I want to give you the solution to this issue so if it comes up for someone else they will know what to do. After 8 hours plus of trouble shooting, I discovered anytime that a certain engine was on the track it was causing the WIFI signal to fail for the entire layout  Since the WIFI signal failed that engine couldn't be added to the WIFI device. That engine would add and run with the remote but anytime the engine was on the track the WIFI signal would fail. I had gone as far as getting a RMA number from MTH and as a last ditch effort tried one more thing before shipping it back.  Not expecting this to work I did a factory reset on the engine from the remote and the turned the WIFI on and the problem was solved. The WIFI signal was back to normal and I could add the engine to the WIFI device.

Thanks to everyone for the help,

Scott Smith

 

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My DCS WiFi unit keeps giving me these messages.I am connecting to the WiFi DCS unit fine,However I keep getting these messages. I changed out the usb cord and no difference, got another TIU still the same. Changed at the WIFI units and still the same issue. It works fine with the remote. I have tried an ipad and two different IPhones and it makes no difference.

Help!!!

Scott Smith

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Scott, I only run with Android devices and not sure if this will help you?

 When I shut off the power to the trains, if I don't shut off these devices first, they automatically divert to the house's router when the TIU loses power. The next time I start I get that message. I then have to go to the phone or tablet settings, wifi, and press forget for the house's router so that it will connect to the DCS device (force it to only see the MTH WIU).

 

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

Scott, between your son's layout and downtown, what is different? Is everything exactly the same between the wall receptacle and the track? If so, since it works on your son's layout, that eliminates the TIU, wiring, and WiFi unit. Which leaves the building and the building wiring. Not sure why this would make any difference, but I would check the wall outlets at both locations for correct wiring. If everything checks out, that's one more possibility eliminated. Perhaps Andre or GRJ have some ideas.

 

Chris

LVHR

I spent another 2 hours over there this evening, that in addition to the 2 hours this afternoon.  A few weeks ago we rotated the layout and plugged everything into two outlets on a different wall. I ran everything with original extension cord to the original outlet to see if that made a difference and it didn't.  I have two power stripes I eliminated those one at a time and it made no difference. I ran everything to a different outlet and once again no difference. I reversed the polarity on my TIU adapter no difference. A ran without the adapter no difference. I turned off the CW-80 that runs all of my lights-same result.

As far as the difference between my son's layout and the club. His layout is a single loop and a siding plus an AIU for accessories. The club layout had 4 loops on DCS. Even disconnecting some of those loops didn't make a difference.

The remote works perfectly but the WIFI doesn't. I do not know what else I can do to fix this.

Scott Smith

I am running on DCS WIFI only. I wonder if the Museums WIFI is interfering with the DCS WIFI. Someone correct me if I am wrong but I think the DCS WIFI only runs on Channel 11. If the museum also runs on Channel 11 that could be the issue. Unless someone can offer another suggestion I may just add a wireless router to the set-up and see if running on a different channel works.

Scott Smith

 

Are you wifi connecting directly to the WIU or through a WiFi access Point?   If possible I would direct connect the WIU to the access point/router with a Cat 5/6 cable and not use the WIU wifi.  This would narrow it down to whether it actually is the WiFI.  Also, have you done a factory reset on the WIU and re-configured it?

The WIFI unit is connected directly to the layout. Hooking up thorough the museum is not an option. It's in a brick building and I can't take it outside, the serial cord/USB would be too far from the TIU. I reset the WIU and it made no difference.
Scott Smith

You have done most of the stuff I could think of. The fact that the remote works is interesting. I don't think most of us have run into this issue. Using the stuff in commercial buildings, probably introduces problems that most here will never see. Did you do a signal test with the remote? I have seen where weaker signal strength caused the WIU to flash the message of no TIU found. I think it's another generic message saying it didn't get the response it expected?

 In your OP, I didn't know the system would work at all. I have no idea what freq the WIU is set to.

I wonder if an Android device is any better? maybe a stupid idea there?

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

scott.smith posted:

I spent another 2 hours over there this evening, that in addition to the 2 hours this afternoon.  A few weeks ago we rotated the layout and plugged everything into two outlets on a different wall. I ran everything with original extension cord to the original outlet to see if that made a difference and it didn't.  I have two power stripes I eliminated those one at a time and it made no difference. I ran everything to a different outlet and once again no difference. I reversed the polarity on my TIU adapter no difference. A ran without the adapter no difference. I turned off the CW-80 that runs all of my lights-same result.

As far as the difference between my son's layout and the club. His layout is a single loop and a siding plus an AIU for accessories. The club layout had 4 loops on DCS. Even disconnecting some of those loops didn't make a difference.

The remote works perfectly but the WIFI doesn't. I do not know what else I can do to fix this.

Scott Smith

Could you have the TIU's wires reversed? I have done it. It just takes a single misstep to cause issues. Obviously something got changed here.

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

Try running a wireless sniffer at your problem site to determine conflicts on channel assignment.  Note that non-WiFi 2.4GHz transmitters (wireless cams, security systems, etc.)  may not show up in the results.

The last time I diagnosed wireless issues at a show, the WIU was broadcasting on channel 149 802.11n,ac,  and channel 11 802.11b,g,n.  When I logged on to the club's WIU LuCI interface, I briefly looked at the station mode tab ... IIRC, the channel configuration could be managed there.

Something else you could try is get a wifi analysis app on your phone (or tablet) and check what channels are being used to see if there is interference with the WIU.    I have an android and have used it to great effect when installing our WiFi network at the club.  It helped me find dead spots and unused channels.  

Hi Scott.  I would do what Chris is recommending.  If you have a Mac, there is a wifi analyzer built in.  For Windows 10, just type Wifi Analyzer in the Cortina search box and download the app - it is free.  I don't have an Android, but Chris said that their version works.  The IOS version does not show the channel, so it is no help.  Before changing the MTH Wifi channel, use the analyzer to determine what channels are being used by the club.

By default the MTH Wifi use channel 11.  You can change the channel using LUCI.  Once you are in LUCI go to AP MODE and select Wireless Config.  Move down to Device Config and Channel.  Select any channel the club is not using.  This will have no effect on using the Wifi at home.

Dan

Tracker John posted:

Try running a wireless sniffer at your problem site to determine conflicts on channel assignment.  Note that non-WiFi 2.4GHz transmitters (wireless cams, security systems, etc.)  may not show up in the results.

The last time I diagnosed wireless issues at a show, the WIU was broadcasting on channel 149 802.11n,ac,  and channel 11 802.11b,g,n.  When I logged on to the club's WIU LuCI interface, I briefly looked at the station mode tab ... IIRC, the channel configuration could be managed there.

Is this as simple as typing in a different channel number like 8 rather than the default 11?

Scott Smith

Actually, you just select a different channel from a list of channels.  Yes it is that simple, if that is the problem.  It is worth trying since whatever channel you choose, it will work fine at home.  Chances are pretty good that the problem is the Club’s router using the same channel.  Change it at home so that you know everything is working before you get to the club.

Let us know it works out.

Dan

OK, so it is a locomotive issue.Thanks for everyone's input on this. If I remove one of my 3236 MTH/Ives engines and restart the TIU and WIFI everything works. When I place the locomotive back on the track everything loses signal.

So now I need to fix the 3236 locomotive. We have a PS2 locomotive 3V board. When I first placed it on the track there was a spark. Tried it again no problem and it added to the remote perfectly.
First time I tried to reverse the engine the light switched directions but the engine didn't after a couple of tries it worked fine......later on I was going to run it with the WIFI and that is when everything started with my WIFI problems. It still worked fine with the remote. Add the WIFI and the signals are lost to the WIFI. My guess is that there is a short somewhere that is causing the signaling issue I am open to suggestions on the repair remedy.

Scott Smith

 

scott.smith posted:

OK, so it is a locomotive issue.Thanks for everyone's input on this. If I remove one of my 3236 MTH/Ives engines and restart the TIU and WIFI everything works. When I place the locomotive back on the track everything looses signal.

So now I need to fix the 3236 locomotive. We have a PS2 locomotive 3V board. When I first placed it on the track there was a spark. Tried it again no problem and it added to the remote perfectly.
First time I tried to reverse the engine the light switched directions but the engine didn't after a couple of tries it worked fine......later on I was going to run it with the WIFI and that is when everything started with my WIFI problems. It still worked fine with the remote. Add the WIFI and the signals are lost to the WIFI. My guess is that there is a short somewhere that is causing the signaling issue I am open to suggestions on the repair remedy.

Scott Smith

 

troubleshooting involves retracing the steps exactly on what has changed or eliminating things correctly and orderly.

I'm glad you solved this

but I can't help but feel bad for all the down time. Sometimes we can't look past what is working and what isn't. The "why is something not working?", the important question. Coming to the forum and typing, helps me solve issues faster when I can't seem to step back and look clearly at the whole picture.

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

kgsouth posted:

Scott, glad you found the issue, Just a reminder if you are plugging the power usb in and out that plug mounted to the board inside the WiFi is not very secure and and any bending action on it will break it loose,

KG,

This is actually the 3rd WIFI unit I have purchased. I have had one where it came loose inside. I have one in my trainroom, one on my son's layout and one at the club downtown.

Scott Smith

scott.smith posted:

OK, so it is a locomotive issue.Thanks for everyone's input on this. If I remove one of my 3236 MTH/Ives engines and restart the TIU and WIFI everything works. When I place the locomotive back on the track everything loses signal.

So now I need to fix the 3236 locomotive. We have a PS2 locomotive 3V board. When I first placed it on the track there was a spark. Tried it again no problem and it added to the remote perfectly.
First time I tried to reverse the engine the light switched directions but the engine didn't after a couple of tries it worked fine......later on I was going to run it with the WIFI and that is when everything started with my WIFI problems. It still worked fine with the remote. Add the WIFI and the signals are lost to the WIFI. My guess is that there is a short somewhere that is causing the signaling issue I am open to suggestions on the repair remedy.

Scott Smith

 

Sorry Scott! Now it's me not looking at the issue.

The problem with this one from here, is it would be hard to pin down what's causing it outside of something obvious like a pinched wire.

I would guess it's a board issue and would need to be tested in a jig or proper frame set-up. Now you have to narrow down the issue and I would look for things like a wire that has rubbed on the frame right at the trucks. I don't have or have worked on this particular engine to know it's faults. I do know that the wires to the trucks is always a weak link!

 Like posted before, don't put a good board inside this engine until you narrow the issue down! Just try this board set outside the engine. Marty F has posted ideas like unplugging stuff one at a time to narrow down a short. You don't need the smoke unit plugged in for example. The 8 pin harness can also go. The 12 wire can even go but you won't have sound.

 If it is a wire from a truck issue grounding to frame for example, it must be intermittent enough so not to be throwing the breaker. Do you use MTH bricks? Z4000 or other Z? Lionel PH180s? Any power meter to show amp draw?

I think an email to GGG would help you the best here! When these board sets are on the way out, it can be frustrating to find the issue. Intermittent stuff is like chasing your tail.

 Don't work on powered track!

Unplug everything at the board set and then only plug the 7 wire harness that carries the tach, and power wires to the board set. If the issue is gone, we can move forward. If it remains, you need to pull the board and test it in something else to see exactly what is shorting.

Heck, I've even seen shorted ditch light wires on an AC6000 causing me grief until I found it. I've had a truck that had an internal short from a missing isolator. I've had bad pots, etc. That's what I get for buying used stuff! It's a learning adventure.

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

So the engine was scrambled? Locked into forward? An engine reset fixed the signal being dragged down?

Engineer-Joe posted:

BTW, I have also got the "no TIU found" if the signal was drawn way down. You don't have Lionel stuff on the same powered rails do you?

I expected it to be an engine that needed a choke! Watch for failing battery down the road. I've had these issues pop back up later on when the battery was failing.

Did you ever run a signal strength test with any engine here during this issue?

" on Sour mash and cheap wine " ??

Why go back to DCC when I have DCS!

The engine was not locked in forward. It would operate fine forward, reverse, and even a lash up with the remote. Turn on the WIFI and the WIFI signal was lost. Remove the engine and the WIFI worked great. I did not run any signal tests before the fix.

Scott Smith

 

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