Help with routes requested.

Hey Nicole,

I had issues with routes too witch command switches. My solution was to use route ID's that were double digit. So my first route ID is 10. I skipped 1-9.

Try a double digit ID, curious what your results will be.

Thanks
Jason

I don't have these switches but since you are using them in a crossover why not just program them both as switch #1. Then when you address them they would both change to either straight or curved position. That is the way other types of switches work when  being controlled in a command environment work.

 

 

Thanks for the advice Jason, I'll try that in the morning.   I've just spent a while doing some more experimenting.  I wondered if it may be a low power issue, so I added another 150w transformer to the TPC, giving me 300W available. (I can go welding with paperclips now!)  That made no difference, and so I upped the switch delay time to 1.5 secs. And now it works for both straight and diverging. Weird eh?  I'll probably drop the power down to 150W again tomorrow, as that should be ample for 2 switches and a maximum of 3 locomotives at a time.

Thanks Trainman9. I'll give that a try too. 

Nicole-If these are a crossover with fastrack switches-simply program both switches to the same switch #.  Both will aim the same way when addressed.  Saves you a route and the crossover is treated as 1 switch-which saves you from remembering the route # as well.  I gaurantee...

Dear all,

 

This morning I dropped the power back down to 150W, and then tried using a route number higher than 9. As Jason suggested, that works fine. I can only surmise that this may be a small software 'feature' that will be resolved at some future date. It's good to know about this though, as I was starting to think that I was going bonkers.

 

I have now set both switches to the same number. As Trainman9 and William 1 both said, it's the simplest way for a crossover.

 

My reasons for wishing to use the Legacy route function was mainly to learn how it worked so that I'd be ready for the future when I have more switches and have proper routes to set. I think that the command control switches are great. They are so simple to install and program, and there is no wiring involved either. (I removed the manual lever switches.) They are also quite a bargain, as the cost is only slightly higher than the non-command control switches.

 

Thanks everyone for your help and advice. 

I think they are a great idea, it really opens up some interesting programming possibilities. I think, I will start selling of my non command switches.

Dave, you might be pleased to hear that they are working fine on 50Hz power too. 

I don't think 1.5 delay is all that unusual. If it works I would go with it and not worry.

If both switches operate simlutaneoulsy, why not wire them in parallel? I have 57 switch tracks (Atlas-O) on my layout, and 22 of them are crossovers that are wired in parallel (11 pairs), which leaves me with 46 switch tracks addresses. I use a dedicated 18VAC supply to actuate them and have had no problems.

 

Just a thought  . . .

 

Alex

Thanks for sharing that a double digit route worked for you also. I was thinking it was a software bug too. But wasn't sure but now that you have seen the same issue I am thinking it is a bug and nothing wrong with our remotes or switches

Thanks!

Now hopefully Lionel happens to read this or someone who knows them can share so they investigate for 1.5 software. 

 

 

Folks,

 

I tried this today, and the reason this is happening is there are left over Cab-1 routes in the switches that conflict with the Cab-2 switch commands sent out.   Explaining further: there are two ways routes work in TMCC, Cab-1 and Cab-2 modes.

 

Cab-1 mode works by building the routes in the switch, and only works for ID's below 10.  To fire the route in this mode, a "route fire" command is sent to (all of) the switch(s).  All switches associated with the route fire; as built by the route building process by a Cab-1. (akin to a train construct).

 

Cab-2 mode works by building the routes in the Legacy Base and this is done for all ID's 1-99.  The routes in the Legacy base are a collection of switches, no route build commands are sent to the actual switch like the Cab-1 implements.

 

There is an overlap and potential conflict if a route exists in the switch (built with a Cab-1, or random data in the switch as shipped from the factory) and the Legacy Cab-2 fires a switch in conflict with the switch stored route.   When firing a route below 10, The Cab-2 sends a route command with Cab-1 protocol, then the switch commands in the Route stored in the Legacy base.  This is why slowing the route throw rate fixes the issue, the switch has a chance to finish the action of the route command then the switch command comes in and executes.

 

This sounds complicated, but implemented for "legacy" products like ASC's or SC2's, so maybe I should just conclude with the way to fix the issue instead of delving deeper into the protocols:

 

Simply clear the route before building them on Cab-2. Once you clear the route, then build the intended route with the CAB-2, and they should work, no matter the "route throw rate" setting.  Instant works fine in my setup.

 

FYI: The route commands are sent above 10 (10-99) but they are not interpreted by the switches.

Thanks Jon, I'll try doing as you suggested. Although I'm pretty sure that I did clear the routes after they failed to work initially.

 

It sounds like it may be an idea to avoid using routes under 10 wherever possible though.

 

As my switches were brand new from the LionelStore web shop and I only have Legacy, could this setting have been made during production testing? (I doubt that they would have sent me 'previously enjoyed' switches?) It seems unlikely that random data would affect multiple switches in exactly the same way.

 

Thanks for taking the time to test this out. I appreciate it. 

My switches were built up as prototypes, and may have had routes programmed in them before I tried to operate them.  It is possible for the routes to be "dirty" from the factory on the switches; I will advise them to clear the routes on the final checkout going forward. 

 

I think the problem is as I discovered, because I was able to reproduce this issue quickly here.  You can use routes about 10 in your setup, that is a good approach as well to addressing the use of routes on the switch.

 

I also found the route operation in Legacy cumbersome; needing to fire the route before I could hit "info" to create the route was frustrating.  Time for a detailed review of routes....for v1.5.

jon do these routes have to be cleared with a cab1 or will the cab2 do?

Ron

Cab-2 will work fine to clear the route.