Pricing of New Old Stock

Imo. It depends on the particular model and it's features. I.e. whether it has 2 chuffs and a puffer type smoke unit or 4 chuffs and a fan driven smoke unit, real coal load or cast etc.

Having said that. I find the build quality and detail to be better on some of the TMCC versions of models. Some have lost bell/ whistle lanyards, tender truck chains and other details when the legacy version was produced.

 FWIW.Lion chief still does not have as many features as TMCC. It's "new"  but it's not better persay. The Bluetooth control is also a very "basic" control method at this point. If and when more features are accessable with either Lion chief or Bluetooth then they will be a bigger "threat". 

Keep in mind the new Lionmaster Lion chief 2.0 big boy does NOT have whistle steam, and is $300 more than the legacy equipped whistle steam version from a few years ago

 Of course, "how much YOUR willing to pay" is still the ultimate decider.

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel and many other brands of engines and cars. Most were years old and had outdated sound system and running equipment. They even had some S gauge cars that were made by companies that had been out of business for years. Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

I think I know the store you are referring to.  We stopped one time on our return from visiting family in IL.  One visit was enough.

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

They must be franchising because there are at least three locations in St. Louis! 

There is no right answer.  When my wife had a store(not train) after the holiday (whatever holiday it happened to be) I would try to get her to discount those items and turn them into cash.  I never was successful in convincing her.  After I made her shut the store things went for a lot less.

That said, if you walked into a store and there was postwar Lionel on the shelf for full list price I am not sure there would be anything left on the shelf when you left the store.

Personally, if it is an item I want, the price is running a distant second.

MikeH posted:

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

They must be franchising because there are at least three locations in St. Louis! 

We have it here in Eastern Pa as well. There is one hobby shop that has stuff which is older than I am, still NOS and still at the original price. Some of the boxes have actually faded from age

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

I've been to that place once. Saw the prices and walked out. I have no idea how they stay in business. At least the Chicago area has two other hobby shops that have a focus on O gauge trains, and realistic prices. Most cities aren't so lucky.

Back to the OP. If you're looking for an item that has been made in PS3/Legacy and also in PS2/TMCC then I would say the max I would pay for the older control version is about 60-65% of the MSRP, if it is actually NOS. Any run time and that falls to 50%. 

The real deals are Premier PS1 steam locomotives. Update them to PS3 or ERR TMCC and you can get a scale steam locomotive with command control for about 45% of the cost of a new one, if you do the work yourself. 

I must say, (sucker), is a loose term, One Less informed, or ignorant to the older Merchandise without all the newer bells and whistles and Yes, the price is a major factor. A Sale, is a deal made between 2 parties, after the negotiated price is agreed upon. Some folks are paying unbelievable prices for postwar. Some, are not. There is a place for both, older and also modern trains today. A merchant or any individual seller may ask whatever he feels like, it may or may not sell. I know the value of some older modern trains are losing dollar value. I think the biggest reason for prices bringing top dollar, and those hitting the bottom is, Supply and Demand. Personally, I would rather take a small beatting and move on....Happy Railroading 

CarGuyZM10 posted:

MikeH posted:

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

They must be franchising because there are at least three locations in St. Louis! 

We have it here in Eastern Pa as well. There is one hobby shop that has stuff which is older than I am, still NOS and still at the original price. Some of the boxes have actually faded from age

I live in Nazareth, and we might be thinking of the same place.

drelo posted:

CarGuyZM10 posted:

MikeH posted:

RickO posted:

scale rail posted:

There is a toy/train store I would buy building materials from when we lived on the mainland. They had shelf after shelf of old MTH, Lionel  Everything to this day is full retail price. I don't get it. Don

We have one of those hobby shops in the far western suburbs of Chicago.

They have a wall 10 feet high of new old stock. In fact , the dust covered 15 year old tmcc stuff at msrp is more than the same discounted legacy locomotive on the shelf next to it.

Needless to say....After one visit,I've never been back. 

They must be franchising because there are at least three locations in St. Louis! 

We have it here in Eastern Pa as well. There is one hobby shop that has stuff which is older than I am, still NOS and still at the original price. Some of the boxes have actually faded from age

I live in Nazareth, and we might be thinking of the same place.

Lol yes!  Dozens of faded boxes.

I was just at another local store with some new old stock k-line that is more than the original price.  I don’t understand it. 

Scale Rail is refering to the store in Novato,Ca,I think they make their money on Dolls and related Equipment.

Mikey

There are some real deals to be had on NOS engines from time to time. You just have to be careful. Some super details are available, however, on NOS freight cars. I have picked up some gems for very little money on Ebay by searching diligently for bargains.

I got a lionel tmcc berkshire.When new it was worth$1,100.00 dollars.I went to a train show in hickory n.c.I went in to mainly look around.Just as I came in there it was a virginian tmcc  berkshire .The seller wanted $375.00 for it I could not pass that up.He alway so had a y6b for sale.My layout is not that big and I would not be able run in with my sharp turns O54.To me it depends on what the seller wants for the train.

In my experience, any latest greatest gizmo laden diecast three  rail based loco will experience the same drastic drop in value as the years roll on. 

Planned obsolesence. 

Only spend on a tricked up loco the amount of which you are willing to throw  50% of it away.  Your purchase price is almost like a rent payment. 

Stuff is approaching salvage level resale pricing.  I still get decent returns on my brass sales but my diecast selling returns are pitiful.   Diecast products should come with salt and pepper shakers.

I think some of this falls under the Greater Fool Theory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_fool_theory

I can understand why an LHS might put high price tags on an item hoping an uneducated walk-in buyer might pay the premium. And, since an LHS does/can provide value-added advice, I don't begrudge them from seeing MSRP even on NOS.  I chuckle, however, when sellers on auction sites put a 15 y/o NOS item up for sale at the same price as brand-new (and improved) versions listed right there on the same site.  

This is really timely for me.  I was watching an MTH E-8 ABA and passenger car set on ebay this week.  The seller admitted that the sounds and smoke were inoperable.  Tonight it sold for over MSRP.   This was a PS2 set from the 2000 catalog!  I'm sure it's those types of once-in-a-blue-moon sales that encourage sellers to keep rolling the old stuff out there at crazy prices.

Big Consideration to be taken into account when purchasing NOS. Mfgs. have put limits on how long after production they warranty their products.  So, unless you cut a "warranty agreement with the seller" - you got squat if something goes wrong.  BBW!

I know what you're talking about.  A certain garden center (that sells trains) in northwestern PA has MTH PS-1 locomotives at MSRP.  They also had the same PS-2 engine at MSRP right next to it.  The PS-3 version of that locomotive has been released as well.   

You can't make this stuff up.

George