What is your favorite postwar '4 wheeled' Locomotive - and why?

woodsyT,

Like you I also have a 1655 which I absolutely love.   My Dad bought Lionel Freight Set 1423w of which the 1655 is a part  in 1948.  I still have the entire set and run it at Christmas time.  My other favorite Lionel 2-4-2 is the 249 which was made in 1958.  If you examine it closely you can see that in actuality it is a plastic remake of the the die cast 1655.   The only differences are that it sports a nifty orange stripe along the engine's running board and the plastic tender also has a matching orange stripe which runs the length of the tender; also, it has no operating headlight and only a two position E-unit.  Nevertheless, when I was an 11 year old I loved the matching orange stripes on the engine and tender and still do.   My mom could never afford the magnificent Lionel Norfolk & Western 4-8-4 Class J northern which also has matching orange stripes on the engine and tender.   I constantly drooled over the 746 as pictured in the Lionel 1957 and 1958 catalogs so I would pretend my little 249 2-4-2 was the big 4-8-4 when running it on my layout.   I still have that little 249 and the entire set it came with, Set #1590.  It still runs perfectly.  These two still fully operational very inexpensive sets are a testimony to the reliability and durability of the trains manufactured by the old Lionel Corporation.      

I would say that the 1655 is probably the highest-quality, smoothest running Scout type loco that Lionel ever made.  That being said, I also like the 2034 which has the newer-style parallel plate motor, and its cousin the 250 which is very similar but with a ballasted plastic body.

One of the fun projects I've done is to build a "super stock" 2-4-2 using the metal shell from a 239 and the motor from a 250.  Then I added the liquid smoke generator and Electronic Mighty Sound of Steam circuit from a battered MPC 8203.  Yes, it all fits!  Eventually I would like to add a connecting rod in addition to the factory main rod.  There's a customized pink (!) 2034 on eBay right now, that has the rod added.  It looks like 1615 hardware to my eyes.  I might also need to source a 1615 mechanism (I can't remember whether the holes are tapped in the front pair of driving wheels on mine.)

The Scout or "Columbia" locos were everyday freight haulers, and undoubtedly Lionel's most common type.  On my railroad, I thought of them as equivalent to 2-8-2s.  Which isn't terribly far off the mark, because the boiler casting was based on a USRA light Mikado or Pacific.  My brother and I had O27 curves and a small budget, so there were no 736s or 746s on our railroad.  The 2036 was a credible stand-in for a C&O Kanawha or NKP Berk, and the 2056 Hudson was our big battleship, the equivalent of a 4-8-4.  It's amazing what can be accomplished with a little imagination!  Good thread!!

@Ted S posted:

... I would like to add a connecting rod in addition to the factory main rod.  There's a customized pink (!) 2034 on eBay right now, that has the rods added...

can you fit other rods/gear to the 4-wheelers? that sounds like an interesting 'kit-bash'

I have 2 of the scout type engines.   One the 239 is metal body, scout motor, light, smoke and a whistling tender.   Traction tire.  It pulls well.  The other is the 244, light, smoke and a metal sided motor.    The 239 reminds me of my very first lionel I got at age 7 but mine did not have smoke or a whistling tender.       

If you are fixing/rebuilding a plastic scout motor, be aware they are more complex to assemble.  A lot of little pieces.    There may also be holes for magnets to add magnetraction, if you can find the right size magnets to use.

@woodsyT posted:

can you fit other rods/gear to the 4-wheelers? that sounds like an interesting 'kit-bash'

Well it depends.  After the 1655 ceased production in 1949, none of the Scout/Columbia locos had connecting rods, until Lionel elongated the boiler and turned it into a 4-4-2 circa 1984.  To add a connecting rod, the driving wheels have to be pressed on "in quarter" and the gears have to be timed correctly.  For example, the holes on both axles have to be at the 6 o'clock position.  Both sets of wheels have to be tapped to accept a hex bolt to retain the connecting rod.  You could cheat by using the mechanism from a 1615 switcher (all of these had quartered drivers and full valve gear.)  But you might have to swap E-units to get the lever to fit into the Columbia body shell.  I would have to look at the service manual and parts lists to see if the wheels and rods are fully interchangeable with the 2034 and 250.

I don't personally mess around with plastic Scout motors.  Even the Lionel service manual suggests replacing the whole motor/chassis with part number 250-100.

One more note for those who might wish to build their own "super Scout":  Although not strictly postwar, when General Mills / MPC took over Lionel in 1970-71, the ONLY steam locos in the product lineup used a redesigned version of the 249-100 four-wheel motor.  This MPC motor had some improvements and some drawbacks compared to the 1950s metal Scout motor.  Most importantly the armature is MUCH larger in diameter.  In fact, it's the same size as the armature that had been used in six wheel drive locos like the Hudsons, 2025, etc.  It also has a much thicker stack of laminations than the motor in a 244, 247, or 249.  So in theory, the MPC motor should produce more power and torque than a 249-100.  By virtue of its larger diameter, it definitely provides more coasting.  The mounting points are exactly the same, so it's fully interchangeable with a 249-100.  The variation used in the MPC-era 4-4-2s like 8142, 8204, etc., have all wheels tapped and the drivers properly quartered to accept a connecting rod.  But the hex bolt is a different size and thread than postwar hardware and the rear wheels have a "boss" or shoulder to accommodate a new driving rod design.  The downsides, the MPC motor is a bit lighter in weight.  Most of these have a single grooved wheel, and long-wearing rubber tire.  If you want the larger armature and field, you'll also have to live with nylon gears and the shiny aluminum sideframes, although I've seen at least one case where someone painted the sideframes a dull black for greater realism.

The corporate budget must have been tight in those early MPC years.  I always wondered why they went to the trouble of redesigning something that worked pretty well already.  And being as they did, it's a shame they didn't also gear it down for more realistic speeds.  Good topic!

@Ted S posted:

...  I always wondered why they went to the trouble of redesigning something that worked pretty well already.  And being as they did, it's a shame they didn't also gear it down for more realistic speeds.  Good topic!

Agreed! The start speeds of some toy trains seems ridiculous.

Also, dressing up these smaller steamers to be a super steamer sounds like a lot of work

@Ted S posted:

I would say that the 1655 is probably the highest-quality, smoothest running Scout type loco that Lionel ever made.  That being said, I also like the 2034 which has the newer-style parallel plate motor, and its cousin the 250 which is very similar but with a ballasted plastic body.

One of the fun projects I've done is to build a "super stock" 2-4-2 using the metal shell from a 239 and the motor from a 250.  Then I added the liquid smoke generator and Electronic Mighty Sound of Steam circuit from a battered MPC 8203.  Yes, it all fits!  Eventually I would like to add a connecting rod in addition to the factory main rod.  There's a customized pink (!) 2034 on eBay right now, that has the rod added.  It looks like 1615 hardware to my eyes.  I might also need to source a 1615 mechanism (I can't remember whether the holes are tapped in the front pair of driving wheels on mine.)

The Scout or "Columbia" locos were everyday freight haulers, and undoubtedly Lionel's most common type.  On my railroad, I thought of them as equivalent to 2-8-2s.  Which isn't terribly far off the mark, because the boiler casting was based on a USRA light Mikado or Pacific.  My brother and I had O27 curves and a small budget, so there were no 736s or 746s on our railroad.  The 2036 was a credible stand-in for a C&O Kanawha or NKP Berk, and the 2056 Hudson was our big battleship, the equivalent of a 4-8-4.  It's amazing what can be accomplished with a little imagination!  Good thread!!

Ted S,

Granted the Lionel 1655 from 1948 is a 2-4-2 "Columbia" type locomotive but it does not contain the infamous cheapened  plastic  "Scout " motor from the "Scout" locomotive design.   The  2-4-2 1654 and 1655 as well as the 1656 Switcher all used the standard Lionel motor while the 1001,1101and 1110 and later units all used the specifically designated Lionel "Scout" plastic enclosed motor which differed from the standard Lionel motor in that it did not require a separate reversing "E-Unit" because the reversing mechanism was part of the "Scout" motor itself.    The 1654, 1655 and 1656 were easily maintained while the "Scout" motors were somewhat problematic due to the number of additional parts they contained.  The Lionel repair manual clearly shows the the 1654, 1655 and 1656 did not contain the Cheapened "Scout" motor.  I'm probably way to sensitive about this but I always objected to it when my trusty old 1655 was described as a "Scout" locomotive.