Williams Trains WoW!

So do I!  

Welcome to the club!! I am a conventional runner so no command is a plus as I hate paying for it and not wanting it. Now I started as a MTH for most of my equipment....but as loco sounds was pushed out and cost went up I turned to Williams. I got this one for under $100 brand new sealed box from a major internet retailer.

Some may say the detail is coarse compaired to the big 2 but it's rugged and looks good running by you!!!

My only fear with WBB is they get full of themselves and prices go way up.....but then there is always the used market and I really have plenty now!!!

They have a new sound board without too much price increase. I too hope they hold the line on prices.

What worries me is the guys who keep asking Bachman to put more electronics in the Williams engines. That would drive the cost way up. We buy Williams because it is affordable and reliable. I just bought a kit to power a Williams F3 B unit for only $99.00. Try that with Lionel or MTH. Williams is the best bang for the buck.

Rob

I really want to see their new GP-30, it's suppose to have a 16-bit sound card and more individual (not cast on) detail.  Hopefully they'll also have a better slow speed than some of their older engines.

 

If they can hold the prices down they ought to sell out fast.  I hope they do more

I'd be much more interested in WBB locos if they had sound, so the could card they have talked about will be welcome.  I also would like it if they would gear more of their locos so they would run slower/smoother.  Clearly they can (e.g., the new ten-wheeler).

The first all WBB loco too......all other were Williams heritage  units that are still good units....I have rewired some of mine to slow them some. If it lowered the price I'd be happy with a no sound option with DCU only!!! 

Big fan here too. I also hope they don't try to join the features competition and end up raising both price and number of things that can go wrong. Their trains are today's version of what Lionel was in the post-war era.  

Hello guys and gals.........

I am still waiting for some mail order stores to have a williams #21698 black Santa Fe NW-2 on sale for 99 dollars.  Trainworldonline doesn't have that road name for that price oh well.

 

the woman who love the S.F.#5021

Tiffany

I have been running some conventional off and on and really enjoying it. Thinking back I may have been prompted somewhat by Lee and others conventional posts.

 

I do like the look and feel of the post war stuff. My LHS has some Williams, actually my local hardware store.  Great looking and very reasonable. I'm heading to town today and may pick one up. Especially with holidays coming I find myself running more and more conventional. Even dug out all mu coal dump cars, log car, aquarium car, all post war. Fun tiring to get them to work just right on the old operating tracks

 

Plus I can run at night and not wake anyone. Cant wait to run a Williams tomorrow. 

You know whats funny when you guys mention "Sound"?

I used to love all the sounds my MTH DCS locos make, that is until I took out my 1963 vintage Lionel Post War Growlers SanteFe Alco's passenger set for the first time in 25 years and man oh man is that post war growl addictive.

I find it very relaxing to just hear the sound of the electric motor, click clack of the rails and occassional odd noises these trains make.

I hope these Williams Trains sound that way, as I have not started them up yet....just been drooling over them sitting there on the track LOL!

 

Oh by the way, went to an actual hobby/train store (Hobby Town USA) for the first time in about 7 years (been 100% online), and got some track I needed for last nights track laying, and I can say that I miss that.

Cant imagine the fun of going to an actual Hardware Store, especially an old hardware store for trains...that would be the ultimate cool.

I have about 12 Williams engines and had only a minor problem, started in the wrong direction for me, so I took out the circuit board and wired it to a 6 amp bridge rectifier, it was an older Crown Edition engine.

Some of the older Williams engines had a QSI sound board that has engine revving sounds for the diesel engine, and train leaving announcement.

The newer Williams by Bachmann have the True Blast 2 sound system installed, horn and bell features.

Only the steam engines have smoke if so equipped.

For better prices on Williams try either Westrn Depot or Choo Choo auctions.com

 

Lee F.

 

Hi Lee, even better prices than Trainworld?

I thought $149-$169 was pretty darn good?

Also, do you use the 3 types of "Bachmann" oil Williams/Bachmann states in their instruction sheet or do you use the standard MTH oil for the roller, gears, and pivot points?

This was the first time i was instructed to use Oil instead of grease on the gears.

I have six Williams/ Williams by Bachmann locomotives and I really enjoy them all. They are all excellent runners and I operate only conventional mode equipment. I prefer it thay way, which ofcourse is a personal choice. I am hoping to pick up an NYC GP30 when they come out. I can't wait  to hear the new 16 bit sound system. Way to go WbB, keep up the great work!!
Cobrabob.

Nice layout cobra!

Of the last  ten engines over the last three years I've purchased eight are Williams. In reverse order they are WBB NW2, K-line Plymouth, WBB E7, WBB Rectifier, WBB GG1, WBB Peter Witt trolley, WBB BL2, WBB GP38, K Line Empire State Express Hudson, WBB J Class. I have been running conventional and quietly I love mine. I think I want the GP 30 next.

You folks who are waiting for the WBB GP-30 will, I believe, not be disappointed once you receive your locomotive.  I will be buying at least one, and possibly more, when it is released in my chosen livery.  And I'm sure our product reviewer, George Brown, will be giving one a thorough testing once they are available.

I have gone over to the Williams engines as well. I find this a very interesting thread and I am enjoying all the posts. I have gone to the conventional operations because it has become very interesting to me. I have Legacy and DCS but do not turn them on any more and in fact have turned off the Smoke and Sound on my TMCC engines. I really like the horn on my Williams Southern F7's AA. I just ordered a GP9 L&N and F3's AA Southern Black/White. Please keep posting about Williams and the conventional operations.

I just ran my Williams train for the first time (GG-1 scale), and it ran like a charm!

Used the MTH Z-1000 transformer and control and it ran nice and slow too.

Lubricated the rollers and pivot points with the MTH Oil, and used MTH grease on the external gears per the instructions.

I had to stop because it could not clear the wall on the elevated side of the layout, so I had to pull up the 48' curve, set back down with T-pins, glue and allow it to set hopefully with better clearance.

BTW, there is only one sorta bad thing about these Williams trains....as previously mentioned because you can get them for such a great price you end up buying more and more of them.

LOL..I am trying to justify my 3rd and fourth loco's now!

Chipset, I think the GG1 (scale) and the E7's are the very nicest locos Williams make, you should get many years of happy running with them too. As you said, at the price, you can't beat them.

Thanks Dave! I am thinking about getting a Green GG-1 next since I already have a Brown GG-1 an d E7.

Williams will always be the price leader as they are the only company that owns its own manufacturing plant.  Their parent company Kader actually runs several manufacturing plants in China and the far East. Thats also a reason for consistent good quality.  In contrast Lionel and MTH are importers, not manufacturers. Those companies outsource their requirements probably to the lowest bidder.

Okay!  I have a Williams by Bachmann 4-6-0 Christmas set on the way.  I no longer collect Christmas sets (at one time I did), but I saw this one in action at York and couldn't resist getting one.  It will share running time on my around-the-tree circle of track with one of my tinplate sets (on an alternating basis since this is just a small circle of track on a circular table that I mounted atop the bottom half of a Jack Daniels whiskey cask).  A small train-ornaments-only tree will occupy the center, along with some tinplate cookie-container buildings.

I love their 0-27 offerings.  I think that Williams was a big reason why Lionel came out with the Conventional Classics series.  I hope they keep making good, affordable trains.  I was just running one of my favorite consists, a Williams turbine with Lionel PRR coaches.  

The Williams line speaks for itself. Solid, sturdy, and dependable trains.

 

The first Williams train I bought was the Western Maryland BL-2. I've always loved these "ugly ducklings" of the diesel world and you don't see many of them. Williams makes them in a number of road names.

 

Also have enjoyed their GP-9s and the NW-2s.

I have about 20 Williams/WBB Engines....GG1, EF4,EP5,BL2,E7,GP38,F3,F7,E60...They just keep running and running with no problems...Just keep them lubed and oiled as per the instructions and have fun. I have 2 grandsons,5 and 2, who I have absolutely no problem letting them run these engines without fear of blown boards or short circuits. My oldest Williams is an SD45 which is 25 yrs old and still runs perfectly. Wonder how the newer MTH and Lionel Products will run 25 yrs from now?

Keep up the great products WBB

 

Matt

This is such a great thread  I thought I would add a nice little review about a Williams by Bachmann 746 J class. When I opened the box I found a great big heavy engine and tender. Not a bit of plastic on the engine and the tender has everything metal but the shell. The tender has a nice whistle and bell that operate at low voltages. The engine pulls a ton and is very well detailed. Williams did a great job on reproducing the Lionel 746 J class and operates reliably like the original. Like ?chipset I use the MTH Z1000 and it makes for a nice smooth start and stop and slow operation, the controller also operates the sound very well. I liked the engine so much I put a fan driven smoke unit in it. It was very easy and took no time at all. Here's a video with the smoke and the engine running in the other one. Keep the great comments coming 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I use the MTH z-1000 transformer too. Perfect for slow starting and works that bell/horn every time. I installed a lionel fan driven smoke unit in my Williams 671 also. Easy to do and works great. Boxcar Bill has a kit for sale to convert it..

Rob

Liam

 

What mfg smoke unit did you use? How difficult is it to put in?

 

Thanks

Matt

Great post everyone and I am enjoying the read. I use a MTH Z4000 to run my conventional operations and my Williams E7's run very slow and just outstanding. Can't wait to get my GP9 and F3's. I thought I was the only person who liked Williams and conventional operation but I am reading a different story now. Great thread.

Its from a forum  Boxcar Bill it is liionel 27OHM fan driven smoke unit. The kit comes with the unit, funnel, switch, and wires and it took me less than five minutes. eres a video of the switch.. he engine already had a place so it was done in less than a minute  

 

Matt, its not hard to install and I have some pics of the install. It comes with an on/off switch too. Very nice to have. You will need to buy an led to replace the front head lamp though because the OEM light is run by the smoke unit board and at only 6 volts.

Rob

Liam...thanks for the info

oldrob....if not too much trouble, could you e mail me the pics of the install..Mil261@aol.com

 

Thanks Guys

Matt

I agree with you 100%....Just upgrade the sound like in the new GP30s and leave everything else alone!!! If it ain't broke, don't fix it!!!!!

 

Matt

about how much are those smoke units?

 

thanks

I bought a UP Berkshire about a year ago for around $230. It is a great little steamer but I did miss the absence of sound and finally installed a sound board in the tender. Talk about being solidly built!. With the speaker inside the tender one barely heard the sound. I had to end up mounting the speaker underneath the tender. Now it is loud........Williams makes a great product.

I enjoyed the Berkshire but will probably sell it. I just aquired a Lionel Legacy SF 4-8-4 Northern (yea I know $230 is a far cry from $1300 but my lord what a locomotive.......) and need the track siding. I just get the feeling I won't be running the Berkshire that much any more.

Joe

I guess it must be hit or miss. I bought a dash 9 for my son and it had no sound out of the box and it ran so fast that slow speed operation is impossible. I took it apart and found the sound board was just double side taped to a piece of metal and had come loose. I tweaked the pot, remounted it and it started working. I still need to go back and rewire the motors into series to try to slow it down, but I don't feel like it. I bought him an MTH RailKing dash 8 for about $125 more and he won't even look at the dash 9 anymore. I like the idea of inexpensive durable good performing trains. The dash 9 just doesn't deliver.

Allan, what happened to the Jack Daniels that was in that cask?

100% agree too! The customer can upgrade it if they wish at a later date. The only thing I do with a Williams engine when I get it is rewire the motors and add my own LED lighting. They are bullet proof stump pullers!

I wouldn't worry about Williams being badgered into adding command control to its locomotives. 

 

Lionel isn't licensing TMCC (much less Legacy) to anyone else other than the companies who signed on initially*...ask the guy who runs SMR Trains (they make Civil-War-era brass models), and we all know how many licensees DCS has.

 

*(Jerry Calabrese. was quoted as saying that was a mistake)

 

Williams is in pretty much the only spot they can occupy given the market conditions, and their units can be fitted with either command system thanks to similar motor/powertrain setups.

 

---PCJ

Matt I sent you pics. I can't remember for sure, but I think I paid only 25.00 for the smoke unit from Boxcar Bill.

Rob

Chipset, congrats on the purchases.  I own a few Williams by Bachmann engines myself. The E7 is a nice model and my favorite WBB.

Add me as a Williams fan.  I have a GP38 and an O27 Alco FA set, and both are great runners with heavy-duty construction.  I series-wired the Geep, but the Alcos seemed to be geared a bit differently (?) and didn't need rewiring.  There will definitely be more WBB units added to my roster, especially if/when the GP30 is offered in Conrail and/or PRR. 

I love my williams engines. I have gp-38 and gp-9 and nw-2. They all run great and pull great and also i have several williams cars they are durable to  

Hello chessie1971......

 

I hope to find a Williams S.F. NW-2 as that is my favorite switcher for like 99 dollars when trainworld online has the S.F. version for that price but they have other road names for that price and not the S.F. oh well.  Is your NW-2 an good runner ?

 

the woman who loves the S.F.#5021

Tiffany

 

Yes my nw-2 engine is very good runner. I pulled 11 coal hoppers loaded with coal for two hours at the mall show. The motors only got luke warm and we was using a mth z-4000 transformer. I run it at 10 volts it pulled 1.9 to 2.2 amps the whole time.  

Tiffany i hope u find one i been looking to for yeah

Hello chessie1971........

 

I am impressed with the performance of your NW-2.  I think the Williams S.F. version is #21698.  Is yours a chessie version by chance ?

 

the woman who loves the S.F.#5021

Tiffany

I have 2 WBB GG-1s semi-scale (space is a problem). One in PC and one in green Pennsy 5 stripe. For anyone who is dipping their toe in the O Scale waters, and came from a smaller (and less expensive scale) WBB is a good buy to get you started, although it will appeal to many experienced O Scalers who don't mind conventional nor copious amounts of detail.

Tiffany my NW-2 Switcher Engine is in B&O paint scheme when C&O took over B&O

hello chessie1971........

Oh that is a handsome engine, love the dark blue and yellow colors .   Did you get yours for 99 dollars at the trainworld online ?

 

the woman who loves the S.F.#5021

Tiffany

no i didn't. I got this one for 121.78 plus 10.00 shipping off a dealer wasn't bad price but after i got it i seen it on trainworld site for 99.99. I said darn could have got it cheaper LOL. Thanks for the compliment on the engine Tiffany.

Nice switcher Chessie. Enjoy. 

Williams and WbB are the mainstay of my pulling power.  70% of my locomotives are by Williams.  I love the reliability and value of these products.   E7, F3, Genesis, GG1, Metroliner's, and steam locomotives are my favorites.  Generally my layout will host long MTH & Lionel consists pulled by Williams locomotives. 

 

Once in a while I am in the mood to run sound equipped locomotives by MTH, but mostly I enjoy the smooth quiet reliable running of trains with Williams power on the front. 

 

 

 

 

Here's a Williams NW-2 pulling 21 cars, effortlessly:

---PCJ

Great video. When I'm running conventional, I only run my Williams and WBB engines. Any one of my WBB engines (BL-2, FA1, Sharks, etc) will pull as many cars as my MTH engines. I'm hoping get a GP-30 in UP colors because I like the look of the new engine.

Thanks Jeff

My thoughts as well. I am enjoying this thread on Williams and conventional operations. Keep them coming. Great thread.

I too love my Williams engines, price cannot be beat and the quality is certainly there.

Most of my mainline power is W/WBB.  Most of Houston Tinplate mainline power on the large portable layout is W/WBB.  The stuff is like Timex watches or Pink Bunny batteries.  The only week point I can see is where the wire from the hot 3rd rail shoe goes to the motor.  That connection has torn off on one truck.  But stuff from the Shack can fix that here at home.

 

What I like about W is you can hear a sound system nobody thinks about.  The sound of a train on the rails going through joints, switches and crossings is a nice sound to hear.  And if the locos are far enough from you, that is the only sound you are going to hear except for brakes and car springs.

Allen Miller:

 

Is that GP30 you are getting by any chance be in yellow and blue?

It will be if/when they produce one in that livery.  Until then, I'll just have to sit on the sidelines and hope they make one.  I won't be buying one in the first round because I've stopped buying anything other than in my chosen road names.

The GP 30 I want is black and yellow and white. They are the same as the paint scheme EMD used for thier painted ads for the GP 30 in the 60s. I have an old Trains mag with it. Does anyone know which one?

I like the scale sized Williams (WBB) locos. I add crew figures from MTH, and LED headlights from Evan Designs for added realism.

 

Here are the Williams (WBB) I own:

 

-B&O E7 ABA

-PRR GG1 in Tuscan and Green

-PRR EP5 in Tuscan and Green

-BLW Shark demonstrator ABA

-Santa Fe F3 ABBA

-Southern 4-6-0

-Baltimore Transit Co. Peter Witt Street Car

 

At York, I bought my second WBB EP5 brand new, for $120, unbelievable!

 

I like pulling long trains and have upgraded the dummy units on all my covered wagon sets, so they have four motored pulling goodness.

 

FYI, simply putting my two GG-1s together, or my two EP5s, makes for an easy lashup with four motored pulling power.

 

Or better yet, I can lash up my 2 GG1s and 2 EP5s for 8 motored pulling greatness.

 

See below:

  

 

 

 

Myself, I have just the B&M BL-2 and the AMTRAK Genesis as far as engines.  I love 'em.  I also have several cars.  They seem as rugged and well-built as postwar Lionel.

Is that black, white and yellow KCS?

My nephew is into John Deere.  He likes trains.  I want all the UP heritage.  Guess what is next:  CNW

After seeing  the NKP 765 in Lewistown, Harrisburg and going around Horseshoe Curve this summer my 4 year old son and I decided we had to get a NKP 765. We bought a Williams at York and wow, what great detail, smooth operation and a great self-quilling whistle for $235. I will be buying a lot more Williams in the future.

       

Nope, Atlanic Coast Line. I must gp look for that ad. It was really ominous looking with the engines really leaning into it.

I have a couple of Williams engines and they can’t be beat for the money, and they were easy to upgrade to TMCC.  But I have one small complaint for Bachmann. They dropped most of their B-units from their catalog.

Rob

 

 Williams used to offer a decent sound system. It was add on,easy to install and optional and they could do it again without changing the cost or design of their existing locomotives.

 

I would also like it if they offered interiors for their passenger cars.

 

I think they would sell a lot of these as well as sound systems. RS4 is available for an upgrade but competition and variety of offerings benefits customers.

 

Dale H

 

Does anyone have more pictures of that Christmas set?  The single picture published everywhere is lacking because it doesn't show each car well with the train going around the tree. 

towdog

I do not have any pictures but what I can read in the catalog it comes with a gondola, refrigerated box car, caboose, engine and tender. I really like the looks of this set and just might get it for our Christmas tree train this year.

For under $200. I brought home from York a GP30 NYC the detail level is considerably better than any Williams before it. The volume of the engine is not very loud though. You may not even hear it while pulling a train...Jim

The only thing I dont care for is the dorky whistle on those steamers..that would be the first thing that goes..second like you did is put a good fan driven smoke unit..Id moded all my smoke units and man they put out the smoke..Liam checkout my 4 new videos of my smoke units mods..hope in a day I'll get a video of my S2 running and smoking..

I only have 1 Williams engine, an E7, but am very pleased with it.  The one thing I noticed that puts it above all others is that I can remove the shell by taking out only 4 screws that are easy to get to.

 

I installed the ERR Cruise Commander and a LED headlight, with plug so it would still be easy to remove the shell, and added wire handrails and grabs.  The result is a very nice-looking engine that is a solid performer.  Next mod is to add the ERR Railsounds kit.

 

I see they have a "scale" F3 AA set, how are those?  Anybody know what "phase" the unit is?  I need a F3 for Seaboard Air Line, but they only had certain phases of the F3 and I'm not in the mood at present to take on anymore projects.

Hi, Bob.

 

The Williams F3 is very similar to Lionel's postwar version which means it's a "hodgepodge" of a bunch of details and not correct for any particular phase. Given that the Williams model also duplicates the dimensional innaccuracies of Lionel's unit, the use of the term "scale" is misleading as the former Williams management had a somewhat loose interpretation of "scale."

 

I hope this helps.

 

Bob

 

I have Williams too! As I said on a post in another thread where everyone was groaning & moaning about cost accounting and overseas production and spewing out incorrect economic theories that would make Keynes turn over in his grave (and now that thread is thankfully locked) I'm all about value and Williams seems to me to be the one company that has its head screwed on straight. 

 

They're providing an extremely fine product...good looking, smooth running and reliable, at an extremely fair price. And it's an even better value if you get it from an on-line discounter (thank you Trainworld). I already know that my next purchase will be a WBB steam engine of some sort.

 

One thing though...their motors are so quiet, I'm actually missing the sound of the engine...either the actual buzzing of the electric motor like on my old PW Lionel, or a synthesized sound from a circuit board & speaker. So I would like to ask, are there any instructions someplace that could help someone who is an electronics nincompoop like me how to add a sound card to a WBB engine so I can get more than just a whistle and bell?

Hey Bob, thanks for the info   It doesn't look like Atlas will ever come out with a Seaboard version (and it may be out of my price range) so I'll give these some thought.

 

Ray, the cheapest way to go is installing a MRC AC Sounder card, that will give you diesel, bell, and horn sounds.  You'll need the handheld remote to set the sounds up like you want them, but I think both can be bought new for $50.

 

From there you're talking of close to $200 for something like the ERR Railsounds Commander, if you want cruise then add the ERR Cruise Commander (more $$$).

 

I presently have just the Cruise Commander (no sound, I took my MRC AC Sounder out) in my E7, but it glides along the rails.

I gave up on command engines too, my first williams was a GP9. had problems with right out of the box, but found the help it needed on this forum. I then bought the scale GG1 and 6 car passenger set, what a good looking and running train. I then found a F7 AA set at a good blowout price, and just ordered the southern E7 AA set with matching 6 car passenger cars at blowout price. was so happy that I placed another order for a D&H engine and another 6 car passenger set at blowout prices. I might buy one more passenger set at these prices, I can't stop.....

I just read the review on the Williams GP30 in this months OGR...god i want one, but I am still an unemployed Government contractor...

Anyway, I loved your Editorial Allen regarding your Thomas Kinkaide print of Lionelville station.

Excellent Editorial!

OK Pete - let me be your conscience - STOP STOP STOP! (I did the same thing - bought 3 of the Williams f7s)

I bought both of these for $220 at York...two different road numbers. I added a Evan Design LED, and crew figures. Voila...a handsome stump puller.

 

 

Can't see the pic - only the words, "PREMIUM IMAGE"?

Can you see my Trainmasters now?

 

I have mastered posting pics and movies from my PC. 

 

I am having no sucess posting pics directly from my Iphone or Ipad, whats the secret? Do I still have to have the pic online offsite...or is there a place here to host the pics???

 

 

Very nice! I take photos with my iphone and upload them to "photobucket" a free photo hosting site - then I paste the URL for that pic into the message.

In the conventional electric train arena Williams locos are far superior to Lionel in operation and price. Significantly more pulling power and a lot smoother.

With "Bill T"'s comment above, I wondered about the conventional Lionel (ex-K-Line??)

conventional Shay (druther have a Heisler, but these are available)?  How good are

these as runners?  Are they inferior to the electronic loaded Lionel stuff?  I have the

Wms. 4-6-0, but have not heard of any other Wms. steamers on the horizon..certainly

have read rave reviews of it and don't think I've read of the 4-6-0 being rewired to

slow it down?

Per Bachamnn at TCA talk.....if you want to see what might be in O look at what we do in other scales........not sure what that means...but I like what they do in other scales.

Just read on another thread and thought it might be useful to those following this thread...

 

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/d...nt/16494189563426381

 

Bob