What would you do?

Pictures would help as all I can find is a modern in its box and I don't see a lower cross member on that one. Another idea thou is there a way to raise the tracks coming to it so you could raise the bridge and all by how much clearance you need, or wire them to lift when your train is going under them. Would have to wire a stop for any train that might be coming to the bridge also. 

rtraincollector posted:

Pictures would help as all I can find is a modern in its box and I don't see a lower cross member on that one. Another idea thou is there a way to raise the tracks coming to it so you could raise the bridge and all by how much clearance you need, or wire them to lift when your train is going under them. Would have to wire a stop for any train that might be coming to the bridge also. 

I would tend to think the O.P. issue with the bridge is crossing the span and not going underneath for clearance. 

With that said, I too would need to see a picture of which crossmember and it's location on the bridge. If it's in the tower, it could be ok but if it's in the center span that raises and lowered it may NOT be ok as you might compromise with the strength/rigidity of that center span and it's ability to raise and lower smoothly.

A long time ago there was someone who wrote up a mod that he did for this.  That cross member was removed and I think wire-tied from the top of the moving part of the span so it didn't have a chance to impact cars rolling underneath.  I forget exactly how, but he also raised the entire bridge (or lowered the track - take you pick of how you would like to look at it) to add clearance.

It doesn't take much to hit here.  I found a K-Line smoking caboose had it's smokestack hit.

I'll have to see if I may have a bookmark of a link on another computer later.  I just did a search and didn't find it here.

-Dave

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

rtraincollector posted:

Pictures would help as all I can find is a modern in its box and I don't see a lower cross member on that one. Another idea thou is there a way to raise the tracks coming to it so you could raise the bridge and all by how much clearance you need, or wire them to lift when your train is going under them. Would have to wire a stop for any train that might be coming to the bridge also. 

I would tend to think the O.P. issue with the bridge is crossing the span and not going underneath for clearance. 

With that said, I too would need to see a picture of which crossmember and it's location on the bridge. If it's in the tower, it could be ok but if it's in the center span that raises and lowered it may NOT be ok as you might compromise with the strength/rigidity of that center span and it's ability to raise and lower smoothly.

Thanks for the replies, yes it's the tower cross members that are the problem, although the lowest cross member on the span is very close. I'll have to check each model of auto to be sure. Here are the pictures.

This shows the problem from above, you can see the cross member right in front of the windshield.

Here you can see from track level view that the roof will peel back.

Here I put the  car on the span and slipped the auto through the girders to show that it clears the span girder.

By comparison here is the Lionel Evans Auto loader with the same car, plenty of room.

A sharp eye may pick up the bascule bridge in the background, and yes that too is a problem; but I have a Form D written to restrict auto loaders from the local track passed the streets cut off. So I'll be able to cut an auto carrier off the main and run it on the local track to the Streets interchange where it can be moved through town to the auto dealer siding. 

Dave45681 posted:

A long time ago there was someone who wrote up a mod that he did for this.  That cross member was removed and I think wire-tied from the top of the moving part of the span so it didn't have a chance to impact cars rolling underneath.  I forget exactly how, but he also raised the entire bridge (or lowered the track - take you pick of how you would like to look at it) to add clearance.

It doesn't take much to hit here.  I found a K-Line smoking caboose had it's smokestack hit.

I'll have to see if I may have a bookmark of a link on another computer later.  I just did a search and didn't find it here.

-Dave

Thanks Dave I hope that you find it.

Why don't these companies make bridges and other accessories with a higher clearance. My GG1 all hit the signal &  bridges of all types  both Lionel  & MTH.

Bob ,say the word and I will come to your house and cut up those bridges, we are not going to sell them,after all how much longer do you think we have to go, the way things are going last time I checked I think I am going first, Its a good thing I have Eddie to lower me down. Just kidding. Are you coming to york with us  we will have a good time

Well you can cut it out and make an arched replacement girder that will allow the car haulers to pass.

Jushavnfun posted:

Why don't these companies make bridges and other accessories with a higher clearance. My GG1 all hit the signal &  bridges of all types  both Lionel  & MTH.

Actually, my MTH scale GG1 does fine under the 213.

Jim53 posted:

Bob ,say the word and I will come to your house and cut up those bridges, we are not going to sell them,after all how much longer do you think we have to go, the way things are going last time I checked I think I am going first, Its a good thing I have Eddie to lower me down. Just kidding. Are you coming to york with us  we will have a good time

Jim,

I know you will; besides I have some repairs lined up and I'm picking up 10 more railrax at York.
I've been waiting for a visit. Ritchie keeps say that you're all coming but I think he got beamed up.
I'll be flying solo on Friday, hope to meet for breakfast. hopefully not the Round the Clock.

with this bridge being show in the 2002 catalog it just proves that even if Lionel said they made 1/48 cars they did not measure something correct.

http://www.lionel.com/products...lift-bridge-6-14167/

we had a custom made bridge that let most cars pass in the 2002 to 2005 time frame but as cars got bigger they tore that bridge up.

we ended up replacing it with 8 inch clearance steel bridge, nothing hits now.

I agree with PHIL0426 idea, measure the maximum height of the car from top of rail, remove the existing structural shape, either a I beam or channel, make a taller I beam or channel with the bottom flange and web cut out  for clearance, and glue in position on bridge.

You  should be able to use Plastruct or Evergreen strip and sheet stock to make this beam, use a styrene cement/glue to make this beam and for attachment to the bridge. This type of modifications are applied to actual structures as clearance requirements change this beam in actual practice would require a  structural analysis for stress and welded attachment to the columns. So following this method would add additional interest to the bridge.   

One final comment, this method would work for a plastic bridge assembly, I do not know if this Lionel bridge is plastic or metal, if metal you can fabricate a soldered brass beam assembly, your local Hobby Lobby carries K&S Metal brass sheet stock, pricing is okay. This metal can be cut with tin snips and soldered 18 to 20 gauge material would be okay to use in my opinion.

bigdodgetrain posted:

with this bridge being show in the 2002 catalog it just proves that even if Lionel said they made 1/48 cars they did not measure something correct.

 ...........

I'm pretty sure they never claimed the bridge was supposed to be scale or necessarily have clearance for all scale equipment. 

True, they could have designed it to have a bit more clearance, but this was approached from an o gauge toy accessory standpoint (like most accessories Lionel has made).

Supposedly this accessory is pretty close (intentionally) to the design of the original post-war piece that never was produced beyond a prototype.  Obviously, most of these larger rolling stock pieces did not exist back then.

Point is, I'm not so sure it's that "they did not measure something correct", more that they weren't trying to re-design the PW prototype to make it big enough to clear all modern rolling stock.

There certainly were not dual level MTH auto carriers at that point.  I don't think anyone is pretending the traditional sized Evans Auto Loader car that does fit is a scale piece - it's the post war traditional design.

-Dave

The member who did the bridge modification is Alan Nelson. His "handle" is alanrail. He lives in Des Plaines, IL. His phone number is 630-530-4161. He is a structural engineer by training.

pennsyfan posted:

This shows the problem from above, you can see the cross member right in front of the windshield.

 

Bob,

Cut that cross member out.

While many of the above mentioned structural modifications/reinforcements would be necessary if this were an actual real world bridge, in the model train world, no reinforcing is needed if you remove that cross member.  The bridge will be plenty strong without it.

Stu

I would not cut that beautiful bridge to sake an incorrectly scaled car. Get rid of the car.

Tin

I recommend using the contact info TURBGINE provided, as I could not find a link to the write up on my other PC.  It might have been many versions of Forum software ago, so I may have made a printout for myself, but I could not find a link.

-Dave

Both the older 313 bascule Bridge, also the newer 313 and the 213 bridges are not designed for the newer scale auto carrier cars, inter-modal cars, Crane cars, etc. They do look good, but that’s the extent of things. In 1992-1993 there was a scale lift bridge, Lionel 6-12782 I think, which works wonders for most all engines and rolling stock, it’s availabl sometimes at shows and on the For Sale Forum. I would replace the bridges with the Atlas O bridges. 

Have you considered shipping only convertibles on those carriers?

<tongue in cheek> Just a thought....

Don Merz