CB&Q and Fort Worth & Denver passenger cars

I've been eyeing a Lionel Observation or considering converting my K-Line ESE obs into a similar car to model the CBQ one that is preserved at the National Railway Museum.  Thanks for the inspiration!

As for the rest of my K-Line ESE cars?  Dare I say they are likely getting redone in PC.  I know how dare a deface such a fine thread with a road name like that.

Great work as always Rob!

@GG1 4877 posted:

I've been eyeing a Lionel Observation or considering converting my K-Line ESE obs into a similar car to model the CBQ one that is preserved at the National Railway Museum.  Thanks for the inspiration!

As for the rest of my K-Line ESE cars?  Dare I say they are likely getting redone in PC.  I know how dare a deface such a fine thread with a road name like that.

Great work as always Rob!

Stuff you already know:  the Lionel already has great lighting and plastic windows which remove without a battle.  The K-Line has incandescent lighting prone to flickering. The window openings are noticably larger and covered with a thin clear plastic strip. Lionel has the best doors and diaphragms (IMHO). K-Line’s E.G. Budd fluting looks the better, to me. Those are some of several differences.

P.S. I have never disliked Penn Central…maybe felt kinda sorry for them. I will never forget a cartoon I saw in Trains magazine decades ago. A forlorn looking kid is sitting on the floor running a PC train on a loop. The transformer has a throttle and 3 buttons: Forward-Reverse-Liquidate. Haha

This Atlas (nee MTH) RPO was a special run done by Berwyn's Trains.  It arrived painted silver and FW&D did not have any silver RPOs on their roster.  I added some extra roof vents to the clerestory roof section which was common on Burlington head end cars.  I removed all the lighting and the pickup rollers, and blanked out several windows.  Pullman green paint, Microscale decals, slight weathering, and plenty of dullcoat finished the job.  Relettering this car caused me to realize I had mistakenly lettered a full baggage car with the same number.  That #33 became 103 to correct the mistake.

This type of RPO could be seen on both the Texas Zephyr and the unnamed mail trains.

The Fort Worth & Denver had five 60’ baggage cars built by Pullman in 1907. They were numbered 47 thru 51.  

F.W.&D. 47 is an Atlas car and F.W.&D. 50 is a K-Line.  This completes a 10 car mail train, #7 southbound or #8 northbound. (The FW&D was a north/south railroad according to their timetables).  This would be enough for most modelers but I got a screaming bargain on a set of four GGD heavyweight coaches which will be redone in FW&D or C&S paint jobs. The party never ends…

True story:

In the mid 1960’s young Dennis Braden left Lusk, WY to get an Agriculture degree from Texas Tech in Lubbock, TX.  To make a little money while going to college he worked part time at my father’s cattle auction.  He probably rode from WY to Denver on CB&Q #30 in a car just like this one.  He related to me that getting to Amarillo from Denver on the TZ took less time than riding the all-stops local to get to Denver.  :-)

Dennis eventually went on to be general manager of the historic Swensen Ranch headquartered in Stamford, TX.  His son is now general manager of the King Ranch in south Texas.
yes…I know that I have already done this car with a  70’ Atlas model, but I have little self control in some respects.  I think the paint is more accurate this time.
@CBQ_Bill

@Rob Leese

Wow !!!  What a great model !!!

Did the Texas Zephyr continue operations into the early 1970s ?  I was under the mistaken impression that the TZ ended in the mid 1960s.  

It is neat that you have personal knowledge of the prototype passenger car for your model.

CB&Q Bill

@CBQ_Bill posted:

@Rob Leese

Wow !!!  What a great model !!!

Did the Texas Zephyr continue operations into the early 1970s ?  I was under the mistaken impression that the TZ ended in the mid 1960s.  

It is neat that you have personal knowledge of the prototype passenger car for your model.

CB&Q Bill

The last Zephyrs were discontinued in 1967.

@Rob Leese - What color did you finally settle on for the C&S coach?  I have a few GGD coaches I plan on painting in the same paint scheme.  Going to re-letter a few Atlas CZ domes to Burlington first, but my heavyweight coach project is somewhere on the list!

@Rob Leese posted:

The last Zephyrs were discontinued in 1967.

Too bad, too. I've thought for years, given the growth in Texas and the popularity of Colorado with Texans for vacations, skiing, etc., that a passenger train from Houston to Dallas/Ft. Worth to Denver using the old Zephyr trackage (now used by BNSF) would be an extremely popular route for Amtrak, year-around. Adding additional cars to transport SUVs, Jeeps, etc. for passengers would really add to it. This line is probably now too crowded to allow passenger trains, based on my observations, but if at all possible this route would give Amtrak a huge moneymaker.

@GG1 4877 posted:

@Rob Leese - What color did you finally settle on for the C&S coach?  I have a few GGD coaches I plan on painting in the same paint scheme.  Going to re-letter a few Atlas CZ domes to Burlington first, but my heavyweight coach project is somewhere on the list!

I will get back with you on this next week. My artist wife has me on the road to an art exhibit this long weekend.

@breezinup posted:

Too bad, too. I've thought for years, given the growth in Texas and the popularity of Colorado with Texans for vacations, skiing, etc., that a passenger train from Houston to Dallas/Ft. Worth to Denver using the old Zephyr trackage (now used by BNSF) would be an extremely popular route for Amtrak, year-around. Adding additional cars to transport SUVs, Jeeps, etc. for passengers would really add to it. This line is probably now too crowded to allow passenger trains, based on my observations, but if at all possible this route would give Amtrak a huge moneymaker.

I like / agree with this idea. For a Houston and DFW departure dependent, an overnite sleeper would be wonderful. Sleep thru the not so interesting / subdued Texas scenery (my opinion - I’ve lived in Denver, Dallas, Houston) to wake up to sunrise on the Rocky Mountains rolling towards Denver.
Return trip …… Denver departure timed to facilitate sleeping in the Texas part.  

The auto train part is interesting but I’m not sure it would have a “critical mass” to work (like Florida).    

Cheers. 😉

@Rob Leese posted:

The primary reason I use this type of paint is: I do not have the time to dink with an airbrush. My job takes most of my time, and most ranchers never get to retire. That is also why I will never have a layout. I would would be more than happy to “eat those words”.

Thanks for the info.  I'm not sure when I'll get my "round tuit" out and finally get my cars done as my airbrush is buried in a box somewhere in my shed.  Might try and dig it out after the holidays.  I also have to find out what I did with the four sets of Microscale decals I bought for my projects.  I have a drawer full of decals and literature for all the roads I research for 3rd Rail and somehow am missing the ones I actually want to put on cars. 

I hope you do get to eat your words one day!  As an architect, our definition of retirement is falling face first onto our drafting tables now sadly occupied by a computer at some point late in our career, so I understand the inability to retire part even if I don't put in nearly the hours a rancher does! 

Silver Maple has been added to the roster.

Another baggage car for pool service on the Texas Zephyr, Sam Houston Zephyr, or #’s 7 and 8.

This was a K-Line car lettered for the California Zephyr.

Rob

Fantastic !!!

Did you apply new decals to K-Line’s existing letter boards & car name plaques ?

Please share your process

Thanks in advance !!!

CB&Q Bill

@CBQ_Bill posted:

Rob

Fantastic !!!

Did you apply new decals to K-Line’s existing letter boards & car name plaques ?

Please share your process

Thanks in advance !!!

CB&Q Bill

I only had to remove the California Zephyr lettering and the car name.  The letter boards were of sufficient length for the new decals.  To make these cars look almost real, I weather them slightly with black chalks and apply several coats of dullcoat finish.  I also removed the power pickup rollers and lighting because I do not light my head end cars.  This was a quick and easy project.  This car should have been named Silver Light but K4 did not include this name in their decal set...presently, they only have names for the Texas Zephyr cars.

  The Chicago Burlington and Quincy built a total of 60 "economy" baggage cars in its Havelock shops between October 1950 and September 1953. Twenty cars #990-1009 were assigned to Zephyr service and wore Aluminum paint. Some of these cars also had shadow-lining applied for time in an effort to better blend them with the fluted stainless steel cars. The other 40 cars #1015-1054 were painted Burlington dark green and assigned to the general passenger pool.

This baggage car was part of a two-car Santa Fe set from MTH.  The boxes are long-gone, so I don't know the set number.  The other car is a streamlined RPO, and these cars ran on a Santa Fe Fast Mail train I collected.  That entire collection will be for sale at our March 9-10 Train-A-Palooza, but I could not part with this car.  The detail is as good or better than anything you can buy.  990 does not fit my FW&D projects, but as I said, I just could not let it go.

One of these Havelock cars has been preserved at the IRM.

Another wonderful job Rob.  Thanks for sharing!

@GG1 4877 posted:

If the color is "Light Aluminum" then it would be closer to gray than to true silver.  I have the photos of the FW&D silver heavyweight coaches and the GGD one is a really close match.  That was how I was going to letter mine.

If I can ever find the decals ......

On March 9-10 I attended the annual Train-A-Palooza hosted by the Lone Star Hi-Railers, and railroad historian and author Steve Allen Goen was there as a vendor.  He is an authority on Texas railroads. I ask him what exact color did the FW&D use on the heavyweight coaches and diners. His reply was “light aluminum”, and the appearance of rooftops looking white-ish in color photography is due to fading caused over time by sunlight. I think we have all seen autos painted silver which badly faded as they aged.
I still have 3 GGD coaches to repaint and reletter as FW&D or C&S when time allows. I think I will still mask the sides and apply a coat of matte white to the roof as a first coat…then go over the entire car with light aluminum yet barely covering the roof to create the effect of fading.

@GG1 4877As a followup to my last post, here is a completed 21” heavyweight coach for FW&D Rwy. with the color of paint I have finally settled on. Three of the photos show a side by side comparison of the final paint vs. the old paint. * If I could only go back in time and see an original coach and its color, then I would know how close it is *
I am not going to repaint the two 17” cars I have previously done.   A rare FW&D modeler interested in those cars would stumble into a bargain.

@Rob Leese I love the sheen on the FW&D car.  That is how I would like to paint mine.  Still trying to find what I did with my decals, but I can always order more and dig out my airbrush to move this project up in the schedule.  Beautiful work as always. 

A few outdoor photos contrasting a Sunset E5, homespun heavyweight, and a GGD obs.

@robleese, "It's a weakness, I admit.", more of a strength I would say.

Mr. Leese, I am pleased to inform you that, by approval of the Vice President - Mechanical,  your personal record has been awarded ten merits for exceptional research, painting, and detailing, of O gauge  passenger cars used by the Fort Worth & Denver Railroad.  Congratulations and best wishes for future projects.