Yep. We use fiberglass batting.
Hot Water posted:Well,,,,,,that finally confirms just what the current manager has been saying privately since the winter of 2010/2011, i.e. "The 3985 will NEVER run again, so long as I'm in charge!".
I'm confident 3985 will run again, even with Ed in charge. If they publicly announced that they would retire the Challenger, they might generate more bad press than the Big Boy would generate good press. Also...
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TrainMan1225 posted:Hot Water posted:Well,,,,,,that finally confirms just what the current manager has been saying privately since the winter of 2010/2011, i.e. "The 3985 will NEVER run again, so long as I'm in charge!".
I'm confident 3985 will run again, even with Ed in charge. If they publicly announced that they would retire the Challenger, they might generate more bad press than the Big Boy would generate good press. Also...
And you think ANYONE at the UP actually cares what the railfans think??? Especially what with the current conditions of trying to institute Precision Scheduled Railroading and all the unbelievably sever weather happenings over the last month or two?
It has been a few days now, so I guess I can say something since my last post. Last week Colorado and Wyoming went through a 'bomb cyclone', lots of snow and howling winds. My friend Ted Schulte was coming home from the Cheyenne roundhouse southbound on I-25 when it hit. Between Cheyenne and Ft.Collins it is flat land with nothing to impede the weather. A car was stopped dead on the highway and with visibility at zero, hit the car, and was rear ended by cars hitting him from behind. He is severely injured and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance. He has fractured back, and wearing a brace. So him being ready for the trip seems pretty distant. And that is one less shop personal to work on 4014. Not sure of Ed's plan, to use his own crew, or get someone from another steam program to run/fire. And since they are running 844 out first, it takes a few days to prepare for the run, less time to ready 4014.
Best wishes to the Cheyenne crew.
Chuck Sartor posted:It has been a few days now, so I guess I can say something since my last post. Last week Colorado and Wyoming went through a 'bomb cyclone', lots of snow and howling winds. My friend Ted Schulte was coming home from the Cheyenne roundhouse southbound on I-25 when it hit. Between Cheyenne and Ft.Collins it is flat land with nothing to impede the weather. A car was stopped dead on the highway and with visibility at zero, hit the car, and was rear ended by cars hitting him from behind. He is severely injured and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance. He has fractured back, and wearing a brace. So him being ready for the trip seems pretty distant. And that is one less shop personal to work on 4014. Not sure of Ed's plan, to use his own crew, or get someone from another steam program to run/fire. And since they are running 844 out first, it takes a few days to prepare for the run, less time to ready 4014.
Best wishes to the Cheyenne crew.
I am just glad he is alive! What a horrific experience he must have went through. I have covered many, many miles running a SEMI up and down, over and across, 25-287-80. It is just by GODS grace on my part to have never been in a weather related crash. If you get a chance to talk to him please let him know that prayers have been sent for his speedy recovery.
Chuck Sartor posted:It has been a few days now, so I guess I can say something since my last post. Last week Colorado and Wyoming went through a 'bomb cyclone', lots of snow and howling winds. My friend Ted Schulte was coming home from the Cheyenne roundhouse southbound on I-25 when it hit. Between Cheyenne and Ft.Collins it is flat land with nothing to impede the weather. A car was stopped dead on the highway and with visibility at zero, hit the car, and was rear ended by cars hitting him from behind. He is severely injured and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance. He has fractured back, and wearing a brace. So him being ready for the trip seems pretty distant. And that is one less shop personal to work on 4014. Not sure of Ed's plan, to use his own crew, or get someone from another steam program to run/fire. And since they are running 844 out first, it takes a few days to prepare for the run, less time to ready 4014.
Best wishes to the Cheyenne crew.
WOW! That is really terrible, especially for Ted. I'm sure that Ted would have been the "second" Engineer on the Steam Crew, as he has been in the past. Obviously there is not another FRA/UP certified Engineer on the Steam Crew, so I wonder if Bill Stettler would be called on to assist (Bill is a Road Foreman of Engines for Amtrak out of Los Angeles, and an EXCELLENT steam Engineer).
Chuck Sartor posted:It has been a few days now, so I guess I can say something since my last post. Last week Colorado and Wyoming went through a 'bomb cyclone', lots of snow and howling winds. My friend Ted Schulte was coming home from the Cheyenne roundhouse southbound on I-25 when it hit. Between Cheyenne and Ft.Collins it is flat land with nothing to impede the weather. A car was stopped dead on the highway and with visibility at zero, hit the car, and was rear ended by cars hitting him from behind. He is severely injured and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance. He has fractured back, and wearing a brace. So him being ready for the trip seems pretty distant. And that is one less shop personal to work on 4014. Not sure of Ed's plan, to use his own crew, or get someone from another steam program to run/fire. And since they are running 844 out first, it takes a few days to prepare for the run, less time to ready 4014.
Best wishes to the Cheyenne crew.
Yikes! Good thing he lived, but he certainly won’t be able to run or fire a steam engine for a while yet. Prayers sent for a quick recovery.
Kelly Anderson posted:smd4 posted:I looked over this photo again:
The hardware appears placed directly against the blackhead, with no allowance whatsoever for the thickness of the lagging.
The big UP engines are set up with all of the backhead plumbing running under the jacket, with only the bonnets and handles showing, so the plumbing must be installed first. I would think that all of the "experts" who post here regularly would know that.
#3985, thanks Google.
Right. So that's why they installed all the cab flooring, on both sides, as well as the brake stand, prior to installing the insulation and jacketing? Sure Kelly, keep standing up for you know who.
Hot Water posted;Give me any younger, experienced, FRA "certified" Engineer, male or female, that REALLY knows & understands train handling and their assigned district, plus the rules, and within an hour he/she could be taught how to run 4014, or any other large steam locomotive.
I say put Rikki in the engineers seat.
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RickO posted:Hot Water posted;Give me any younger, experienced, FRA "certified" Engineer, male or female, that REALLY knows & understands train handling and their assigned district, plus the rules, and within an hour he/she could be taught how to run 4014, or any other large steam locomotive.
I say put Rikki in the engineers seat.
Darned good idea! I'd sure vote for that, but then I don't believe she is FRA certified for the UP.
Hot Water posted:Kelly Anderson posted:smd4 posted:I looked over this photo again:
The hardware appears placed directly against the blackhead, with no allowance whatsoever for the thickness of the lagging.
The big UP engines are set up with all of the backhead plumbing running under the jacket, with only the bonnets and handles showing, so the plumbing must be installed first. I would think that all of the "experts" who post here regularly would know that.
#3985, thanks Google.
Right. So that's why they installed all the cab flooring, on both sides, as well as the brake stand, prior to installing the insulation and jacketing? Sure Kelly, keep standing up for you know who.
Not trying to hijack the thread, but can we stop with personal attack’s please? Why can’t our community just be CIVIL people? Mods, has the time come to shut down this thread after multiple warnings? Anyway, please get back on topic.
NS6770Fan posted:Not trying to hijack the thread, but can we stop with personal attack’s please? Why can’t our community just be CIVIL people? Mods, has the time come to shut down this thread after multiple warnings? Anyway, please get back on topic.
OK, so, in your opinion, just what IS the "topic"?
4014 is in steam. Per vid posted to the UP Steam Club Facebook page.
eldodroptop posted:4014 is in steam. Per vid posted to the UP Steam Club Facebook page.
No way! Too bad I don’t have Facebook. I wish there was some other way to see the video.
Just 38 minutes ago the Union Pacific Railroad Steam Team. Under the leadership of Ed Dickens, has began the process of bringing the Big Boy back to life.
Source: Union Pacific Railroad • Cheyenne, Wyoming
Gary: Rail-fan
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Kelly Anderson posted:eldodroptop posted:4014 is in steam.
That's extremely cool, and that IS the "topic".
Cool! Is she fired-up or still on house-steam?
Hot Water posted:Kelly Anderson posted:eldodroptop posted:4014 is in steam.
That's extremely cool, and that IS the "topic".
Cool! Is she fired-up or still on house-steam?
The post above from UPRR says steam is being applied, so I assume that would be house steam?
Kelly Anderson posted:eldodroptop posted:4014 is in steam.
That's extremely cool, and that IS the "topic".
I thought steam was boiling hot....?
Had she/he/it actually passed the federal hydro yet. (OK, BIG BOY and SHE are not the same......)
Hydrostatic Test completed: Feb. 6, 2019
Source: Union Pacific Railroad • Cheyenne, Wyoming
Gary: Rail-fan
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riki posted:Hot water..i think I know bill. Does he have red hair .
No.
Kelly Anderson posted:Yes, I believe several pages back in this thread.
Except, the FRA people were not present for that preliminary hydro. So,,,,,,I suppose they still must do the OFFICIAL hydro again when the FRA people are present.
Chuck Sartor posted:It has been a few days now, so I guess I can say something since my last post. Last week Colorado and Wyoming went through a 'bomb cyclone', lots of snow and howling winds. My friend Ted Schulte was coming home from the Cheyenne roundhouse southbound on I-25 when it hit. Between Cheyenne and Ft.Collins it is flat land with nothing to impede the weather. A car was stopped dead on the highway and with visibility at zero, hit the car, and was rear ended by cars hitting him from behind. He is severely injured and had to be taken to the hospital by ambulance. He has fractured back, and wearing a brace. So him being ready for the trip seems pretty distant. And that is one less shop personal to work on 4014. Not sure of Ed's plan, to use his own crew, or get someone from another steam program to run/fire. And since they are running 844 out first, it takes a few days to prepare for the run, less time to ready 4014.
Best wishes to the Cheyenne crew.
Drove through there yesterday and the accident site is still visible. Sad to see. Best wishes for a speedy recovery!
Kelly Anderson posted:FRA being present is at their option. The operator must give them notice, but if they don't appear for whatever reason, it doesn't invalidate the hydro.
§230.16
(b) FRA notification. FRA Regional Administrators shall be provided written notice at least one month prior to an annual inspection and shall be afforded an opportunity to be present. If the Regional Administrator or their delegate indicates a desire to be present, the steam locomotive owner and/or operator will provide a scheduled date and location for the inspection. Once scheduled, the inspection must be performed at the time and place specified, unless the Regional Administrator and the steam locomotive owner and/or operator mutually agree to reschedule. If the Regional Administrator requests the inspection be performed on another date but the steam locomotive owner and/or operator and the Regional Administrator are unable to agree on a date for rescheduling, the inspection may be performed as scheduled.
All well and good but, do you REALLY believe that nobody from the FRA would even show up for the very first hydro test on 4014 in 60 some years? In years past, someone from the FRA has always been present for annual hydro tests on locomotives such as 844, 3985, 3751, 700, 261, and 4449. I would think that as important as this project has been, SOMEONE from FRA would have been there for its first hydro, especially after such an extensive rebuild/overhaul/restoration.
Kelly Anderson posted:Perhaps they were there, but neglected to report in to you... Disciplinary action may be warranted.
Red alert!!!!! LOL!
Just speaking for me, but I don't care who claims the glory, who drives the beast, it will just be nice to see it back on the rails, hopefully it works, it passes inspection, and it is able to be out there running again. I doubt I'll be able to see it in person anytime soon, but if I actually get to travel the country in the future, I'll certainly try to make sure I see it in person and maybe give it a pat on the nose
A photograph taken by a Union Pacific Steam Team Member, March 21, 2019 at about 4PM RMDT and posted to the Steam Shop Club Page about one hour later. They have been doing short video updates daily, set to run in a 45 second video loop.
Source: Union Pacific Railroad • Cheyenne, Wyoming
Gary: Rail-fan
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The thing I don't get is that a UP 4000 is being readied to run. How is it there's very little bandwidth devoted to what's going on with getting her into steam?
Feeding steam form the shop source a few days ago then zip - nothing. I would have thought that each time they open a valve, it'd blow up the internet!
p51 posted:The thing I don't get is that a UP 4000 is being readied to run. How is it there's very little bandwidth devoted to what's going on with getting her into steam?
Such a steam test on "house steam" is simply part of looking for leaks, etc..
Feeding steam form the shop source a few days ago then zip - nothing. I would have thought that each time they open a valve, it'd blow up the internet!
One must assume that the whole bunch are WAY TOO busy for such small event up-dates.
Hot Water posted:p51 posted:Feeding steam form the shop source a few days ago then zip - nothing. I would have thought that each time they open a valve, it'd blow up the internet!
One must assume that the whole bunch are WAY TOO busy for such small event up-dates.
I agree but I wasn't even thinking about the UP steam team, I was thinking of the foamers who always seem to just hear about stuff like this and then report on it.
p51 posted:Hot Water posted:p51 posted:Feeding steam form the shop source a few days ago then zip - nothing. I would have thought that each time they open a valve, it'd blow up the internet!
One must assume that the whole bunch are WAY TOO busy for such small event up-dates.
I agree but I wasn't even thinking about the UP steam team, I was thinking of the foamers who always seem to just hear about stuff like this and then report on it.
The UP Cheyenne Steam Shop is a pretty closed environment, i.e. there are no "foamers" inside to "report" anything. What is released is done through the UP Steam Club site, by someone on the UP steam crew.
I'm ore surprised that someone in UP PR isn't doing it. I suppose they just aren't aimed at the general public anymore but rather just the shippers.
palallin posted:I'm ore surprised that someone in UP PR isn't doing it.
As I posted, just above, someone inside the UP Steam Crew is doing it, since the few folks in the UP PR department generally have no clue about the technical aspects of 4014, nor do they have the time to converse and answer the dozens of questions on that Steam Club site.
I suppose they just aren't aimed at the general public anymore but rather just the shippers.
The PR Dept. handles the public, the news media, and rarely some shipper issues (the Marketing Dept. generally handles the shippers).
Long story, but most groups now have a Public Information Officer that presents the "official message" to the world.
Dominic Mazoch posted:Long story, but most groups now have a Public Information Officer that presents the "official message" to the world.
Concerning the 4014 on the UP, THAT is the current manager at Cheyenne.
At this rate, they're going to be cutting it ridiculously close to their deadline to get to augment for the anniversary. Many people who don't understand Steam at all have said online in the last year or so that they assumed that the very first run of 4014 would be the run to Ogden.
Naturally, I laughed at the very idea of that, but I do wonder if they're going to have too many options to be able to get any breakin runs before the anniversary at this rate?
Here's what I wonder about, these locomotives where never oil burners, right? Seems to me there could be problems with getting that large firebox ready to properly help the boiler make steam, could take a little bit of experimenting, maybe?
Ed
Ed Mullan posted:Here's what I wonder about, these locomotives where never oil burners, right?
Nope. The UP converted #4005 to oil burning, and after sorting out a number of initial problems, the 4005 was very successful as an oil burner. The down-fall was, the 4005 could not make it all the way from Cheyenne to Laramie without running out of oil fuel (bunker C), the UP Engineering Dept. was NOT about to spend huge amounts of money build a steam plant and associated oil fueling facility on Sherman Hill, just for 25 locomotives in one class (assuming the other 24 4000s were converted to oil burning).
Seems to me there could be problems with getting that large firebox ready to properly help the boiler make steam, could take a little bit of experimenting, maybe?
Maybe, if the current crew learned anything from the 3985, which was converted to oil burning in 1989/1990, it shouldn't be that big of a problem. Learning to fire 4014 as an oil burner may be a whole different issue, however.
Ed
To me, the 150th and the rebirth of 4014 are things to celebrate. SEPARATELY! I think the BB project could be more front and center to the public than the Golden Spike.
I think its very likely that if 4014 is there under steam it will likely see very little work. There will be 1 or 2 diesels in the consist supplying power. I don't care about that. If they get it there hot that's good enough.
jethat posted:I think its very likely that if 4014 is there under steam it will likely see very little work. There will be 1 or 2 diesels in the consist supplying power.
I've heard several people say the same thing for 4449, that its only hot enough to qualify as actually under steam and that the diesel helper really does all the real work.
Beats me if that is fair or not to say that, though. I'm a fan of Doyle and his crew and I've chased and ridden behind 4449 several times and it never seemed accurate to me.
