Proto 2 DCS engine will not go into motion

Did it work before? Can you move the engine in conventional mode?  If it's a steamer have you confirmed you have a good tether connection?

It did work the last time I parked it on it's present track.  It is a diesel. MTH proto 2 ACL E6 A-B-A with both A units powered.  So far, I have not been able to run it in conventional mode either.

Ray

Make sure the tethers between the units are properly connected.  I believe you can run the leading A unit on it's own, but the trailing powered A unit will just have a slave board and must be tethered to the lead locomotive through the B unit.

I like John's idea of focusing on just the main A unit.  In conventional can you get it to reverse direction (hear the relay click and/or see the headlights switch) every other DIRECTION button press as it cycles through Fwd-neutral-Rev-neutral?  This would at least confirm the battery is charged.

Since it appears the Resets had no effect, I'd next pop the shell and check the motor wiring to the 5-pin connector with the yellow/white motor wires. 

If ambitious I suppose you could see if DC voltage appears at the board connector when the engine should be moving.  You should be able to touch the probe tips to the metal crimps of the yellow/white motor wires in the connector housing on a stopped engine.

The trailing A unit is not an issue.  The teather was secure but it does the same thing without the slave unit attached.   I did find out that the battery is the older type that MTH used about the size of a 9 volt battery.  I wonder if a BCR battery replacement would work?  Seems like it should if you wait the required minute or so for it to charge up before trying to move.  This engine powers up in DCS but will not power up in coventional nor will it enter a direction.  I have a feeling that it is a battery problem.  I will try the BCR or a charged up battery and see what that does.

Ray

Ray,

How are you testing the engine in conventional?

If you have it on a track connected to the TIU it will see the watchdog signal. It will then come up dark and silent, and will not respond to transformer commands.

Barry, I have two loops of track.  The TIU is connected to track one.  Track two is also connected to the TIU but I thought with the power to track one turned off ( where the TIU gets its power from) that track two would act like a non DCS track.  I tested another engine on track two with the power turned off in track one and it starts right up in conventional.  Not so with the MTH E6 in question.  Hope this makes sense.  Another way to say it is that the TIU gets its power from the throttle on track one.

Ray

When you start the engine up, turn the power off and see if the engine does a normal shutdown sequence.  If not and sounds shut off right away, I would charge or replace the battery.  If the battery is older then 5 yrs, replace it.

If sounds do play a shutdown when power removed then:

In conventional mode with TIU disconnected do a feature reset 1W and 5B in sequence.  See if that resolves it, if not reconnect TIU and do a factory reset of the engine.  Turn off for 10 secs and try it again.

If still no joy, I would open up the engine and inspect the 5 pin connector, making sure it is not out or partially out.  G

Any powered track that's connected to a TIU channel is going to generate a watchdog signal that tells a PS2/3 engine to come up dark and silent. It will not respond to conventional control while in that state.

To ensure conventional mode, turn off the DCS signal for all TIU channels as follows:

• Press Menu/System/DCS Setup
• Press soft key AOF to turn off the DCS signal on all channels.

Then, put the enigne on the track and give it power.

To restore the DCS signal:

• Press Menu/System/DCS Setup
• Press soft key AON to turn on the DCS signal on all channels.

Or, you could just remove the TIU from the picture completely and connect the transformer directly to the rails.  No danger of the TIU talking to anything.

John,

Or, you could just remove the TIU from the picture completely and connect the transformer directly to the rails.  No danger of the TIU talking to anything.

I consider it to a bad idea to do something to physically disrupt a system when doing something non-invasive will obtain the same result.

I thought he was saying pretty much with a little reading between the lines, The TIU is not powered up because Fixed 1 does not have power or power to the AUX. My thought, Fixed 2 will pass power with the TIU off. How can the TIU generate a watchdog signal if it is off.

Jim,

My thought, Fixed 2 will pass power with the TIU off. 

Yes, it will and that track will be in conventional mode.

My thinking was not to do anything to physically move wires or adjust transformer power. I tend to look first for processes that don't involve handling equipment, since all of my transformers, TIUs and AIUs are stored under the layout and are never touched during operation.

I took the shell off the engine this afternoon and checked the battery.  It still has enough power to light up a small street lamp from the layout.  I also tried a BCR and after allowing it time to charge up started the engine.  Everything is normal until you try to move the engine.  When you advance the thumb wheel you get no movement.  So I am back to square one.  I think at this point, I can rule out battery problems.  This same engine had some issues a few months ago when all the lighting on the engine failed.  However everything else still worked.  Maybe the whole thing is a board issue.  I oppted not to fix the lights but jury rigged one light from the pick up roller just to have a headlight.  It has all worked fine until now.  I am charging up a new battery overnight for one last try.  I did notice that during normal shut down you get no lingering sounds.  I know from previous quotes from local shop that it would require two new boards to fix the lights.  One for the leading unit and one for the slave unit at a cost of around $200 plus labor.  If there is more electronics that need replacing to fix this latest thing, then that would make the cost prohibitive over just ripping all the electronics out and just install a reverse unit and run conventional.  You would have to do the same for the slave unit as well I suppose.  If this weren't one of my favorite engines, I would make a shelf queen out of it or sell it as a fixer upper.  BTW, I have replaced the lighting boards once before so to do it again would double the cost.

Ray

Are you sure you don't have a bad earth/dry joint somewhere?

I had almost the same symptoms with my Y6B a few months back - it turned out an earth wire joint had gone bad. Once I found it everything fired up as normal in both DCs and conventional.

MIKE

Ray,  OK.  The is the early PS-2 5V board.  First, to repair the Lead A does not require changes to your Slave A.  If the board is totally bad, the recommended repair is installing a PS-2 3V board with 5V connectors, with a 4 ohm speaker and 2.4V battery with harness.  I have done this repair on several early E-6/8s including the ACL.

Now that you have given some more information:  If your first problem was loss of all lights, that is a chip on the board.  It actually also controls smoke fan which you don't have in your unit.  This can be fixed by me.

The direction control may be a different matter, and while some of the components are exposed, if it is the micro controller it may not be repairable.

You could send me the board and I could test and repair, but if motor function can't be restored upgrading to the 3V system is you best alternative.  I have the parts to do this and I am a MTH Tech, so it comes with warranty.  You can contact me via my profile e-mail.  I would only need your Lead A to do this.  G

Hi Ray.... Read this thread and  try the resets again, feature first and then factory ,  and a new battery.

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/d...nt/13397135074244733

G, I sent you an E mail.

Ray

Ray,  I did not receive it, can you send again, may want to check address.  G

G, I resent my message again.  I had the wrong address on the first one.

Ray