TIU software update

G;

You can avoid switching to ver. 10 in at least 2 ways.

1. turn off auto update or set it so you decide what to do when MS notifies you of an update.

2. use a PC that MS judges to be not capable of Win 10 upgrade.

I currently have at least 1 desktop (HP slimline) that MS just recently said was not a candidate for the Win 10 upgrade! It runs Win 7 Pro and I also found info on the web about why it is not a candidate and what to do to make it acceptable as a Win 10 candidate.

I'm currently evaluating whether to make it acceptable or ignore Win 10 on that particular machine.

I think your wise to ignore Win 10 if it might interfere with your income production!

Ray

Ray,

I also use a program called GWX Control Panel. It allows you to disable the windows 10 update notification in the lower right corner, remove the update file s for windows 10, and disable automatic updates from installing windows 10. You can turn these features on later with it also.

h1000

Ray,

I don't know if it would or not -- just wondering.

I can assure that "if you plugged in the USB cable to your TIU BEFORE downloading the dealer loader" it would not make even the slightest bit of dfifferene, except that, depending upon the flavor of Windows and the manufacturer of the PC, Windows might well have loaded the driver software, if it had not already had it available on George's PC.

Are you still of the opinion that I had to download the drivers because I didn't keep my PC up to date with the latest software updates from the Microsoft Update Service?

I think that would apply in any number of cases, as evidenced by other's responses to this thread.

I will add that a good part of the problem is that the implementation of Windows is inconsistent, and perhaps even a bit chaotic, across different manufacturer's of PCs. Further, the constantly changing, and I don't mean evolving, nature of Windows "look and feel" further adds to the confusion.

As an aside, calling Windows a "standard" is a bit of a contradiction, since implementation of Windows varies so much from PC to PC, and version to version.

Thanks Barry -- I agree with your remarks.

H1000 posted:

Ray,

I also use a program called GWX Control Panel. It allows you to disable the windows 10 update notification in the lower right corner, remove the update file s for windows 10, and disable automatic updates from installing windows 10. You can turn these features on later with it also.

h1000

H1000;

Thanks for the info -- good to know in case I decide to go with that approach!

GGG posted:

I can't answer your question.  I know on my XP I did have to down load the extra file for Rev L.  For my current program I did not, but it is an all in one and only has USB ports, and lots of them.  So maybe that type of soft ware was installed by OEM since serial port not on this.

I also know my computer works with the USB to serial adapter cable which I needed to upgrade non Rev L TIUs.

I have been a little leery switching to Window's 10 because I can't afford any glitches at this point in the train repair season.  G

George: Oh boy, yes, I too am very leery of all those "free upgrade" popups I would like to block on my Win7 machine!!

RayL posted:

...

...

The only part I would question is the contention, by some, that the drivers were acquired via Microsoft Update service as would happen when you make an explicit request for a driver update OR through the normal scheduled Update process that we can configure within Windows.

I have tried the explicit request through a right mouse click on the device icon in Device Manager many times and it always failed to find the drivers on the Microsoft Update server.

...

Hi RayL,

I did a test with a Win7 laptop that I am not using since 2011.

As you will see in the screenshots attached, It appears that Windows has installed the missing driver, directly from Microsoft.

As per my first post, for some reasons, it is only after a reboot that the "magic" did occur.

The screenshots are showing the sequence:

1. Windows Version

2. Connect TIU Rev.L to PC via USB

3. Use Windows Troubleshoot

4. Windows Detecting Problems

5. Windows confirms driver missing

6. Windows is looking for driver

7. Windows did not find a driver... well for now

8. I Did not give up...  Simply did a reboot... and Restarted exactly the same process with Troubleshoot... et Voila !

Note: It took a really long time for Windows to complete the driver search/install.  I have just let it go and never interrupted the process.

To be sure that it was really fully operational after the driver installation, I did a new DCS5.0 update on the TIU.  All good.

Conclusion:  hum... not sure what to conclude :-)  But it did worked for me with 3 different PCs,  with 3 different Windows versions, and without looking for any driver anywhere else than at Microsoft.

Daniel

 

Daniel, Is your computer running a 32 or 64 bit version of windows? H1000

H1000 posted:

Daniel, Is your computer running a 32 or 64 bit version of windows? H1000

32 bit

 

Daniel Auger posted:

H1000 posted:

Daniel, Is your computer running a 32 or 64 bit version of windows? H1000

32 bit

 

Sorry, I should have also asked Home or Pro.

H1000

H1000 posted:

Daniel Auger posted:

H1000 posted:

Daniel, Is your computer running a 32 or 64 bit version of windows? H1000

32 bit

 

Sorry, I should have also asked Home or Pro.

H1000

See attached picture.

Daniel

cnwdon:  Those popups can be eliminated.  I did it right after W10 came out.  Google the issue and you'll see how.  I'd say how to do it but I forgot how

Purely FWIW here, and I can't say about my drivers needed for my MTH items, not sure where they came from, but I don't recall installing them in Win 7? I can say that Windows Update has listed updates for some of my video cards over the years. I can't recall all the exact devices as it's been a while.

I can also say that I am currently using the built in Intel CPU (i5 & i7 cpus) graphics on two PCs and I get notifications from Windows Update for new drivers for these. They are in the 'Optional' update category below the 'Important' ones, but they still come from Windows Update and Intel is 3rd party. I have not yet tried communicating with my Rev L TIU from Win 10.

rtr12 posted:

Purely FWIW here, and I can't say about my drivers needed for my MTH items, not sure where they came from, but I don't recall installing them in Win 7? I can say that Windows Update has listed updates for some of my video cards over the years. I can't recall all the exact devices as it's been a while.

I can also say that I am currently using the built in Intel CPU (i5 & i7 cpus) graphics on two PCs and I get notifications from Windows Update for new drivers for these. They are in the 'Optional' update category below the 'Important' ones, but they still come from Windows Update and Intel is 3rd party. I have not yet tried communicating with my Rev L TIU from Win 10.

rtr12;

I haven't been online lately -- been doing some system upgrades and testing.

A few hours ago, I verified the Rev. L TIU drivers are downloaded from the MS update servers when using MS Windows 10.

I also verified it works for Win XP Pro ver. 2002 SP3 32 bit and Win 7 Pro SP1 64 bit.

I'm in the process of verifying it works for Win 8 or 8.1 and I'm still trying to understand why it fails for Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

I sure would like for someone "out there" to perform a test for me on their PC if it is

Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

The test would consist of first uninstalling the ftdibus.sys and ftser2k.sys drivers by using the uninstall feature within the device manager and be sure to check the box that says to delete the drivers.

The next step is to plug in the TIU into the USB port on the PC and see if the drivers get loaded!

If I can't find a volunteer, I setup a machine for that purpose and report what happens.

I'm wondering if it might be the case that this problem only occurs with the particular version of Windows I mentioned above (Win7 HP SP1 64 bit).

I also sent an email to the FTDI chip manufacturer's US office (to the support folks) asking if they have heard of anything like this. They have an Application Note (AN_119) on their website dealing with the issue of their drivers in Windows 7, but after reading the note, I wasn't able to see anything that helped me.

More to follow ...

Ray

Daniel Auger posted:

RayL posted:

...

...

The only part I would question is the contention, by some, that the drivers were acquired via Microsoft Update service as would happen when you make an explicit request for a driver update OR through the normal scheduled Update process that we can configure within Windows.

I have tried the explicit request through a right mouse click on the device icon in Device Manager many times and it always failed to find the drivers on the Microsoft Update server.

...

Hi RayL,

I did a test with a Win7 laptop that I am not using since 2011.

As you will see in the screenshots attached, It appears that Windows has installed the missing driver, directly from Microsoft.

As per my first post, for some reasons, it is only after a reboot that the "magic" did occur.

The screenshots are showing the sequence:

1. Windows Version

2. Connect TIU Rev.L to PC via USB

3. Use Windows Troubleshoot

4. Windows Detecting Problems

5. Windows confirms driver missing

6. Windows is looking for driver

7. Windows did not find a driver... well for now

8. I Did not give up...  Simply did a reboot... and Restarted exactly the same process with Troubleshoot... et Voila !

Note: It took a really long time for Windows to complete the driver search/install.  I have just let it go and never interrupted the process.

To be sure that it was really fully operational after the driver installation, I did a new DCS5.0 update on the TIU.  All good.

Conclusion:  hum... not sure what to conclude :-)  But it did worked for me with 3 different PCs,  with 3 different Windows versions, and without looking for any driver anywhere else than at Microsoft.

Daniel

 

Daniel;

You're a true Renaissance man! That was a heroic effort!

I see you're using Enterprise Win 7 -- that's a new wrinkle!

Did you or do you have a machine with Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit to try the experiment?

My conclusion is the same as yours -- hmmm...

I'll update this thread with my results -- probably tomorrow.

Ray

RayL posted:

 

...

Did you or do you have a machine with Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit to try the experiment?

...

Hi RayL,

No, I don`t.

Daniel

Daniel;

OK, I'll setup one of my machines.

I'll let you know.

Ray

Here is and update I can offer with my testing. Up to now I have been testing Professional versions of 64 bit MS operating systems. My next primary focus is just Windows 7  Service Pack 1, Home & Professional (Enterprise is nearly identical to Pro and figure the results should be the same) and  I have both the Retail and OEM versions. 

I have found that the 32 bit versions of Professional (OEM only) did not have the driver installed and needed to be downloaded from MS update. I did not have to reboot the VM to install the driver but it did take longer to install (locate and download time I assume).

I then recalled a problem I had with my wife's laptop (HP ProBook - Win 7 Pro 32 bit) a few years ago. I had a tough time installing a basic MP3 player that I had no problems with on my Dell laptop and had to install those drivers manually.  I plugged my TIU into that HP laptop and sure enough no driver found plus a new problem.  Her HP couldn't locate a driver online either.  Did some more investigation into that machine and determined that Automatic Updates were turned on and the computer was up to date.  There is however a a setting that allows windows update to search automatically for hardware drivers when windows is unable to locate one already on the computer. This was set to "Never install driver software from Windows Update"

You can find this setting by right clicking "COMPUTER" and selecting "Properties" and clicking on "Advance system settings".   Goto the "Hardware" tab and click on "Device Installation Settings"

I was able to download the driver without issue when I changed the setting to "Install driver software from Windows Update if it is not found on my computer." I went a bit further to find out how windows was configured this way and reloaded my wife's laptop from the factory image (on a different hard drive of course!).  Sure enough, this was set from the factory by HP, not Microsoft.  The retail & oem installations on my VMWARE system were not set this way from the original installation.  I did check my work computer (HP ProDesk G400) and it was set to ask me to search windows update for the drivers when new devices are plugged in, so HP didn't change this setting on all of their computers (why? I don't know).

I believe that Micro$oft had every intention to make this driver available, by either including it on the original installation or via Microsoft Update.  However, it is beyond their control (and MTH) to know how the OEM's will modify the installation of windows. I surely hope that nobody expected Microsoft or MTH to test every possible Brand, Make, Model and configuration of PC / laptop out since the release of the TIU ver. L. Obviously there was an issue created by a combination of the specific OS installed and how the OEM installed that OS on the computer at the factory. MTH did their part when the issue was brought to their attention and released the News Flash.

Any questions? Please ask!
Too much computer stuff for me today, I want some run time with my trains!!

H1000;

Another Renaissance man! A very elegant and thorough analysis -- I agree with your last paragraph beginning with "I believe ...". You zeroed in on the real issue here -- what OEMs do is anybody's guess!

I notice the dialog boxes differ a little (within the same version such as 7) based on some combination of  bit size (32 vs. 64), edition (pro, home, enterprise, etc.) and builder (MS or an OEM).

I've included 2 views of the dialog boxes you mention (I checked them after reading your post) and what you see is the settings I've always had.

You can see they differ slightly from yours.

I wonder if your analysis will convince the skeptics who believe this issue was a result of my not keeping my system "up to date" via the Windows Update Service? (probably not!).

We can be thankful for the "H1000's" of the model railroad community and lets not forget VMWARE!

Thanks again for your valiant efforts.

Ray

Very interesting thread and technical issue. The personal sacrifice, time, thoroughness, professionalism, and textbook problem solving approach invested to resolve this issue for the benefit of the forum members is truly admirable.

Certainty pays to understand all the facts before drawing conclusions.

Certainty pays to understand all the facts before drawing conclusions.

A novel idea.  Would keep us from the fun of argument.

FWIW, I have an ASUS Win 7 Home 64-bit, and I had no issues finding the TIU with the USB connection, the driver was loaded automatically.

Good to know, John.

Did the machine come with Win 7 on it or did you upgrade from a previous version?

Apparently ASUS is one of those OEMs that include the drivers!

Just out of curiosity, what Service Pack is the ASUS?

Ray

Ray, the ASUS has the original Win7 Home Premium version that came with it, and it's updated to SP1 and any updates to whatever's current.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Ray, the ASUS has the original Win7 Home Premium version that came with it, and it's updated to SP1 and any updates to whatever's current.

John;

Thanks for the update. I guess it might be the case that ASUS provided the drivers when they built your copy of Win 7 Home Premium or they did something so your "Found New Hardware Wizard" was successful finding the drivers on Microsoft's site during the install drivers operation.

I can't understand why my copy from HP would not behave the same. It seems that my other HP machines do behave properly (although I haven't tried every one of them!). To be sure I should try my wife's HP laptop and her older desktop machine as well.

I have just one more entry to make, for now, to this mind-numbing tale:

I have an old Dell laptop that had Win XP Home Edition ver. 2002 NO SPs and it would recognize the new device when I plugged in the TIU, but it couldn't get the drivers but it wasn't the same reason my HP laptop failed.

The Dell had older software (e.g. IE6) and it couldn't be recognized by the Microsoft Update Service.

My intent was to upgrade it in a minimal way so it could be recognized by the Update Service, but I wound up upgrading it to Win XP Pro SP3 32 bit with IE8 and it performed properly.

I know there are those who have contributed to this thread who were successful with one of the "Home" editions of one of the Windows versions (like XP Home & Win 7 Home), but there are also those (me included) who were NOT successful with a "Home" edition.

It just drives me nuts not being able to arrive at a clear understanding of why!

However, I'm going to make one more effort with respect to Win 7 Home by re-installing from a MS retail CDROM that came with the machine. If that works or fails, I'll quit and consider the time spent as my education.

There is something more pressing on my mind and I wonder if you know anything about it.

I recently installed the Standard WiFi app on both my Galaxy S5 and my iPad and have been playing with it.

I'm thinking of writing my own version of the program to be run on an Intel based machine.

Do you think the technical info I would need for that project would be readily available or is it "secret"?

Ray

Ray,

It's secret!

To save you some work, you could just run software on your PC that creates an Android environment, then use the Android version.

As I described in this thread:

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/t...36#48171004100873436

Ed

ps.  That being said, I hope that someday MTH decides to share the secret codes so we computer types could write some software of our own.  I have been told it's because MTH doesn't want to support other programs. My response, "Why would they have to support it?" Lionel doesn't support programs written using their TMCC/Legacy command set... no harm-no foul!

Ed;

Thanks for the info and the link. I'm going to check it out.

I agree completely -- MTH doesn't have anything to lose by sharing the info and I suspect there is much to gain, if only to get the software types more interested in their DCS products.

Have you ever heard anything about the guy who captured the codes somehow and used them to control things?

I can't remember where I read about it but if I use Google, I can probably find it again.

Thanks again;

Ray

Ed;

I found the link about capturing the packets with the codes for the DCS Remote:

"I can't remember where I read about it but if I use Google, I can probably find it again."

http://www.silogic.com/trains/RTC_Running.html

I haven't yet read the article, but it looks promising.

Ray

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Ray, the ASUS has the original Win7 Home Premium version that came with it, and it's updated to SP1 and any updates to whatever's current.

Doing it on Windows 10 Pro (64 bit) was "fun".  It seems Microsoft hid the feature to 'eject' USB devices gracefully, so if you just pull them out, the drivers may not load the next time.  I have both the USB version of the TIU and the older one.  I needed to try multiple USB ports for the USB version TIU before the drivers loaded.  My machine gave me some trouble with the USB 3.0 port.  Then came the real fun, I tried to get my Belkin USB to Serial adapter to work.  Guess what; no drivers available!  Well, that wasn't exactly the case.  After 45 minutes of searching the web, I finally found a compatible set of drivers.  Belkin had updated the adapter to a new model, but added backward compatibility to the drivers for that model to my older model. 

I can't complain too much.  It eventually worked, and Windows 10 is super fast and stable compared to Vista and Windows 8.  Windows 7 was good, but Windows 10 has grown on me.

George

RayL posted:

Ed;

I found the link about capturing the packets with the codes for the DCS Remote:

"I can't remember where I read about it but if I use Google, I can probably find it again."

http://www.silogic.com/trains/RTC_Running.html

I haven't yet read the article, but it looks promising.

Ray

Ray,

This is some pretty cool stuff! I was taking a different approach by actually capturing the data packets that the MTH App was sending to the WIU over the wifi network. The information in this article pretty has beat me to it!

THanks!!

George S posted:

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Ray, the ASUS has the original Win7 Home Premium version that came with it, and it's updated to SP1 and any updates to whatever's current.

Doing it on Windows 10 Pro (64 bit) was "fun".  It seems Microsoft hid the feature to 'eject' USB devices gracefully, so if you just pull them out, the drivers may not load the next time.  I have both the USB version of the TIU and the older one.  I needed to try multiple USB ports for the USB version TIU before the drivers loaded.  My machine gave me some trouble with the USB 3.0 port.  Then came the real fun, I tried to get my Belkin USB to Serial adapter to work.  Guess what; no drivers available!  Well, that wasn't exactly the case.  After 45 minutes of searching the web, I finally found a compatible set of drivers.  Belkin had updated the adapter to a new model, but added backward compatibility to the drivers for that model to my older model. 

I can't complain too much.  It eventually worked, and Windows 10 is super fast and stable compared to Vista and Windows 8.  Windows 7 was good, but Windows 10 has grown on me.

George

George;

Thanks for recounting your experiences with respect to the USB ports.

I would not have expected so much "drama" with Win 10!

This is really great to hear from people about their experiences concerning the various Windows versions and how easy or difficult it was to make use of DCS products with the OS.

My experience with Win 10 was just to plug in the TIU and see that the drivers were found!

I haven't yet brought up Win 10 on any of my machines -- I was using a laptop of a friend.

Some time soon I have to get back to the rather mundane task of completing the construction of my new layout.

It's difficult, since it's not nearly as interesting as messing around with hardware and software!

Thanks again, George;

Ray

Well, I just found the widget to safely eject software.  It is in the tray and looks like the outline of a USB drive with a check mark on the lower right corner. This might have saved me some time.  

If anyone needs Belkin F5U409 drivers, you can get them here:

http://www.belkin.com/us/suppo...icle?articleNum=5201

It will load F5U109 drivers, but they are compatible.

George

RayL posted:

rtr12 posted:

Purely FWIW here, and I can't say about my drivers needed for my MTH items, not sure where they came from, but I don't recall installing them in Win 7? I can say that Windows Update has listed updates for some of my video cards over the years. I can't recall all the exact devices as it's been a while.

I can also say that I am currently using the built in Intel CPU (i5 & i7 cpus) graphics on two PCs and I get notifications from Windows Update for new drivers for these. They are in the 'Optional' update category below the 'Important' ones, but they still come from Windows Update and Intel is 3rd party. I have not yet tried communicating with my Rev L TIU from Win 10.

rtr12;

I haven't been online lately -- been doing some system upgrades and testing.

A few hours ago, I verified the Rev. L TIU drivers are downloaded from the MS update servers when using MS Windows 10.

I also verified it works for Win XP Pro ver. 2002 SP3 32 bit and Win 7 Pro SP1 64 bit.

I'm in the process of verifying it works for Win 8 or 8.1 and I'm still trying to understand why it fails for Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

I sure would like for someone "out there" to perform a test for me on their PC if it is

Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

The test would consist of first uninstalling the ftdibus.sys and ftser2k.sys drivers by using the uninstall feature within the device manager and be sure to check the box that says to delete the drivers.

The next step is to plug in the TIU into the USB port on the PC and see if the drivers get loaded!

If I can't find a volunteer, I setup a machine for that purpose and report what happens.

I'm wondering if it might be the case that this problem only occurs with the particular version of Windows I mentioned above (Win7 HP SP1 64 bit).

I also sent an email to the FTDI chip manufacturer's US office (to the support folks) asking if they have heard of anything like this. They have an Application Note (AN_119) on their website dealing with the issue of their drivers in Windows 7, but after reading the note, I wasn't able to see anything that helped me.

More to follow ...

Ray

The PC I use to update my MTH items is Win 7, Home Prem. 64bit, SP1 (the one I was talking about above). However, it is pretty old, has had Win 7 on it for a very long time and has had a LOT of things installed on it over the years. I got Win 7 fairly early on, when MS had the special 3 user versions for around $100 or something like that. That is why I said I didn't know where the drivers came from? This thing has been scheduled for a free Win 10 upgrade since right after 10 was released. For some reason it's still waiting? It spends most of it's time powered off, maybe that has something to do with it? 

RJR posted:

Certainty pays to understand all the facts before drawing conclusions.

A novel idea.  Would keep us from the fun of argument.

These days, facts never deter the fun of arguments. When some folks don't like the actual facts, they just make up their own.

Fortunately, things are a bit different around here and facts do still matter. Many good facts are shared here among us as well.

You don't have to wait your turn anymore.  You can download Windows 10 anytime by clicking the link below.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-u...qEWZUKggfDC78bq4Q)()

The process is explained here:

http://www.theverge.com/2015/8...ownload-how-to-guide

rtr12 posted:

RayL posted:

rtr12 posted:

Purely FWIW here, and I can't say about my drivers needed for my MTH items, not sure where they came from, but I don't recall installing them in Win 7? I can say that Windows Update has listed updates for some of my video cards over the years. I can't recall all the exact devices as it's been a while.

I can also say that I am currently using the built in Intel CPU (i5 & i7 cpus) graphics on two PCs and I get notifications from Windows Update for new drivers for these. They are in the 'Optional' update category below the 'Important' ones, but they still come from Windows Update and Intel is 3rd party. I have not yet tried communicating with my Rev L TIU from Win 10.

rtr12;

I haven't been online lately -- been doing some system upgrades and testing.

A few hours ago, I verified the Rev. L TIU drivers are downloaded from the MS update servers when using MS Windows 10.

I also verified it works for Win XP Pro ver. 2002 SP3 32 bit and Win 7 Pro SP1 64 bit.

I'm in the process of verifying it works for Win 8 or 8.1 and I'm still trying to understand why it fails for Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

I sure would like for someone "out there" to perform a test for me on their PC if it is

Win 7 Home Premium SP1 64 bit.

The test would consist of first uninstalling the ftdibus.sys and ftser2k.sys drivers by using the uninstall feature within the device manager and be sure to check the box that says to delete the drivers.

The next step is to plug in the TIU into the USB port on the PC and see if the drivers get loaded!

If I can't find a volunteer, I setup a machine for that purpose and report what happens.

I'm wondering if it might be the case that this problem only occurs with the particular version of Windows I mentioned above (Win7 HP SP1 64 bit).

I also sent an email to the FTDI chip manufacturer's US office (to the support folks) asking if they have heard of anything like this. They have an Application Note (AN_119) on their website dealing with the issue of their drivers in Windows 7, but after reading the note, I wasn't able to see anything that helped me.

More to follow ...

Ray

The PC I use to update my MTH items is Win 7, Home Prem. 64bit, SP1 (the one I was talking about above). However, it is pretty old, has had Win 7 on it for a very long time and has had a LOT of things installed on it over the years. I got Win 7 fairly early on, when MS had the special 3 user versions for around $100 or something like that. That is why I said I didn't know where the drivers came from? This thing has been scheduled for a free Win 10 upgrade since right after 10 was released. For some reason it's still waiting? It spends most of it's time powered off, maybe that has something to do with it? 

rtr12;

I wasn't ignoring your remarks about having already tried Win 7 HP SP1 32/64 bit with a Rev. L TIU when I posted the remark about "someone out there" trying with that OS.

What I was really hoping for was someone who had a MS retail copy of the OS and someone else with an OEM copy and both persons with the resources to do a complete install from scratch and then see if the drivers are found when inserting the TIU.

I have enough hardware to do it, but I'd have to go out and buy some software.

But, that's the advantage H1000 has over the rest of us -- he has VMWARE and can do all this with ease -- maybe he has and reported the same and I missed it?

I doubt if your "update" PC being powered off most of the time has anything to do with it's capability to recognize the TIU.

Have you tried uninstalling the drivers with the "delete drivers" box checked and then re-scanning via the device manager?

I was wondering what you thought about my experience with my HP laptop that has Win7 HP SP1 64 bit?

Do you have any idea why it would not be able to find the drivers when the TIU is inserted?

I'm wondering if some very obscure configuration setting somewhere in the bowels of the machine is preventing the proper behavior!

That is why I'm so focused on a clean, from scratch install, preferably with BOTH MS retail CD and one from an OEM. My OS has to be an OEM copy (HP) since I got it from a very large MS customer.

The only place I know to get a retail copy (and be sure it's retail) is through the retail chain, such as Staples and the like. Although the are plenty of retail copies of old MS software for sale on eBay (that's one of my major sources). The eBay approach is probably my only hope since old MS software usually isn't carried very long by the retail stores after something new comes out.

Ray

"Do you have any idea why it would not be able to find the drivers when the TIU is inserted?"

This could be anything.  My wife's laptop runs Windows 7 and will not recognize USB jump drives.  I found out it was because we loaded Samsung Kies to sync her smartphone.  Kies totally locks up the USB ports.  You need to disable it to get the ports to recognize anything else. Not saying this is your problem; just saying that third party software can cause these problems.

Does it try to find them and fail? I do know that the drivers need to be installed on the PC and the PC needs to be rebooted (because these are loaded at boot) BEFORE you plug the cable into the PC.  I found that out the hard way (by not reading the readme.txt file).  Then, I needed to reinstall the drivers and start over. 

George;

Yes -- it does try to find the driver and it does fail!

If the device FT232R does NOT exist AND the drivers are not on the PC, I SHOULD be able to just plug in the TIU and the system should install the device "FT232R" (which it DOES!) AND THEN, it's supposed to locate and install the drivers from the Windows Update Service (which it DOES NOT do on my laptop (Win 7 HP SP1 64bit) and DOES DO on my desktop (Win 7 Pro SP1 64bit))!!!

If I had to FIRST install the drivers and THEN plug in the TIU, that would kind of defeat the whole notion of plug-n-play (which is how it is supposed to work!).

Where did you get your drivers? I'd like to read the "readme.txt" file.

 

I didn't think I was being ignored, I was just trying to provide a little more info about my old Win 7 PC and also that Windows had previously updated 3rd party drivers for items that I've had over the years, however, my typing doesn't always say what I am really thinking.  So to clarify, my old PC works fine with the DCS loader and my TIU, but I don't remember ever installing any USB drivers on it? That does not mean I haven't though, I could have either forgotten or they could have been loaded by some other device, as that old PC has had a ton of stuff loaded on to it over the years.

The update problem the PC has with updates is with Windows 10. Through the little window at the bottom, MS just keeps telling me I will be notified when it is ready to update. The only thing worse than updating to Win 10 would be missing the free update period and having to pay for it. I can see why they are offering free upgrades, if upgrade is even the proper term here?

Not sure here, and I would have to go back and reread this thread, but I think H1000 may have already tried what you are wanting to try here using VMWARE? I don't have an extra copy of Win 7 either, all 3 of my licenses are currently in use so I don't have one to experiment with and I'm a little short of hardware as well.

Here is the install guide.  It does not say you need to reboot, but it does say to search locally for the drivers after you install them, not use the update service.  Also, check section 5.1, it could explain why it is not automatically found.

http://www.ftdichip.com/Suppor...ide_for_Windows7.pdf

BTW, if you don't like my suggestions and comments, please just ignore me.  Reading all those exclamation points directed at me hurts my head.

George