New Layout 2021-24......Update, April, 15, 2024

Great News ! It will be really cool to follow your progress!!

Have you ever thought about a layout ?

Congrats Peter. Looking forward to your build.

Bob

That's great Peter, I'll bet this will be a doozy!   Looking forward to the progress pictures.

WOW Peter, that's a wonderful wife! I hope she set aside some extra funds for all the new train items your going to need to fill such a big room! I cant wait to see the new layout build in progress!

@Putnam Division posted:

My current layout is about 10 years old....

It is 6x16' on 3 levels of Mianne Benchwork. The Top level is a 2x16' engine  facility.

You can expect regular updates.....I intend to finish this new layout!

Peter

“I intend to finish this new layout!” - I believe that phrase will be carved on all of our tombstones

I do have one question about your old upper level, Peter... does it connect to the main level or does it require the use of the flying five-fingered crane to move serviced engines onto the mainlines???

I am looking forward to seeing your progress.

if anyone deserves a bigger train room, it's certainly gotta be you.  Glad to hear it.

= walt

Looking forward to your updates Peter.

Breaking down your beautiful current layout has got to be heartbreaking but building a new one will be great fun.

What will happen in the old space? Will you be salvaging parts of the current layout? What did you learn and will do differently on the new layout?

Pete,

I am so pleased for you.   This is great news!!!   

Some unsolicited advice:

• Don't be in a hurry to "get trains running"
• Get it right the first time - do-overs are demoralizing

Best of luck.  I will watch this thread with great interest.

Again - congratulations on your retirement.  I hope this brings you much joy.

George

Awesome news Peter! Can't wait to see what you will create in your new space.

Dave

Peter, I have enjoyed watching trains run on your present layout, but am really looking forward to seeing what you build in the attic.  Now that you are retired, you should be able to move along at a very quick pace!  Oh!  I'm retired, and my layout progress is crawling along at about the same speed I was taking down Christmas lights and Nativity display this warm (35 degrees) afternoon. 

Just kidding, follow George's advice and don't get in a hurry!

Excellent, Peter! Nice size room you are getting. I'm jealous! I second (or is it third) George's advice. And be certain to leave room for visitors!

Chris

LVHR

@Apples55 posted:

“I intend to finish this new layout!” - I believe that phrase will be carved on all of our tombstones

I do have one question about your old upper level, Peter... does it connect to the main level or does it require the use of the flying five-fingered crane to move serviced engines onto the mainlines???

I am looking forward to seeing your progress.

......the flying 5 fingered crane......it was great conceptually......if, I did it again, I would plan on better lighting underneath......I used battery-operated LEDS, and they weren’t enough.....

Peter

@Lionelski posted:

Looking forward to your updates Peter.

Breaking down your beautiful current layout has got to be heartbreaking but building a new one will be great fun.

What will happen in the old space? Will you be salvaging parts of the current layout? What did you learn and will do differently on the new layout?

The old space will be basement living space.....and one wall will eventually be built-in shelves with a library ladder......I have a huge history book collection (separate from my collection of books on railroad history and model railroading).

The Mianne Benchwork will be reused and I will get with Tim for an expansion.

I believe that I will switch to all Ross track and switches. I am toying with a few plans.....

The big changes are that I will try to leave more room for viewing and have at least one O72 loop.

Peter

@G3750 posted:

Pete,

I am so pleased for you.   This is great news!!!   

Some unsolicited advice:

• Don't be in a hurry to "get trains running"
• Get it right the first time - do-overs are demoralizing

Best of luck.  I will watch this thread with great interest.

Again - congratulations on your retirement.  I hope this brings you much joy.

George

Agreed.......I’m not going to finalize a plan until I see the room......then I will make sure it doesn’t overpower the space......

I have no deadline for getting trains running since I will have the modular group layouts to run on......

I am re-reading Dennis Brennan's wonderful book from about 10 years ago. I am reading the new Jim Barrett book now. I will be reviewing certain OGR and TM videos, especially those that deal with urban cityscapes.

Congrats Peter, on both retirement and new layout space.  Good luck with obtaining your dream layout, whatever that may be.

@Mark Boyce posted:

Peter, I have enjoyed watching trains run on your present layout, but am really looking forward to seeing what you build in the attic.  Now that you are retired, you should be able to move along at a very quick pace!  Oh!  I'm retired, and my layout progress is crawling along at about the same speed I was taking down Christmas lights and Nativity display this warm (35 degrees) afternoon. 

Just kidding, follow George's advice and don't get in a hurry!

Mark.....I'm also going to have helpers from the Modular Group.....

Peter

Peter,

This is a tremendous opportunity. I'm looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

MELGAR

Let's look at the space.....the attic is approximately 30x40 at the 5' knee wall.

A stairwell cuts off a 6' cedar closet on the right end.

This leaves approximately a 30x30' space, plus the stairwell area. 10x20' is reserved for storage and the HVAC unit.

What have I been doing? We moved here 17 years ago......besides the train boxes, we have ben putting "stuff" up there ever since......plus, the stuff we brought over from the other house. My job this month is to move it out.

I rented a 10x20' storage unit to put everything in during construction. I have been moving train boxes down to the basement and am slowly packing trains...

The rest of the stuff: Legos, Rokenbok, American Girl Dolls, blocks, Beanie Babies, etc is being carted to storage along with multiple GoodWill trips.

I found some old friends

The storage area is 2 adjacent 10x10 units.....this is the kids stuff. The trains will be just next door.

This project has also showed me how "healthy" model railroading is as a hobby......since I retired, I am doing over 20K steps a day.......90% of them in the house, going up and down the stairs, carrying loads......

Once I clear it out, the contractor and I will go over the plans.....

Peter

Congratulations Peter.

This will be fun to watch.

J

With that much space you may be able to fit a nice version of the New York Central, New Haven, Amtrak and Norfolk & Western Railroads! Maybe Richmond, Fredericksburg & Potomac, too! Model railroads are great retirement projects.

MELGAR

@Putnam Division posted:

Mark.....I'm also going to have helpers from the Modular Group.....

Peter

With help from the Modular Group, you will be able to make great progress and bounce so many ideas off each other planning and while under construction!

What an attic!!!!!!  Tremendous!

Peter,

Congratulations on your retirement, after 41 years, well deserved.   Look forward to your new layout.  That’s the best fun, building the layout.

Craig

Oh what fun you will have! Can't wait to see your plan(s) and construction dailies. Congrats on your retirement.

Congrats, and much success and enjoyment with the layout.

Congratulations!!!.   Look forward to seeing you progress as you build the new layout.

its,"up up and away we goooooooooooooooooooooooo.retirement isn't what its cracked up to be,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,it's BETTER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! congratz

@terry hudon posted:

its,"up up and away we goooooooooooooooooooooooo.retirement isn't what its cracked up to be,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,it's BETTER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! congratz

Yes indeed!!  You tell him Terry!

Peter, Congratulations on your retirement and new space! Like everyone else, I look forward to the new layout.

Andy

Peter,

Congratulations on retiring and on the new train room.

I retired 6 years ago and keep so busy I don't know how I ever had time to work! 

Looking forward to what you'll be doing with that space - what an opportunity!

When I originally saw the pics of the space, I was concerned about temperature extremes.  Reading further, I see that you've lived there for 17 years, so I'm sure you'll have that covered as part of the construction. 

@Putnam Division posted:

......the flying 5 fingered crane......it was great conceptually......if, I did it again, I would plan on better lighting underneath......I used battery-operated LEDS, and they weren’t enough.....

Peter

But you do get to do it again! Have a great time.

What a space! How nice to have an attic with some height. I have to walk around hunched over in mine as it's not even 6' at the ridge.

Hi Peter,  Your space is enviable, soon I will start a similar but much smaller project. Here is something to consider before you insulate, as I recently got a smaller space ready ready for a permanent layout.

I rough wired multiple locations for 2 circuit tracs, running 14-3 type nmb  (romex). I treated each Trac as a home run (single 14-3 cable between each Trac and J box)  I ran the Home Run to a hidden but accesible junction box that also had a 15Amp 14 Gauge 120VAC power circuit.  Using multiple and amiable Trac heads with LED spot and floods I will be able to do many different lighting scenes. The many different scenes can then be programed into Lutron Caseta switches with unlimited possibilities such as simulated dusk using your cell phone to control the out of sight Caseta switches.

I also installed  2each  4" flexible ducting from high points on the ceiling  to a Panasonic 300 cfm remote fan exhausting to the outside.

Before I retired I had installed a lot of like equipment for my customers.

Anyway good luck you appear to have the talent and the space, I wish I had the same.

kevin

@Fast Mail posted:

Hi Peter,  Your space is enviable, soon I will start a similar but much smaller project. Here is something to consider before you insulate, as I recently got a smaller space ready ready for a permanent layout.

I rough wired multiple locations for 2 circuit tracs, running 14-3 type nmb  (romex). I treated each Trac as a home run (single 14-3 cable between each Trac and J box)  I ran the Home Run to a hidden but accesible junction box that also had a 15Amp 14 Gauge 120VAC power circuit.  Using multiple and amiable Trac heads with LED spot and floods I will be able to do many different lighting scenes. The many different scenes can then be programed into Lutron Caseta switches with unlimited possibilities such as simulated dusk using your cell phone to control the out of sight Caseta switches.

I also installed  2each  4" flexible ducting from high points on the ceiling  to a Panasonic 300 cfm remote fan exhausting to the outside.

Before I retired I had installed a lot of like equipment for my customers.

Anyway good luck you appear to have the talent and the space, I wish I had the same.

kevin

Thank you....

Peter

Take down continues.....I am still mostly clearing out the attic and packing trains up.

I curtailed my weight training temporarily......I am doing plenty of lifting......

I'm averaging 18-22K steps (up and down the stairs) daily.....no need for my 3 mile walks right now!

Peter

Peter,

Congratulations on your retirement and your new train room! It should be a winner!

Anymore photos of your subway station before demolition?

Peter, hope you and your bride enjoy many wonderful days of retirement.

I too have my trainroom upstairs.  I think the most exercise I've gotten in years is in carrying things up and down, especially the lumber when building out the tables.

All the best!

More progress.....I am leaving the main layout level together to run trains. The upper level engine yard is coming down and the lower subway is disconnected. The attic continues to be emptied so that room construction can begin in February.

Peter

You need a bugler playing TAPS for this operation Peter.

Peter,

A wise move to keep part of the layout intact to run some trains. I hope to see your Boston & Albany 4-6-6T running soon on what's left of the old layout.

MELGAR

Don't know how this topic got missed by me? Must have been buried dang it. Looks great Peter. How is climate control in the attic? I know some homes in VA are, others aren't depending on a bunch of different things. Guessing if it wasn't, you'd get that fixed.

Peter, That is a good plan to keep the existing layout up for running trains until you get things going in the attic.  I also agree all that exercise up and down the stairs carrying boxes and then at the storage unit makes up for exercise elsewhere.  During the last 10 years I was working, I was in an office on the second floor.  In good weather I walked outside at lunchtime, but in the bad weather I walked up and down the stairs.  My legs were stronger during the winter and so was my breathing capacity.

It always comes apart quicker than it goes up...

Andy

Peter

I like your commitment to finishing your new layout

my layout will never be done by design  it’s fun to build,mostly

Consider under cabinet lighting for your under layout lighting needs

I used black and decker leds and am very happy with them

Are you finished with the plan?

Steven

@Putnam Division posted:

Take down continues.....I am still mostly clearing out the attic and packing trains up.

I curtailed my weight training temporarily......I am doing plenty of lifting......

I'm averaging 18-22K steps (up and down the stairs) daily.....no need for my 3 mile walks right now!

Peter

Tonight on Storage Wars...  Dave Hester hits it big when he find all of Peter's Trains packed away.

@MartyE posted:

Tonight on Storage Wars...  Dave Hester hits it big when he find all of Peter's Trains packed away.

LOL  😆

Congratulations Peter, I had a big laugh when the "stuff" belonging to the children was mentioned and you were putting it in its own storage unit.  How many of us still have tubs of things belonging to our children?  Anyone need baseball cards?

HI Peter, first a huge congratulations to you on your retirement.

Your new layout space offers a world of opportunities. I look forward to your planning and progress.

I had a layout in the attic space a long time ago in a galaxy far far away - during the build I don't think my legs could have gotten any stronger from all that climbing up and down with material.

I wish you all the best in this new chapter,

Paul

Coming along! Except for bookcases which I'll need help moving, the attic is cleared out (compare to earlier pics) and ready for a "sometime in February" construction start up.....

I will start working on the plan again, but I'm not going to commit myself to a final plan until I see what the room looks like.

Packing has been fun.....I came across a ton of things I had forgotten about that "came aboard for the ride", some of them from long ago.....

415 Diesel Fueling Station.....in pretty decent shape for something about 65 years old.....

A collection of buttons from previous Yorks......

One of these was mine as a kid and I acquired one with a collection I purchased....forgot all about them.....

.....I don't think I'll use this stuff.....it actually solidified.....

It's amazing what one accumulates over a lifetime in the hobby!

Peter

Nice solid grease haha

@Putnam Division posted:

Coming along! Except for bookcases which I'll need help moving, the attic is cleared out (compare to earlier pics) and ready for a "sometime in February" construction start up.....

I will start working on the plan again, but I'm not going to commit myself to a final plan until I see what the room looks like.

Packing has been fun.....I came across a ton of things I had forgotten about that "came aboard for the ride", some of them from long ago.....

It's amazing what one accumulates over a lifetime in the hobby!

Peter

Enviable space, Peter.

Peter,

What are you planning to do to the space before you start building the layout? I imagine  (actually, I know) it can get VERY hot in Virginia in the summer...

Chris

LVHR

Peter, it is a great space!!  I hope you have some young guys to haul lumber up two flights of stairs, or put a pulley outside a window.  

@lehighline posted:

Peter,

What are you planning to do to the space before you start building the layout? I imagine  (actually, I know) it can get VERY hot in Virginia in the summer...

Chris

LVHR

It's going to be done right.....HVAC unit is the major single expense.....

Peter

@Mark Boyce posted:

Peter, it is a great space!!  I hope you have some young guys to haul lumber up two flights of stairs, or put a pulley outside a window.  

Through the dormer windows by truck crane.....

Peter

@Putnam Division posted:

Through the dormer windows by truck crane.....

Peter

Excellent, Peter!  I knew you had it all figured out, I just didn't know the answer!

Haha that's a slick way to get it done!!

Looks like you have a lot of natural light to take advantage for your space.  Are you going to have wall space for train display shelves or do you like to keep them in boxes?  Might want to leave some space for a mini-fridge and a half bath-once it’s finished it might be hard to pry you out!  

Peter,

May I presume you have a contractor lined up to make the space hospital, layout and visitor friendly?

@lehighline posted:

Peter,

May I presume you have a contractor lined up to make the space hospital, layout and visitor friendly?

Yes......the house is 21 years old and we are nearing the end of a 3 year upgrade/refresh....when the house was built, the subfloor and kneewall were put in with the intent to finish. It was wired at the start.

Peter

Oops! I meant to type "hospitable"!

Chris

LVHR

Peter, Your attic looks huge, but I'm curious as what the vertical wooden structure (pole, shaft) is in the center. Will it hinder what otherwise appears to be a obstruction free area?

Steve

@Rescued Trains posted:

Peter, Your attic looks huge, but I'm curious as what the vertical wooden structure (pole, shaft) is in the center. Will it hinder what otherwise appears to be a obstruction free area?

Steve

Not an issue......the entire room is 30x30.....that post is about 10 ft out from the side which will be walled off for an approximately  10x30 area for storage and the HVAC unit. It leaves me an area a little larger than 20x30.

Peter

@NeophyteMRR posted:

Looks like you have a lot of natural light to take advantage for your space.  Are you going to have wall space for train display shelves or do you like to keep them in boxes?  Might want to leave some space for a mini-fridge and a half bath-once it’s finished it might be hard to pry you out!  

I'm planning on floor to ceiling shelving on 2 walls. It's no fun for me taking trains in and out of boxes.....when that happens, I find I change things out less frequently.....

Peter

@Putnam Division, please edit the title. or I'm losing my mind understanding the date references.

Moving right along Peter. I envy  that space for sure. One comment of what will be more I'm sure. Have you thought about sound proofing for the bench work? Besides tabletop, I would recommend something under the table legs as well. Vibration isolators will go a long way. Since you are on top of your living space the clickety clack may get to be an issue later on.

Bob

@Pingman posted:

@Putnam Division, please edit the title. or I'm losing my mind understanding the date references.

.....ooops!

Fixed...... and, thanks.....

Peter

@RSJB18 posted:

Moving right along Peter. I envy  that space for sure. One comment of what will be more I'm sure. Have you thought about sound proofing for the bench work? Besides tabletop, I would recommend something under the table legs as well. Vibration isolators will go a long way. Since you are on top of your living space the clickety clack may get to be an issue later on.

Bob

Great idea!

Thank you!

Peter

Great project.  Enjoy your retirement

I’m loving all of this. Good luck and the very best of wishes with this cool evolution project. Have fun! Thank you for sharing and best, W

Peter,

Looks like a great new spot for your trains!

Attic is still empty.......the contractor has been here and has sketched plans for the wall and HVAC equipment.

Materials are ordered.....next thing I hope to report is a video of a truck crane taking materials through a dormer window.

Have a great and safe weekend, folks.......hope to have something better to report, soon....

Peter

This is so cool!  An open space waiting to hold your dreams!

George

Do I see an expansion area across the hallway?

Congratulations Peter, this is a great area for a new train layout, with all the folks on the OGR Forum, any help you need is a click away. It’s going to be fun watching your progress on this fun adventure. Happy Railroading

@NJCJOE posted:

Do I see an expansion area across the hallway?

Not really.....that’s a cedar closet.....and not part of “the deal” .

Peter

Peter,

looking like this is going to be a great space peter.  Looking forward to seeing your progress!

rich

Finally, a little progress!

Now, we have to get it from here.....

....to here......

.....that comes tomorrow when the truck crane arrives!

Peter

Going to be a great room and layout! Looking forward to seeing the progress.

wow Peter, a lot of work for tomorrow! My wife would have me carry it up the stairs! LOL It is really going to be a wonderful train room!

That is a welcome sight, Peter!  

Will you be taking some photos of the lift??

Peter,  That's a really nice space.  Great idea w the HVAC.  Looking fwd to seeing the lift pics.  How's your wiring / power availability to the room. I'm assuming they'll be pulling in new wire for the hvac unit; if you don't have enough existing power available for the layout, you may want to have them pull in some train room dedicated additional power.  In our train room i ran 2 separate 12-2 circuits to power only the wall plugs and put each feed on a 20a heavy duty wall switch, so that when we leave the room we flip the switches and kill all power to the room / layout. A safety thing for young kids and old guys who forget stuff.     

Baby steps Peter! Trains will be running by Christmas.

@Putnam Division posted:

Finally, a little progress!

Now, we have to get it from here.....

....to here......

.....that comes tomorrow when the truck crane arrives!

Peter

Just chuck the 2x4s up to the window...What could go wrong?  LOL!

@BillYo414 posted:

Will you be taking some photos of the lift??

I stayed home today to take pictures and video......the truck with the drywall was supposed to be here at 1PM and it broke down  ......now it's planned for 7:30 AM Wednesday......I hope they're not late.....I have to head to the Chesterfield County Fairgrounds at 11AM to be one of the afternoon vaccinators.

@TomSuperO posted:

Peter,  That's a really nice space.  Great idea w the HVAC.  Looking fwd to seeing the lift pics.  How's your wiring / power availability to the room. I'm assuming they'll be pulling in new wire for the hvac unit; if you don't have enough existing power available for the layout, you may want to have them pull in some train room dedicated additional power.  In our train room i ran 2 separate 12-2 circuits to power only the wall plugs and put each feed on a 20a heavy duty wall switch, so that when we leave the room we flip the switches and kill all power to the room / layout. A safety thing for young kids and old guys who forget stuff.     

This has been part of a house renovation/refresh that started in early 2019. We're getting to the end. When we did the pantry and laundry rooms, we extended the wiring from the basement. We are lucky that when the house was built, they put in 400 amp service.

Once the framing is done, I'm meeting with the electrician to plan wall outlets and at least 2 floor outlets.

Peter

Nice. Sounds like you'll have plenty of feed and outlets.  Wow, tomorrow must be shot day. Me too tomorrow afternoon.   

Late to the thread. Congrats on both your retirement and new train room.  I live in the RVA area and noticed we finally have a good stretch of weather to get the material delivered.

I’ve been fighting the weather and the contractor on getting my deck rebuilt.  Contracted in August, but material delays pushed me back to bad time of year for weather.

Well......the truck crane was supposed to be here at 0730........it didn’t show......at 11 AM, I left to go to a Vaccine Clinic where I gave 67 shots......

Unfortunately, the truck came while I was gone and there isn’t a video. However, progress has been made!

This is exciting!

Peter

Peter, those 67 vaccines are far more important than watching a crane lift.  The material looks great in your attic!

Glad to hear about those 67 vaccines! Glad to see the progress too!

That's a lot of lumber. That should be a magnificent train room!

Too bad you're not closer Peter, I still can't schedule my vaccine, our county is running months behind everyone it seems!  I'll be getting my vaccine when most places are vaccinating high school kids!

Peter, Thank you for your service.

Steve

Peter, looks like you have everything needed to get started on a great train room layout! Thank you for taking the time to do the vaccines!

Progress!
The room is divided into a 10x30 storeroom and an irregular 20x30 train room.

An overview of the train room.....

Room for bookcases between the dormers......

Another view of the stairwell enters the room to the right.....

The storeroom......

The room from the other end......

I’m getting very excited......

Peter

Peter,

I have the popcorn popping! I can hear the announcer saying "We're getting ready to rumble".

Dave

Looking good Peter! You have a crew moving right along . Next thing you know you will be running trains! But then again you have to carry them up all those stairs!

Peter, wow... this layout area is awesome! I will be following this thread to see your progress.

Alex