Passenger Cars for Lionel "Red Lightning" F-3

With the Lionel cars you could add red pin stripes down the raised flutes to make a matching effect. The Williams cars seem to have some blue on them? In the end whatever you like best.

Well... Not to be a nitpicker, but the NYC didn't use F units on passenger trains (much), the "F" is for "freight".

The F3s were freight units (with the exception of those tested on the NE States through Massachusetts and out of La Salle Street Station to St. Louis). 

How about a nice long train of Pacemakers?

Landon,

Of the two sets you mentioned it would seem the Lionel set would be the best. Going strictly by memory they seem to be the closer match. As another poster said maybe you can give the cars a red trim.

Just to share a couple ideas I had for my set of the same engines. I understand that Williams also made a set of 15 inch NYC aluminum cars in a silver/chrome finish. The second idea was since the engine are Postwar Connentional Classics, I thought a set of Lionel Lines aluminum cars would look great behind them as well. Whichever of these sets I choose to go with they would be alternated with a freight train.

Bill

Actually F3's did pull passenger cars.  I don't believe the "F" stood for Freight as you see lots of pictures of F3's pulling streamliners and all sorts of passenger cars.

Let me suggest a set of Postwar aluminum stream liners with "Lionel Lines" on their sides .  Another option,  about 20 years or so ago, Weaver imported aluminum finished cars with New York Central lettering.  I have a set of these and they look good behind my Conventional Classics F-3s.

I am not sure, but I think Williams also imported aluminum cars in silver that would be suitable for your Fs.

The Williams and Weaver cars are clones of the original Lionel 2500 series aluminum streamlined cars and that is why I believe they would make a suitable consist for your Fs.

Ed Boyle. 

Actually, I believe the "F" designations used by the builder Electromotive Division of GM started with the F-3s predecessor, the FT. The "F" stood for "Fourteen hundred," the horsepower of the prime mover of that engine. "F" worked for the F-3 as well, it having been equipped with a Fifteen hundred horsepower prime mover. It had nothing to do with "freight."

The "F" for freight designation had some meaning with some engines made by ALCO (American Locomotive Co.). In the designation of their FA series of diesel engines the F stood for freight, and with their PA series of diesel engines the P stood for passenger.  

Of the two choices presented, my vote is for the Lionel version, and by adding a red pinstripe, I think it would look really cool.

Ed Boyle is right about the Williams cars - they made silver aluminum passenger cars that were clones of the original Lionel 2500 series of aluminum cars. I think they made them over a quite a few years, actually. The Williams cars say "Luxury Lines" on the side instead of "Lionel Lines," which of course they couldn't use. Lionel also made some very nice "Lionel Lines" silver aluminum cars in the 90s, which were in the same catalog with a set of Santa Fe warbonnet Alcos (I think it was Alcos); I believe it was the Surfliner set.

Lionel has made a number of the two-tone grey aluminum NYC passenger cars, beginning with the 9594-9598 Twentieth Century Limited set made in 1983-84 (they have smooth roofs rather than the fluted ones in the set you pictured). As others said, I think if you're getting a set of grey cars, without a doubt you're better off getting a set of Lionels rather than another manufacturer's versions, because it's more likely the grey color shades will match your engines. Personally, I like color, and the classic grey cars would be preferable. If it were me, I'd go with that 19171 Lionel set you have pictured, or if you want silver cars, the Surfliner cars mentioned above.

Another choice would be the 15" K'Line NYC Empire State Express cars, which are nice, and have finished interiors, but may be hard to find.(pictures below)

I'm sure we'll be corrected a billion times, but in FT103 (the movie), it was said that the F = freight, and T = 2700hp.  In addition, the four-wheeled passenger power was called the "TA" (twelve-hundred HP / A-unit), and was delivered before FT (1937).  If they were going to continue this naming line, then it would have been the T2 (Thirteen-hundred fifty HP / A unit-2nd version of the TA) or FA (fourteen hundred HP / A-unit).  Since ALCo didn't release it's FA until 1946, then EMD would have already named its units FA.  Their RS' (the "1" was added after the war) wasn't until 1941, a full 2 years after the EMC 103.

References:

FT Operating Manual

oil-electric.com - FT-103

Readingmodeler.com - The EMD FT

Americanrails.com - The EMD FT

we shall see...

Thanks,

- Mario

If you went with the aluminum Lionel Post War type or repros's, you would have a set of cars that could always be run behind something else if you chose too. I pull mine with a Marx tinplate Santa Fe diesel.

Steve

We're certain to have others weigh in on this , but here's what I've read:

The term F-unit refers to the model numbers given to each successive type, all of which began with F. The F originally meant Fourteen, as in 1,400 horsepower, not F as in Freight. Longer E-units for passenger service had twin 900 horsepower Diesel engines. The E meant Eighteen as in 1,800 horsepower. Similarly, for early EMD locomotives S means Six hundred and N means Nine hundred horsepower.

This just popped in my head... if we are going to use the F3s as passenger power, let's follow the Central's lead... Stainless.

Here's screen shots from Green Frog's "NYC Odyssey" and Pentrex's "The Water Level Route"

Thanks,

- Mario