38402 Amtrak HHP poor performance

That's pretty surprising, that one has the Cruise Commander and RS5 boards, I'd think it would be a good runner.

Did you make sure that the motor screws are tight under the trucks?  Poor running in one direction could be loose motor screws, or the center rail roller screws.

gunrunnerjohn- Thanks for the reply.  Checked motor screws and center roller screws, all appear tight.  One other thing, sometimes when I first turn up the track voltage using a powermaster, the full sounds start up before I hit any buttons cab-2.  Doesn't always do this.  I've had a Legacy GP-30 once that had reception issues, and that one wouldn't run well in any direction but this is the first time I've seen this type of issue.

It's odd that it only happens in forward.  The sounds starting up in advance suggest that you may have an issue with the antenna, did you check that?

I would try reprogramming. If that don't help, then switch the R2LC with a know good one. If you still have problems you might need to change the motor driver.

Bill

Bill - Thanks for the reply. Tried reprogramming last night, did not help.  Maybe I'll take one last look with the shell off again.

Is this still under warranty?

It is a TMCC engine, so most likely not.

I had trouble with my HHP. It wasn't a Legacy but it died while running. I took it to Charlie and he sent it to Lionel. Believe it or not they didn't have parts for it even though it was two years old when it came out. So Charlie ripped the old motor out and put in one that only goes forward. It runs well but still.....still a Williams man.

Well, Lionel still sells TMCC stuff.  I checked, this was in the 2010 Catalog, so it's probably out of warranty.

yardlet6, even though Lionel doesn't stock the parts, you can fix that locomotive, I have replaced the TMCC board in the set version with the ERR MiniCommander 2 in a couple of them.  Same functionality and even the same connections.  They both worked fine after the fix.  The newer version being discussed here has the ERR Cruise Commander and R4LC as it's TMCC package, again readily available.

Ed, did this just start happening out of the blue?

My HHP loco was purchased about two years ago, so its no longer under warranty.

Looking on the Lionel website, the Cruise commander shows up as unavailable.

The RS motherboard, R2LC and Railsounds 5.5 show up as available.

Hopefully tonight will take another another look at this loco, would like to get it running again.

Looks like it is the R2LC C08 so swapping any other C08 in would work to test receiver sensitivity.  If you hold you hand over the engine will it respond better?  If so, checking antenna may help.  Or do the R2LC swap Bill mentioned.  G

The fact that it runs properly in reverse is puzzling, that would seem to indicate the receiver is working.

This locomotive has the same board as the ERR Cruise Commander.  The firmware is listed as a different version, but I'll bet you could replace it with a Cruise Commander if necessary.

If the R2LC isn't the problem component, I suspect the driver board may be repairable.  If not, just opt for the ERR Cruise Commander.  The only difference is the Cruise Commander in this one is the OEM version with a connector for the one terminal block.  If I were to do the swap, I'd pull screw block and replace it with the matching connector and just plug the old wiring in. 

Maybe, but from previous post from Jon Z some commands are more sensitive to signal.  The flickering head light indicates a possible sensitivity issue.  Otherwise it is the driver board and it is dragging down the voltage.  Either way you have to start troubleshooting some where.  R2LC is always the first and simplest item to rule out.   G

Anything's possible, and I certainly agree that ruling out the R2LC is a good start.  OTOH, I don't personally believe that's going to solve this issue.

To answer two earlier questions, the loco did not respond any better if I put my hand near the top of the shell.  Last time I ran the loco was several months ago, don't recall any issues at that time.

Ok, so I played around some more with this loco today.  Although I don't have a spare R2LC handy, I wanted to take another look with the shell off. Looking closely I noticed a small exposed portion of wire from one of the motor leads.  Tape up the wire, still no better.  So I take the shell off again, this time I run the loco with the shell just sitting loosely on the loco, now it runs fine in both directions.  One thing I notice with this loco there are a lot of wires and its a tight fit getting the shell back on, as a large bundle of wires go to the switches and lighting circuits on the inside bottom of the shell.  I also notice on the upwards facing surface of the R2LC there is electrical tape, assuming this is there to prevent pinching of wires inside the shell ?  So after a second try, I get the shell back on and so far its running properly. Cant really say I did anything different putting the shell back on the second time or why its running properly now.

Actually this incident sort of reminds me of an issue I had with the Cen Club 2 ESE Hudson, where it was making random sounds and the electrocoupler randomly opening.

Turns out on that loco the wire going to the wireless tether had a minute piece of insulation worn thru, as it was rubbing on one of the wheels on the trailing truck.

At this point, I'll see how the HHP does the next few days.  Want to thank the folks who responded with different ideas, if the loco acts up again may certainly be asking some more questions.

The motor armature moves up and down very slightly for forward and reverse, you probably had something going across the top of a flywheel that was dragging when going forward.  Next time you have a shell off one with the vertical motors, observe what you see.  I had a Williams that did that, can't believe I didn't think of it this time.

gunrunnerjohn - Now that you mention that, I noticed an exposed antenna inside the shell right above one of the flywheels. Wonder if the flywheel was contacting that ?

One thing about that HHP is a lot of wires crammed into a small space so probably

a lot of places for things to go wrong.

Those connectors can be issues.  So the wire stress may have made some of the connectors not seat well against the pins.  This would not be the first Lionel cruise engine where disassembly and reassembly solved the issue.  Good news is no board replacement!  G