Issue with Lionel C&O Pacific Continues

This may be a silly question, but have you checked that you haven't accidentally knocked the train-brake slider on your cab-2 to fully-on?  This bites all of us at times and can cause a lot of head-scratching. If this problem only happens to this loco, and other Legacy locomotives are unaffected, then my suggestion probably does not apply.

The train brake is ok, thanks for your input

Doug

Hi Doug,

This also might sound silly, but I assume this is a used engine. If this is the case check a few things, first make sure you clean all the pick up rollers and drive wheels,

check for heavy grime build up on the drivers with the tires. This grime can hit the brake shoes and cause a problem. Check that all pick up rollers are tight.Also I had this problem with a Hudson, It would stop in the same area all the time, I needed another power drop. Also check all your ground wires.

 Sorry for the fast typing I have to run out in a few minutes

Alex

I had this problem with a lionel steamer tmcc and the  radio board was defective.  Lionel sent me a new one and all is well.

Does the headlight blink when that happens? If so try holding your hand just above the loco and see i8f it responds. Does the problem occur in the same place on the layout?

Thanks all for your replys.

I just ran it again for about 10 minutes, no problems.  It seems to be intermittent.  I believe that at one time the headlight did blink when it happened, but I'll continur to check that.  I did notice that one of the handrails was touching another piece of piping at the front of the engine. I gently bent it away wondering if that was affecting the signal.  I'll keep running it and if it happenes again I'll put my hand above the engine.  It does not happen to any other engines and it was happening at various locations on the layout.

Doug

You may have found the problem on your own. Depending on the engine some use the handrail for the antenna and if it touches something that is grounded it will short out the signal. If it is barely touching a little bump now and then could cause an intermittent loss of signal. A flashing headlight is a clue that the signal is weak.

Ron

If that handrail is part of the main handrail  thats connected to the antanna thats a likely culprit, a blinking light on a TMCC or Legacy loco indicates a signal loss. The antenna/handrail is insulated from the  boiler by insulator rings if any part of the handrail/antenna touches the boiler it can interfere with the signal.

I hope that's it, although it's usually not that easy for me.  I'm going to let it run a while.  I'll keep you posted.

Doug

The problem is now very sporatic.  After running for a while it will occasionally slow down for a second and then go back to speed.  (with cruise on).  Any ideas?

Doug

It could be something with the flywheel magnet/speed sensor, I'd email Lionels tech support. They may be able to diagnose the problem and recommend the necessary part(s). They have no problem giving out of warranty repair advice for "do it yourselfers"

I have found another spot where the hand rail might have been touching the cab.  I adjusted that opened up the engine and again checked the connections.  I also tightened the wire nut connecting the hand rail wires.  While I had it open I modified the smoke unit, what a difference that makes.  I ran it and so far no problems.  One thing that I noticed was before the headlight had a slight flicker, now it doesn't.

Doug

The handrails touching anywhere will cause the flicker, so maybe you're onthe road to happiness.

I am having the same problem on two of my legacy engines. I am not sure if it is the engines. Have you checked your track voltage when it does this? I asked in a previous post about this issue

Mikemike, I have checked track voltage and have seen no problems.  Since this only happened with this engine. I think it is engine specific.

doug

The flickering headlight is usually a marginal TMCC signal.  Of course, if the track and/or pickups are dirty, it can be that issue if it happens when it's moving.  Usually, you can tell the difference between dirty track and marginal signal by the way the headlight blinks.

My problem came back.  I'll do more investigation in the morning.  (I knew it was too good to be true)

Doug

I'm really in the antenna or R2LC board being the problem here.

John, I have been pulling 7 heavyweight passenger cars always with this engine.  Could this be an issue?

doug

This may be another of my off-the-wall ideas, but does this happen in specific places only? You said earlier that it happens at various points around your layout, but are they always the same ones?  If so, and if these are near large metal surfaces (On bridges, in some tunnels, running under other tracks, passing any other large metal surface, etc.) then it could be a signal issue if this locomotive is a bit weak in the reception department. Sometimes holding your hand over the locomotive (As was suggested earlier by RickO.) or running an earth-grounded wire to the applicable object, or alongside the track can sometimes solve these problems. As you seem to have improved matters by your attention to the locomotive's antenna, this does seem to point towards a signal issue.

Still having a problem with this.  It also happens when it is running alone with no consist.  Something new happened yesterday. It run 1 loop and when I stopped it and tried to reverse it it would not run in reverse, then it would not run in forward.  After I shut it down and turned off the power and waited a few minutes it ran but if I stopped it it would repeat the process of not running.  Any ideas?

thanks

doug

Now it's sounding like it could be either the R2LC or the DCDR.  It could also be the connection between the R2LC and DCDR, check the smaller 4 pin cable at both ends.

John will do in a bit and post back.

Also, good to see you again at Trainstock

Thanks  Doug

That was the first time I saw that layout, it's something to behold!  It was embarrassing, I kept losing my train!

Well no luck.  I did find the R2Lc board was not seated by about 1/8 in.  I though that might be it but after running for about 2-3 min. I stopped it and it would not go in reverse or forward.

Doug 

If you have the parts, or can borrow one from another locomotive, try swapping the R2LC from another engine.  Note that you'll have to do a full reset of it when you do the swap.  You can also test the R2LC in the other locomotive and see if the problem moves with the part.  Next would be the DCDR I would guess.  Those two parts, and the associated wiring, are about all that is in the picture for what you're seeing.  Of course, check the antenna connection as well.

One question, is the headlight blinking at any time?

Yes there is a slight flicker occasionally.

Doug

Doug. 

Sorry this is an issue. I am grateful that I didn't sell it to you. Ours run great.

can you say more about what you did to the smoke unit?

Mr Muffin, I drilled out the hole for the air intake on the smoke unit.  I don't remember what size bit I used, but not large enough to touch any burried wires. 

I believe that Mike has a video on the Lionel web site explaining this.  It makes a big difference. I have done this to most of my non-Legacy steamers.  Alex M has done some also.

doug

I've drilled a few of my TMCC smoke units, none of them have complained.

Doug, did you try swapping the R2LC to see if you could narrow down where the issue is?  How about checking the antenna closely, and making sure it's not shorted to the shell?

Dumb question:  Have you removed the shell, connected a 12" wire to the antenna connection, and run it around that way?  I'd be curious if it ever has a problem without the shell (and of course any antenna issues as a result).

John, I have not tried exchanging the r2lc board yet.  I have run the engine without the shell, I didn't realize I could do that, it has the same problem.  Maybe this week I'll be able to borrow a board from another unit.

doug

If you added an antenna with the shell off and it has the same issue, my next step would be the the R2LC swap to either indite or eliminate it as the issue.

Are all R2LC boards interchangeable?

Doug

In general, but look at the firmware version on the board.  For instance, here's one of the later ones, the C13 firmware.  Many are the C08 firmware, that's what I find in most of my TMCC stuff.  However, if you have a C08 in this locomotive and a newer board, say a C11 or C13, it'll work well enough to test this issue.  There is no damage danger in mixing them, at least I've never seen or heard of any.  I know the C11 had a compatibility issue with the ERR Cruise Commander, but no damage results, just didn't work right.  I've used the C08 in a lot of places in place of the earlier versions and everything worked just fine.

John it has C13 in it.  I had a C08 and put it in and nothing happened, would not move.  I don't know if the old C08 is bad or not.  Also before I tried swaping the boards the engine would not go into reverse at all, just forward.  Would that indicate a motor board problem, or still possibly a R2LC problem?

Doug

One direction running would point to the DCDR, though it could be the R2LC.  Also, any connections between them need looking at.  Since that's a cable, examine it closely to see that there is continuity all the way to the DCDR.