ATLAS O RS1

Turn the flywheels by hand. That will tell you if you have a mechanical problem. More likely the EOB board is giving up the ghost.

Pete

Ok thank you, will try that.

....and there was no 'cruise' on/off switch on this one, it also did vary in speed in low voltage spots, so wondering if it does in fact have EOB?  In any event, this is a process of elimination it seems.

It’s an early TAS SAW board, so no cruise on this. Also, of all of the Atlas Big O/Master locos, an RS-1 is probably the most difficult to remove the shell then reattach.

Thanks, I noticed none of the Master line locos are easy to dissasemble. It seems to slowly be running better over time (30 min run with no cars)...I will save the dissassemble for another time if it totally dies.  Fingers crossed.

This was moved to the proper forum since the discussion is about an ATLAS product.

DMBX,

I have the same engine, Atlas GN RS1. Do you have the manual? I have a diagram from Atlas that shows all the parts and how they all go together. It's a PDF file I can forward to you if you don't have a copy.

I did take mine apart and it takes a lot of patience. I would dig into the engine, clean the gears of the old grease and then re-grease the gears. Don't over grease, this will only cause issues down the road.

You can then run test run it without re-installing the shell. Do this to make sure everything is working correctly.

Good luck.

RAY

Some, not all,of the original Atlas RS-1's, had EOB,  (Engineer on Board),   speed control.  Original, from TAS, (Train America Studio), Youngstown Ohio,  at the time.   Key is a flywheel,  with sensor hash-marks, and an optical sensor.  There was information about operation and adjustments of the speed control, in the box with the model.   

There is information in the TMCC section of the forum about EOB.

Link to older post.    Click on the underlined phrase.

Edit/Add:   Removing the shell, requires information about the handrail installation. 

My Atlas RS-1 came with EOB and I believe its from one of the earlier production runs.

I have several Atlas engines of this vintage and have noticed in some the grease inside the trucks has hardened so much the wheels will barely move. The only solution is to disassemble the truck and pick out the old grease. The trucks are really difficult to remove as there is a screw that has to be removed from above the truck to get it to drop out of the frame and there is very little room to get to it. The RS-1 is the most difficult because it is much smaller than say the 4 axle Geeps and there is limited room to get to anything.

Ken

@kanawha posted:

My Atlas RS-1 came with EOB and I believe its from one of the earlier production runs.

I have several Atlas engines of this vintage and have noticed in some the grease inside the trucks has hardened so much the wheels will barely move. The only solution is to disassemble the truck and pick out the old grease. The trucks are really difficult to remove as there is a screw that has to be removed from above the truck to get it to drop out of the frame and there is very little room to get to it. The RS-1 is the most difficult because it is much smaller than say the 4 axle Geeps and there is limited room to get to anything.

Ken

I dont disagree. But I have found that sometimes, its the axles getting stuck in the bearings being the issue, not the grease in the gearbox.  Every atlas diesel I've seen, the axles can drop out the bottom without pulling the truck block.  Worth a try to do that first as its easier. There's 4 screws on each axle cap. Pull the axles out, manipulate the bearings until they free up and clean the axle with acetone. Reassemble and re-oil the bearings. When you reassemble, take note of the fact that the bearings have a flat spot. Make sure you orient them correctly and get the idler gears re-engaged, or it wont go back together.

Thanks all, I am going to try the easier procedure 1st and pull the axles and clean/lube.  My best guess at this point is what Ken observed with the axle grease hardening. I would appreciate the .pdf that you mentioned Ray in case I have to dissasemble further.....and yes it's O gauge or No Gauge!  Cheers!

To remove the shell you first remove six screws. Four under the long hood, two under the short hood. Then look for the locking tabs the hold the cab into the frame. Also tabs that hold the hoods into the cab near the top. Pull out the four railings from the cab and also the small box (toolbox???) at the base of the cab. Then lift slowly. Its easy to break off those locking tabs. You will feel a lot of resistance due to the tight fit of the electronics next to the hoods.

Pete

I bought a 2-rail DC model to convert to DCC. I think the shell comes apart in 3 pieces - long hood, cab then short hood. I had to remove the cab first to get to the smoke unit bracket. The bracket was interfering with removal of the long hood so I loosened up the screws securing the smoke unit and that allowed for enough play side-to-side to remove the long hood. It actually went together much easier but that's 'cause I chucked the smoke generator. Frees up a lot of room.

Here is the PDF. Let me know if this helps.

RAY

Ok, good to know the hood removal procedure...and yeah I have not seen any loco where the electronics did not fit exceedingly tight.  Definitely risk of damage/broken wires, etc. A job for the afternoon at least!

Thanks Ray! Man there are way more screws and parts than one might imagine...

Update: I removed the lower gear box screws and oddly still could not remove the assembly to access axle gears. I suspect that a screw from above also needed.  However, I injected some light oil into the centre screw hole (kind of where the traction motor would be on the real one) and it runs much much better now.  I conclude that the gear grease did in fact dried up so much it essentially siezed the gears.  Happily a full dissassemble not required. 👍

@DMBX posted:

Thanks all, I am going to try the easier procedure 1st and pull the axles and clean/lube.  My best guess at this point is what Ken observed with the axle grease hardening.

What I found was not only was the axle grease hardened but also the gearbox grease.

The Atlas truck/gearbox is a good example of something that has been grossly over engineered. On an MTH engine one screw drops the truck from the frame and motor. Cleaning the gearbox and motor worm is easy. On the Atlas you have to remove the screw that holds the pickup roller and remove the body shell. Then you have to remove the very small screw that holds the motor mount to the truck and this has to be done from the top. Note that the tach reader board is in the way of getting to the screw on that truck. The other truck is relatively easier. In some cases I've had to remove the 4 screws that hold the motor/truck mounting plate to the frame and drop the whole motor/truck/mounting plate assembly out of the frame to get to that #%*^ top screw all while trying not to break any wires. Then you can remove the screw from the bottom of the truck that holds the motor to the truck. Remove the 4 screws that hold the lower  and top parts of the truck block together. Then you can disassemble the truck block and get to the internal gears and axles.

It's an absolute nightmare.

Ken

I too own the Milwaukee Road version of the loco. Mine also preformed poorly when I received it. Like DNBX I did the required maintenance and it still ran like crap. I did a search here on the forum and the one thing I found was the coating on the wheels lead to a rather poor ground to the outside rails. I started with a wire brush in my Dremel tool which helped but it still struggled to run well. I finally switch to a fine grinding wheel which worked much better. The trick is to lay the loco on it's side and use alligator clips on the frame and center pickup to the transformer and run it slowly while using the Dremel against the wheels. Take your time with gentle pressure as you don't want to distort the shape or cemetery of the wheel. It runs better now but still not as well as my other Atlas offerings.

I have 3 mth rs1's all perform flawlessly. best railking scale ever produced by them. this is one time where atlas loses out. glad I went mth on this model.

I am thinking that might not have EOB but an OEM version of TAS' SAW board. The SAW board put like 5 volts to the motor at the first speed step in command mode so it's a jumping bean at the start. It will probably konk out all over the place due to only having two rollers.

Right now you are probably dealing with Atlas' congealed grease. On my Erie Builts, I really had to scrub out the gears. I don't know what they used back then but it turns into cement over the years.

Thanks Norm, yes and yes.....jumpy starter and for sure cemented grease.  After 'flushing' out with very light oil via the screws removed (I am really trying to avoid a nightmare dissassembly) and running at a higher speed and voltage for 30+ minutes it is approaching a normal operator.  I never leave my units without running for more than a few months but this used one in my estimation has sat in box its entire 20 year life.  I really like Atlas O locomotives, and 90% trouble free, but a few notable problems, and both of my RS-1s needed 'treatment'.  The other had wheels that needed serious sanding just to get a stable TMCC signal. Ah this is a learning hobby after all🤓👍

If you are fortunate enough to find the parts, I would replace the traction tire wheel-set with tireless solid wheels.

DBMX,

I guess lessons are learned.  I have two New Haven Atlas RS1diesels, and both are doing well. I guess locos are like people—if we don’t keep moving regularly, it’s a lot harder to maintain our mobility.  🙈

Nice engine. Mine has been running well since new. I appreciate all of the info.

Thanks, the NYC unit is a nice scheme too! GN 182 is doing much better now - hauled 22 cars.  I love the heft, details and nice paint job on Atlas diesels.  Most of mine (11) are also running just fine! This forum is a great place to share and help fellow modellers - O scale trains are not as simple as they used to be - especially with all the electronics!👍

@kanawha posted:

My Atlas RS-1 came with EOB and I believe its from one of the earlier production runs.

Atlas started making its RS-1s in 2002, and made another run in 2003 and again in 2004, and at various times afterwards. I think they started putting EOB in engines in 2004 (EOB was installed in some of their other engines beginning in 2004, I know), so the first two runs of RS-1s wouldn't have had it. I did, however, see a review of the RS-1 from 2006 (in the other O gauge mag), and there was no mention of it having EOB (and it rated low speed performance) - only TMCC and RailSounds.

I have the 1960’s paint LIRR version — really beautiful engine had the same problem- sent it to atlas for repair it was the geese getting hard — they fixed it but it cost 100 as I remember— two things drive me crazy tho first off it’s not alco sound but a GP9 and second that headlight is white not a yellowish and too bright— I always wanted to know if it’s possible to put ERR alco sounds in it and swap out the led headlight for something more prototypical

Swapping the sound depends what system is in it now, as it could be SAW, TAS EOB or ERR.  

Sure you can put ERR in it, but its probably a full gut job and reinstall (LIRR was a 2006 release, which is probably a SAW board.

As far as the headlight, you can do one of 2 things (or both):

1: add a resistor to dim it

2: swap the LED for a different color. I like sunny white LEDs from TCS which provide a much more headlamp colored glow.