Wireless systems

CB CSX posted:

I'm new to the forum and i am starting a new layout after over a ten year break from model railroading.  I have had large N scale and HO layouts and now going to go with o gauge. My question is what wireless system to go with and why ? I am looking to run 2 mainlines and a yard at the same time.

Me being out of it for so long theres alot of new technology that has made its way into the hobby. 

Another thing i am noticing is the different sizes of cars supposed to be O gauge. Confusing the heck out of me😦

Thanks for your help !!

really only you can answer that question.

both systems MTH and Lionel have their good and bad points.

buy what you like and that will determine the system you need and it might mean you need both.

Both Lionel and MTH systems are very good.  While similar, they are different and cannot run each others equipment.  They do, however, coexist just fine.  I have both so I can run whatever I like.

After running HO and N the shock of O is how much space is needed.  Essentially, O comes in two sizes, traditional or semi-scale and scale.  In traditional you can make a circle as small as 27" diameter,  In scale you will find many locomotives with minimum that require 48", 54" and even 72" diameter so, you are going to need some real estate.

Which ever you choose you will find both well represented in this forum along with lots of people ready to help, should you need it.  Welcome.

Years ago I jumped in on Lionel Trainmaster when it was released.  Then Mth came out with DCS which I liked better plus their locomotives in the 2000 era were more to my liking ,so that was my preference for the next few years . After being out of the hobby for 8 years I noe an impressed with Lionel  engines and their Legacy and Lionchief equipment. 

This is now my preferred operating mode. I like the wireless and conventional potions  and I own many older trainmaster engines I can run with my legacy remote, however when I want to run conventional trainmaster I must unplug the legacy power, so the signal doesn't confuse the engines electronics. I really enjpy operating lionchief engines, conventional , renote, and newer ones bluetooth. 

Buy them both and build your layout for DCS. The systems are not interchangeable and you will want to buy locos from both manufacturers. Legacy will run everything TMCC & Legacy from Lionel, atlas and 3rd Rail, DCS will run everything from MTH that is PS2 or newer. Don’t let the TMCC/Legacy feature on the DCS system fool you, you sill need the legacy system to use that functionality.

They both work. The Legacy (formerly TMCC, and there is backwards equipment compatibility) is less fussy, less bothered by dirty track and wiring issues (there are none, really) and, to me, just all-around more friendly. But - I use the older TMCC, not Legacy, and Legacy can be more complicated than TMCC - but you are not required to use these features. I just run my locos with it - throttle, direction, brakes, couplers. That's all I find of interest.

A Lionel "Legacy Lite" system would be the place to start there.

I do have an MTH DCS Remote Commander that I occasionally use. It's a cheap way (do they still make it?) to dabble in it.

CB CSX,

   Lots of new and different remote control engineering has been developed sense you 1st ran your layouts.

I ran DCS for years until Lionel came out with FasTrack low voltage Command Control Switches that can run directly from Track power and are controlled directly from the Legacy Cab2 or the TMCC Ca1L HHRC's.    I also like the Legacy Engines big time.

Matt gives great advise, if you have the money, purchase both DCS and Legacy, you will eventually want both as your layout grows.  If you want to keep your money expenditure down, start with DCS and later add Legacy.  However it's hard for me to not have the incredible FasTrack Command Control Switches operating all overly Train Room, they are IMO the best engineering to come along in our hobby in many many years.

Have fun making your decisions.

PCRR/Dave

Thanks for all the info guys. I am gathering much info on everything and started looking at layouts and getting ideas.

As far as the wireless goes looks like i am going to start off with a lionel universal remote to operate three locos simultaneously. From what i am reading the remote will control any blue tooth legacy,ironchief + or lionchief locomotives. This will be a good start for me as i have alot of building supplies to get. Once up and running i will upgrade i think.I will be using the garage/mancave (24x24) for the new layout and look forward to getting to work.

Thanks

    Trey

Trey, I think that's a prudent decision and that was my decision too.  Everything in the 2018 Lionel catalog is Bluetooth so I think that's the wave of the future.  Also, on the MTH side, consider an MTH DCS Explorer.  It's $125 or less and will give you basic DCS wireless capability of any DCS equipped MTH engine (that is, if you have any).  Take your time with your layout and you may find in the near future that you don't need Legacy or DCS.

CB CSX posted:

I'm new to the forum and i am starting a new layout after over a ten year break from model railroading.  I have had large N scale and HO layouts and now going to go with o gauge. My question is what wireless system to go with and why ? I am looking to run 2 mainlines and a yard at the same time.

Me being out of it for so long theres alot of new technology that has made its way into the hobby. 

Another thing i am noticing is the different sizes of cars supposed to be O gauge. Confusing the heck out of me😦

Thanks for your help !!

First, on the size issue. The O-Gauge (3-rail for the most part) hobby is now segmented into O-Scale (1:48) and Traditional/Non-Scale/Semi-Scale. Some grammar Nazis on this forum get upset with the phrase semi-scale since things are either scale or not, but I digress. The additional challenge with this distinction is that true "Scale" means scale dimensions as well as details. Some Traditional items are close to scale size (1:48) but not in detail. Let confusion reign.

Generally speaking, it's a good idea to make the scale vs. non-scale decision as part of your technology decision. Going scale IMO means spending more money and requiring more space. My feeling has always been that scale requires the space to have 72" or greater diameter curves although some will run on smaller.

For that and other reasons, I've stuck with Traditional which will generally run on 31" curves, some as tight as 27" (once widely known as O27 gauge or scale).  In truth, though, I don't like using anything less than 42" curves even though more than half of my equipment is rated for 27" and the balance for 31". The overhang of my 10" - 13" O27 rolling stock and passenger cars is noticeable on 27"-34" curves. I imagine others running 18" scale passenger cars must see similar overhang on 54" or 60" curves.

Also, I've found that MTH's Railking line for Traditional is a bit larger, car for car, than Lionel, WBB, and other defunct manufacturers like K-Line and Industrial Rail. If you go traditional, you have to be careful mixing RailKing with others. For example, RailKing cabooses look ridiculous with other traditional rolling stock.

From a technology perspective, if you go Traditional, there is still some Lionel TMCC equipment out there on the new-old-stock and used markets at deep discount prices. You can buy a used TMCC engine for 1/3 - 1/2 what they sold for originally. For new, you'll need to go with LionChief Plus which appears to be moving to BlueTooth. Many other manufacturers use/used Lionel's TMCC system for scale and semi-scale.

If you go Scale with Lionel, the system will be Legacy, the newest version of TMCC.  As others have pointed out, scale and semi-scale from MTH  use the DCS system. The nice thing about scale is that adherence to 1:48 dimensions makes it easier to use multiple brands interchangeably. 

Raising4daughters has provided a good strong synopsis of O.  Good stuff.  Only thing I'd expand on is: scale Lionel is all Bluetooth as of the latest catalog.  That's what I was referring to in my previous post.  So if you're interested in a scale look but not necessarily every bell & whistle, then no need to invest in the Legacy control system.  You can get Legacy engines and still get a lot of wireless fun via Bluetooth.  Later you can decided whether adding the Legacy system is worth it to you or (as I'm wishfully thinking) Legacy will just go away and everybody will use Bluetooth!

My only problem with the Bluetooth is my phones time out then everything stops. I don't want to readjust settings.  So I have to remember to touch screen.

  When my Legacy goes to sleep I just hit the horn and it's back on.

It's your railroad ....... run what you like and have fun.

My only problem with the Bluetooth is my phones time out then everything stops. I don't want to readjust settings.  So I have to remember to touch screen.

You can set iOS devices to never time out, if you desire. I Expect that the same s true of Android devices.

Wireless????  Ain't nothing wireless about any system.  I bought five 500' spools of copper wire in 5 different colors to wire my layout. 

Dennis