Make it and I will be a buyer!!!

Alan

Nay! 

It was never a real locomotive. Pure fantasy. 

Looks like a nice door stop to me. No way would I waste money on one of those.

It's purely an engineering concept at this point. I like to think of it as a PRR T1 Duplex with modern tech. I'm intrigued, but I don't think I'd want to drop over 2K on a model without a working prototype.

Entirely too silly.......but if you're going to do this you might as well also cut down the mightiest tree in the forest with a herring.......

I would be in for one!

Greg

www.youtube.com/trainbros89

I'd love one, but I'm sure it would be far out of my price range.

As big fan of Chapelon, Porta and all his disciples, Wardale in particular, i would love to have this locomotive.  Alas I would never be able to afford one new.  Lately I have been concentrating on updating some of my older equipment and scooping up some good looking ps1 engines o be updated later.  

As to paint scheme I think it would be wide open.  Given the timeframe the C&O 614 trials were done in, I am thinking of the current class ones along with Conrail, (maybe bnsf if you could make it run on powder river basin coal).  If you just want to go with whatever strikes you than I would say Erie, P&WV, or Milwaukee would all look good.  I could also see a WM fireball scheme on the flanks.  

This locomotive would have stood a half decent chance at production if oil prices had remained sky-high.  In the current market it would be doubtful at best.  When you factor in the stress load on the track from big drivers its almost a guaranteed no-go for the real thing, but as for a model I still think it would be pretty cool. Interestingly enough it would be a loco that you could easily change to run off liquefied natural gas by hooking up a tank car for a tender, or switch back to coal, simply based on lowest dollar fuel availability.

No

Too big.  Too much money.  Not an interesting locomotive.

It looks like there are at least 2 people who would buy it.  If you add yourself and the other anonymous, influential person, you got 4.   I would say start production.

Yes - the final decision would be based on the price. I don't expect it to be cheap, but.

Now, if I may comment upon the above statement, and others like it:

"Nay! 

It was never a real locomotive. Pure fantasy." 

That is factually incorrect - it was never built, but it was designed by people who were qualified to do so and was in no way "fantasy". But, as it never had a Warbonnet paint scheme or some such thing, I guess there's no reason to build it, huh?

My photo says it all

D500 posted:

Yes - the final decision would be based on the price. I don't expect it to be cheap, but.

Now, if I may comment upon the above statement, and others like it:

"Nay! 

It was never a real locomotive. Pure fantasy." 

That is factually incorrect - it was never built, but it was designed by people who were qualified to do so and was in no way "fantasy". But, as it never had a Warbonnet paint scheme or some such thing, I guess there's no reason to build it, huh?

Add in it is also a 34+ year old concept.

Rusty

I got to look over  an Audi concept piloted car last week, it was truly the future now.

I like this engine for the same reasons, I would buy it.

Fred

Nyet

Want a Steam Turbine Electric that hasn't been done in O Scale???

As a Sunset brass thing it would require about 120 reservations and the price would be about $1800.  Painted in the Demo paint, yeah, I'm interested.  When I was an undergraduate in mech engineering in the '70s my senior project was to study the possibilities of a nuclear powered version of this type of proposal.

Yea, but probably out of range of my wallet and too big for any layout I could build. 

Maybe, depending on price.  Especially, in brass, I know it will be a lot of bucks but depends on how much.  And, for me, 2 rail and in CSX paint.

Rick

For they with more money than brains.

Simon

and too big for any layout I could build.

Really ?it's only a 4-4+4-2. IF you run a 4-8-4 you can run this.

Simon Winter posted:

For they with more money than brains.

Simon

 

Or maybe they used their brains to get the money in the first place.

Don't want to insult anyone here but it's the ugliest thing I have ever seen not even it's mother would like it.

But that's just strictly my opinion and I am only talking about a model not a person so please don't take offence.

Roo.

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

and too big for any layout I could build.

Really ?it's only a 4-4+4-2. IF you run a 4-8-4 you can run this.

Technically, the Ace 3000 would've still have been a 4-8-2.  The second and third drivers were to be inside connected, which would keep the two engine sets in sync.  The arrangement was supposed to reduce pounding.

Rusty

Highly interested.

Simon Winter posted:

For they with more money than brains.

Simon

 

I have both the brains and the money, so I am in.  Interesting design and would look good on my layout.  Union Pacific of course. 

rex desilets posted:

No

Ditto!

I rather have an E2C PRR electric. Or an MTH old rivets.  

"SERIOUSLY! How many of you ARE interested in an O Scale/O Gauge ACE 3000!"

SERIOUSLY, I'm not.

NO--as simple as that.

I normally do not respond with a negative to topics asking "who will buy a (add what you want)".  But since you asked: nay.

david1 posted:

Nay! 

It was never a real locomotive. Pure fantasy. 

Yep, pure fantasy.

Even if I modeled standard gauge, it'd be a huge NOPE for me.

i was one of those that suggested it

so get it out there

still waiting on a tier 4 SD70ACe

It looks like a brute and I like that. What really makes it such a great eye catcher is the cross  between steam and diesel.

That said my big but is before I would ever shell out six figures for a toy it better have the pull to match the look.  I'm talking a hefty motor in  the prime and two in the tender.

If it will be lithographed tin and handle O-27 curves like my 2020 turbine I might be interested.   

Since you are asking who would be interested, I think it would be fair to also estimate the sale price, if it were produced. Based on the likely number of sold units of less than 200 pieces, and in view of the unique running gear and construction costs, I would estimate the model would sell for $700 or more. Still interested, paigetrain?

My guess would be that you need to add, at least, a "1" before the "700" estimate. After all, this is potentially a handmade brass item.

Although I'm not interested in the item, I hope to see it made. If the person the OP knows is not currently in the model train business, the project would be like SGL Reading project in the early 2000's.

Jim

jd-train posted:

My guess would be that you need to add, at least, a "1" before the "700" estimate. After all, this is potentially a handmade brass item.

Although I'm not interested in the item, I hope to see it made. If the person the OP knows is not currently in the model train business, the project would be like SGL Reading project in the early 2000's.

Jim

This project has exactly the same chance as any other.  It depends on the reservations.  Lobbying for something you want is a good thing if people are willing to contact Scott and reserve one as a result.  If Scott sees 20+ reservations (not necessarily individual persons)  then there is a reasonable chance it will be offered.  But if after 6 months to a year of offering if the number of reservations is still below some minimum it will still be cancelled.

But, it will be brass, and yes $1700 is a reasonable price and it will take probably 100 firm reservations to become a go.

Also,

As far as any sound system it must be realized this would never have sounded anything like a traditional steam locomotive, i.e., it would have no chuffing sound.  It would actually sound more like one of the UP turbines, albeit a LOT quieter.  Like a steam ship the exhaust steam from the traction pistons is then expanded through a turbogenerator and then to a condenser to be reused.  That is what the heat exchangers in the tender are for.

jd-train posted:

My guess would be that you need to add, at least, a "1" before the "700" estimate. After all, this is potentially a handmade brass item.

Although I'm not interested in the item, I hope to see it made. If the person the OP knows is not currently in the model train business, the project would be like SGL Reading project in the early 2000's.

Jim

Jim,

Your guess is right on regarding pricing. The person the OP knows IS in the model train business and is actively involved in representing an O scale importer at 2 rail shows and the TCA York shows as well as assisting with product selection.

On a different topic, some Reading 2 rail modelers have given me detailed information regarding the Reading 2-10-2 locomotives. We'll see where that goes but keep in mind that the minimum production run for brass steam is 120 pieces which is getting to be a very difficult number of sales to achieve.

Rheil,

I am definitely in for a 3R Reading 2-10-2, if Scott makes them! 

As I missed a couple of pre-order dates for some other items, I currently have nothing on order!

Man, I hope these get made.  Aside from Weaver/SGL Pacifics and some T-1's, there seems to be very little Reading scale steam previously made.

Jim

To my eye this is one of those projects that looks better in the concept sketches. In actual 3-D it's just too ugly for me.

I agree with Gilly above - go for that classic UP turbine-electric for model sales. As a historical steam locomotive development concept, however, the ACE3000 - 6000 designs are classics in their own right; maybe there is a viable market. Look at how many runs of the PRR turbine steamer exist.

That is one interesting looking beast and concept. Can't say that I want to buy it however. Good luck with getting enough votes!

For those wishing to learn more about Mr. Rowland's American Coal Enterprises and the concept of the proposed locomotive, here is what I believe to be one of the best on-line sources of reliable information relative to this project:

www.american-rails.com/ace-3000.html

It should be noted CSX's Mr. Watkins was on record as having stated his railroad was going to take delivery of the first production locomotive so there's one road name in which an O scale model can be decorated. Given the time frame during which the 614T trials were conducted and the transition of CSX from a holding to an operating company, had actual construction commenced, I doubt the locomotive would have been completed in time to be delivered in Chessie System livery. 

Bob

Yes  Put a reservation in

What version of the Burlington Northern markings would have been used?

Andrew

Ah..no. Not my cup of tea.

-Greg

Seriously -  - Not me.

I would buy it, but as I said above I wont it to be a puller. I would like it to be able do O-42 turns or smaller, though O-72 would not be a game stopper.  

Just think what a conversation piece it would make, the last steam engine that may have been.

 Is it interesting looking model and if I  could afford one I would buy one myself. Though some say it was fictional the fact that it was a serious  engineering proposal  solidifies that idea for me.   Besides  it would look great in CSX colors  and would definitely be a  conversation starter on the layout. 

prrhorseshoecurve posted:

NOW being realistic, I believe this will be made in brass so the production run would be limited- unlike the "SD60E" that two other mfg's importers are jumping on the proverbial "band wagon".  Judging by today's market pricing I expect the price to be in the 4 figure range.  And for that I would hope this model will have the following features:

• Smoke - With some volume control
• Sound - Steam sounds in the Locomotive and including fan sounds in the tender for the condenser fans
• Some sort of command control
• Operating couplers
• Directional lighting
• Cab interiors on both ends
• Optional opening doors and coal hatches
• And since this is a "Fantasy Island" loco- show off the unique drive train with ground lights! [a la NYC ESE]

So for those that are serious, [And for you "lurkers" out there who want to see this loco get done- it's a great opportunity to break the ice], Please say YEAH [or ney] and what road name/ Paint scheme you would like to see it in.

Since we're being realistic, some of the stuff that you have detailed simply isn't gonna' happen unless you have volume orders and get Lionel or MTH to bite on the production.  Specifically...

• Smoke - With some volume control

The only folks that currently offer smoke with control of the output are Lionel and MTH.  I haven't seen any smoke volume control with 3rd rail or Atlas TMCC.

• Sound - Steam sounds in the Locomotive and including fan sounds in the tender for the condenser fans

 The sounds are another sticking point, that would require considerable work with some original sounds.  Since this is a fantasy locomotive, recording the real one ain't gonna' happen.  The integration of the sounds with the command operation is another place that currently only Lionel or MTH would have the resources to tackle.

I can fix you up for Ground Lights, just use my Chuff-Generator, ground lights are a feature output.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Since we're being realistic, some of the stuff that you have detailed simply isn't gonna' happen unless you have volume orders and get Lionel or MTH to bite on the production.  Specifically...

 

• Smoke - With some volume control

The only folks that currently offer smoke with control of the output are Lionel and MTH.  I haven't seen any smoke volume control with 3rd rail or Atlas TMCC.

• Sound - Steam sounds in the Locomotive and including fan sounds in the tender for the condenser fans

 The sounds are another sticking point, that would require considerable work with some original sounds.  Since this is a fantasy locomotive, recording the real one ain't gonna' happen.  The integration of the sounds with the command operation is another place that currently only Lionel or MTH would have the resources to tackle.

Since the proposed ACE 3000 was designed to a "condensing" steam exhaust system, just like the "condensing" class of South African Railways 4-8-4 stem locomotives, using recordings/videos of those real locomotives should provide good information. The sound was pretty much a "woooooshing" noise, anyway.

 

I can fix you up for Ground Lights, just use my Chuff-Generator, ground lights are a feature output.

Hi Gents, Sunset.. 

Instead of a concept engine... Ace 3000.. Why not spend your design and engineering dollars on a loco that would sell. Or reengineering older loco's so that if you rerun them, then they will be super! Ex, the SW1.. Do that again, but with a drive that is horizontal like the Atlas SW8's.. those things run fantastic. in HO Plastic, the Horizontal drives work very well. Why can't we have that in not only smaller loco's like the SW8 but in larger ones like an SD45? Yea, perceived value because the larger loco's have two motors.. who cares. they grind and run like crap and if something is wrong, you have to go in and change it out.. They SUCK! I do like the models and details, just dealing with duel motors is horrible.. That's my opinion anyway... it is hard to get slow running with them.. one day, when I get ambitious.. I am going to do the above to my loco's.. Since I have a small shop here that can do it.. Essentially make the O-Scale stuff I have like KATO Ho models.. I had to admit, those run so smooth.. and the O-Scale Atlas SW8's also run fantastic and they pull like mad with one motor which proves it can be done and they are so much better. thus also leaving room for more electronics space etc.. anyhow, I think investing in an Ace 3000 is a waste of effort and time.. you would get more mileage from other products, SW1, ALCO S2-4, etc..   Dan

In the $1,700-2,200 price range, I'm OUT, unless I win a lottery, It is an interesting idea, and in Armour Yellow and Harbor Mist Grey, I might be tempted if some extra money suddenly became available.

 I could see the Union Pacific, taking a demo for testing, they have always been open to unusual ideas, and still having some steam service capabilities, wouldn't hurt the concept.

Doug

challenger3980 posted:

In the $1,700-2,200 price range, I'm OUT, unless I win a lottery, It is an interesting idea, and in Armour Yellow and Harbor Mist Grey, I might be tempted if some extra money suddenly became available.

 I could see the Union Pacific, taking a demo for testing, they have always been open to unusual ideas, and still having some steam service capabilities,

The Union Pacific has NO "steam service capabilities" anyplace on their system, especially for a coal burning locomotive. They don't even have any water plugs remaining. The "heritage" steam locomotives owned by the UP burn oil, or will be converted to oil, and water must be taken from wayside fire hydrants. 

wouldn't hurt the concept.

Doug

Sorry, Hotwater, I was referring to the Steam Shop in Cheyenne, not on the road infrastructure.

Doug

BXCXDan posted:

I think investing in an Ace 3000 is a waste of effort and time.. you would get more mileage from other products, SW1, ALCO S2-4, etc..   Dan

If Scott doesn't get enough reservations, there won't be any investment.  If he does, it's essentially BTO.  Simple as that.

Rusty

BXCXDan posted:

Hi Gents, Sunset.. 

... in HO Plastic, the Horizontal drives work very well. Why can't we have that in not only smaller loco's like the SW8 but in larger ones like an SD45? ...

  Dan

Dan, you must have missed the fact that for the last several years, all of Sunset's diesel locomotives have had a single-motor drive (E-7, F-7, FP-7, SD-9, SD40-2, E-8/9, etc.).  If you are a serious buyer of single-motor, horizontal drives then you should have been aware of this.

The ACE 3000 gives me pause...

Maybe a Taggat Transcontinental Railroad layout is in order??

Hi Bob,

Thanks for the heads up! That is fantastic. I do not own any of those products.  Either because they aren't the road name i wanted or the era I was modeling.. But that is Fantastic NEWS!!!! 

Well, if this the case as Bob mentioned and so correct me.. Thanks!!! I will look closely at other offerings from Sunset.. I guess I was reaching out more towards the MTH, Atlas & Lionel guys.. but they all have to have 2 motors because everything that is a plus..  Do people like the two motors? 

Anyhow, happy Sunday!  Thanks again Bob!!

Dan

BXCXDan posted:

Hi Bob,

Thanks for the heads up! That is fantastic. I do not own any of those products.  Either because they aren't the road name i wanted or the era I was modeling.. But that is Fantastic NEWS!!!! 

Well, if this the case as Bob mentioned and so correct me.. Thanks!!! I will look closely at other offerings from Sunset.. I guess I was reaching out more towards the MTH, Atlas & Lionel guys.. but they all have to have 2 motors because everything that is a plus..  Do people like the two motors? 

For me, no. I much prefer the single, large motor horizontal drive design.

Anyhow, happy Sunday!  Thanks again Bob!!

Dan

"...you would get more mileage from other products, SW1, ALCO S2-4, etc.."

Don't forget more ATSF Warbonnet F-units - we definitely don't have enough of those, either! Maybe more UP Geeps? 

D500 posted:

"...you would get more mileage from other products, SW1, ALCO S2-4, etc.."

Don't forget more ATSF Warbonnet F-units - we definitely don't have enough of those, either! Maybe more UP Geeps? 

The more F7s Warbonnets has been an open discussion at shows, etc to come up with the numbers to do a 2nd run of F7s and there has been basically no interest expressed.