So, in the new catalog there is a Lionchief Plus New Haven FA A-A Bluetooth set in the McGinnis color scheme. Wow! I might buy one of those.
"Lionchief Plus New Haven FA A-A Bluetooth set in the McGinnis color scheme. Wow! I might buy one of those."
Ditto. One of the more beautiful postwar color schemes, IMO. Rode the New Haven quite a bit in the 1960s.
The list of locos that will work with this app is very short (far shorter than the list for the Universal LionChief Controller), only the HO Polar Express, the most recent Am. Flyer Northerns, and just a couple of other new Lionel O Gauge pieces. Too bad they didn't include a list of compatible locos like the one they sent to the dealers, it would have saved me a lot of time!
Bill in FtL
Bill Nielsen posted:The list of locos that will work with this app is very short (far shorter than the list for the Universal LionChief Controller), only the HO Polar Express, the most recent Am. Flyer Northerns, and just a couple of other new Lionel O Gauge pieces. Too bad they didn't include a list of compatible locos like the one they sent to the dealers, it would have saved me a lot of time!
Bill in FtL
Agreed, I even emailed them today to see what the deal was since I didn't see this thread and I didn't notice that some of the locos had the icon next to them and others did not.
So, would you buy a LC+ engine at retail co$t without the Bluetooth - when you know some of them have it and it'd be great to run them with your device?
They should have made all the LC+ engines bluetooth and all the non-plus ones not, but I guess that would have been painful for them to go back to the drawing board for engines like the A5/etc.
Murnane posted:
They should have made all the LC+ engines bluetooth and all the non-plus ones not, but I guess that would have been painful for them to go back to the drawing board for engines like the A5/etc.
Hindsight is always 20/20. Bluetooth is great tech, but I don't think one could have foreseen the popularity of LionChief or the market for LC+ that formed, nor the desire to use mobile devices to operate locomotives when things started rolling. Also add into that that the bluetooth modules that allow this to be possible have only relatively recently come to market at reasonable prices.
The documentation on the module in the universal remote shows it to have only been released in April of 2016. A quick bit of google-fu shows LC+ to have been released in 2014. In that year BLE modules were only just starting to hit the market and many of the ones offered still required an independent processor to control them. Searching for 2014 prices is a bit tricky, but it looks like these early BLE modules, that still required an additional processor, retailed in low quantity for about $10. A large order might have gotten them for quite a bit less, but in the same time frame the standard 2.4GHz radios that LC/+ did use cost less than 10% of that. Current modules with 'powerful' built in processors cost $2-$3 in low quantity, likely a buck or less in large quantity. To sum it up when LC+ was released it would have significantly added to cost of production for features no one needed or wanted at the time. Today, however, using this tech can actually lower the cost of production while providing more features.
I would guess the decision to go with bluetooth for future products was only made in time to use it in products released for 2017 and beyond. I can't see it being worth anyone's time to redesign models that are already on the shelf. I'm just happy that the tech is keeping up with the times in LC, rather than remaining oblivious to improvements in technology like other systems have.
There are some shortcomings to using BLE tech over other communication systems, but I don't think they will affect most users, or even a statistically significant number of users.
JGL
Can you point out some of the shortcomings of BLE that you referred to in your post?
Thanks.
BOB WALKER posted:Can you point out some of the shortcomings of BLE that you referred to in your post?
Thanks.
The biggest one is going to be radio range. While the tech of BLE is very good the class 2 Bluetooth radios found in almost all mobile devices are only required to provide for 10 meters range (about 33 feet). Now the radios most use greatly exceed this spec, but I wouldn't expect a reliable, open air, signal to make it much more than 30 meters, and less through obstacles. Now as noted earlier I don't think this will be a factor at all for 99.99% of users, but it will be for some people with large layouts or for large club layouts.
Another factor is that Bluetooth is a proprietary protocol, Simply using the name "Bluetooth" or the logo on a product costs several thousand dollars. https://www.bluetooth.com/deve...ication-listing-fees This one actually effects all users, as it raises the price of every single LionChief/LC+/FlyerChief engine made from 2017 on. It also hinders folks from making independent products that can use this tech.
Aside from the fees, the protocol is quite a bit more complex to work with for a hobbyist wanting to develop their own control systems than the simple serial communication offered by TMCC or Legacy. If you want to plug a computer in to control your entire layout it becomes much harder here. Again only affects a tiny portion of users, but it is a downside.
One last one that comes to mind is that Big L has now shoehorned themselves into a commitment to support bluetooth from now on, which will limit their ability to upgrade to something better when it comes along... and anyone that's been keeping up with digital radios over the last 10 years knows there will be some new, better, protocol or frequency range on the market before we know it. BLE is really good right now, but it isn't likely to remain top dog forever.
JGL
I'm wondering if LC+ engines offered in the 2016 catalog and carried over in the 2017 catalog will be modified to have the bluetooth capability. There's one of those that I'm interested in getting.
breezinup posted:I'm wondering if LC+ engines offered in the 2016 catalog and carried over in the 2017 catalog will be modified to have the bluetooth capability. There's one of those that I'm interested in getting.
I wonder the same. I really hope so.
It doesn't look so, as those engines do not have the Bluetooth logo in the catalog.
Stuff made prior to the 2017 catalog appears to be older stock without Bluetooth. They do come with a remote, so unless you absolutely must operate it only with your phone or tablet (these must be iOS at present) they are identical in capabilities to the newer models, I believe.
Landsteiner posted:Stuff made prior to the 2017 catalog appears to be older stock without Bluetooth. They do come with a remote, so unless you absolutely must operate it only with your phone or tablet (these must be iOS at present) they are identical in capabilities to the newer models, I believe.
So you mean you think they are actually identical in capabilities to the older models, don't you? That is, although shown in the 2017 catalog, they will not have bluetooth capabilities.
I mean that in terms of functionality (digital command control by remote, controlling speed, direction, sounds [and couplers for LC+]) they are identical locos. The Bluetooth capability may allow updating of firmware and new functions not as readily possible with the Older LC+ or LC only equipped. Operationally they appear the same.
breezinup posted:I'm wondering if LC+ engines offered in the 2016 catalog and carried over in the 2017 catalog will be modified to have the bluetooth capability. There's one of those that I'm interested in getting.
Flipping through the catalog, and using a little common sense as well, it appears that most things designed for 2016 and before will not have the bluetooth capability. I do think it likely that old stock will be sold off until it is gone, and only then would a new product be cataloged that offers the BLE support. You can see that in what are likely three of the biggest selling starter sets. The Polar Express, Hogwarts, and Thomas sets now all offer bluetooth... Suppose I'll be buying a third polar express set to see what's different in the new future. As for deciding to buy or not, if there as a model with a road name you like, as others have said, LC+ is pretty good even without Bluetooth. If all else fails you may be able to buy a future release that has Bluetooth and swap shells, but I would hope that in the not so distant future Lionel releases an update to the universal remote to allow it to be used as a bridge between mobile devices and older lc/+ engines.
JGL
i cant download the new app i go to apple store and type lionchief and a lion king app pops up. HELP
Type in Lionel. That worked for me.
i tried that to no luck did get other lionel on it but not lionchief thanks for the reply
Doug-Sr posted:i tried that to no luck did get other lionel on it but not lionchief thanks for the reply
Is this for iPad or iPhone? If on an iPad make sure you select the choice of iPhone Only. I just did it and it did work.
ok thanks will try but cant even find the app to download
Go to the APP store and type Lionel into the search window. Make sure as shown below iPhone only is selected.
When I did this was the result.
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