Solvent to Remove Oil from Painted Tender

Hexane is used in the refining of soy beans and is DEADLY poison and quite explosive. I sold industrial equipment and had 2 bean plants in my territory and was duly warned about it. SO be careful.

Dick

I would try Goo Gone first. At least it is definitely safe. Then if that didn't work I would try something else that is safe. Perhaps Castrol Super Clean but I think the Goo Gone will work. After using the Goo Gone wash with warm water and soap. 

Try some cold cream, it won't hurt the paint. I use it to clean rail cars. might take some work on the oil if it has penetrated the paint.

Ed Kelly posted:

Hexane which is a hydrocarbon might work but is not available at my local hardware store.

Alcohols will not work very well at removing oils.   Hexane will work and probably might leave the paint alone...maybe....kind of iffy...test carefully.  Depends a lot on the type of paint and then that weathering paint as well.  If you were nearby I'd get you some - got gallons at work.  Used to use it by the gallon all the time.  Terribly flammable but that's the extent of any worries I ever had with it - doesn't make my top 100 hazardous otherwise.

Mineral spirits chemically is not all that far removed from hexanes; another maybe on the paint, but it will remove oil.

Does anyone know of a solvent that would remove the oil without destroying the paint?  The oil must be removed so the weathering paint will hold. 

 

Unfortunately my favorite degreaser / oil removing solvent, methylene chloride, will almost certainly remove the paint

Have you tried a detergent? You want to disperse the oil, not dissolve it or the paint. Try some mild dish soap and a little water. If that fails, do a test on a hidden area with some 409 on  a Q-tip.

Dawn dishwashing detergent works great for removing oil and grease.  Be careful with Castrol Super Clean, that's what I use to strip paint.

In the olden days, benzene would have done it.  Now the best solution might be to add oil to make the entire finish uniform.  Try mineral spirits and detergent first.  Time might also help.

This is exactly what this product is designed for. Used in the automotive industry for well over 60 years. Will not harm paint or plastic. Wipe on, wipe off.

Pete

I would be careful with DAWN detergent on old Lionel paint. I had it mark a box cr I was cleaning. Left a white splotch on the area.

WD40 is an effective AND safe degreaser. I've used it sparingly on some rolling stock that had grease smudges and it worked great. Spray a little on a piece of paper towel and rub the surface lightly. Make sure you "buff" the excess off afterwards.

Check the mfg website for product details or ask them directly.

I had a painted postwar Lionel tender that had smoke fluid (mineral oil) leaked all over it. I used talcum powder, sprinkled on the oil, to absorb most of it. Then a gentle washing with a mild dishwashing soap. I used whatever we had in the house at the time.
Sometimes I use Murphy's Oil Soap.

I think the talcum powder is a good idea. It will act as a poultice to dry up the oil. I tried Murphy's Oil Soap on my Lionel Standard gauge refrigerator car and it softened the  paint.  I would be very careful with any modern product with the Lionel paint. If the oil has soaked in to the paint you probably won't get it out.

Mineral spirits is likely to leave an oily film. Try Ronsonol or Zippo cigarette lighter fluid (which is pretty much just naphtha, if you can find it in a small container at a local paint or hardware store). It's used as an industrial cleaning fluid and degreaser, and I have used it for years for cleaning my model's, and haven't had any problem. However, always test first in a hidden spot before you douse the whole model! Before overcoating with anything new, wash with mild, warm soapy water.

Bill in Ftt

I have lighter fluid and will try some on an older Lionel that has been difficult to get clean.

Why do you need a solvent to remove oil? Is a degreaser really a solvent? I may learn something here.

Goo Gone is a cleaner. It removes glue and adhesive very well. It is citrus based I believe. It can leave a film, but you should be able to wipe the film off or wash it off. Just make sure to dry the tender really well if you wash it and make sure the water doesn't get into crevices. A hair dryer works well for this. Also, I use dish soap, but just a drop or two, and I bought the clear kind not the blue or other colored ones.

bob2 posted:

In the olden days, benzene would have done it.

Benzene would likely take the paint off and I doubt that many can get hold of any anyway being a defined carcinogen.  Real mineral spirits won't leave a film; comprised of relatively low MW aliphatics; WD-40 is designed to leave a film as a water dispersal agent.  A detergent might work as long as it's not a caustic one.

Good luck.

I'm no chemist but I see no reason to try and remove solvent residue with solvent. And that includes "solvent lite" like goo gone.

I would have first tried a degreasing detergent like Simple Green or formula 409 or the Walmart concentrated versions of them of whose name I can't recall now. 

And i'd first try it underneath where it's not visible to see what the affect/effect is.

Rule292 posted:

.....try it underneath where it's not visible to see what the affect/effect is.

 

 

Good advice no matter what you use or try - test it 1st as noted above!

BTW, I am a chemist,

I would have first tried a degreasing detergent like Simple Green or formula 409 or the Walmart concentrated versions of them of whose name I can't recall now. 

Simple Green will remove some lithography, and sometimes it will remove paint. Guess how I know!
I have not used formula 409 in a long time. As I recall, it was too aggressive for Lionel trains. I don't know whether the finishes used in the world of 2- rail are more durable.

I always thought Ed Kelly was a 2-railer.  At least I don't think he said the part was Lionel.  I have heard that Lionel folks spray WD-40 on their models.  Gives them a shine.

You generally want to start with the least aggressive cleaner and gradually move on to more aggressive ones. I would start with dish washing liquid.

If it is oil based paint and you spilled oil on it, I am not too sure you could remove it without ruining the paint. the oil is, probably, soaked in to the paint. What I would try would be nice, even heat  from a hair dryer and try to  evaporate as much of the oil as possible. These commercial products aren't going to work.

Some of you are pretty hard to convince.  There is a specific tool to do this and everyone is offering home remedies. Suppose the OP had a nail and wanted to get in into some wood. First person said I use a frying pan, the next guy says I use a baseball bat. No, no need for a bat, just go out into the woods and get a stick. Stick? You need a rock, and on and on...........

Pete

leave the oil and use powders to weather then seal. Will work fine.

Norton posted:

Some of you are pretty hard to convince.  There is a specific tool to do this and everyone is offering home remedies.

 

Not really.  After 40 years of using solvents of a longer list than I take here to list, I'm pretty sure I might actually know about their uses.

BTW, Dupont 3919S is

Hydrotreated heavy naphtha (petroleum) 48 - 59%

1,2,4-trimethyl benzene 1%  boiling point over 300F

Cumene (isopropylbenzene) 0.2%  boiling point over 300F

Ethylbenzene 0.2%  boiling point over 276F

Any concentration shown as a range is to protect confidentiality or is due to batch variation.

Non-regulated ingredients 40 - 50% 

OSHA Hazardous: Yes

and those high boiling small percentage benzene derivatives are going to leave a film.

You want to use something that's going to go away......within your lifetime.

mwb posted:

Norton posted:

Some of you are pretty hard to convince.  There is a specific tool to do this and everyone is offering home remedies.

 

Not really.  After 40 years of using solvents of a longer list than I take here to list, I'm pretty sure I might actually know about their uses.

 

I know your background. I guess my question is why you are suggesting something else? This product has been in use since most here got their first train set. Its made to remove oil and wax from paint. Even if all the components don't go away they will mix with the paint and not interfere with its application.

PS Thanks for the analysis. It will save me from having to do it myself.

Pete

I always thought Ed Kelly was a 2-railer.  At least I don't think he said the part was Lionel.

Are you making some sort of point?
If so, what is it?

Norton posted:

PS Thanks for the analysis. It will save me from having to do it myself.

Pete

He's giving you the text of the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheets) which is available online for everything classified as a hazardous material.    But he's of a chemist  background so he knows his aromatic hydrocarbons. 

I'd still try common household cleaners (diluted if need be) via a q-tip and see what happens.

Hi All,

Yes, I am a 2 railer and this is a Sunset tender.  I checked out DuPont prep-sol 3919S and I don't need a gallon.  It does have the heavy hydrocarbons in it and I have to wonder if it will leave a residue that will take a long while to evaporate.  I will try liquid dish detergent next and rinse thoroughly. 

Thanks,

 Ed

Ed, with Prop Sol, you wipe it on then wipe it off. If you leave it to evaporate on its own the grease, oil and wax remains. After wiping down you can paint in couple of minutes. I understand its pricey today but a gallon lasts me over ten years even using it for other items like cleaning automotive and motorcycle parts. If you ever watched one of the many auto resto shows on Velocity like Chip Foose's Overhaulin' and the like you will see someone prepping a car with this stuff. If it left a residue no painter would ever use it.

I am not trying to sell anyone on this product, just doing my Joe Friday imitation, "just the facts".

Pete

Too bad you are not in Southern California.  A buddy brought me a quart of oil and grease remover similar to the DuPont stuff from Arizona.  You might beg an ounce of the stuff from an auto body shop - in theory they use it before the top coat.  My use is before masking tape for aircraft fabric repair.  Tape will not stick to oil, grease, or Pledge.

On the Lionel comment - sorry, did not mean to offend anyone.  Lionel finishes on steam are (or at least used to be) different.  A couple of posters were discussing how to remove smoke fluid.  I think Sunset is a baked- on enamel, and the body shop grease remover ought to do just fine.  If you get oil on a flat finish, it is a lot harder to remove.

I think the paint was rejuvenated by the oil,its pretty much the same base. If you spray the whole car it should even out. Then clean with a 50/50 solution of dawn dish det and water. Rinse thoroughly It should at least be even and oil free.

You might try wrapping it in Kleenex or paper towel and see how much might just be absorbed off the surface by the paper.