LIONEL NYC 20th Century Hudson question #6-8406

Let me say I do not consider myself an expert on the NYC.  However I believe the streamlined engines and cars arrived in June 1938.  I did look at my copy of Al Staufer's book Steam Power of the NYC System.  On page 113 there is a picture of a non-streamlined Hudson pulling streamlined cars on the Empire State  Express and below that picture is a non-streamlined Hudson pulling the 20th Century Limited with a lead heavyweight car followed by what appear to be streamlined cars.  However the date is not given.  Given the heavy traffic loads of WWII who knows what pulled what and what pulled what as the diesels were arriving.

I’m not sure 100% about the 20th Century Limited, but in my copy of NYC Power by Jerry A. Pinkepank, there are several photos of NYC two tone gray smooth sided streamlined passenger cars pulled by unstreamlined J series Hudsons.

Most of these trains photographed were for the Mercury in the mid 1940’s, including J1E number 5340 (which Lionel made in 1990).

You might have seen an unstreamlined Hudson pulling the cars you reference in the 1950s. By then the NYC had removed the streamlining from most if not all of their streamlined Hudsons. Those cars are in the 1948 paint scheme BTW? Not likely it would have been the 20th Century train though as that was pulled by Diesels in the '50s. The Hudsons still pulled local trains of mixed passenger cars.

The streamline Dreyfuss Hudson debut in 1938 with matching streamline cars. The 1938 and 1940 cars would have had their grays reversed from the 1948 cars. That is light gray with a dark gray stripe across the windows.

Pete

Bruce E. Vincelette posted:

Question:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6WGjEq-I6M 

 

In 1985, Lionel introduced the NYC Hudson #6-8406. It was an O scale model of locomotive used for the 20th Century Limited from 1927 to 1938. To complete the train, Lionel offered a six car streamlined passenger set with aluminum bodies: #6-9694, #6-9505, #6-9696, #6-9597, #6-9598 and #6-19137.

Within that time frame would the NYC 20th Century Hudson (NOT a streamlined Commodore Vanderbilt, 1935) have as its consist a streamlined passenger set, or did Lionel introduce a car set that their #6-8406 would not have headed?

If you can answer my question, no speculations please, I would be most appreciative.

The NYC 20th Century Ltd streamlined passenger cars had there first run on June 15, 1938. Lionel Hudson 6-8406 has number 783, a number not used for any Hudson by the NYC so this cannot be seen as a specific Hudson locomotive; i.e. you can run it with whatever you like. The video shows an upgraded version of this Lionel Hudson with number 5344. Hudson 5344 was the Hudson which was streamlined in 1935 as Commodore Vanderbilt and run like that until 1945; it was built in 1931. In 1945 Commodore Vanderbuilt was rebuilt with Dreyfuss streamlining. So a non-streamlined Hudson with number 5344 cannot be run with a streamlined consist.

I do not know whether this answers your question (it is no speculation anyway)?

Regards

Fred

Note: In our model world we can do what we like of course (like Lionel does), so I ran a model of Commodore Vanderbilt and Hudson 5344 in the same train: