K-Line by Lionel Help Needed

See if this helps with your question.

one thing you have to be sure of is if the voltage is to low then the mechanism coil will not have enough energy to eject the milk can onto the platform, also you'll need enough current to make the belt to the drive motor to run.

Alan

Thanks Hokie 71  - I've also found some other previous posts from Stan and Gun Runner John.  The lamp  is hard wired to be on all the time.  The SPDT microswitch shuts down the belt when the man starts his work.  The man push button starts the loading operation and operates the switch providing continued power to the motor after the momentary button is released.

The belt mechanism is the remaining question.   There appears to be only one DC motor.  I'm guessing a direction change along with gearing engages the belt or man.  I don't see any diodes yet for driving the motor.  The gearing is well hidden without disassembly.  So either I have an electrical short in the belt drive circuit or the belt gear drive is jammed stalling the motor ? 

Gun Runner John - do you know how the belt engage gear mechanism works ?  Thanks for your photo of the controller internals.

@Alan Mancus posted:

one thing you have to be sure of is if the voltage is to low then the mechanism coil will not have enough energy to eject the milk can onto the platform, also you'll need enough current to make the belt to the drive motor to run.

Alan

Thanks Alan  - My man works great.  My belt doesn't turn and there is excessive power draw (everything dims) when I move the slide switch to ON.  Stalled motor ?  Due to ?

I removed the bottom depot circuit panel and discovered the second motor that drives the belt, what looks to be a full wave rectifier and small power supply board.  The power supply board is connected to the milk man and the full wave rectifier is connected to the belt.   The microswitch only controls the milk man acting as a limit switch.

The belt is designed to run all the time as long as the slide switch is ON powered by the full wave rectifier.  The wiring under the circuit panel is a jumble and the soldering is sloppy.  I haven't noticed any wiring shorts.  Next is to check out the rectifier and belt motor.

Check the grease that lubricates the gearing.  If it's dried out and hard, it will jam the gears.  You will need to remove the bottom of the depot.

Zeke13

drink beer

@shorling posted:

I removed the bottom depot circuit panel and discovered the second motor that drives the belt, what looks to be a full wave rectifier and small power supply board.  The power supply board is connected to the milk man and the full wave rectifier is connected to the belt.   The microswitch only controls the milk man acting as a limit switch.

The belt is designed to run all the time as long as the slide switch is ON powered by the full wave rectifier.  The wiring under the circuit panel is a jumble and the soldering is sloppy.  I haven't noticed any wiring shorts.  Next is to check out the rectifier and belt motor.

if everything looks OK, then it might be time to start isolating things, start with one motor find a place you can either cut the wire and splice back together easy or unsoldered. Then try it if the short has disappeared. Obviously, it’s the motor. One component at a time you’ll find the one that’s giving you the problems. Also, while I’m thinking about this, take the drive bels and or gear off or disengage the motor and see if it runs free if it does then it’s a mechanical problem.

PennCentralShops

@ThatGuy posted:

if everything looks OK, then it might be time to start isolating things, start with one motor find a place you can either cut the wire and splice back together easy or unsoldered. Then try it if the short has disappeared. Obviously, it’s the motor. One component at a time you’ll find the one that’s giving you the problems. Also, while I’m thinking about this, take the drive bels and or gear off or disengage the motor and see if it runs free if it does then it’s a mechanical problem.

PennCentralShops

Thanks ThatGuy - Very logical, exactly the direction I'm heading.   It's puzzling that this fault is loading down my ZW.  I wouldn't think that the tiny can bridge rectifier would be capable of sourcing that much current.

@fastman posted:

drink beer

Admittedly, this is a temporally solution.

This is turning out to be a nightmare.  I found there was a piece of shrink tubing jammed in the belt gear train.  This stalled the motor which resulted in damaging the motor.  The DC motor does not run after testing on a separate DC supply.  The ejector mechanism works however there is an intermittent connection on the PC supply power to the eject motor.  I think it's an easy solder reflow  fix.   Lionel clams they do not sell the motor.?   So I'm purchasing a used depot assembly in hopes of cannibalizing the motor at worst.

Final - Shrink tubing  (Manufacturing FOD) jammed in the belt drive gearing stalled and damaged the motor.  Lionel Parts Dept were no use on this after 3 attempts.  Lionel said they had no parts for the depot.  Lionel does have some parts, you just have to hunts for them.  I even think they have the motor but with no description or photo, I wasn't going to chance it.  Purchased  a used Dairyman depot from Trainz less controller, cans, instructions for not too many dollars.  It worked fine.  It wasn't much more to buy the Dairyman by the time I would have paid for the motor and shipping.  I think the bridge  rectifier was bad too. I switched the shells and now It's Moose Pond.   Bottom line - KBL manufacturing quality on this item leaves a lot to be desired: FOD and poor soldering.