Nickel Plate Road 757 Going to Bellevue, Ohio!

Bryan Smith posted:

Aliens 

LOL! It must be, Bryan. Or they think the general public is genuinely stupid and will buy anything they make up.

NKP 765 has run almost 100,000 miles on various signaled railroads around the country, including running with functional cab signals on certain parts of Norfolk Southern. More recently, she ran on Metra with functional cab signals. The locomotive has never caused a signal malfunction or "...damaged..." the various signal systems in any way. I'm sure the fellas with the 611, 261, 4449 and other main line steam locomotives could all make the same statement.

Ridiculous... 

The excuses don't have to make sense, just support the company policy!  Some REAL excuses:

1. "We're a serious business, not an amusement park."

2. "The liability isn't worth the trouble."

3. "Even allowing a steam engine on our property would open a whole can of worms."

4. "Railfans are idiots." (Valid if only 1% true.)

OLDGUYFROMNJ

Tell me about it.  I have to ship a diesel on a flatcar this fall over CSX and another one next spring on its own wheels.  The CSX meltdown in progress has made trying to work with them on these shipments almost impossible.  

 

Rick Rowlands

 

Team Member

Bring Back 757 Project

Mad River & NKP Museum

Rick Rowlands posted:

Tell me about it.  I have to ship a diesel on a flatcar this fall over CSX and another one next spring on its own wheels.  The CSX meltdown in progress has made trying to work with them on these shipments almost impossible.  

 

Can you use NS to avoid CSXT much as possible? I realize you may need to use CSXT for the very first and/or last part of the trip though. On the other hand to interchange a shipment to NS then back to CSXT may bring its own complications such as interchange costs and another inspection?

Dave, it is a somewhat more difficult route from Strasburg, PA to Bellevue than the route out of Roanoke.

The NS routing would likely be Leaman Place  (pronounced "lemon" like the fruit) - Harrisburg - Altoona - Pittsburgh - Alliance - Bucyrus - Bellevue.

The Leaman Place to Alliance portion of that route is NS busiest main line (the former PRR) with somewhere around 80 trains per day on it. Freight train speeds are as high as 60 mph, plus Amtrak runs that route at 79 mph. Sticking a 25 mph hospital train out on that line will seriously disrupt traffic for several days and hundreds of miles behind it.

The Roanoke to Columbus route does not have those problems. A lot of it is 40 mph due to the curvature in the mountains. It is not as busy as the other route, nor does Amtrak run on it. Moving a 25 mph train over that route was not too big a deal.

The cost for the special move is over $50,000, and will most likely take a week or two or more to complete.  A couple of us will ride along with the locomotive to tend to its needs and address any mechanical issues that arise enroute.  Ideally we would like to have some sort of tool car accompany the locomotive both for supplies and bunk space for the riders.

 

Rick Rowlands

 

Team Member

Bring Back 757 Project

Mad River & NKP Museum

....the reasoning behind the Burlington Northern not allowing the UP 844 and SP 4449 operation over BN trackage from Seattle, WA to Vancouver, BC.....

I would have appealed to Warren Buffet or cc'd him on the request.

Bobby Ogage

"I hear that train a coming,

it's rolling around the bend"

 

The CSX needs federal money for the Howard Street Tunnel in Baltimore. Maybe some political pressure to sway the CSX management into a favorable outlook about moving steam engines could get the 757 out of Strausburg.

How many other steam engines are trapped by the CSX? Does the 2156 get to stay in Roanoke for more time than contracted? Is the 614 trapped in Clifton Forge indefinitely?

Bobby Ogage

"I hear that train a coming,

it's rolling around the bend"

 

Bobby Ogage posted:

The CSX needs federal money for the Howard Street Tunnel in Baltimore. Maybe some political pressure to sway the CSX management into a favorable outlook about moving steam engines could get the 757 out of Strausburg.

 

Somehow, "allow steam, living or dead, on your tracks or forget your federal funding" is on any politicians mind.

Rusty

As much as I enjoy putting someone over a barrel when it's justified, making enemies out of the railroads is NOT the way to success in the preservation business. Study the way the FWRHS works with Norfolk Southern and Metra. Make friends, build partnerships, earn trust and confidence.   Be true to your word and deliver on your promises.  RESPECT, RESPECT, RESPECT. 

Bobby Ogage posted:

....the reasoning behind the Burlington Northern not allowing the UP 844 and SP 4449 operation over BN trackage from Seattle, WA to Vancouver, BC.....

I would have appealed to Warren Buffet or cc'd him on the request.

As usual, you are out of touch with the events surrounding such statements from the BN. Note, I said BN, i.e. NOT BNSF! This happened long before the merger of the Santa Fe and the Burlington Northern, which created BNSF, and even longer before Mr. Buffet purchased all the BNSF stock.

Bobby Ogage posted:

The CSX needs federal money for the Howard Street Tunnel in Baltimore. Maybe some political pressure to sway the CSX management into a favorable outlook about moving steam engines could get the 757 out of Strausburg.

You are TOTALLY out of touch with reality!

How many other steam engines are trapped by the CSX? Does the 2156 get to stay in Roanoke for more time than contracted?

Note that Norfolk Southern towed Y6a 2156 from St Louis to Roanoke, with absolutely NO involvement by CSX!

Is the 614 trapped in Clifton Forge indefinitely?

Might be, since it has no place to operate and nothing to pull.

 

Hi all. I am very excited fir this piece of history to be returned to Bellevue. Sure, Ill miss seeing 757 at Strasburg, but its not always about me  I would guess this move will not happen until 2018 when the MR&NKP can gather the funds, but I sure hope to catch the train. As Rich stated, it will go through Altoona, so hopefully I won't miss a NKP berk on the Horseshoe curve again! I do have a question, is anything being given to the RRMPA in exchange for the 757? When 4014 was taken from Railgiants Museum, two SD40-2s and some rolling stock were exchanged, so I am curious if the RRMPA is getting a new item, or just the wrong end of the stick. Also, is the 757 suitable for travel after sitting for so long?

Max

 

"Q: What is the difference between a school teacher and a steam locomotive?

A: The school teacher tells you to spit out your gum, while the locomotive says 'Choo Choo Choo!'"


Bobby Ogage posted:

 CSX needs federal money for the Howard Street Tunnel in Baltimore. Maybe some political pressure to sway the CSX management into a favorable outlook about moving steam engines could get the 757 out of Strausburg.The

How many other steam engines are trapped by the CSX? Does the 2156 get to stay in Roanoke for more time than contracted? Is the 614 trapped in Clifton Forge indefinitely?

What, geographically, does the move from Lancaster, Pa to Ohio have to do with the  Howard St. tunnel in Baltimore, MD.?

The 757 was a gift to Mad River.  I disagree that the RRMPA got the "wrong end of the stick".  This is not a win-lose situation.  RRMPA, due to budget cuts and a small paid and volunteer workforce has not had the resources to keep up with the deterioration of the artifacts that are located outside in the train yard.  The museum management very wisely decided that it was better for all of the artifacts that some items be deaccessioned so that they could focus their limited resources on a more manageable roster of equipment.  

What struck me when I first visited the RRMPA and talked with the staff is just how small a number of people there are that keep the place going.  And in the restoration shop there is a very small number of volunteers working with the paid staff.  Historic preservation is a participation sport.  Historic equipment in a museum still will rot away if there are not humans there to care for these beasts, and even with the heroic efforts of the restoration shop staff and volunteers, it is still a losing battle with nature.   

If 757 were to remain in Strasburg, it would continue to dissolve into the earth for the foreseeable future, as it was way down the priority list for rotation into the shop for restoration work.  However, as soon as 757 reaches Bellevue it will be placed inside and a team of people who are motivated and excited will descend upon the locomotive and give it the care and attention that it deserves.  

As for its road worthiness for movement.  Our initial inspection revealed no major issues.  We will start in depth evaluations this fall and will of course keep everyone apprised of the progress as we get 757 ready to roll. 

 

Rick Rowlands

 

Team Member

Bring Back 757 Project

Mad River & NKP Museum

The 757 was built with roller bearings on the pony axle and the drivers, just like the other NKP S-2 class Berkshires.  The trailing truck and the tender trucks are equipped with solid bearings.  That will trigger the 25 mph speed limit on NS.  The 757 could avoid the busy PRR corridor from Harrisburg to Pittsburgh to Cleveland if the 757 was routed from Harrisburg north to Scranton, Binghamton and Buffalo.  The traffic density is not as great on that routing but it is longer.  The question will be how NS would price the longer route in order to keep the 25 mph move off the busier but shorter route.  

NKP779 posted:

The 757 was built with roller bearings on the pony axle and the drivers, just like the other NKP S-2 class Berkshires.  The trailing truck and the tender trucks are equipped with solid bearings.  

Any idea WHY the AMC went with rollers up front, but not on the back? 

 

Maxrailroad posted:

When 4014 was taken from Railgiants Museum, two SD40-2s and some rolling stock were exchanged, so I am curious if the RRMPA is getting a new item, or just the wrong end of the stick. Also, is the 757 suitable for travel after sitting for so long?

You are incorrect regarding that UP traded a pair of SD40-2's plus rolling stock for the 4014. What got traded in exchange for 4014 was UP SD40-2C 3105 (ex-MoPac 6027), UP insulated box car 453665 and UP bay window caboose 24567 (ex-Rock Island 17149). Don't know how you got a pair of SD40-2's out of that?

As for NKP 757 being fit for travel Mr. Rowlands did say there will be work done to prepare it before the move. Need to rig up air lines (if existing air piping is broken or corroded), lubricate moving parts (and unsticking same if stuck in place) and so on.

Kent Loudon posted:

Well, this is all nice and I appreciate the effort being made, but what are they going to put behind it?  Anything age appropriate is probably gone, taken or has inoperable body rot. 

Have you ever been to the Mad River and Nickel Plate Museum? Maybe if you have visited there, you wouldn't be making such a statement!

Kent Loudon posted:

Well, this is all nice and I appreciate the effort being made, but what are they going to put behind it?  Anything age appropriate is probably gone, taken or has inoperable body rot. 

When we put a passenger consist together for steam excursions, I can assure you that being "...age appropriate..." is not considered at all. The general public (the people who actually buy tickets to ride) don't know or care whether a given passenger car is age appropriate or not.

It just doesn't matter.

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