PENNSYLVANIA LEGACY K-4 LOCOMOTIVE WITH LONG HAUL TENDER

Mine has been a solid, reliable runner. I haven't experienced any issues. No complaints here.

I saw where new K-4s are arriving now in stores. I saw one yesterday in a train shop. The owner told me it had just arrived. It was really nice, but it is TMCC not Legacy. I want to stay with Legacy.

I run TMCC... just curious, what does legacy do for you that TMCC lacks? Wondering if/when I should upgrade.

First let me say - TMCC is awesome. The reasons I want to stay with Legacy are:

1. I just got back into model railroading after being away from it for a long time. I started from scratch with no equipment. Since I was going to be buying new equipment, I decided that I wanted Lionel’s most advanced system, which is Legacy.

2. The Legacy Command CAB2 remote is absolutely amazing, offering more control over locomotives than available with TMCC remote controls.

3. You can control roughly 99 locomotives with the CAB2 remote.

4. The Legacy CAB2 is backwards compatible with TMCC, so you have the best of both worlds.

Thanks. I am just curious as to what "more control over locomotives" actually means... 

@HiramO posted:

Thanks. I am just curious as to what "more control over locomotives" actually means...

Comment should be; more features available as well. Lighting, sounds, better cruise, smoke...

Thank you!

We’ll said, Jeff T.

The level of control is just remarkable. Really cool system.

@DILLI posted:

I saw where new K-4s are arriving now in stores. I saw one yesterday in a train shop. The owner told me it had just arrived. It was really nice, but it is TMCC not Legacy. I want to stay with Legacy.

Who makes the K4 you saw at a train shop?….if it’s a Lionel model, they don’t even offer basic TMCC as an option anymore, and haven’t for a long time,……

Pat

It was Lionel.

I asked the owner if it was Legacy and he said no. Now that I am thinking about it, I think it was LionChief not TMCC. It was not Legacy and was selling for less than a Legacy steamer. It was beautiful.

I took a few photos of it.

Lionchief stuff is semi scale,…just an FYI, the K4 you’re inquiring about is a full scale model, with much more details than the LC line, or even LC+ …..you don’t have to be stuck on Legacy alone…yes, Legacy is leaps and bounds over the older TMCC, however, older equipment such as TMCC stuff with Oddesy, can be fairly easily upgraded to cruise, 4 chuffs, and fan smoke. Subsequently, most any MTH model can be upgraded, even to full Legacy by the local Legacy doctors Sid & Bruk….they turn plain ordinary scale models into works of art,……..just an idea for you to explore,……most importantly, have fun!…

Pat

DILLI,

     I believe the TMCC K4 your hobby store has is the TMCC version they had in their 2002 Volume 1 catalog 6-38025 was #1361 and 6-38044 was #5385. If it is unused it has been in the box for a long time. I don’t know about his statement “It just came in” but who knows, I still see the on EBay available as new in the box. The big issue with this engine was the size of the boiler (too big). Our club has a # 5385, it has seen a lot of wear and tear but still runs. Very early railsounds but has a nice whistle.

    If you are looking for a inexpensive version of a K4 look at the Kline K4s that were introduced just before they went under. I have one # 1361 and is identical to the Lionel Legacy K4 which I have two except of course the TMCC in the Kline version and Legacy in the Lionel version. They appear on eBay now and then. Mine has been running since I got it in 2005 or 6 if I remember correctly. The TMCC has only two chuffs per revolution but they can be upgraded to 4 see guys like Alex M or GRJ. Mine now sits in a display case as it is a beautiful locomotive.

JohnB

I’ll speak for the legacy version with long haul tender you asked about. I have one and love it, great engine. Others have had issues with Lionel Legacy K4s and the gearbox, but I run mine often and have had no issues. The long haul tender is unique and sounds are good.

Thanks, everyone, for your contributions. I appreciate everyone’s expertise. I just went on the website for the train store I referenced but never named. The locomotive that I photographed is shown there and is advertised as Lionel’s Lion Chief + 2.0. It is not the Long Haul Tender Legacy version I originally asked about. But I did like it. The owner said he had ordered it a while back and it was delayed coming in, but that it had just arrived. I want to stick with Legacy for all of the reasons shared here by everyone. I hope everyone has a great 2022!

DILLI,

     I never thought about the Lionchief locomotive. I am a scale guy and when I read long haul tender I thought you were talking scale. I guess this could be a compliment for the LionChief model that so many of us were only thinking of scale engines.

JohnB

TedW

My email address should now be displayed in my profile.

I will present an opposing view of this particular model.  It has the infamous K-Line designed chassis with the internal gearbox.  I have replaced a number drive blocks on these, I believe six and counting.  It happens enough that I keep a spare new driveblock in stock so that I don't have to wait for it!  Other than for damage from drops or zinc pest, this is the only model that I've had to replace the whole chassis on.

The problem with this model is an internal gear has a side load due to the gearbox design and works it's way off the shaft.  Although it could probably be repaired by pulling ALL the wheels to be able to remove the internal gears, the amount of labor to do that simply isn't justified.

If you buy this model, I suggest you don't overload it with long consists, as I don't have any faith in it's longevity in heavy use.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I will present an opposing view of this particular model.  It has the infamous K-Line designed chassis with the internal gearbox.  I have replaced a number drive blocks on these, I believe six and counting.  It happens enough that I keep a spare new driveblock in stock so that I don't have to wait for it!  Other than for damage from drops or zinc pest, this is the only model that I've had to replace the whole chassis on.

The problem with this model is an internal gear has a side load due to the gearbox design and works it's way off the shaft.  Although it could probably be repaired by pulling ALL the wheels to be able to remove the internal gears, the amount of labor to do that simply isn't justified.

If you buy this model, I suggest you don't overload it with long consists, as I don't have any faith in it's longevity in heavy use.

GRJ

Just to be 100% sure, are you speaking about the 2016 Lionel Legacy K-4 Long Haul Locomotive/Tender?

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I will present an opposing view of this particular model.  It has the infamous K-Line designed chassis with the internal gearbox.  I have replaced a number drive blocks on these, I believe six and counting.  It happens enough that I keep a spare new driveblock in stock so that I don't have to wait for it!  Other than for damage from drops or zinc pest, this is the only model that I've had to replace the whole chassis on.

The problem with this model is an internal gear has a side load due to the gearbox design and works it's way off the shaft.  Although it could probably be repaired by pulling ALL the wheels to be able to remove the internal gears, the amount of labor to do that simply isn't justified.

If you buy this model, I suggest you don't overload it with long consists, as I don't have any faith in it's longevity in heavy use.

I’ll second that,….problematic for sure,….and yes, it will affect the ones with the long haul tender,…..any of the Lionels with this type of gear box is susceptible to this failure, …fortunately, I do believe it is limited to the K4 at the moment, the problem lies in the intermediate gear in the compound gear box,…..the intermediate gear walks off the final drive, and then either slips and quits engaging, or goes into self destruct mode,…..

Pat