Will we ever see a SD70ACe or ES44AC produced in plastic that is similar in quality to the Overland Models brass engines?

I like all era of trains to an extent, but i grew up in the 90's and watching the modern stuff til now has fascinated me the most. I would say the engineering and mechanical aspect of the modern freight and engines is what most draws me in the most. I like to see the roller bearings rotate on the truck and just the awesome power of the modern Diesel engines. with all that it is probably no surprise that my modeling interest mainly are in the super detailing and probably why I'm fascinated with Proto 48 too.

Agree 200 per cent! 

I belabored the point many times on the old Atlas forum of how I don't understand why HO and N modelers demand things like Proto-2000 and Kato and Kadee where 2 Rail O scalers are more content with Blue Box Athearn quality models.

The direction of this scale should take some lessons from HO and all of the absolutely stunning plastic models being produced...

And admittedly the offerings such as the GGD plastic just keeps getting better and better.

Overland's models are nothing special, that couldn't easily be duplicated or surpassed, in plastic.

Maybe, raise the bar, knock out a model with working trucks(suspension-wise) you don't need real brakes; and, put small electric traction motors on each axle.

Build a locomotive model that actually performs similar to the prototypes.

If it's a 6 axle model, make it a working 6 axle model.

Rick

Good Day Gentlemen,

Modern Day Diesel Locomotives are growing in popularity more and more each day!

On the Atlas O forum, I created to campaign for the GP40-2 titled “How about EMD GP40-2’s for future production?” I created that post on May 23, 2008. To date there have been 35818 people read/view the posts with 229 replies.

Is there still an interest in the GP40-2 being produced? I would say, yes. Who will be the first to produce this diesel locomotive in O Scale? 

Regards,

Swafford     

Mike,

When I speak of plastic, for most part, I'm referring to the main body panels etc; the grab irons, hand rails... could be nicely made out of a variety of materials.

I don't get the big fascination with brass; it's not a precious metal... just a common soft metal, like tin, but golden in color.

I'd be more impressed, if actual steel was used; pliable brass seems to be the easy route.

BTW, models in Overland's price range and higher, should held to the highest standards... No allowances should be made, for less-than accurate models; there's no excuse for that.

Mike P. seemed to start out candid, and some fellow forum members mostly added very basic praise; kind-of like support...

Nobody, yet really gave Overland's models, a thorough candid review. I've seen some of these guys, lay into other manufacturers efforts.

I don't see a problem, re: making a nice realist model, for a reasonable price. The shapes of modern North American freight locomotives, are designed to make manufacturing easier/less costly.

Shouldn't be hard to copy.

Rick

Yes,  an Atlas Master quality, even with the vertical twin drive, GP40-2 would be a winner, as would an SD40-2.  As I said Atlas makes what they want to make, and it is their money.  The single most asked for O Scale brass model is an SD40-2, no contest, not even close.  And there are brass ones available on the secondary market; frequently.  The current MTH and Lionel versions are crap and crappier to a scale person.

Atlas is going to be very interesting over the next couple of years.  Their new builder is the same as Athearn's so doing the same things in HO as Athearn could end up in an MTH<>Lionel cat fight, so we will get to see where that goes.  

MTH would go a long way in the scale world to me if they would just fix those godawful oversized bezels around the brass screens and the handrail frames sticking out and humongous horns.

This is not the For Sale forum but is kinda appropriate for this thread.  I was planning on trying to sell the following at O Scale West for $350.  But if anyone who might want to try an MTH or whatever drive might be interested.

It's an Overland SD60 shell.  I just wanted the drive and under frame for an SDP40F I am working on.

I don't get the big fascination with brass; it's not a precious metal... just a common soft metal, like tin, but golden in color.

Me neither - and I prefer brass.  It is irrational to not prefer plastic in all cases.  The detail on plastic models cannot be beat.  That said, I do not like plastic models, and can give you no valid reason why.

One of the other reasons high end models are generally brass is that production numbers are too low to justify making dies.  But that has been well covered above.

With all this pent-up demand, one would think there is an opportunity for a new manufacturer.  My guess is that some very smart marketing folks have decided the real money is in K4s and E-7s.

Oh, yeah - I forgot to add - my first scratchbuilt used a steel boiler.  Brass is so much easier to work with - steel would double the cost, and then it would rust.  Not a good modeling medium.  Even Lionel made pre-production models from brass.

The more I run the OMI SD70ACe the more I'm inclined to give up on my MTH models except I need to have PS3.0.  I like a little bit of sound but not so noisy.  I'll be on the bandwagon if OMI decides to stay in O scale and do a proper GE ES44.

Bob2,

Re: your reason(s) for preferring brass - I think plastic has always been associated with cheap, disposable and throwaway; whereas, metal seems more substantial...

Rick

I see the SD60 shell; I really like it's lookalike sibling, the SD50. I've really taken to this look - with it's straight long back and chiseled conventional cab nose. The "Arrow" of locomotives.

I have a Premier 3.0 UP Hi-rail SD50 that, even with all it's failings, has a beefy looking kisser. I should have gotten the scale wheels version, too. UP's colors look really good, on that model.

Mike P.

What do you favor - MTH's ACe or their GEVO, and why?

Rick

Nope - I do not have a reason, and since it is a hobby, I do not have to have any reasons.  I am not alone, though - all you have to do is watch brass hoppers on eBay, and watch the widely available plastic versions.  Many 2- railers are as irrational as me, and many will not be quickly shelling out a grand for a plastic locomotive.  That's opinion - I have no data.

GEVO, they are newer (tooling) and have sharper detail.  MTH does incremental improvements to their base models as time progresses and these are nice.  They still miss at a few points, hand rail, pilot and truck but they sharper than the SD70ACe.  What are awful are their 90's era 2 rail.  

Their Dash 8-40CW probably is their best GE safety cab model, there seems to be a bit larger face on it.Their CN model, of GE's DC locomotive, is one of their best GEVO models, if not their best.

I have the newer 3.0 ACe, Hi-rail version; they dropped the roof mounted sun shades. I like that look better. It makes for a cleaner, taller, stronger appearance; basically... rectangular. That must look even better,with the fixed pilot.

I'd like both the ACe and the GEVO models, without sun shades. Less clutter, nicer visual impact.

It should be noted that the livery plays a significant roll, in determining how massive the front looks, on these two models. I find that fewer breaks in the base color(going with basically one color), makes for a more massive  appearance.

Rick

Hello, new to this forum, I saw this topic and thought I'd throw my 2cents in.

It's hard to believe that modelers are trying to get someone to produce a less expensive, plastic model of a prototype that hit the rails over 40 years ago. 

I know there have been brass versions produced, but being a mere mortal, and a retired one at that, I just can't swing the cost.  If Atlas or anybody else can do the GP 40-2, with the level of detail that matches the Atlas HO version already out there, I'd be happy to part with some of my money. ( if you do them in Chessie)

As for the more modern stuff like the Ace's and Dash 8's and 9's, I hope they get produced too, that could possibly benefit modelers of a slightly older era (70's to 80's), with some updated rolling stock.  There's something that just doesn't look right about a couple of big, burly SD's  pulling a long string of USRA 2 bay hoppers.

Sorry about getting caught up in the discussion about the GP 40-2.

The model manufacturers are already there for the most part, although in much smaller scales, I think given some time and the continued growth of O scale, 3 Rail Scale, there's a good possibility that these locomotives could be produced.

Well, I just picked up another SD70ACe of eBay in UP/MP Heritage with scale wheels. For what I paid for the six of the SD70ACe's in my collection, that would get me one OMI brass, so there is the benefit of being able to fill out a roster at a lower price point.

I've mentioned it before - the "original' demonstrator is an all-time favorite of mine.

Straying from the prototype paint scheme, by going with a white pilot, instead of the blue, MTH created the best looking ACe, I've seen. You're a lucky lad, Matt.

Rick

That was a popular series in O; smart move by MTH, to be the first to offer the Heritage fleet.

Nice shot and collection, Mike P.

Rick

I just discovered that, at least, one of the four EMD SD70ACe Demo units(No. 70) had the pilot area painted white.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...ture.aspx?id=3664884

MTH's original demo unit, was painted like No. 70; done correctly.

Rick

BTW, for the people that purchased PS 2.0 versions of MTH's SD70ACe, the new 3.0 versions - have some upgrades; including, a new LED light package...

My, from the first production run, Demo unit ACe's roof melted, because of significant heat coming from the headlights.

Rick

Nice sharp pic on Demo unit, obiviously not all frame piping and cableing was included on the Overland units [ I believe Key strives for even more detail on their newest imports],most obivious missing is the red power connector cable across the pilot front[unless its in the spare parts bag] interesting this detail is included on MTH and Atlas modern diesels,MTH should upgrade truck sideframes and pilots in future [don't think they will ever move on handrails]JMHO and observations on these models.

Here's GM72 wearing a blue pilot; 71's and 73's pilots were blue, too.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=128450

Rick

and I've got to post this one... my idea of "presence"!

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=128452

Rick

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=371009

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...ture.aspx?id=1915465

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=233249

http://www.rrpicturearchives.n...cture.aspx?id=507435

I haven't found a good rear shot, yet.

These pictures might help your understanding, of EMD's Demo ACe's.

Rick

As hibar noted, the prototytpe ACe's have significant visible components, just under the main deck, of the locomotives. EMD did this on purpose, to make servicing easier - by making the components easily accessible...

Rick

Some manufacturer, with initiative, might want to put out a complete set, of the four EMD Demo units?

I'm thinking MTH could handle this task, quite well.

Rick

Nah...  EMD did it to drive the modelers and manufacturers nuts.

Rusty

Ya Rusty, they've got their work cut out for them...

Rick

Mike...I used Stainless .010 wire bent with 1/64 wire loop pliers to make hooks on PSC chain.  I hooked one in into the hose itself and painted it black around it so you cant see it, and hooked the other to the hanger under the pilot.  Click on the pic and make it full screen in my photobucket and you will see how I did it.  I have since cleaned it up a bit, I painted the connectors(plugs) silver and the part the cable slides onto red to match the hose so it doesn't show through as much (although you shouldn't have to do this with the hose that came with it that is more brownish and solid in color (not prototypical for NS)).  I also went back and put a coat of dull coat on everything since the photo to kill the shine.

Yes great job.  Now I need some PSC chains.  I'm not sure about the color, I did more looking and I see both kinds.  

With the red

http://www.flickr.com/photos/g...2281/in/photostream/

And brownish, like this which could be the color balance?  I can understand brownish from all the others because of dirt.  The likely new replacements like the same 4837 dirtied up with a bright red cable in the link above.

I believe the 70 originally was painted that way to highlight the lower chassis to help train railroad maintenance staff since most serviceable items were now visible with the SD70ACe/M-2 series.   Easier to see when things are white!

 Edit - looks like you already noted that..