UP derailment and bridge collapse in Chicago northern suburbs on July 4.

I don't think mark s' post was off the mark at all.  I know exactly where this is and where he's coming from.  My wife and I passed over the main line a bit north on the way to a beach day at Lake Michigan today and we talked about it.  Sad story-  these two won't be enjoying any beach days again, that's for sure.

This could have been a brand spankin' new bridge and it still would have collapsed.  A new bridge would have been designed for a Cooper E80 loading.  This loading includes two engines at 284 tons each and then a following load of 8000 pounds a linear foot.  The E80 design engines are 48 feet long so two would have completely covered the bridge span of 86 feet.  So the bridge would have been capable of holding around 568 tons.  These bridges are typically design with a factor of safety of about 3.  So, a new bridge would collapse at about 1700 tons.

There is an article linked above that said there were 28 cars stacked up on that bridge.  At about 80 tons each, that is 2240 tons.  Easily enough to bring a new bridge down.  Keep in mind too that the existing bridge was built maybe in the 20's and would have been designed for a Cooper E60 loading.  Consequently it's load capacity would be about 3/4 of a new bridge and would collapse at a load of about 1275 tons or when roughly 16 loaded coal cars stacked up on it.

That bridge did not stand a chance of staying up with all those loaded coal cars stacked up on it.

Jack

One reason for the quick filing of the lawsuit was to preserve the evidence that UP pushed aside to fix the bridge.

As to the load weight on the bridge, the pile-up was caused when the first car derailed and pulled the other cars on top of it. Unfortunately there was an auto under the bridge at wrong time.

There are quite few railroad bridges that need repair in this area. In Park Ridge, the CN&W refuses to repair a crumbling bridge and instead has provided netting to catch fallen chunks.

Sadly, no one in Congress can seem to find any money to fix infrastructure. 

Are you aware that there no longer is a "CN&W (sic.)"?  

RR al the C&NW ceased to exist in 1995 when they merged with the U.P.   

RR Al, in Park Ridge, IL, are you referring to the Touhy Avenue bridge?

The "grieving" lawyers who almost instantaneously filed a wrongful death suit against the Union Pacific were on tv yapping about how they had to get a temporary restraining order (which a dopey judge issued) for 36 hours, so that they could run an independent investigation on the cause of the accident. That was necessary because the Union Pacific could not be trusted. Now, really, what could these amatures figure out that the UP and the FRA (an independent body, BTW) could not determine. And, really, is there any question about UP's liabilty?  Blowhard lawyers exhibiting greed and self-serving puffery are quite annoying.

Jay Jay

Does that one Touhy Bridge where METRA runs not C&NW, have netting or wood planking?

Mark S. 

Next time you're arrested try asking the prosecutor for help in getting you released.

Or maybe you also trust the fox to guard the hen-house. Who sits on that "independent FRA" board?, you think there are a few former railroad employees!

Yeah I trust'em too.

Of course, we know that UP quickly cleared the tracks to get at the evidence. Just like the lawyers who filed quickly, but not quickly enough it seems to find any.

Oh and we have NO dopey judges here in Crook County.

I don't know, Alan; I lived over there in the late '70s, but haven't been there in a long time.

WOW! You sure are smoking the REAL EXPENSIVE stuff!

Alan - Is there any doubt regarding the UP's liability? What possible evidence can the noble servants of truth and justice arrive at, that would be more ****ing then a mountain of coal, 28 hoppers strewn about and 2 unfortunate deceased people under all of that?

Mark S.

Really!; You have lived in this country for many years, I'll bet you watched lawyer-shows on TV and you think you win lawsuits showing up in court without evidence?

Or that the opposing counsel just hands over dispositive evidence against his client? REALLY!

 Come on guys whats with all the bickering?As I said earlier, you  really think this case will even get to court? For all we know UP has probably already cut the settlement check. It saves court costs, stops the publicity from the media and lets the UP get back to moving freight, this was a mere bump in the road. Why wasn't the bridge in better shape?, because the UP hadn't gotten to fixing the abutments yet.Where did the track failure actually occur, before the bridge?, after? on?. No one will ever know because the area was cleaned up and all of the track was pushed into a pile off to the side before anyone could assess what even happened.You think the state, attorneys,or anyone else can force a railroad as big as the UP to do anything, HAH, thats funny. They had all of the damaged cars and coal out of there and trains running again 48hrs after the accident, those poor folks are just being laid to rest today.

Here is the obit of the folks that were killed. They are being laid to rest at this very hour. RIP.

http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/chicagotribune/obituary.aspx?n=burton-and-zorine-lindner&pid=158413111

So, for a 'little bump' whereby evidence allegedly gets swept under the carpet, what sort of payout will the UP be expected to pay out to the family?

I assume there have been other scenario's like this in the past, what has been the payouts then and are they publicly available?

Regards,

Neil

First of all, while trains may be running, they're not running over the location of the bridge.  They're running on a shoo-fly consisting of an earthen embankment parallel to the bridge location.

And unless the UP's torn up all the approach track and graded the area, that evidence still exists.  Even with moving the twisted mass of steel that once was the train, track and bridge, it can still be studied.

I seriously doubt that they could safely send a man into the wreckage to find the cause of the accident.  With a good deal of the stuff buried in coal, things will have to be moved in order to investigate.  This is all heavy metal, bent, folded, spindled and mutilated.  It would be difficult to move things without disturbing something else.

Unless someone actually reported that a car was under the bridge at the time of the accident, the clean up crews were doing what they were supposed to do. 

Accident scenes in real life are seldom as antiseptic as TV dramas make them out to be. 

They don't investigate debris of an aircraft that crash in the water on location, do they?  No, they collect the pieces an take then to a location for investigation.

Plus, I'm pretty sure the FRA will be investigating. 

This story's not going to be over with the writing of a check by the UP.

Rusty

Neil, here in Illinois, jury verdicts are reported in the "legal press" (http://www.juryverdicts.com/999990/about.html) , if not in the mainstream press. Settlements, however, are often confidential. Verdicts can be in the millions in wrongful death cases, but it depends upon numerous issues particular to the individual case. I would hesitate to guess at what may occur here.

My main interest at this point is to learn the cause of this tragic event. We have had extreme heat here this week (over 100 F), and my best guess is that it is a heat-related accident. However, The Federal Railroad Administration report will probably not be entered for a number of months.

This story struck me because it is local, and because it was a tragedy in which a couple of people were driving down an arterial on the Fourth of July and met a horrific end. How the lawsuit plays out is of no interest to me, really.

Really?http://www.wgnradio.com/wgnam-...0707,0,4903360.story

Rusty,

The trains are indeed running over the EXACT location where the bridge was. They took out what was remaining of the bridge, filled the whole thing in with gravel, and laid the railroad right on top. There is a junction within a VERY short distance on this bridge/land fill, thus they could not have "sho-flyed" the track around the original location of the collapsed bridge. The UP's "contractor" did the whole job REALLY FAST. 

Well, then my observation of the local news coverage was incorrect.  While that will hamper the investigation, it's still not going to go away quickly.

Rusty

Representatives of UP will meet Monday with the public and city officials regarding this accident.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/...0712,0,6589382.story

The situation is really really sad as the man was found decapitated. Can you imagine the shock of approaching a railroad bridge while driving and then seeing a derailment occurring in motion and realizing that you can't slow down fast enough and you won't make it if you speed up?!

Hopefully, they DIDN'T see it coming.

Here is an interesting tidbit that came out of last night's public hearing on this wreck. I am surprised that a UP employee was allowed to state this in a non-judicial forum. 

http://www.nwherald.com/2012/0...-derailment/a4ugobe/

I believe that comment from the news paper reporter, about the UP Employee not thinking it was a big enough deal to "stop the freight train", is another case of the news media "reading something into a statement". According to the Chicago Tribune article in this morning's paper, here is the quote from Mark Davis (UP spokesman at the meeting),

"He didn't know what he saw", said UP spokesman Mark Davis, referring to the employee who reported the problem. "He did the proper thing. He saw something he thought wasn't right and he notified someone"

Nothing was said about the employee NOT trying to stop a train!

Yes, it appears the Herald reporter may have "overstated the testimony". I'll have to see what the Times has, if anything.

Here is the Sun-Times version:http://www.suntimes.com/138152...re-deadly-wreck.html

Interesting reading. 

UP has proposed a new bridge at this location.

The federal report on this accident has been issued:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/...0723,0,5152216.story

"Area business owners have voiced frustration at being isolated by the blocked road. Glenview Deputy Village Manager Don Owen said he hopes the road will reopen by the end of December. The railroad has agreed to pay roughly $10 million to repair the bridge, he said."

This might lend some credence to the Craig's List post.