Beware of the US Post Office package acceptance of FedEx and UPS Packages.

I made my first eBay purchase in many years just recently (a Lionel TMCC Heisler), and paid via PayPal (which I never use) through my AMEX card.  Being a "new" eBay buyer and a "never" PayPal user, I felt very safe with this transaction thanks to my AMEX card.  All went well and I even took the time to leave very positive feedback for the seller.

 

I also buy a whole lot of stuff (train and mostly non-train) via Amazon.com, and every purchase there is made with one or the other of my AMEX cards.  Since I am enrolled in Amazon Prime ($80 a year os so, as I recall), shipping is always free and very prompt.  No complains whatsoever about the service received, and those AMEX reward points just keep accumulating.

Hi Allen, My experience is that Amex sides 100% with the customer every time. Refunds immediately. And then does its own investigation. Never had them do anything else but the right thing. And they will call me whenever a questionable or unusual charge or pattern of charges happens. And while they may not cover the laptop batteries for warranty reasons, I am pretty sure that if the issue was that they were never received, they would refund the buyers money. Fred

Every single box I receive from the post office is damaged.

Does not matter what is in it or where it is shipped from.

I truly hate the fact that so many places ship USPS versus UPS, but I know the shipping costs with UPS have gone way up. So far no damage to contents, but it makes me wonder who is doing the damage?

The post office, the planes that carry the mail, mail trucks?

We ship most of our Ameri-Towne and other products via UPS.  I believe there's even a flat $5 shipping charge "special" in effect that expires soon (I'm not sure about the deadline).  Can't beat that!

Thanks Allan, checking it out asap!

A month or so ago I sent a package Priority from San Jose CA to Portland OR.  Should have been 2 days, took 8.  I was more worried about damage than timing and it arrived perfect so...

 

I have an acquaintance who is a dog person and also an Amex person.  Over the past 15 years she has been dissatisfied with the services of every single veterinarian in her local area at least once.  Sure Amex has refunded her money and she has now been blacklisted from every single veterinarian with 50 miles.  They will no longer accept her business even for cash.

Scott,

 

Talk to the local Postmaster.

.....

Dennis

Sounds entirely reasonable to me.  My dog's vet doesn't take AMEX.  I pay with CareCredit (extended payments; no interest).

Hi Scott, maybe you should call the Postal Inspecters office. Even if the PO is not legally esponsible somebody accepted your packages fraudulently.

That dose not sound guilt free to me.

Try this link and see if you can get some help.

 

https://www.usps.com/customer-...customer-service.htm

 

Good luck buddy, sorry to read about this problem.

For those that don't know, each shipping company use one another to get packages to their destination. 

 

Even ups uses the USPS to deliver packages to out of the way addresses. Fedx does the same. The USPS uses both ups and fedx and others to transport their packages around the country. All 3 use contractors for delivery also In places they don't go.

 

So you see blaming one company for problems is not always correct. 

I have post office box since I live at the of a rural road and long driveway.  So I don't really understand why a vendor would not ship to a POB.  I wouldn't like my packages left where my mail box would have to be, in fact I'm not too crazy about packages left on my porch by UPS and FedEx when I'm not home.

Larry

Well hello, if she was disappointed, why does she care if she is blacklisted by someone who sucks. Sounds like she does not have good negotiating skills or unrealistic expectations. Not sure what your point is. Fred

I may have a resolution coming. FedEx called me to tell me they have the packages. It appears they dropped them off at the Post Office and then a FedEx employee picked up the from FedEx boxes instead of the to FedEx boxes at that post office. So they are going to redeliver them tomorrow.

Scott Smith

Glad to hear that your packages have been found.  I usually have my train shipments delivered to the local UPS distribution center for this very reason.  

Maybe, just maybe, the problem isn't with the veterinarians...

 

Rusty

That's what I thought, as well.

The simple solution would be to have somebody sign for the package when picking it up.

I can't even recall the last time I received a train order that didn't require a signature.  UPS and FedEx in particular.  I don't receive a whole lot of package deliveries via USPS.

 

ALL of my train-related orders are delivered to the office.  Even non-train orders are delivered there.  No point in having them delivered to my home because I'm rarely there when UPS or FedEx delivers, even though my neighbors would be happy to sign for them and hold onto them until I get home.  I often do the same for them.

So, this whole thread started as a complaint against the Post Office when it was actually a mistake by FedEx?

 

I'm curious how the Post Office "signed" for the items and then FedEx was able to take them back. Sounds like someone needs to change a procedure if that was truly the case. We were just starting this "sharing" of delivery workload when I retired, so I never saw how things were done by the clerks involved. However, even though I worked for them for over 14 years, I won't defend the Post Office. Unfortunately, they are like any government agency who promotes from within, bad carriers become bad supervisors, etc. In those 14 years I saw a lot of good people succumb to poor supervision and the constant drive to do more with less mentality. It's a piece-rate operation and route inspectors always find a way to increase the workload and forced overtime is routine, even while they are supposedly downsizing.

 

Just last week I knew I had a package coming that day or the next and I actually said Hi to the carrier, but no package. About 10 minutes later, here she comes with it. She missed it because she had packages for the neighbor and didn't make a note that she had packages for more than one resident at that set of mailboxes. So much is left to the carrier to figure out and there is absolutely no guidance on how to do things. And unlike UPS/FedEx, the mail trucks are simply shells, not designed for managing package delivery at all.

 

As for the vet, we have a lady down the street from us who took over a year to finalize the colors to paint her house and actually had major parts of it painted 3-4 times. She also had a fence redone several times because she kept changing the design and type of block facing she wanted. Some people just can't be pleased. I realize that's probably a OCD disease, but AmEx shouldn't have had to waste resources on it.

I think you'll find there's issues with ALL of the package delivery services at one time or another.  The odds of potential shipping damage or loss increase with more usage, particularly as folks are relying on mail order/internet/auction sites for their purchases.

 

Rusty

the post office does not own their own planes.  most damage is done when the items are given to the airlines, most mail is flown by fedex and because they have items much heavier smaller items get smashed.  which is why packing said items is sooooo important.

But that costs the delivery service significant time and money. Shipping costs are high enough already and no one wants to charge/pay more. Can you imagine if someone had to sign for EVERY package? Not just from the Post Office, but all those drop & ring deliveries by UPS/FedEx. Most of us think of a package as a fairly large box, but a package is ANYTHING that won't fit in a mailbox, and even that depends on what kind of box the resident has, especially those multiple delivery units with relatively small slots. They're great for magazines, but not for anything larger than a single box of checks. And that doesn't consider the number of recipients who are not home to sign. That means a redelivery or pickup, more time and money.

If you ship a costly item to a buyer, go with "Adult Signature Required" every time.

 

The signature takes just seconds to process with those electronic gizmos all UPS and FedEx delivery persons carry with them.  Provides verification that the package was delivered, and to whom it was delivered.  It's your own darn fault (as a seller or buyer) if you don't take advantage of the protection the signature requirement offers.

I'm curious how the Post Office "signed" for the items and then FedEx was able to take them back. Sounds like someone needs to change a procedure if that was truly the case.

That's my concern now. FedEx shows the name of the postal employee who signed for the packages. The problem is someone let them remove those same packages. It looks to me that would be a way for the perfect package theft. They need to lock down their procedures

Scott Smith

Here is an option:  self-investigate this and present that information to the Postal Inspector's Office, I would encourage you to do the following:

1. Request from the offending post Office a copy of the written procedures that the postal employee is supposed to follow with this half-baked FedEx/USPS delivery process. 
2. When those procedures say that the employee does X, Y and Z before releasing the package, ask to see proof of that - in writing/signatures/video
3. When they refuse to provide and/or provide the inevitable litany of excuses, go to the Postal Inspector

Why?  The procedures, the signatures, the proof and the video are all available to the postal inspector and will provide evidence of what could be at the minimum stupidity and at worse an out right 'insider' theft.

 

The Postal Inspector's Office is supposed to pursue cases of waste, fraud and abuse of position.  Looks to me like you have 1 or 2 of those, possibly (I said possibly - and that is based on what you have stated and my experience).  Postal Inspector will find out what happened as they have that supreme authority - but you have to layout a solid case because what you experienced - if a fraud - is the tip of the iceberg.  If the best case - just stupidity - then you have someone not following procedures.  In either case, the USPS is on the hook for compensating you.

 

One other item - I can't recall if you mentioned this.  If you paid by credit card, contact the credit card company.  The bottom line is that you have not received your goods.  End of discussion.  None of the "well, FedEx delivered" or the shipper saying "we did our part".  You have rights with a CREDIT CARD (not a debit card, but credit card) and can dispute this up to 60 days after the billing date.  I would pursue this angle concurrently with any other approach you take.

 

It all may sound aggressive but the only one that is looking out for you is you.  Do not get caught up in anything other than the facts.  Do not accept verbal assurances from anyone.  Take copious notes of conversations including names, dates and times.  Keep in mind that all the parties involved basically hope someone else takes responsibility or that you just capitulate and go away.

 

Let us know how it goes.  Contact me off line if you want to discuss more.

 

 

I once knew a person who was continually dissatisfied with services or purchases provided by nearly every vendor / store that he bought something from.  This person was basically a consumer crook who was always blackmailing vendors to get free or discounted services and  items.  He would cancel the plumber's credit card payment, for example, for scratching a pipe under the sink while repairing a drain.  In some cases he would sue in small claims court for perceived defects in services.  Not a single vendor who knew him would work for him twice.

 

It sounds as if your acquaintance falls into the consumer crook category.  I really believe that people in this category are totally dishonest and a thief.  I think that the vets are correct to blackball your acquaintance.

 

Joe

Hi Rusty, Of course it was not the "all" the vets problem. But it could have been one or two bad ones in the lot. Clearly the women has an issue. But the humor is that if the women is dissatisfied with "all" the vets, then why should she care if they blackball her. In her mind the all "suck". Otherwise she would not have filed the claims. No judgement. Just the observation that she should of attempted to resolve ( negotiate) first with the vets. Amex is not stupid and they do catch on. And sometimes they will refund the consumer ( to keep the relationship) but also pay the vendor ( depending on the situation) All situations have two sides to the story and then there is the truth.

It's not one or two, it's more like 10.  She's a dog person, they are her children, if they come out of an experience at a vet in pain or she thinks they were treated roughly or something like that she is dissatisfied.  

 

And like I said, it was over a 15 year period.  If you haven't been "dissatisfied" with lots of stuff over the past 15 years you either lead a charmed life or you have a high threshold for dissatisfied or you don't do much.  

 

In this specific case of this thread would you be telling Amex you were dissatisfied had you paid through them?  She would.  I would not.  I think Scott has every right to be dissatisfied.

 

Also, she has no interest in dealing with their internal problems, and neither would I.  All shipping carriers have issues and I have issues with all of them.  They know it.  If you think you are going to change the way they do business or have any impact on them whatsoever your dreaming.  No business works that way anymore.  Even killing someone is just an insurance payout number.

 

 It's the threshold for "dissatisfied" I have an issue with.  It's not thievery doing exactly as they describe.  If you call Amex to complain about something they just refund your money, withhold it from the payee and tell them it's up to them to prove otherwise.  Not even so much as a "have you talked to them about it?"  Not even a description of the dissatisfaction.

 

The same is true for Paypal.  It'll only happen to you once and from then on you will document every step of a sale through Paypal.  They say it's good business but I think it's bull.  To have to take apart something that is used to prove everything inside was present and not physically damaged (like command electronics) is too far in my book.

Maybe I'm dense, or stupid, or just tired, but the above post makes no sense to me.  

What dose this have to do with the post?

I have never been disatisfied enough with a vendor that I would file a claim with my credit card company.  I've had credit cards for the last 41 years.

 

Larry

Just so you know. UPS/FEDEX/DHL/USPS Using best industries practices All use each other to keep cost down and profits up. I have had packages delivered thru the other carriers(especially DHL) that have originated with the USPS. DHL which is owned by the German Bundespost has working contracts with USPS, Royal Mail Service(UK)France, most of Europe to deliver parcels. FEDEX and UPS in addition have contracts with the USPS. Most airmail with in the US is moved through FEDEX I believe. All international mail through DHL. If the post office decides to separate the packages from the mail delivery which will be cost effective if they get the approval to ship Alcohol and other items that are currently prohibited. DHL will most likely get the contract.   

 

Doug

I have talked with a mail carrier who is a friend of mine a few years back. This is what he said to do; insure your package everytime or they will physically kick it around in the mail terminal. When you insure it, whoever handles the package has to sign for it everytime they touch it, and this makes people more responsible, so almost no damage gets done to it.

 

Lee Fritz

My contact at the Post Office says that heavily-insured items receive the worst treatment. If a handler sees an insurance tag, he or she will afford the package the drop & kick protocol, just to be obstinate. He says he has never heard of the "every time someone touches it" method of package accountability.

Sort of off-topic but Post Office related; Do not accept a postal money order from somebody that you don't know if it comes by FedEx. I was stung a couple years ago by fake postal money orders, only $15.00 for bounced checks. Also FedEx tried to get me to pay for COD, cash on delivery, and overnight shipment of these money orders, but I told them it was sent by somebody else and I refused to pay for it.

 

Lee Fritz

Oddly enough, it's not you this time - much of this entire topic falls under the "makes no sense" category.

 

I'm still working on understanding why anyone wants Fed-Ex (or UPS) to be delivering to a USPS mailbox.  Both Fed-ex and UPS will hold deliveries at their site for pick-up and you can arrange that through the web with the tracking numbers.  There's no need to worry about stuff sitting on a porch using any of these companies or USPS if you set it up for signature deliver or set it up to be held at their offices for pick-up.

 

The last think I'd think anyone would want to do is cross-connect any of these operations.   

Makes no sense categories are what makes this forum this forum. 

By coincidence, I just had the first instance of the post office delivering a UPS packag to me this past week. I was following the progress of the item (a Lionel car, btw) from Pennsylvania and then, when it arrived in Los Angeles, the notice came up that it had been transferred to the local post office for delivery. The notice also said that this "might delay the delivery by one or two days." Who knew? Anyway, I did receive the package the next day in my regular mail, so all is well.

As far as I am concerned, the more transfers a package makes on its route to you, the more chance there is for something to go wrong. Same as taking an airplane trip -- non-stop is always the best choice, if available.

Are we done yet? Package delivered. Not sure how to "beware of the Post Office" anyway. There is risk getting out of bed in the morning. Not sure how to "beware" of that either. If I do not get out of bed, I guess I will be less likely to get accidentally electrocuted running my trains. LOL. Fred