Damaged MTH Z1000

I believe it says 6 amp maximum. Sounds to me like you mixed / paralleled the z1000 output with another track controller.  I would think if you did not connect the transformers correctly they should have tripped the circuit breakers.

It does say 6 amps max. I see the plug where the transformer plugs in the back and where the black/red connections are. The transformer is separate from the controller. 

A couple of questions -

1. What is the date code on the bottom of the PH180?
2. if you are not using the controller with the Z1000 -the track power wires (barrel connector) will output 19-20v.
3. Are you getting 19volts from the 14v ACC screw terminals on the Z1000 brick?

Both have polarized plugs for the 120v.

The smooth wire on the output cord of the PH180 is hot. That would be the center wire in the plug or the one closest to the pointed end.

The neutral or common has ribs or is marked.

Pretty sure problem is with the Z1000 controller.

I had to look up which wire on the PH180 was hot/common and learned the common wire is ribbed and I connected the PH accordingly.

I think the PH date code is 2009 23

i am using the MTH controller with the Z1000 brick.  I think I shorted something in the controller as that is where I am getting 19 volts no matter where the throttle is set.

i am getting 13.8 volts from the Z1000 brick accessory connections

I will take some static tests of my z1000 with an ohm meter and post back the readings so you can compare them with yours.

Ok, I was asking about the PH180 because an early production run 2000 48 and earlier had the polarity reversed.

Ok, so you need a controller or a controller repair. It appears the transformer is fine. 19v track and 14 ACC is correct.

I don't know how to tell how to fix it. Search around for one as many people don't use them and may have one around. Check the For sale forum with an advanced search.

maybe Pops can tell you how to repair it. His is the same.

Pops,

I have one if you want another set of readings. Are you just measuring the output with no power?

I appreciate all the help.

My dilemna is I'm not sure I want to phase the Z1000 with the PH. I'm not sure I have to phase them with my set up (PH for track power, Z1000 for switches).  I tried to phase them because I have Ross switches wired for non derailing and I don't want to fry an engine. The polarity must be reversed on one of them. When I had them phased, I was getting 36 volts when I checked voltage across the hots on both transformers when the Z1000 was working and throttle was all the way up. Right now I have the PH phased with a Lionel 1033. I have the 1033 set at 10 volts, the PH is 18 and I get 8 volts across the hots. Is this correct? 

This is a no power static test. Very easy. You have the power in and power out. 4 connections.

*Static means no power (except for your volt/ohmmeter)

Doing this test there is nothing connected to the Z1000 at all.

All the Z1000 is doing is switching the hot  IN (center pin on Z1000 power IN)  from the transformer to the RED output terminal which you would connect to the track. (The output is between this connection and controls the output). The flat ground (flat part on Z1000 power IN) is common to the black output.

**So with an ohmmeter you should  have very high resistance between the Hot IN center pin (Z1000 Input connector) to the RED output. If it's very low the output is shorted.

If you test between the flat input side of the power in connector to the black output connector you should have very low, close to 0 ohms. This is normal.

Transformer ---------> Flat Pin      ------> Black output terminal ( Common / ground,  very low ohm, close to 0)

Transformer ---------> Center Pin ------> z1000 ------> output to Red terminal ( Hot ) .

My Z1000 also reads .5k ohms ( 500 ohms ) between the output terminals.

Hope this helps.

Thanks Pops

**So with an ohmmeter you should have very high resistance between the Hot IN center pin (Z1000 Input connector) to the RED output. If it's very low the output triac is shorted.  I have no resistance here. 

Sounds like the triac is shorted. 

I also have no resistance on the ground side.  Sounds like this is normal.  I do have 500 ohms of resistance between the two outputs.

It can be repaired. It sounds to me like / somehow maybe you have connected the outputs of controllers together.

What I posted was how to troubleshoot outside the controller. To determine good/bad. The internal workings are proprietary property of MTH.  I would have it professionally repaired. Locomotives are to expensive to replace.

That's exactly what I did. I touched the 2 hots hot together to test the phasing per Mike Reagans video on phasing transformers. 

Take a look at this OGR thread.  It shows a photo of the guts of a Z-1000 controller and identifies the relevant parts which chop/switch the AC voltage.  As the pic shows, recent MTH controllers (including the TIU variable voltage channel) use a pair of transistors rather than the above-mentioned triac. 

In any event, these are low-cost components ($1-2 each) that can be replaced if you're handy with a soldering iron.  Or, if you are patient you will find the Z-1000 controller by itself available on eBay or here on OGR Buy-Sell from someone who previously used the Z-1000 controller and since moved on to command-control and now only needs the "brick".  The going price of just the controller might be less than getting it professionally repaired considering 2-way shipping costs, your time, etc..

That's exactly what I did. I touched the 2 hots hot together to test the phasing per Mike Reagans video on phasing transformers. 

I also watched that video. If you look at it again he was touching the output of the transformers, not the controllers.  You can't do that if the connection from the transformer is the male plug. But you can do the same using a voltmeter.  As far as I know the only protection on the output (RED & BLK) connectors from the Z1000 is from the circuit breaker on the transformer.

 

Tanner111 posted:

I appreciate all the help.

My dilemna is I'm not sure I want to phase the Z1000 with the PH. I'm not sure I have to phase them with my set up (PH for track power, Z1000 for switches).  I tried to phase them because I have Ross switches wired for non derailing and I don't want to fry an engine. The polarity must be reversed on one of them. When I had them phased, I was getting 36 volts when I checked voltage across the hots on both transformers when the Z1000 was working and throttle was all the way up. Right now I have the PH phased with a Lionel 1033. I have the 1033 set at 10 volts, the PH is 18 and I get 8 volts across the hots. Is this correct? 

A lower voltage than either transformer alone or the sum of the two should indicate in phase.

The Z brick and the PH180 have polarized plugs. Plug them into the same receptacle and or the same power strip from a receptacle and they will be phased.

Use the Z-1000 ACC terminals(which are labeled) for the switch power. Then, the only variable is if you cut the connector off of the PH180, but we already discussed which is hot.

Introducing the 1033 creates another variable, which you know you have to find the phase. It has insufficient track/acc protection.

By the way, I had the same reading for the Z-1000 controller across the output - .5003kohms

A lower voltage than either transformer alone or the sum of the two should indicate in phase.

So, if I had 2 transformers both putting out 18 volts, and they were not in phase, what voltage would I see across both hots?