Modern Day VIRTUAL Bandit Meets and York Musings?

David,

I did those bandit meets as you call them twice a year for 10 years in the early 1980's to about the middle 90's(never heard them called bandits meets the whole time I was going) any way at that time I was collecting post war and never not found what I was looking for the 10 years I went, there, some really great trains to be had them and I never missed not getting what I went there for, I never had a reason to join the TCA because  there was no need for York as most of the dealers who came there came a couple of days early and where going to York anyway so they would just set up at these flea markets as we called them to sell before York. Fast forward to now,  I left the hobby for about 8 years came back this year was told from alot of my friends that it is nowhere near what it was so no reason to go early any more,So I decided to join the TCA to just see what York is like before I am pushing up daisy, now I get my TCA card I can't go just like you said except it wasn't the online dealers but my LHS had some great trade ins and I brought them and spent my money so maybe in April if my LHS doesn't get any good stuff at that time I can go?

Fred

I guess when your focus is on recently made stuff, online sales can substitute for York IF your main reason for going is bargain hunting.

When one is looking for collectable older trains, there is no substitute for seeing them in person before buying. (I know many people think collecting is dead, Ebay indicates otherwise.)

It seems that many folks enjoy York for reasons that go beyond shopping.

I think the open shows have lost their luster, because the people, who, for instance, used to show up at the Billy Budd and pack trains in boxes under the tent at the back of the lot, found it was a lot easier to type a description into that four letter word, "eBay".  THAT is where I think those shows have gone.  The recent economy hasn't helped, but  I think technology is the the culprit.  This is for all the old, collectible trains....new trains sales, is, for me, a different market.  For me, very little new,

has been and is interesting, at least since the "reefer craze."  New trains recently have been a whole lot less reason to attend York, so the withering away of the old trains markets, also, is not good. (that too, is economy impacted, and one I hope turns around)

We all do it. Speak in generalized terms. We talk of manufacturers, importers, dealers, retailers & York meets when in truth sometimes those that are so lumped together exhibit very important differences. Just as Lionel is a different company than MTH, and both are different from 3^rd Rail & Bachmann-Williams, so too the term “dealers” lumps & obscures many different players. Included are sometimes what we around here call jobbers. Businessmen all to be sure, yet there are often significantly different business models in play. So too with York meets. While I have sometimes been able to anticipate  an upcoming meet accurately,  those few times have only been at the extremes of the grand overall business/economic/stock market  cycle.  So said, some comments to your points are worth addressing once again, despite most of these issues having been discussed in prior threads, prior to past meets.

• The York meet’s place in many "dealers" business model is an opportunity to move inventory that is otherwise not selling in their shop. Why would a dealer remove product from his store, inventory such a move, load up his truck, risk theft at each point along the way. move said truck & its contents to the Fairgrounds, load tables, pay for his lodging, meals for both himself & his staff. Conduct business transactions, keep records, argue price, then do the reverse for all that didn’t sell? Why do all that when he can move the very same product pre York meet, at his convenience, directly from his store, at his price, and perhaps get the customer to also pay for some S&H? Even more amusing are those new jacks who actually think that dealer/retailers will under cut their own store prices at the meet. That's why so many times seasoned Yorkies counsel that developing a York "shopping list" is a waste of time, unless you are looking for parts or supplies.
• There is a long relationship between some manufacturer/importers and their authorized dealer/liquidators who use the York meet to quietly dump warehouse surplus w/o much noise in the G.P. retail chain. This practice is of course legendary & unpredictable. Old timers know who the players are and where to head first for this type of action.
• Cash, cash, cash. Cash in hand is king, and here I’m talking about some dealers who have a known history of arriving inventory light with intent of being net buyers… not only from members, but also from other dealers! Again if your are in the business and this is part of your business model you start selling in September & not at the meet. One well known Webster began setting up a display in the Orange a couple yrs ago w/o any inventory at all, instead using the event to hand out pens, mints & business cards.
• On the Bandit meets? It’s 1995. Facing divorce? Got a dozen pre War Lionel scale Hudsons your buddy is keeping for you that your wife’s lawyer doesn’t know about? How do you liquidate those neatly and cleanly? It wasn’t by setting up a table under the Standz or a member’s Hall. I know of two New Jersey “dealers” who set up shop & took in high end inventory during York week, two of which never seemed to have ever found reason to even set foot on the Fairgrounds. As late as 3 yrs ago there were still direct reports of minty-mint F3 sets changing hands through this channel. Of course these transactions, were never virtual & didn’t take place in the parking lots, & certainly not for check, credit cards, paypal or square! And you best believe no one was sticking a camera in your face trying to photo your presence at the meet, bandit or not.
• The  relationship between EBay & the Meet has been a changing one certainly over the past say 14 yrs, often discussed, & certainly beyond the scope of this thread

For those of you who have followed my threads on these York themes I must apologize as there is little new here that I haven't said before.  What surprises me is how these recurrent themes continue to reemerge, little changed, despite so many significant changes in the toy train business, the meet, and indeed this very Forum. Legend, myth, fact or fiction? Does it really matter? Ten days from now there will probably be 13K people there, and 13k different views of what went up, down or sideways! Enjoy, if you plan to participate.

I'll venture a guess that everyone who goes to the York Meet has there own "Tradition of York" in whatever way they enjoy it.

Some may only attend for a few hours and some attend the whole week.  There are those who go just to buy trains and others who just like to socialize.  And some like me who loves both! It's so much fun meeting up with far away friends and starting a "How's the layout coming?" conversation, as we are carrying packages, boxes or bags of train goodies.

As for myself, I've always seem to find a good deal in the Halls without looking too hard.  The pre-York sales have been going on for as long as I can remember and I've dipped into my York kitty more than once.  Actually I think it's a good idea for the stores to have sales before York as they know hobbyists have saved up some spare cash for the York Meet, or may catch a customer or two who isn't going but likes the sale.  It's what's good for business.

Sure, these days you can buy anything at anytime from anywhere, but to me it's just that much more special and fun when you can walk through the aisles full of train items along with  a lot of other like minded people.  And you'll probably meet a few new friends.  Can't get that from eBay!

Everything changes and evolves, but whether I don't spend a dime or if I come home with a boat load of trains, I have always had a great time at the York Meet.

The bottom line is:  Short of some medical or other disaster, it's virtually impossible not to have a great time at the York Meet, regardless of your reason for attending.  If you don't have a good time, you're probably in the wrong hobby, or the wrong segment of the hobby.

I really never cared for the bandit meets, mostly junk and over priced IMO. I also don't care what the dealers do or not do. The only thing I care about is the item I buy. If they have the item I want at a good price I will buy it if not I move on. 

I know the guys who have the best prices and inventory, those I hit first.  

I loved the bandit meets in the mid to late 90's.

Current dealer "blowouts" are mostly of recent inventory. Back in the mid to late 90's Mike was just getting started and it wasn't so easy to get older stuff. That was before the internet really took off. It was a lot of fun to walk around the motels, see what people and dealers had for sale, offer and make a deal or not make a deal, eat out with friends, talk trains, etc.

That was when MTH took a table at the Holiday Inn.

That was when the weather was a lot more important than it is now, because the show didn't go on if it was raining.

And by the way, those pre-York deals are still really significant for pre-war stuff. I have a friend who goes out on Sunday just for that. He typically leaves York for home on Thursday morning. He doesn't care about modern toy trains.

None of this is to say that "the good old days" were better. They were different, and to me they were fun.