple.  It's like bringing a dull model engine to life.  Dr. Frankensteinlike.  Good luck.  You can handle it.  I hope you do it.

Trainman,   As Jon and Mike suggested, first download the ERR instruction manual and study completely, become familiar with it.  Email Ken at ERR about any questions you may have, he is very helpful and informative.  I have installed ERR in many of my engines, converting MTH PS1 diesels to CC, and some steam locos as well.  One steam I converted to TMCC/RS with ERR was the conventional K Line Hudson #5344.  It was not hard to do at all, but, it was not my first engine to do so.  When you get started, the process becomes easier with each conversion you do.  And, you can go as far, or less, as you want... it is your engine(s).  The great products from ERR, and from John, are all great for upgrades and compliment one another.  Either way, you will well pleased and cannot go wrong... it is a learning process.

Jesse   TCA  12-68275

The first solo ERR upgrade I did was to a K Line Hudson. After a bad experience having someone do previous upgrades, I decided I could do it. After downloading ERRs manual, I could see that it wasn't so intimidating. As a 1st timer and amateur, it only took 2 hours. I've since done 5 others and changed out one done by a pro after a failure.  

Well I will definitely be getting a K-line hudson and upgrading it, but my cousin is also offering me a centruy club 773 hudson and now I cant decide which I want to buy first, the only things holding me back on the 773 is the pittman motor and the 1 chuff per revolution. I know the pittman motors are AC and dont run the best, but is there anyway to negate that? I know I cant install ERR cruise (atleast I dont think) so thats why I cant decide. Both are very well priced and I do want to buy both, so which would you guys recommend getting first?

The 773 has a Pulmore motor, not a Pittman. The Pittmans are DC. The Lionel J3 Hudsons made in the 2000s have Pittmans. All of the Hudsons made in the 1990s have Pulmores. No comparison in operating characteristics.

Pete

Norton posted:

The 773 has a Pulmore motor, not a Pittman. The Pittmans are DC. The Lionel J3 Hudsons made in the 2000s have Pittmans. All of the Hudsons made in the 1990s have Pulmores. No comparison in operating characteristics.

Pete

Oh right, I meant pullmor. So a pullmor motor operates exactly the same as a DC Flywheel motor? and if so can I install cruise control?

No, Pullmor motors are AC open field motors. You will need to use the ERR AC Commander and they do not have cruise on them. That's your only option for this motor